Would you trade Bouchard?

[MessierII]

I want Bouchard locked down for 8 years and I would pay over 9 million to do it.

 

[Tobias Kahun]

Because Team Canada is being built by nincompoops that don't understand stats?

Also somewhat related: me literally every time I see a "BUT HE LEADS THE TEAM IN GIVEAWAYS" argument

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Some posters would be shocked when they look at the league leaders in giveaways.

It’s almost like the players who gave the puck the most and constantly trying to make plays will have more.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

I want Bouchard locked down for 8 years and I would pay over 9 million to do it.

I'd like him to come in at a little cheaper than that but yeah we don't need him getting poached by an offer sheet.

 

[MessierII]

I'd like him to come in at a little cheaper than that but yeah we don't need him getting poached by an offer sheet.

I would too ideally but there’s no scenario where I don’t want him locked down for 8 years. To me he is as big a piece of the core as Connor and Leon.

 

[Canovin]

Ekholm doesn’t get 45 points without Bouchard though. He got that because his D partner is one of the best offensive D in the game.

True. He's probably get more than 45 points if he played on the 1st unit PP tho

 

[MessierII]

True. He's probably get more than 45 points if he played on the 1st unit PP tho

Maybe but he doesn’t really have the skill set to be there. Obviously anyone would get a bump playing on our PP.

 

[Canovin]

Maybe but he doesn’t really have the skill set to be there. Obviously anyone would get a bump playing on our PP.

Ekholm plays on the 2nd unit. What do you mean he doesn't have the skillset to be there? lol

 

[MessierII]

Ekholm plays on the 2nd unit. What do you mean he doesn't have the skillset to be there? lol

If Ekholm is your lone D on your top PP unit that’s not a good thing.

 

[Canovin]

If Ekholm is your lone D on your top PP unit that’s not a good thing.

I disagree. Ekholm would be a fantastic choice for the 1st unit. He doesn't waste time hesitating to throw a bomb like Bouchard does.

 

[MessierII]

I disagree. Ekholm would be a fantastic choice for the 1st unit. He doesn't waste time hesitating to throw a bomb like Bouchard does.

The only time Ekholm scores on a bomb is an uncontested look from inside the hash marks.

 

[FlameChampion]

This team is going to have a hard time finding a 2D let alone trying to find a 1D if we were to move him.

I understand the people who get frustrated with him though. He makes a lot of head scratching plays. I think people can accept when he turns the puck on a scoring play but he has so many bad plays where he launches a grenade up the middle for either no reason or a poor reason.

I hope he doesn’t cost $10m though.

The guy has been lights out in the playoffs as well. That’s another reason I wouldn’t personally move him.

 

[McDoused]

You absolutely lock in Bouchard long term, especially with the cap going up. Fans need to change their perspective of what guys are going to get paid with a 100M cap. He had 114 points last year and continues to drive play (3rd on the team in CF%, 4th in SF%, 6th xGF%, 4th in SCF% and 7th in HDCF%). Fans like to hate on Bouchard because he doesn't match their eye test. Simply, he works with our top guys and doesn't rely on them to produce. Bouchard has a 60.51 CF% with McDavid and a 59.61 CF% without. McDavid is 60.7 CF% without Bouchard and without either its 48.99%. With Draisaitl they are 62.1 CF% and without he's 58.56 CF%. Draisaitl actually drops more without Bouchard to 56.04% and without either its 47.92%. This team is better with Bouchard on it.

 

[Juxta Position]

People seem to forget Bouchard was arguably our second best player in the playoffs of a team that went to game 7 of the finals.

Add to that, Bouchard had the 3rd most points in NHL history by a defenseman in a single playoff year, and now holds the all-time record for assists by a defenseman in a single playoff year.

You don't "luck" into a record like that, and you don't trade a player capable of that kind of production for a Sean Durzi and spare parts.

Bouchard is prone to brain farts, but you take those when that player can literally put up historic numbers for you. You know who else gave the puck away a ton? Paul Coffey

 

[bobbythebrain]

It's not wrong at all. It's a known fact around the NHL. Other teams scout this.

For example when Bouchard has the puck on the point in the Offensive zone he holds on to it too long before moving it or shooting it. He processes too slowly so a lot of his passes/ shots are getting picked off. Players like Kucherov or Drai already know where they want to pass the puck before they receive it. They are always thinking. (like Wayne)

Because Bouchard processes the game slowly teams are pressing him when he has the puck. They skate right at him and force him to decide fast.

Bouchard needs to have the puck on his stick before he decides what to do with it. This makes him look lackadaisical and lost on the ice.

I called this last year.

I know you hate Bouchard but it's pretty pathetic that you need to lie and make stuff up. This is a hockey forum, we love to talk hockey. So why not just be truthful instead of soiling it with your made up bullsh*t?

First off, his passes are no where being effected or the problem. This can proved by the countless dominant cycles the top line has every game. In particular, he is excellent at getting the puck down low to McD coming from behind the net. In MOST cases he makes this pass by pausing and allowing McJesus to get into position. It's LITERALLY a SET PLAY that happens always a game. So what you just wrote is a complete lie about "processing slow" That break pass from the blueline to Nuge the other night was a high IQ play. If it wasn't, Kulak and Emberson would be doing all the time too

Second. Players aren't rushing him more. Bouchard block shots have been reduced to the mean. Going back to juniors, he blew away his competition at getting pucks thru. This year he is struggling internally and with confidence. . It has NOTHING to do with what other teams are doing...hence....the MEAN.

This can be proved in several ways. Yes, i said proved as i like to speak in facts, reality and basic common sense. You should try it

1. Missed nets. Bouchard is missing alot more nets, especially when he has time and space. It's evident he is struggling with confidence. Last year where he was hitting posts and missing by inches, he is now missing by feet. Dude has barely hit a post this year compared to the dozens last year

2. Break out passes. Much like the blocked shots, Bouchard likes to feather it by forcheckers. He constantly did this last year, lofting it past them by mere inches. This year he has alot more giveaways and deflections cuz his aim is off

3. Bobbling pucks. This needs no explanation. Just look at last game. And oh ya, NONE of those mishandles had ANYTHING to do with the other teams forecheck. They were unimpeded

Your post was a fabrication to pat yourself on the back

His shot almost murdered Podz twice and broke Hymans nose...but sure, let's give credit to the other teams for that LOLOL

 

[bobbythebrain]

Watch the games... He looks lost out there and teams have changed the way the defend the player.

Bouchard will start playing better. I'm calling that now, but no way he replicates last years performance.

Total lie. When the puck goes to the point...EVERY team and winger rushes the point.

If teams actually adjusted to Bouchard...HE WOULDNT GET THE PUCK unless you're suggesting that Drai and McDavid are morons to pass a covered player?

So you actually don't hate Bouchard? You actually dislike Leon and McDavid for making bad passes. Too bad those idiots process the game too slow to recognize Bouchard is covered

 

[Cup or Bust]

If the deal was right I would.

 

[ManofSteel55]

I only trade Bouchard in the summer if he is asking for way too much money. It's hard to find a defenseman with his skill set, even if he does have a few issues. Finding one that can play the right side is nearly unheard of outside of the draft.

Total lie. When the puck goes to the point...EVERY team and winger rushes the point.

If teams actually adjusted to Bouchard...HE WOULDNT GET THE PUCK unless you're suggesting that Drai and McDavid are morons to pass a covered player?

So you actually don't hate Bouchard? You actually dislike Leon and McDavid for making bad passes. Too bad those idiots process the game too slow to recognize Bouchard is covered

This. Teams know that Bouchard is a major weapon out there. The only "adjustment" to him has been that teams are watching the pass to the point more, to take away his shooting lanes. This opens up more space for the rest of the teams offensive players to work their magic down low, and create scoring chances. Then they come back down low to cover the forwards, and it opens the weapon at the point back up. He's a valuable player to have back there.

He's also very good at holding the blueline - it used to be an issue with his play that I really didn't like, but he's really good at keeping the puck in, which helps us from having to re-set the play and try to gain the zone again.

 

[ManOfSteelI]

The haters really won't like this...

 

[Fourier]

Some posters would be shocked when they look at the league leaders in giveaways.

It’s almost like the players who gave the puck the most and constantly trying to make plays will have more.

Going back to 22-23 here are the forwards with the most giveaways

1) Pastrnak 279
2) Kucherov 274
3) Draisaitl 253
4) Panarin 231
5) Jack Hughes 229
6) Marner 225

And here are the top defensemen:

1) Erik Karlsson 252
2) Bouchard 236
3) Weeger 229
4) Matheson 211
5) Hedman 204
6) Kovacevic 202
7) Letang 198
8) Hanifin 195

Note that there is a pattern in this group with perhaps one notable exception.

 

[Lannes]

Go back a decade and you'll probably see this exact same thread with Petry....except Bouchard is the far better Dman. This organization and certain fans never learn. Not enough that we undervalued basically all our young talent this summer and lost them, we want to do the same to a top 10 Dman in the league because he makes mistakes. Unbelievable.

I'd like to 'thumbs up' every word of this.

Except this time, we have actually already SEEN this guy utterly dominate the playoffs and we're still whining.

 

[oXo Cube]

The haters really won't like this...

? The haters will just ignore it like every other time.

They're smarter than everyone else in the room after all.

 

[Whoshattenkirkshoes]

? The haters will just ignore it like every other time.

They're smarter than everyone else in the room after all.

Best defensive season to date is a stretch.

This shows 2 things.

1. People are incredibly bias
2. Stats aren’t everything. Some of you guys are way to reliant on “stats”

Clearly I’m not ignoring the subject. Come back and talk to me in 3 years when Bouchard isn’t any better and doesn’t match his post season production of last year.

I’m not going to beat a dead horse anymore. You all know my opinion on the subject.

 

[Gunnersaurus Rex]

The haters really won't like this...

In fairness, this guy is just about the biggest Bouchard promoter out there. Bouchard could score an own goal firing it directly into the Oilers empty net and he'd talk about what a great breakout play he made to get in the open to take that shot.

If he's so great defensively, why does KK never have him out defending the lead in the final minutes of a 1 goal game? Always rotates 14/49 & 25/27. That home game recently against LA, Bouchard didn't see the ice for the final 3-1/2 minutes.

 

[Kamus]

Unless you have hundreds of posters ignored, that's just a flat out lie.

I read your posts. They're mostly just bleating about how bad Bouchard is and absolving Skinner of any responsibility for his own subpar play.


Dobson is the dollar store version of Bouchard. He's bad at everything Bouchard is bad at, not as good at everything Bouchard is good at, and has been a playoff no-show.

I'd love to see how Bouchard looks playing in front of a guy like Sorokin, though.

Let’s say Dobson comes in at 8 and Bouchard comes in at 9.5? If not, what would Dobsons salary have to be compared to 9.5 of Bouchard for you to make the trade if at all.

 

[Dazed and Confused]

and see, for me, I don't care how many high picks and depth pieces I'm being offered.

Bouchard to Durzi is a downgrade, and a sizeable one. Contenders don't downgrade their defence to pick up a bunch of stuff.

Also consider if you trade Bouchard for stuff and then stuff for Durzi, what's left over? a 2nd maybe? A B prospect? That doesn't make sense.

I tossed out CAR as a quick example, but my baseline if they were to move is something like the Seth Jones-level return. Otherwise your right, it's not worth it.


And honestly I do thing it's a near slam dunk he back next year. The only way I see him not returning is if he doesn't reboard to last year's level at any point and still asks for the moon in the offseason.

The haters really won't like this...

He's this generation's Sergi Gonchar.
Generally plays solid defence, and can go up against elites without too much problem. But his issue is the (comparatively few) mistakes he does make stand out like a sore thumb because they are of the complete and utter WTF, brain-dead variety...

Both sides can have a point on this.