Would you take Ekblad back at a "hometown" discount (4-5 million AAV)

[Jean Luc Discard]

he's just not that bad. he's got bad posture and a bit of an awkward stride

 

[RogerRogerr]

There you go again. Winning a cup doesn't magically make a player better.

Ekblad will have to take serious discount on his next new contract to stay with the team. If he doesn't, then some other chump can pay the premium for a 'Stanley Cup champion'.

It doesn't make him a better player. But it does mean that he was good enough to be #2D on a team that managed to win the Cup. If he was such a big liability, he would have been feasted on and we wouldn't have gone past a couple of rounds, or he would have been dropped in the lineup. We play our D in a way that mitigate their reliance on footspeed and in the playoffs, players get away with more clutching and grabbing and Ek is good at that.
If Ek stays, he'll get less than now but more than 2.5M.

 

[zeroG]

There you go again. Winning a cup doesn't magically make a player better.

Ekblad will have to take serious discount on his next new contract to stay with the team. If he doesn't, then some other chump can pay the premium for a 'Stanley Cup champion'.

we have some evidence in front of us and that is - ekblad played top pair minutes as the panthers went through one of the most difficult paths to winning a stanley cup in history. (i think it was 6th on list using some modern model).

the difficulty rank of the path is not what's important, though. any path will include deep and skilled teams as rounds progress. here are his numbers from the playoffs last year.

GP	G	A	P	+/-	PIM	TOI/G
24	1	5	6	+4	16	22:33

for comparison's sake, montour had 11 points, 4 of which were PP. so that's the primary difference between the two. they played similar minutes overall, montour averaging 9 seconds more per game, explained completely by his presence on the PP. montour is two years older. his new contract is north of 7M/yr over 7 years.

sure, montour is a beast physically and more fluid/faster skater and that explains to some degree why a team would be willing to give him that term. but the numbers are the numbers. ekblad played the (much) more difficult minutes last postseason and we won every series.

i'm not saying winning the cup made him better. i'm saying we won the cup because he's better than you think. and there is hard evidence to support this assertion.

all that said, i don't think ek is going to get 7M from us. he almost certainly could on the open market, not based on the fact he's a champion, but based on the fact that's what players who can play his minutes and produce get paid.

i don't think he will get the same term as monty based on his injury history and i don't think he will ask for the same money here given the existing salary structure where you have players giving significant discounts to stay. but i do think he's extremely valuable at a lower number. whether zito feels he can get better value remains to be seen but there's a saying - a bird in hand is better than two in the bush.

 

[zeroG]

View attachment 917794

make all the jokes you want. effective is effective.

 

[ProjectPanthers]

Ekblad isn't a strong skater, not a good one. He's not even an average skater. He's a below average skater which is something you don't want to see from your highest earning dman. His skating ability, or lack thereof, makes me question his hockey IQ department because if he acknowledges his limitations in this regard then why does he have to e.g. make these desperate pinch attempts where he loses the race to the puck (even when he has the advantage in distance to the puck) and he ends up allowing breakaway attempts to go the other way.

Sure, Ekblad plays ~20mins on a regular basis but MStaal did that too but I don't see anyone lamenting about his absence on the team. It all boils down to the quality of effort that he provides.

I'm not sure why you'd want to remind me about the title of the thread when I already said what Zito should offer: 2.5milx6. That's not going to happen because Ekblad and his agent want both money and term. He's not going to accept a 2 year deal where the mgmt could mitigate the risk and see where Ekblad is at both health and stats wise because he might be another Yandle in a year or two. At 2.5mil he could be bought out at a reasonable cap penalty but Zito strikes me as a fellow who wants to maintain a nice and tidy cap sheet where all the money spent is on active Panther players.

You're not really offering much proof or examples that really show that Ekblad is this massive deterrent to the team that needs to go unless he gets paid like a 6th dman. Your entire logic painted all over this thread is "lolheskatesbad". Criticizing the guy for playing the system the coach asks him to?

Imagine offering your decade long #1 defenseman who helped get you (the first year badly injured from round 1 onward mind you) to two Stanley Cup finals and a championship basically the same money Calgary offered Ryan Lomberg

 

[RogerRogerr]

You're not really offering much proof or examples that really show that Ekblad is this massive deterrent to the team that needs to go unless he gets paid like a 6th dman. Your entire logic painted all over this thread is "lolheskatesbad". Criticizing the guy for playing the system the coach asks him to?

Imagine offering your decade long #1 defenseman who helped get you (the first year badly injured from round 1 onward mind you) to two Stanley Cup finals and a championship basically the same money Calgary offered Ryan Lomberg

To be fair, being paid 2.5M would mean he's the second highest paid dman on the team.

 

[I am not exposed]

we have some evidence in front of us and that is - ekblad played top pair minutes as the panthers went through one of the most difficult paths to winning a stanley cup in history. (i think it was 6th on list using some modern model).

the difficulty rank of the path is not what's important, though. any path will include deep and skilled teams as rounds progress. here are his numbers from the playoffs last year.

GP	G	A	P	+/-	PIM	TOI/G
24	1	5	6	+4	16	22:33

for comparison's sake, montour had 11 points, 4 of which were PP. so that's the primary difference between the two. they played similar minutes overall, montour averaging 9 seconds more per game, explained completely by his presence on the PP. montour is two years older. his new contract is north of 7M/yr over 7 years.

sure, montour is a beast physically and more fluid/faster skater and that explains to some degree why a team would be willing to give him that term. but the numbers are the numbers. ekblad played the (much) more difficult minutes last postseason and we won every series.

i'm not saying winning the cup made him better. i'm saying we won the cup because he's better than you think. and there is hard evidence to support this assertion.

all that said, i don't think ek is going to get 7M from us. he almost certainly could on the open market, not based on the fact he's a champion, but based on the fact that's what players who can play his minutes and produce get paid.

i don't think he will get the same term as monty based on his injury history and i don't think he will ask for the same money here given the existing salary structure where you have players giving significant discounts to stay. but i do think he's extremely valuable at a lower number. whether zito feels he can get better value remains to be seen but there's a saying - a bird in hand is better than two in the bush.

Can you please provide this hard evidence? Because saying he played a lot of minutes isn't it.

Btw, I think Ekblad is okay as a mid pairing Dman currently. He gets his arse covered a lot when he's on the top pair.

His game will not age well. This spiel about look at all these minutes he played is something the agent will use when negotiating a new contract. Thankfully Zito seems quite astute and probably won't fall for such nonsense. By the time his next contract comes around, it should be a noticeable discount to what he is currently earning. I'm sure some GM will be out there thinking like you and offer him too much because he played a lot of minutes on a Stanley Cup run being supported by his defensive partner. Thankfully that will be there problem, not ours. As someone already mentioned, Marc Staal played 20:56 on our run to the final. Wow, top pairing minutes! But you don't see GMs queuing to pay him top dollar.

 

[Jean Luc Discard]

Can you please provide this hard evidence? Because saying he played a lot of minutes isn't it.

Btw, I think Ekblad is okay as a mid pairing Dman currently. He gets his arse covered a lot when he's on the top pair.

His game will not age well. This spiel about look at all these minutes he played is something the agent will use when negotiating a new contract. Thankfully Zito seems quite astute and probably won't fall for such nonsense. By the time his next contract comes around, it should be a noticeable discount to what he is currently earning. I'm sure some GM will be out there thinking like you and offer him too much because he played a lot of minutes on a Stanley Cup run being supported by his defensive partner. Thankfully that will be there problem, not ours. As someone already mentioned, Marc Staal played 20:56 on our run to the final. Wow, top pairing minutes! But you don't see GMs queuing to pay him top dollar.

https://thehockeynews.com/news/hot-seat-radar-on-cup-champion-panthers-ekblad-is-in-delicate-situation-while-zito-earned-job-security

Zito might be waiting until the NHL’s trade deadline to ratchet up the asking price for Ekblad, but it’s difficult to envision Ekblad getting a seven or eight-year contract extension with the Panthers. Florida’s embarrassment of riches throughout the lineup means very few, if any players are untouchable. And Ekblad – who has a modified no-trade clause allowing him to veto a deal to 12 teams of his choosing – can help choose his own exit route from the Panthers. Now that he’s been on a Cup winner, Ekblad doesn’t have anything to prove to anyone, but he’s still got a long road ahead in his NHL career, and the reality is the rest of his NHL days may not be spent with Florida.

 

[zeroG]

Can you please provide this hard evidence? Because saying he played a lot of minutes isn't it.

i gave you a full stat line.

he was a +4 while still contributing points and playing the hardest minutes. he was part of the top PK unit that shut down the most dangerous PP the history of the universe and a big part of the championship.

Btw, I think Ekblad is okay as a mid pairing Dman currently. He gets his arse covered a lot when he's on the top pair.

he is, right now, a top pair guy on the defending stanley cup champions! get real.

His game will not age well. This spiel about look at all these minutes he played is something the agent will use when negotiating a new contract. Thankfully Zito seems quite astute and probably won't fall for such nonsense. By the time his next contract comes around, it should be a noticeable discount to what he is currently earning. I'm sure some GM will be out there thinking like you and offer him too much because he played a lot of minutes on a Stanley Cup run being supported by his defensive partner. Thankfully that will be there problem, not ours. As someone already mentioned, Marc Staal played 20:56 on our run to the final. Wow, top pairing minutes! But you don't see GMs queuing to pay him top dollar.

c'mon. staal's situation isn't remotely close.

i'm not trying to convince you that ek the future of the franchise. just sick of him being shat upon every day. zito will make a calculation about value and make a decision. and the team will move forward with that decision.

 

[Chaos2k7]

When you need to pull extreme examples and/or use what if scenarios you may not be on solid footing with your discussion points.

Ekblad will fall in the team hierarchy or he won't. Zito knows what to do.

 

[scholl]

i'm not trying to convince you that ek the future of the franchise. just sick of him being shat upon every day. zito will make a calculation about value and make a decision. and the team will move forward with that decision.

it depends on whether Zito tries to keep Bennett or not. In Pomo's playoff style hockey defense is important and it's very difficult to find Ek's caliber of player for less money. Therefore my hunch is that Panthers offer him 4 x $5m AAV and he stays. There is money for that because my prediction is that Lundell gets a bigger role and Bennett leaves.

 

[Laus723]

we have some evidence in front of us and that is - ekblad played top pair minutes as the panthers went through one of the most difficult paths to winning a stanley cup in history. (i think it was 6th on list using some modern model).

the difficulty rank of the path is not what's important, though. any path will include deep and skilled teams as rounds progress. here are his numbers from the playoffs last year.

GP	G	A	P	+/-	PIM	TOI/G
24	1	5	6	+4	16	22:33

for comparison's sake, montour had 11 points, 4 of which were PP. so that's the primary difference between the two. they played similar minutes overall, montour averaging 9 seconds more per game, explained completely by his presence on the PP. montour is two years older. his new contract is north of 7M/yr over 7 years.

sure, montour is a beast physically and more fluid/faster skater and that explains to some degree why a team would be willing to give him that term. but the numbers are the numbers. ekblad played the (much) more difficult minutes last postseason and we won every series.

i'm not saying winning the cup made him better. i'm saying we won the cup because he's better than you think. and there is hard evidence to support this assertion.

all that said, i don't think ek is going to get 7M from us. he almost certainly could on the open market, not based on the fact he's a champion, but based on the fact that's what players who can play his minutes and produce get paid.

i don't think he will get the same term as monty based on his injury history and i don't think he will ask for the same money here given the existing salary structure where you have players giving significant discounts to stay. but i do think he's extremely valuable at a lower number. whether zito feels he can get better value remains to be seen but there's a saying - a bird in hand is better than two in the bush.

Ek’s lack of speed and his multiple leg injuries are an issue, though. He’s elite at taking the correct angle and cutting off the play entering the zone, but if he’s behind the play he can’t catch up.

The team did just fine without him to start last season, but I acknowledge that’s also because we have a great defensive forward group.

I’m torn, I think it’s foolish to extend him too far out, but he also is an RHD who can play top pair minutes. But, for how long? I fully trust Zito here.

it depends on whether Zito tries to keep Bennett or not. In Pomo's playoff style hockey defense is important and it's very difficult to find Ek's caliber of player for less money. Therefore my hunch is that Panthers offer him 4 x $5m AAV and he stays. There is money for that because my prediction is that Lundell gets a bigger role and Bennett leaves.

Lundy will play a bigger role and Bennett could eventually move to 3C, but imo Benny’s game is huge for this team. Huby played better with him, he’s a staple for Tkachuk, he’s amazing at playing the style Maurice demands…I don’t see him going anywhere. But, as many of us say, I trust Zito.

 

[zosodp]

I don’t see how we cannot keep both Bennett and Ekblad. They currently are making just under $12 million combined this season. I think we can sign both for somewhere around that combined. Something like $6.5 million for Bennett and $5 million for Ekblad. Term of both contracts would be important. With the cap possibly going up $4.5 million and the Yandle buyout coming off the books, we will still have some cap to fill any spots on the roster.

 

[KW]

If it were to come to just money, it’s way more important to keep Benny than Ek.

 

[BabyBennettov]

When you need to pull extreme examples and/or use what if scenarios you may not be on solid footing with your discussion points.

Ekblad will fall in the team hierarchy or he won't. Zito knows what to do.

This.

Bennett should be the priority !

Ekblad will stay if Zito thinks his value is where it’s supposed to be IMO.

But hearing about Aaron here since last year, it would seem like the guy is Gudbranson or Staal’s level ! He is a shame of what he was, or what he could have been… But he is still a pretty effective and valued RHD around the league.

Keep hearing about our style being defensive too… But it isn’t necessarily on the defensemen. It’s our five-man unit, which is mostly due to our forwards job on the forecheck and in the neutral-zone… Which means that Bennett is the more valued of our UFAs left !

Ekblad may be one of the « historic » Panthers… But Benny is the pulse of this team, like Vinnie even acknowledged.

So I don’t care what money Ekblad gets… I care about Benny signing an extension before him !

 

[Great8Cam]

Watch fatso NOT hold the line, turn the puck over time and time again, and he does not belong on the PK or PP because he is way too f’ng slow.

 

[Dread Clawz]

he's not cooked. i didn't see much of the game last night but he's been skating well, imo this year.

he was .5 ppg two years ago (throw last year out with the injuries...).

i think he's going to retire a panther. a wild guess would be 6x4.2M. i don't think you're going to find a better value than that for a 28yo stanley cup champion RD who's played top pair minutes his whole career.

Yup, plus the question remains.... who are you replacing him with at that money?

 

[IceManCat]

I don't think anyone is disputing that he's still a good player. I just wonder since we continuously bring in guys like Mikkola, OEL or Schmid etc. who also look decent, how big would the drop off really be with someone else? Some veteran lets say. And we wouldn't have to only look at guys for league minimum if Ek's salary is off the books, we could sign guys in the 5-6 million range. I'm really on the fence with this one I guess.

Those are guys on the team right now, the drop off is huge.. Ekblad is still very much a top player. In regards to term, it shouldn't be long term no more than 5-6 years.

he's just not that bad. he's got bad posture and a bit of an awkward stride but if he were that bad, he would not survive playing top pair minutes. yet, he just did that on a cup-winning team. i mean, that should be self-evident.

Not only a top pairing, but a top pairing in the most difficult division in the NHL. Look at all the top lines in the Atlantic, this guy shuts them down and the numbers prove it....

 

[IceManCat]

This.

Bennett should be the priority !

Ekblad will stay if Zito thinks his value is where it’s supposed to be IMO.

But hearing about Aaron here since last year, it would seem like the guy is Gudbranson or Staal’s level ! He is a shame of what he was, or what he could have been… But he is still a pretty effective and valued RHD around the league.

Keep hearing about our style being defensive too… But it isn’t necessarily on the defensemen. It’s our five-man unit, which is mostly due to our forwards job on the forecheck and in the neutral-zone… Which means that Bennett is the more valued of our UFAs left !

Ekblad may be one of the « historic » Panthers… But Benny is the pulse of this team, like Vinnie even acknowledged.

So I don’t care what money Ekblad gets… I care about Benny signing an extension before him !

Hot take but Lundell has replaced Bennett as an overall center and will be the better option going forward. Part of what makes Bennett more valuable is his chemistry with Thachuk. But really Bennett is a high end third line center more than a high end second line center.

 

[Dread Clawz]

https://thehockeynews.com/news/hot-seat-radar-on-cup-champion-panthers-ekblad-is-in-delicate-situation-while-zito-earned-job-security

That's nonsense, Zito isn't trading him mid-season. It was gonna happen in the summer or not at all .

 

[BabyBennettov]

Hot take but Lundell has replaced Bennett as an overall center and will be the better option going forward. Part of what makes Bennett more valuable is his chemistry with Thachuk. But really Bennett is a high end third line center more than a high end second line center.

I’m not debating if Lundell should overtake Benny or not… I don’t care !

I think we are THAT good for THAT simple reason actually… Being able to roll three amazing scoring-checking lines… Take one of the centers away, either Barky, Benny or Lundy, and our team doesn’t look the same !

That’s why I want to keep Bennett at all cost…

We would then have long-term: Swaggy-Barky, Benny-Chucky and Lundy-Reinho… Don’t really care who are the other guys on those lines, it still give us the best top-9 in the league IMO.

We didn’t struggle last year without Ekblad and Montour…

We are IMO struggling much more when missing a key-forward than when missing a key defenseman… And that is due to our system.