Player Discussion Zdeno Chara

[Flannelman]

Agreed. Let the man retire as a Bruin. He's deserved it.

Agree and want him as an influence for this next crop of defenders coming up; so much he can teach

 

[ODAAT]

He`s not a Norris guy anymore but I cringe at the thought of losing this guy for a significant part of the regular season, still very much a huge part of settling things down defensively, allows others to slide into a spot they are better served for.

Have to admit, pleasantly surprised with Seids game so far too, couple shots, put himself in good position to block a few shots...good start

 

[Caper Bruins fan]

He`s not a Norris guy anymore but I cringe at the thought of losing this guy for a significant part of the regular season, still very much a huge part of settling things down defensively, allows others to slide into a spot they are better served for.

Have to admit, pleasantly surprised with Seids game so far too, couple shots, put himself in good position to block a few shots...good start

It's only early and I admittedly didn't pay a whole lot of attention to yesterday's game ( I was still bummed about the previous game ) but Seids while looking slow seems to be playing it smart defensively and relying on good positioning .

 

[Over the volcano]

Big Z

Great write up on him today on Weei's site-

http://www.weei.com/sports/boston/h...out-and-lot-stats-say-about-aging-zdeno-chara

It is amazing how much they depend on him- they were completely lost without him at the beginning of the year and he is pulling harder minutes than ever. With all the talk about Sweeny's work towards rebuilding/tooling and our beloved captain pushing 40 the transition talk makes sense, but there is NO WAY they could ice a decent team without him in the line up over the next couple years. He carries so much weight.

 

[whatsbruin]

Great write up on him today on Weei's site-

http://www.weei.com/sports/boston/h...out-and-lot-stats-say-about-aging-zdeno-chara

It is amazing how much they depend on him- they were completely lost without him at the beginning of the year and he is pulling harder minutes than ever. With all the talk about Sweeny's work towards rebuilding/tooling and our beloved captain pushing 40 the transition talk makes sense, but there is NO WAY they could ice a decent team without him in the line up over the next couple years. He carries so much weight.

If this team continues to rely on Big Z the same amount over the next few years they
will show the same downfall that he will/is showing.

The B's must reduce his minutes, and strengthen the surrounding D men. They cannot
rely on Z as they have in the past and still expect to compete.

 

[xgallantx]

If this team continues to rely on Big Z the same amount over the next few years they
will show the same downfall that he will/is showing.

The B's must reduce his minutes, and strengthen the surrounding D men. They cannot
rely on Z as they have in the past and still expect to compete.

Exactly. People here give him a hard time, but without him we'd probably be in the Matthews sweepstakes (some people would probably prefer that anywho). What we need is more capable Dmen so Zee can last us another 2-3 years.

 

[PatriceBergeronFan]

Exactly. People here give him a hard time, but without him we'd probably be in the Matthews sweepstakes (some people would probably prefer that anywho). What we need is more capable Dmen so Zee can last us another 2-3 years.

Exactly. 0-3 before he returned from injury. Small sample size certainly...

I still don't think it's an issue of reducing his minutes below 22 per game, but he needs more capable support via a #2 and #3 defenseman.

 

[wintersej]

Exactly. 0-3 before he returned from injury. Small sample size certainly...

I still don't think it's an issue of reducing his minutes below 22 per game, but he needs more capable support via a #2 and #3 defenseman.

Great article. I agree he just needs a better helper more than fewer minutes.

 

[Artemis]

Great write up on him today on Weei's site-

http://www.weei.com/sports/boston/h...out-and-lot-stats-say-about-aging-zdeno-chara

It is amazing how much they depend on him- they were completely lost without him at the beginning of the year and he is pulling harder minutes than ever. With all the talk about Sweeny's work towards rebuilding/tooling and our beloved captain pushing 40 the transition talk makes sense, but there is NO WAY they could ice a decent team without him in the line up over the next couple years. He carries so much weight.

Great article, should be required reading. Funny that most of the people complaining about him now are the same ones who complained about him when he was at the absolute top of his game.

 

[CharasLazyWrister]

I definitely never claimed I'd rather have no Chara than Chara.

But, if I could trade Chara and start at least building, through whatever we got p=back, for a future #1 D, it's a trade I make. Would be disastrous if we ever lost the guy for basically nothing (whether it be through free agency, a bad trade, injury, etc.)

My issue lies with people who insists he's still an "elite shutdown #1 D-man". I'm sorry, but he's not. You can't convince me. I watch nearly every game...I consider my opinion on the matter pretty valid.

 

[njbruin*]

I definitely never claimed I'd rather have no Chara than Chara.

But, if I could trade Chara and start at least building, through whatever we got p=back, for a future #1 D, it's a trade I make. Would be disastrous if we ever lost the guy for basically nothing (whether it be through free agency, a bad trade, injury, etc.)

My issue lies with people who insists he's still an "elite shutdown #1 D-man". I'm sorry, but he's not. You can't convince me. I watch nearly every game...I consider my opinion on the matter pretty valid.

^ This. People can recognize that his play is clearly slipping but he's still an important piece on the current team. He should be on the 2nd pairing playing 18-22 minutes per night and never seeing the ice for the PP or in OT.

People want to argue he's still a #1, but he's not . The only argument would be that the Bruins don't have a clear #1 or #2 Dman but that doesn't make Chara either by default.

 

[CDJ]

No, he still is very much a #1. The peripheral numbers say it, the advanced numbers say it, and my eye test of this team without him says it. I don't even think it is debatable to be honest.

He's just not the best at it anymore. He's closer to #30 in the league than he is #5. But whatever, I'll take it at this point. He just needs a lot of help around him because the workload he is being asked to carry is far too much

 

[Latrappe]

He`s not a Norris guy anymore but I cringe at the thought of losing this guy for a significant part of the regular season, still very much a huge part of settling things down defensively, allows others to slide into a spot they are better served for.

Have to admit, pleasantly surprised with Seids game so far too, couple shots, put himself in good position to block a few shots...good start

Good point regarding Seids. He came out and perform very well from the get go. He deserve a TON of credit...

 

[Budddy]

https://twitter.com/dj_bean/status/693868896873549824

Interesting write up about Chara...

 

[PatriceBergeronFan]

^ This. People can recognize that his play is clearly slipping but he's still an important piece on the current team. He should be on the 2nd pairing playing 18-22 minutes per night and never seeing the ice for the PP or in OT.

People want to argue he's still a #1, but he's not . The only argument would be that the Bruins don't have a clear #1 or #2 Dman but that doesn't make Chara either by default.

There is a significant difference in 18 and 22 minutes. Chara is still a clear #1. As posted above he is closer to #30 than #5, but a #1 nonetheless.

Chara is still absolutely elite at the shutdown game. Ask the opposition how much they truly enjoy playing against Chara, regardless of what your biased eyes tell you.

His all around game has slipped with age and injury and he has simplified his game greatly -- that doesn't take anything away from the 'defense' aspect of the game.

It's one thing to target his skating or transition game... to attempt to detract from his actual defense is surprising.

 

[GloryDaze4877]

No, he still is very much a #1. The peripheral numbers say it, the advanced numbers say it, and my eye test of this team without him says it. I don't even think it is debatable to be honest.

He's just not the best at it anymore. He's closer to #30 in the league than he is #5. But whatever, I'll take it at this point. He just needs a lot of help around him because the workload he is being asked to carry is far too much

I don't think Z is a clear cut #1 anymore. He's a #1 on the B's but that says more about their D than his ability. He would be a #3 on NAS.

I don't know what "peripheral numbers" are, but I was looking at his giveaways and Hits and was not overly impressed. He has roughly the same number of giveaways this season as he had in 80 games in years past. The lockout year, 34 giveaways in 48 games, this year 61 in 47 games. The next closest guy is Krug with 36 and I would argue that TK handles the puck more than Z.

He has become a turnover machine this season.

 

[GordonHowe]

"(Fans Will) Just Want to Throw Him Away"

Great write up on him today on Weei's site-

http://www.weei.com/sports/boston/h...out-and-lot-stats-say-about-aging-zdeno-chara

It is amazing how much they depend on him- they were completely lost without him at the beginning of the year and he is pulling harder minutes than ever. With all the talk about Sweeny's work towards rebuilding/tooling and our beloved captain pushing 40 the transition talk makes sense, but there is NO WAY they could ice a decent team without him in the line up over the next couple years. He carries so much weight.

I was going to post this, too.

Very good insight from our nameless scout, and though I'm not a stats person, good statistical run down, too.

Two things the scout said that caught my eye, and have bothered me for awhile.

One, that so many fans trash Chara when he has a bad game, now & in the past, basically because he's not "fleet of foot," and because at 6' 9" he's a freak of nature and therefore very noticeable.

When he effs up, it's glaring. Yet so much of what he does right has always gone unnoticed and unappreciated.

And the second comment stems from the first: "Fans will just want to throw him away."

Think about that. Think about all Z has given to this organization, all he has done to reestablish the Bruins as a credible franchise. Think of the shape he keeps himself in. His character. His leadership.

And yet some are so short sighted, so stupid, in a word, they "forget" this. If they ever knew or cared.

It reminds of Thomas getting kicked in the ass on the way out the door. It reminds of the cavalier dismissal of Claude Julien's indisputable accomplishments -- and Peter Chiarelli's.

I am not saying the Bruins shouldn't trade Zdeno Chara, this year or any other. I'm saying, give the man the respect he has earned.

 

[Mr. Make-Believe]

I don't think Z is a clear cut #1 anymore. He's a #1 on the B's but that says more about their D than his ability. He would be a #3 on NAS.

I don't know what "peripheral numbers" are, but I was looking at his giveaways and Hits and was not overly impressed. He has roughly the same number of giveaways this season as he had in 80 games in years past. The lockout year, 34 giveaways in 48 games, this year 61 in 47 games. The next closest guy is Krug with 36 and I would argue that TK handles the puck more than Z.

He has become a turnover machine this season.

This is the one thing that is baffling me. I can understand slowing down with age... But I don't understand some of the questionable decisions he's making with the puck.

I figure it has to do with not having a reliable partner, but that's just a guess on my part.

 

[Artemis]

I was going to post this, too.

Very good insight from our nameless scout, and though I'm not a stats person, good statistical run down, too.

Two things the scout said that caught my eye, and have bothered me for awhile.

One, that so many fans trash Chara when he has a bad game, now & in the past, basically because he's not "fleet of foot," and because at 6' 9" he's a freak of nature and therefore very noticeable.

When he effs up, it's glaring. Yet so much of what he does right has always gone unnoticed and unappreciated.

And the second comment stems from the first: "Fans will just want to throw him away."

Think about that. Think about all Z has given to this organization, all he has done to reestablish the Bruins as a credible franchise. Think of the shape he keeps himself in. His character. His leadership.

And yet some are so short sighted, so stupid, in a word, they "forget" this. If they ever knew or cared.

It reminds of Thomas getting kicked in the ass on the way out the door. It reminds of the cavalier dismissal of Claude Julien's indisputable accomplishments -- and Peter Chiarelli's.

I am not saying the Bruins shouldn't trade Zdeno Chara, this year or any other. I'm saying, give the man the respect he has earned.

Well, the key word regarding those fans is "some," and as I said, they never appreciated Chara in the first place.

Felger has always ripped Chara, which demonstrates to me more than anything that the guy has no clue when it comes to understanding hockey.

As with Bergeron, his peers have always respected Chara, and IMHO they, in the end, are the ones who really count.

 

[CharasLazyWrister]

Good point regarding Seids. He came out and perform very well from the get go. He deserve a TON of credit...

Not enough people are recognizing Seids' for what he has done.

The guy's come back from a major knee surgery late in his career and has been a pretty solid rock on D. He's never going to be at a point where he can make a significant contribution on offense as he once did, but in my opinion, he's done a tremendous job recognizing his role and really harnessing all that his body can give.

 

[CharasLazyWrister]

Well, the key word regarding those fans is "some," and as I said, they never appreciated Chara in the first place.

Felger has always ripped Chara, which demonstrates to me more than anything that the guy has no clue when it comes to understanding hockey.

As with Bergeron, his peers have always respected Chara, and IMHO they, in the end, are the ones who really count.

There are about 1,000 other things that tell me Felger knows nothing about hockey.

I'm also sure that Max Talbot and Chris Kelly receive immense respect from the Bruins' players. That doesn't mean they shouldn't be included in the right deal. That's where you're forgetting to separate the business from the friendships.

 

[GordonHowe]

Well, the key word regarding those fans is "some," and as I said, they never appreciated Chara in the first place.

Felger has always ripped Chara, which demonstrates to me more than anything that the guy has no clue when it comes to understanding hockey.

As with Bergeron, his peers have always respected Chara, and IMHO they, in the end, are the ones who really count.

In using the word "some," I'm being charitable. Too many have no idea how intelligent he is, or how hard he's worked to become a great player. At best, they think he's King Kong.

The respect of your peers is always more meaningful to players than that of fans, I'm sure. Still...

 

[CharasLazyWrister]

This is the one thing that is baffling me. I can understand slowing down with age... But I don't understand some of the questionable decisions he's making with the puck.

I figure it has to do with not having a reliable partner, but that's just a guess on my part.

A big part of the reason Z has fit so well in Claude's system is because he's always been defense first (which all true star #1's are) and because he adheres directly to the system. Now that he's slowed down to the extent he has, he's relying more and more on the simplicities of the system.

I can't tell you how many times this season I've seen a great chance for an outlet pass only to see Chara bury his head and either ice it/or flip it to the opposition in the neutral zone. You can say "that's not on Chara" all you want, but if there's a pass available, I want to see him with his head up looking to make it. Not just following the system and hoping/praying it gets past the onrushing opposition/winger. For the record, I blame this part of Z's game as much on Claude as I do him.

 

[GloryDaze4877]

This is the one thing that is baffling me. I can understand slowing down with age... But I don't understand some of the questionable decisions he's making with the puck.

I figure it has to do with not having a reliable partner, but that's just a guess on my part.

A really good D partner would help, but the fact that the all of Chara's D partners seem to defer to him...doesn't. Chara would be far more effective if he let his partner (esp if it's a guy like Chiller) handle the puck most of the time.

 

[njbruin*]

There is a significant difference in 18 and 22 minutes. Chara is still a clear #1. As posted above he is closer to #30 than #5, but a #1 nonetheless.

Chara is still absolutely elite at the shutdown game. Ask the opposition how much they truly enjoy playing against Chara, regardless of what your biased eyes tell you.

His all around game has slipped with age and injury and he has simplified his game greatly -- that doesn't take anything away from the 'defense' aspect of the game.

It's one thing to target his skating or transition game... to attempt to detract from his actual defense is surprising.

What's more cloudy "bias-vision" or "homer-vision". Chara's all around game has slipped significantly including his defensive game. He's constantly getting beat wide by anyone with a modicum of speed, and he handles the puck like its a live hand grenade, especially in the defensive zone. He very rarely uses his size to punish his opponent, and quite honestly if it wasn't for his stick and reach I'd say he's playing more like a 3rd paring defenseman.

Having said that he still can play a very important role on this team , but his minutes have to get reduced and he needs to realize he's no longer an offensive force in this new NHL. If he plays limited minutes and stays off the PP, we may be able to milk another 2 years out of his contract.