Your Rebuild Opinion? Next Move Coming?

[Lazlo Hollyfeld]

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Amazing work good sir. Thank you for that!

Now can someone set up a bot to spam Chris Ilitch’s inbox with this image?

 

[dalem177]

making the playoffs with a team that has no shot really has no point. See red wings hockey 2010 to 2016

get in and anything can happen simply translates as good being the enemy of great

Your statement makes more sense for a team on the tail end of a 25-year run than it does for a team trying to be at the end of a 9-year drought. There is valuable experience and evaluation to be had in 4 1st round blowout games for a team that's never been.

 

[Retire91]

Your statement makes more sense for a team on the tail end of a 25-year run than it does for a team trying to be at the end of a 9-year drought. There is valuable experience and evaluation to be had in 4 1st round blowout games for a team that's never been.

There is no reason to believe playoffs are completely off the table staying the course next season if we get several more of our draft picks on the team and they make immediate impacts in the same way that has been happening since 2021

 

[JohanFranzenstein]

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This hurts my soul. That is my all time favorite hockey photo.

 

[jkutswings]

There is no reason to believe playoffs are completely off the table staying the course next season if we get several more of our draft picks on the team and they make immediate impacts in the same way that has been happening since 2021

And if the absolute ceiling is having an outside chance of maybe squeaking into the playoffs - because management once again couldn't be bothered to cough up an asset or two and swing a meaningful trade to move things forward - then I'm not going to even bother watching.

Dear front office: There's no salary cap discount for keeping all five hundred of your draft picks while continuing to employ stooges like Holl and retreads like Tarasenko and Mrazek.

DO BETTER. BE BETTER.

 

[Gniwder]

And if the absolute ceiling is having an outside chance of maybe squeaking into the playoffs - because management once again couldn't be bothered to cough up an asset or two and swing a meaningful trade to move things forward - then I'm not going to even bother watching.

Dear front office: There's no salary cap discount for keeping all five hundred of your draft picks while continuing to employ stooges like Holl and retreads like Tarasenko and Mrazek.

DO BETTER. BE BETTER.

If the team looks like a borderline bubble team at the beginning of the season, there's zero chance they'll make the playoffs. This team can't stay healthy and has no depth. If a player of Copp's level got injured on any other team, it's a minor inconvenience that can be replaced with a TDL trade. For the Wings it's a disaster because he was playing 2C, and Stevie won't buy at the deadline.

I'm probably not watching either, at least not every game.

 

[wingsfannnn9191]

If the team looks like a borderline bubble team at the beginning of the season, there's zero chance they'll make the playoffs. This team can't stay healthy and has no depth. If a player of Copp's level got injured on any other team, it's a minor inconvenience that can be replaced with a TDL trade. For the Wings it's a disaster because he was playing 2C, and Stevie won't buy at the deadline.

I'm probably not watching either, at least not every game.

Problem is copp and compher have multiple years left and if it were up to me 1 if not both would be gone. Tarasenko has to be gone somehow , Gustafsson,holl ... possibly one of the goalies , I’m sure I’m forgetting other guys

I’d get rid of chiarot but I know Yzerman won’t ... problem is countless guys need to be gone and I can’t imagine Yzerman would get rid of 5-8 guys and add in new players and make room for the likes of danielson,mazur,asp,lombardi to get a legit shot

If most of the same crew returns and just like mazur makes the team it’s another turdfest headed our way

 

[dalem177]

Least-qualified opinion here:

• Holl has got to go. I don't know how. I don't care how. He's simply not good. He's a Husso who won't do the favor of injuring himself twice a season.
• I'd like for Tank to go, but I don't know if that's possible.
• I don't know if Gustafsson is bad. I think he is, but I don't know. I also don't know if he can be cut loose.
• I like OT Benny. I agree with those who say he should slot in as 2d or 3d pair though, ideally.
• Berggren confuses me a little. 4th liner maybe? I WANT to like him.
• Ras... Man. I want him to be better. He has flashes. I dunno. My man-crush on his crazy-eyes blinds me to reality, maybe.
• I don't hate Compher as a 3d line center. I like him as a 4th line center better, because maybe that means D-Boss is #1, Kasper #2, and Copp #3.
• I like AlJo.
• Dunno about Motte.
• I think Petry does fine when he's slotted correctly. I would like it if the toughest question to ask every night would be "why are you icing Petry?"

I know I'm supposed to be angry or something about this season but honestly I didn't expect them to make it and I'm psyched it still took the last handful of games to squeeze them out. This season was SO MUCH BETTER than the dogpoop seasons of just a few years ago!



Besides, at the start of the season a bunch of smart hockey guys here and elsewhere told me that the offensive points lost via trades and the team's shooting percentage normalizing a bit were going to dictate a very near miss for the playoffs. If I didn't start out claiming that position as my own, after a few weeks that's where I landed.

We got to see a few of the kids on NHL ice, and I don't think any of them disappointed.

So, sorry-not-sorry, I'm disappointed, but a pretty un-hating fan right now.

 

[Go Wings]

making the playoffs with a team that has no shot really has no point. See red wings hockey 2010 to 2016

get in and anything can happen simply translates as good being the enemy of great

Detroit has missed the playoffs for 9 straight years. So yah there is a point regardless of how they do.

 

[Gniwder]

Detroit has missed the playoffs for 9 straight years. So yah there is a point regardless of how they do.

Also, making the playoffs means we're watching quality hockey after the TDL. Something that also hasn't happened in 9 years.

I'll settle for halfway decent hockey at this point, lol.

 

[WF19]

Make a splash in free agency, dump the trash and let the kids play.

 

[Oddbob]

Yeah, can't be another offseason of adding players in the Gus and Tank level and hoping maybe Mazur and maybe ASP and maybe Danielson are on the team. Steve's only somewhat aggressive move to date was trading for DeBrincat and I wonder if Alex hadn't wanted out of Ottawa and to come here, would Steve have made another bigger move? I have my doubts, and that is said as a fan of Yzerman as GM. He tried to trade for Trouba last offseason and that fell through, but he didn't make any other move instead. And I don't care if he tried, he needed to make another move and he didn't.

Patience is indeed needed in a draft approach to a rebuild, but how long is too long, as we are entering year 7 with Steve in charge, and I think the patience window has to be pretty small right now.

 

[better Red than Dead]

How about a trade where Detroit acquires Chris Kreider from the NYRangers with Tarasenko gojng back to the Rangers. Detroit gets a Power Forward and rid themselves of a mistake, and the Rangers get someone to take Kreider

 

[AtlantaHotWings]

I think this coach will be demanding changes to the front office vs last's coach.

Disappointed Detroit Red Wings search for purpose: 'Always something to play for'

Todd's quote from it talking about the players

"Some have had great years – incredible years, really – finish that way. Some have been middling, we've been waiting – go out the right way. And then there’s been some we’ve been waiting on forever, and if they just want to pack their bags up and go home and have it end that way, well then, they’re telling us something."

 

[JohanFranzenstein]

How about a trade where Detroit acquires Chris Kreider from the NYRangers with Tarasenko gojng back to the Rangers. Detroit gets a Power Forward and rid themselves of a mistake, and the Rangers get someone to take Kreider

Problem is, he's been a $6 million pylon this year. His style of play doesn't translate well to mid-late 30's, which is exactly where he's at.

 

[Winger98]

I think this coach will be demanding changes to the front office vs last's coach.

Disappointed Detroit Red Wings search for purpose: 'Always something to play for'

Todd's quote from it talking about the players

"Some have had great years – incredible years, really – finish that way. Some have been middling, we've been waiting – go out the right way. And then there’s been some we’ve been waiting on forever, and if they just want to pack their bags up and go home and have it end that way, well then, they’re telling us something."

there's a very real chance that one of the changes the last coach demanded was moving Walman.

 

[cjm502]

I think this coach will be demanding changes to the front office vs last's coach.

Disappointed Detroit Red Wings search for purpose: 'Always something to play for'

Todd's quote from it talking about the players

"Some have had great years – incredible years, really – finish that way. Some have been middling, we've been waiting – go out the right way. And then there’s been some we’ve been waiting on forever, and if they just want to pack their bags up and go home and have it end that way, well then, they’re telling us something."

Ones level of play when the playoffs are out of reach says a lot more about that player than their level of play when they are still fighting for a playoff spot. You either build a team full of DAWGS, or a team full of quitters. After 82 games, one team will do a lot better than the other. TMac knows.

 

[Retire91]

Detroit has missed the playoffs for 9 straight years. So yah there is a point regardless of how they do.

I think the strategy has been clear, no shortcuts that don't synch with long term goals. If we make the playoffs fine but the priority is collect "core" talent. If the right deal comes up it will happen if not it's more development.

 

[Retire91]

And if the absolute ceiling is having an outside chance of maybe squeaking into the playoffs - because management once again couldn't be bothered to cough up an asset or two and swing a meaningful trade to move things forward - then I'm not going to even bother watching.

Dear front office: There's no salary cap discount for keeping all five hundred of your draft picks while continuing to employ stooges like Holl and retreads like Tarasenko and Mrazek.

DO BETTER. BE BETTER.

I personally choose to admire someone who is sticking to the plan, especially when that plan is working.

We missed the playoffs by one point and then had a year where it slipped, the first year of the entire rebuild that our record didn't improve. The panic button leads to panic results.

 

[Retire91]

Your statement makes more sense for a team on the tail end of a 25-year run than it does for a team trying to be at the end of a 9-year drought. There is valuable experience and evaluation to be had in 4 1st round blowout games for a team that's never been.

I am all for making the playoffs, I am just against blowing resources for temporary solutions to make it happen when we are only a few seasons from it happening organically. If a deal happens that is a legit jump in talent and fits with the core then by all means let's do it. Kinda feeling like if those deals were out there they would already be done though.

 

[jkutswings]

I personally choose to admire someone who is sticking to the plan, especially when that plan is working.

We missed the playoffs by one point and then had a year where it slipped, the first year of the entire rebuild that our record didn't improve. The panic button leads to panic results.

You're creating a false narrative. There's no panic whatsoever. In other posts on the topic I've deliberately explained that it's not swinging for the fences at all costs our making a move just for the sake of it.

What Yzerman is doing is keeping all his picks, year after year. But the longer he employs that approach, the greater the surplus of prospects versus roster spots. So eventually, either he deals away some assets or at least some of his picks will become wasted assets that never provide any value.

Here's an example. Option 1: Detroit deals a 2nd and a 3rd rounder in 2025, maybe with a lesser prospect attached, to acquire a second line NHL forward. That forward increases roster scoring by 15-20 points during the 2025-26 season, leading to another 3-4 wins. Option 2: Detroit makes all its selections in the 2025 draft. Now those two picks become Detroit prospects. Statistics say that the most likely outcome of those prospects is either bottom half of the lineup NHL players or AHL guys that never make it in the NHL. Either way, that's less value than the NHL forward from Option 1.

It's actually the opposite of panic: it's smart asset management. If you can land NHL players that are more impactful than the average outcome of the draft slots involved, it's a win. So go get a second pairing defenseman and a decent winger, make the roster better, and you'll still have draft picks to use if you want to.

Or stay the course for a few more years and approach having to trade Larkin before the roster is ready. Then you'll definitely be in a position closer to panic when it comes to winning a trade.

 

[MBauer]

Kasper’s significantly better as a rookie than Larkin was (not having to play center, and on Zetterberg’s wing the entire season).

And Danielson is better than Kasper.

So Danielson>Kasper>Larkin? Just straight up delusion at this point, the disrespect to Larkin because he's had a mostly rough year is insane. Danielson is most definetely not better than Kasper, who's only 5 months older btw. Larkin was A 60+ center at 21, which is the earliest Danielson could make the NHL.

 

[Retire91]

You're creating a false narrative. There's no panic whatsoever. In other posts on the topic I've deliberately explained that it's not swinging for the fences at all costs our making a move just for the sake of it.

What Yzerman is doing is keeping all his picks, year after year. But the longer he employs that approach, the greater the surplus of prospects versus roster spots. So eventually, either he deals away some assets or at least some of his picks will become wasted assets that never provide any value.

Here's an example. Option 1: Detroit deals a 2nd and a 3rd rounder in 2025, maybe with a lesser prospect attached, to acquire a second line NHL forward. That forward increases roster scoring by 15-20 points during the 2025-26 season, leading to another 3-4 wins. Option 2: Detroit makes all its selections in the 2025 draft. Now those two picks become Detroit prospects. Statistics say that the most likely outcome of those prospects is either bottom half of the lineup NHL players or AHL guys that never make it in the NHL. Either way, that's less value than the NHL forward from Option 1.

It's actually the opposite of panic: it's smart asset management. If you can land NHL players that are more impactful than the average outcome of the draft slots involved, it's a win. So go get a second pairing defenseman and a decent winger, make the roster better, and you'll still have draft picks to use if you want to.

Or stay the course for a few more years and approach having to trade Larkin before the roster is ready. Then you'll definitely be in a position closer to panic when it comes to winning a trade.

If you can get someone to give up a player that moves the dial for second and third round picks. I am not against trading or signing players. But I don't think its bad asset management to keep drafting. You take longshots on players and if they clearly don't work out over a few seasons and you move on from them and replace with a new crop. Sooner or later one of those picks is a Bertuzzi or Hronek. We haven't had much luck in the second and third rounds yet but that could change. If we can get a second liner that, fits the age range of the core, with a handful of those picks I wouldn't be against it. But odds against that happening without adding and creating another hole are slim.

 

[Gniwder]

Patience is indeed needed in a draft approach to a rebuild, but how long is too long, as we are entering year 7 with Steve in charge, and I think the patience window has to be pretty small right now.

The NHL record for a GM is 8 years without making the playoffs. A 10 year playoff drought would put the team second all time behind the current Sabres. I get that people love Stevie, but this is getting to a record level of futility.

In order to build through the draft, you actually have to be good at drafting. This team has not been good enough at drafting, and Stevie has to take the fall for that if they miss the playoffs next season.

I'm OK with one more season though I may not be watching many games.

 

[SirloinUB]

The NHL record for a GM is 8 years without making the playoffs. A 10 year playoff drought would put the team second all time behind the current Sabres. I get that people love Stevie, but this is getting to a record level of futility.

In order to build through the draft, you actually have to be good at drafting. This team has not been good enough at drafting, and Stevie has to take the fall for that if they miss the playoffs next season.

I'm OK with one more season though I may not be watching many games.

What a bizarre evaluation. On one hand you acknowledge they were rebuilding through the draft and on the other you grumble about “8 years” as if the goal was to make playoffs for all 8 years.

What were your expectations for this team 3 8 years ago?

when seider and Raymond were rookies and sophomores, ASP/Kasper/Danielson were undrafted, Ed was in his D + 1/2 seasons, al jo was a developing 2nd rounder, Zadina Berggren and Rasmussen were the senior prospect’s of note, no Debrincat and guys like Mantha/Bert were the best assets to work with behind Larkin, what were your expectations?

The goal was to be bad for 5ish years drafting inside the top 10 and develop those pieces slowly improving.

Also, what are you talking about the drafting has been bad? No it hasn’t. The drafting has been very good.

They’ve drafted developed:
- point/game two way 1st line winger
- 50 point 1st pair D
- a 2/3 Dman than can carry a 2nd pair
- a good top 6 winger/ possible 2nd line center
- a mobile two way 4/5 dman.
- an additional highly regard prospect poop with what, 9ish guys that have a shot to be useful nhl player on the way