SeanMoneyHands
Registered User
- Apr 18, 2019
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Bobrosky is still elite in the playoffs. Him and Hill both have cups with their performances being a big contributor. Hellebuyck hasn't proved anything yet.
Witnessing the End of Paying a Premium for Goalies?
- Thread starter Coach Parker
- Start date
I've been thinking about this a lot lately. It seems like goalies are elite for a very short period of time. Gone are the days of the Haseks, Brodeurs, Roys and more recently Lundqvists and Prices being elite for a decade or more. Now the best goalie in the world for a year or two ends up seeming like garbage a few years later and some young cheapo emerges to take his place. Maybe offering goalies big AAV deals with for two or three years will be the way to go.
Igor Shesterkin career play off SV% is 0.928
Andrei Vasilevsky career play off SV% is 0.918
Leaf Fans
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- Sep 29, 2017
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So far this year anyway but Bob was a huge part of Stanley Cup and still might be again.
Not saying OP is wrong, but this kind of shreds his argument.
Bob before his Cup win was considered very very bad in the playoffs though.
Like anything else, a Cup win is really the right players getting hot at the right time
I agree. Someone like Bob, even when he's off, is still an at worst $5m goalie. But some of those other guys in the $4.5-6m range have performed at a non-roster league minimum value at their worst.
Breakers
Make Mirrored Visors Legal Again
I think the main takeaway from this thread is that elite goaltending isn’t *predictable*. You need elite goalie performance to win - but is there a strong correlation between goalie spending and playoff performance? The numbers in this thread suggest the opposite - the teams that have sunk have been the ones that spent big on goalies that didn’t deliver, and the teams that have succeeded have done so without much spending.
Of course, getting elite goaltending helps. But time and time again it’s been proven that, with goalies, more than anywhere … paying top dollar for past performance … fairly seldom delivers value on future playoff performance.
And the teams that do well, for the most part, are the ones who get elite performances from goalies paid less-than-elite salaries.
Well said. Perhaps the new hybrid style of play has them pushing their bodies into injuries too often?
Either way, teams and cutting the games played down into the 50's for their starters but also paying them top ten money which isn't resulting in wins under the salary cap.
This is what I'm seeing and why I posted.
Elite performances are coming from team play and investing in the players more than the goalie.
The structure and paying for more depth AND elite money to select players who can score against this stingy system in the playoffs is paying off more than paying a goalie the money.
Good point. Paying for the guys who block the shots and backcheck and then paying some additional salary allocation to the guys who can score through that system seems to be better money spent than the last line of defense.
The money gap between Stolarz and Bobrovsky isn't equal to the money gap you get between forwards.
Styles have changed. Seems like more wear and tear on the lower body of goalies given the way they are now taught to play. Too having hip issues.
But, if goalie salaries flatline or drop, guess what, fewer kids want to become goalies. Like RB in football. If they don't get paid, switch positions to DB, WR, or LB depending on your size while in HS.
And then the quality will not be as good moving forward.
Cap data from 05-06 and 06-07 is not readily available. Ward was an ELC. If this is correct, Giguere was an $8 mil equivalent.
It's not the end. Just like other players who played a key role on Stanley Cup winning teams, goalies that have won a cup will continue to get paid more than they otherwise would. But have we seen the end of teams paying 8 figures for a goalie that hasn't won anything big? Probably, yeah.
The argument is more, 'don't pay a goalie the money because the system makes them elite for the playoffs'.
The Leafs are blocking 177 shots in the playoffs. The Two Leafs goalies are blocking 178 shots. That is unreal and can make it more logical to put in any goalie who can stop 9-10 shots getting paid 2-4 million. If he gets injured, put in the next .900 save % goalie who is getting paid 2-4 million.
Here's some other players making big money who are "golfing"
Makar
Mackinnon
Pastrnak
Hughes and Hughes
Crosby
Vasi
Petterson
Dahlin
Kucherov
Kaprizov
It's almost as if hockey is a team sport where every single player matters and 1 guy can't just carry his team without support. Are the days of paying superstar forwards and defenceman over ??? Most of them aren't in the playoffs right now!
Sarcasm btw.
Makar
Mackinnon
Pastrnak
Hughes and Hughes
Crosby
Vasi
Petterson
Dahlin
Kucherov
Kaprizov
It's almost as if hockey is a team sport where every single player matters and 1 guy can't just carry his team without support. Are the days of paying superstar forwards and defenceman over ??? Most of them aren't in the playoffs right now!
Sarcasm btw.
GMR
Registered User
Not really since they have a great roster around him.
Not saying OP is wrong, but this kind of shreds his argument.
Kind of unfair comparing the two given the number of deep runs and sample size of Vasilevskiy vs. Igor. Not as tough to do it as a high seed in the early rounds. Three or four rounds, over and over again? I'll take Vasilevskiy's body of work. But yeah both are pretty great. Could probably still argue that they are not necessarily worth their deals though (especially Igor)
This is amazing thank you for posting this.
Only 7/17 last Cup winners spent above 8% of the salary cap. Unreal.
Golden_Jet
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- Sep 21, 2005
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Demandedace
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- Apr 9, 2015
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Ehhh, I disagree with this. Kids don't choose to be goalies while growing up because of a potential payday. Additionally, it's a lot easier to swap skill positions in football from RB than to switch from goalie in hockey to a skater position
Sure, if goalie salaries absolutely crater it will have an effect, but that just isn't going to happen to the extent that it would need to for this result
MoneyManny
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- Jun 28, 2021
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I would kill to have the privilege of paying a young Carey Price $10m AAV on the Habs moving forward.
Sasha Orlov
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- Jun 22, 2018
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There will always be elite goaltenders worth their pay checks and there will always be middling goaltenders with undeserving contracts
For completeness of information, a few of those teams did have really expensive backups. Huet was an $8.72 mil equivalent in 2010. Fleury was around $7 mil in the Murray years.
