Witnessing the End of Paying a Premium for Goalies?

[Gil Gunderson]

Maybe not

 

[Cup Or Bust]

You don't need premium but you need better then Skinner to win.

 

[ViD]

You don't need premium but you need better then Skinner to win.

Or better than Helly

 

[ScaredStreit]

Bobrovsky had a truck of cashed backed up to his house and people were losing their minds a year or so into the deal. Now you couldn't find anyone who could argue that was a bad deal for Florida,

 

[Cool Hand Puke]

It’s almost as if there’s multiple ways to build a championship team? Using one framework as the be all, end all of building a championship team is going to be a disaster.

 

[WarriorofTime]

As a Rangers fan who has seen nothing but amazing goalies and no cup wins, give me a deep forward group and d core with a $4 million dollar goalie

Teams get what they get. In draft era it’s pretty unlikely they’re going to have loaded forwards, loaded defensemen and a stud goalie and have to come into a decision, in which case sure, maybe not paying the goalie will make most sense. For most teams, you kinda get what you get. Rangers used four straight top ten picks on forwards and only a fourth round pick on their current starting goalie. It wasn’t some master plan to have a great goalie and be light on forwards, just happened.

 

[Cup Or Bust]

Florida potentially making the Cup finals 3 years in a row might change people's minds. The Oilers having games blown by incompetent goaltending might also change minds on this theory. You need the other pieces though too, you can't win no matter who the goalie is if you don't have the other pieces needed to win.

 

[Community]

You just need players outperforming their cap and quality throughout the lineup.

Winning each game 6-5 or 1-0 makes no difference and team structure is more beneficial long-term for goaltending than one individual.

Everybody gets 90mill (or whatever) to put together a team. If you have more guys outperforming their caphit in a series than your opponent, you are more likely to win.

Bobrovsky isnt the reason that Florida beat Toronto, their 3rd line outperforming all of their caphits was the biggest reason.

The Oilers almost won the cup last year with a below average goalie because their offense was fantastic and McDavid/Draisaitl/others outperformed their caphits. They may win it this year with a below average goalie.

 

[ViD]

Florida potentially making the Cup finals 3 years in a row might change people's minds. The Oilers having games blown by incompetent goaltending might also change minds on this theory. You need the other pieces though too, you can't win no matter who the goalie is if you don't have the other pieces needed to win.

But then you have Hellebuyck who’s just somehow unable to perform in the post season while being the best regular season goalie in the league

 

[TD Charlie]

I'm in the "good is good enough" camp with goaltending.

 

[Cup Or Bust]

But then you have Hellebuyck who’s just somehow unable to perform in the post season while being the best regular season goalie in the league

Unfortunately I didn't watch the Jets games to know the circumstances of his performances, but I would certainly play the odds on him out performing Skinner. A game like last night, all the Oilers needed were a couple of solid saves on the penalty kill and they still would have had a chance to win the game. It's the Oilers fault for taking dumb penalties though also.

 

[Troy McClure]

A team who wins with cheap goalies is viewed as a team who is run by a genius GM who is smart with their cap space.

A team who loses because their cheap goalies stumble will be chastised for bad GM work.

The problem is no one has been able to repeatedly identify cheap goalies who can succeed in the playoffs.

 

[Armourboy]

I think eventually what you will see is a happy medium that kind of becomes the norm. Most of your winners will be going in with guys making 6-7 million that are good solid goalies and give you a chance year in and year out. They may not steal a series, but they won't cost you one either. By the time the cap goes up that won't be that crazy of a price on a team.

 

[Summer Rose]

I think eventually what you will see is a happy medium that kind of becomes the norm. Most of your winners will be going in with guys making 6-7 million that are good solid goalies and give you a chance year in and year out. They may not steal a series, but they won't cost you one either. By the time the cap goes up that won't be that crazy of a price on a team.

That's exactly what I'm hoping for with Karel Vejmelka's contract extension with Utah.

 

[centipede2233]

You just need players outperforming their cap and quality throughout the lineup.

Winning each game 6-5 or 1-0 makes no difference and team structure is more beneficial long-term for goaltending than one individual.

Everybody gets 90mill (or whatever) to put together a team. If you have more guys outperforming their caphit in a series than your opponent, you are more likely to win.

Bobrovsky isnt the reason that Florida beat Toronto, their 3rd line outperforming all of their caphits was the biggest reason.

The Oilers almost won the cup last year with a below average goalie because their offense was fantastic and McDavid/Draisaitl/others outperformed their caphits. They may win it this year with a below average goalie.

This. Yes you can win with a 10 mil dollar goalie, but it puts a lot of pressure on the roster to outperform their caphit. You better have some great contracts (typically guys in their contract year) doing great ie. Reinhart and montour last year.

 

[Cool Hand Puke]

Florida potentially making the Cup finals 3 years in a row might change people's minds. The Oilers having games blown by incompetent goaltending might also change minds on this theory. You need the other pieces though too, you can't win no matter who the goalie is if you don't have the other pieces needed to win.

Not to mention Vasi made it 3 years in a row and also won two in a row.

 

[Gizmoskevich]

Bobrovsky had a truck of cashed backed up to his house and people were losing their minds a year or so into the deal. Now you couldn't find anyone who could argue that was a bad deal for Florida,

If we're being honest, he wasn't worth it until the 22-23 playoff run. He lost the starting job to Alex Lyon at the end of the season/start of the playoffs and took it back.

 

[Sol]

The one thing Florida and the Oilers have in common is that they have a really solid group of skaters. It has zero to do with goaltending. You just need a decent goalie which the oilers don’t have. It will be a great day once people stop pretending that elite goalies are still a thing to be revered.

 

[Jumptheshark]

lets look at the final four

oilers--went cheap

Panthers ? 10mill
Dallas 8.25
canes? Sort of gone cheap but they have a 1a 1b system getting paid 5.4

right now? It looks like a Dallas/ Florida final--so when we have out 2 finalist --we will have our answer

 

[Troy McClure]

lets look at the final four

oilers--went cheap

Panthers ? 10mill
Dallas 8.25
canes? Sort of gone cheap but they have a 1a 1b system getting paid 5.4

right now? It looks like a Dallas/ Florida final--so when we have out 2 finalist --we will have our answer

And even when you look back at teams who go on a run with cheap goaltending, the end result is the goaltending stops being cheap when that goalie is up for a new contract. It's very rare for a team to let their cheap goalie go instead of paying him.

This proposition is built on continually churning goalies rather than paying one, and we've yet to see a team figure out how to get multiple runs out of a rotation of cheap goalies.

 

[Time Skip]

And even when you look back at teams who go on a run with cheap goaltending, the end result is the goaltending stops being cheap when that goalie is up for a new contract. It's very rare for a team to let their cheap goalie go instead of paying him.

This proposition is built on continually churning goalies rather than paying one, and we've yet to see a team figure out how to get multiple runs out of a rotation of cheap goalies.

A team will get it eventually and it’ll take off as a strategy, as scouting around goalies vastly improves at a rapid rate

Teams are starting to take a goalie every year or two; why not when you have four slots to throw them in prospect-wise, overseas, and the NHL. Contract spots are a dime a dozen

I think you’ll start seeing that as a tactic more than just a few teams are trying in the 2030s.

The workhorses will still get paid, this isn’t running backs. But it’ll only be the top guys. Issue is this will eventually inflate the prices for backups, bringing them more in line with 1B starter prices

 

[Pablo El Perro]

Bobrovsky had a truck of cashed backed up to his house and people were losing their minds a year or so into the deal. Now you couldn't find anyone who could argue that was a bad deal for Florida,

You could, but that says more about the boards than Bob

 

[End of Line]

This thread pops up every year lol

 

[ShootIt]

Both Conference finals are far from over, but would be funny to have Otter vs Bobtitsky in the Finals after this thread was created.

 

[Edmonton East]

And even when you look back at teams who go on a run with cheap goaltending, the end result is the goaltending stops being cheap when that goalie is up for a new contract. It's very rare for a team to let their cheap goalie go instead of paying him.

This proposition is built on continually churning goalies rather than paying one, and we've yet to see a team figure out how to get multiple runs out of a rotation of cheap goalies.

They key is to not take the middle approach. Either you have an elite goalie that might be worth paying for your team, or you run with a grab bag of cheapos. No in-between or half measures. Paying a guy 5 or 6 mil to give you replacement level results or worse on a stacked team is a waste of cap and isn't a + differentiator.