Player Discussion: Winnipeg Jets Defense

[Buffdog]

The Kovacevic one is really odd because he's almost as big as Stanley and a right shot which we really coveted at the time. 6'5 230 lbs right shot stay at home defender that costs minimal.

At the time that we lost Kovacevic, our right side was set with established vets - Demelo, Pionk, and Schmidt

@WolfHouse has made the argument that they should have tried Kova on the 3rd pairing on the right side instead of going out and trading for Schmidt that summer - hindsight sees the validity in that point of view, but at the time, Kova hadn't shown much at the AHL level that would have indicated that he'd turn into what he has today

 

[Crocket]

At the time that we lost Kovacevic, our right side was set with established vets - Demelo, Pionk, and Schmidt

@WolfHouse has made the argument that they should have tried Kova on the 3rd pairing on the right side instead of going out and trading for Schmidt that summer - hindsight sees the validity in that point of view, but at the time, Kova hadn't shown much at the AHL level that would have indicated that he'd turn into what he has today

Nate is a lefty. We needed a RD at the time. Kov still needed development and may not have fit immediately but that's the gamble with prospects. Need a crystal ball

 

[gojetsgo]

Nate is a lefty. We needed a RD at the time. Kov still needed development and may not have fit immediately but that's the gamble with prospects. Need a crystal ball

schmidt has played the right side almost all of his career

 

[Buffdog]

Nate is a lefty. We needed a RD at the time. Kov still needed development and may not have fit immediately but that's the gamble with prospects. Need a crystal ball

Nate is a lefty who played his whole career on the right side. We acquired him to play there specifically

Edit: just saw @gojetsgo response lol

 

[Crocket]

Nate is a lefty who played his whole career on the right side. We acquired him to play there specifically

Edit: just saw @gojetsgo response lol

That's true but in general right shot rd defenseman are coveted. Kov was probably a keeper in hindsight.
I liked Schmidt, sometimes you lose a prospect to keep a veteran.

 

[Crocket]

schmidt has played the right side almost all of his career

Ya, Gallant put him there in Vegas, with McNabb he was good. But I think as his offense waned he wasn't great on his offside in the D zone. When he played without McNabb he wasn't great.

 

[gojetsgo]

Ya, Gallant put him there in Vegas, with McNabb he was good. But I think as his offense waned he wasn't great on his offside in the D zone. When he played without McNabb he wasn't great.

he was put on the right in washington, he was fine in the defensive zone when he was here, even last year he was good just not worth his cap hit

 

[Wpgpage]

I'm really really hoping that Arniel was just speaking in platitudes and did not want to throw Stanley under the bus. I am really hoping that the brain trust of this team does not serious believe that Stanley is a player that absolutely needs to be in that top 6. Time will tell I guess.

I will also say that on some level I do get what the Jets are looking for. I personally think that defense pairings can be an example of the sum being greater than its parts. Samberg and Pionk being a great example. Pionks isolated numbers look terrible and while yes I get that Samberg is pulling him up that pairing together has displayed results well above either guys ability. Their skill sets just compliments each other really well, Samberg makes excellent defensive zone reads and makes good zone exits (an area that Pionk really struggles in). Pionk is much better in the offensive zone he makes good passes and keeps plays alive in the offensive zone (Way better than Samberg) together it's just a pairing that works to generate shots and goals when they are on the ice.

A long way of saying I think they are trying to create that meshing of skill sets in all thier pairs. They feel like they have it on P1 and up until this year I would have agreed. They now have it in P2 when Samberg is healthy and I can see how they may feel that Stanleys skill set gets them closer to that with Miller on P3. I don't disagree thats what you want in your pairs but I would much rather see them experiment with Heinola and if he proves to be competent then go out and try to get a partner for him that you feel will give you that balance.

 

[DRW204]

I'm really really hoping that Arniel was just speaking in platitudes and did not want to throw Stanley under the bus. I am really hoping that the brain trust of this team does not serious believe that Stanley is a player that absolutely needs to be in that top 6. Time will tell I guess.

teams will usually err on the side of protecting their players in the media publicly. however, in stanley's case - given the history of his transactions, or non-transactions, & the team's overall propensity to keep him in the line-up across a variety of coaches leads me to believe they may be a bit more serious.

 

[Flair Hay]

I don't want to jump to conclusions based off one reaction on the spot from Arniel when asked directly about Stan.

That said, hopefully it's a false flag and not another indication of what's in store for the rest of the season.

I figured these two guys would be competing for the spot the rest of the year, and there will be some in and out. It's the combo of Stan's penalties and Arniel's comments that has everybody fired up. And rightfully so if those words are face value. I don't take much said through the media face value though. Corporate speak is double speak...

 

[JetsFan815]

I don't want to jump to conclusions based off one reaction on the spot from Arniel when asked directly about Stan.

That said, hopefully it's a false flag and not another indication of what's in store for the rest of the season.

I figured these two guys would be competing for the spot the rest of the year, and there will be some in and out. It's the combo of Stan's penalties and Arniel's comments that has everybody fired up. And rightfully so if those words are face value. I don't take much said through the media face value though. Corporate speak is double speak...

I am also not putting 100% stock in those comments but this next game will tell us a lot. If Stan is still in over Ville... that's the ball game as far as I am concerned about these 2 players.

 

[Flair Hay]

At the time that we lost Kovacevic, our right side was set with established vets - Demelo, Pionk, and Schmidt

@WolfHouse has made the argument that they should have tried Kova on the 3rd pairing on the right side instead of going out and trading for Schmidt that summer - hindsight sees the validity in that point of view, but at the time, Kova hadn't shown much at the AHL level that would have indicated that he'd turn into what he has today

You are right the Schmidt acquisition and how poorly it turned out is hindsight. Most folks were excited to see what ue would bring. We brought him in to play top pair after all. Just turned out DeMelo was a better fit there.

What isn't hindsight is keeping him over Stan and Capobianco. That part was contested from day one on here. Capo had a solid year for us, but obviously the org didn't have long term plans for him either as he was waived anyway the following year.

It's one of those things where you have to be good to be lucky and lucky to be good sometimes. Maybe no one in our org saw top 4 type of potential in Kovacevic. But we developed him through the Moose and now we are really lacking his exact player type, which is also a type every contender can use. Big, mobile, can move puck consistently, and good defensively.

It's nice to have 6'5 defensemen out there against the Eichel and Hintz size centers. We don't have one big guy left without Samberg. Except for Stan of course.

Stan isnt even that uber terrible, it's just that the mistakes we have made surrounding him seem to keep compounding with guys we chose to let go succeeding elsewhere

I am also not putting 100% stock in those comments but this next game will tell us a lot. If Stan is still in over Ville... that's the ball game as far as I am concerned about these 2 players.

Just like our hot start... we not yet 25% of the way through the season. I have hope Ville wins that job with his play, even if it takes longer than we would like.

I really hate that we let Dillon go if our primary plan to replace him was Stanley. But again, not ready to go full flamethrower yet. Even if Stan is back in next game.

 

[DRW204]

You are right the Schmidt acquisition and how poorly it turned out is hindsight. Most folks were excited to see what ue would bring. We brought him in to play top pair after all. Just turned out DeMelo was a better fit there.

What isn't hindsight is keeping him over Stan and Capobianco. That part was contested from day one on here. Capo had a solid year for us, but obviously the org didn't have long term plans for him either as he was waived anyway the following year.

It's one of those things where you have to be good to be lucky and lucky to be good sometimes. Maybe no one in our org saw top 4 type of potential in Kovacevic. But we developed him through the Moose and now we are really lacking his exact player type, which is also a type every contender can use. Big, mobile, can move puck consistently, and good defensively.

It's nice to have 6'5 defensemen out there against the Eichel and Hintz size centers. We don't have one big guy left without Samberg. Except for Stan of course.

Stan isnt even that uber terrible, it's just that the mistakes we have made surrounding him seem to keep compounding with guys we chose to let go succeeding elsewhere


Just like our hot start... we not yet 25% of the way through the season. I have hope Ville wins that job with his play, even if it takes longer than we would like.

I really hate that we let Dillon go if our primary plan to replace him was Stanley. But again, not ready to go full flamethrower yet. Even if Stan is back in next game.

yeah i gotta give kovacevic his props. i was a bit wary given it was MTL previously, but now continuing great play in NJD. that is a miss from this team & possibly the first prospect that actually amounted to something of note post-Jets. he'd be welcomed for sure. I did like Schmidt though, and thought he played well w/ Morrissey in 21-22 and Samberg following that. However, given the cap-hit + trade cost + buy-out cost, trying kovacevic probably was the better move.

 

[Flair Hay]

yeah i gotta give kovacevic his props. i was a bit wary given it was MTL previously, but now continuing great play in NJD. that is a miss from this team & possibly the first prospect that actually amounted to something of note post-Jets. he'd be welcomed for sure.

Him managing to be a plus guy in Montreal is pretty impressive. Bowness pooped the bed on that decision.

 

[Buffdog]

You are right the Schmidt acquisition and how poorly it turned out is hindsight. Most folks were excited to see what ue would bring. We brought him in to play top pair after all. Just turned out DeMelo was a better fit there.

What isn't hindsight is keeping him over Stan and Capobianco. That part was contested from day one on here. Capo had a solid year for us, but obviously the org didn't have long term plans for him either as he was waived anyway the following year.

It's one of those things where you have to be good to be lucky and lucky to be good sometimes. Maybe no one in our org saw top 4 type of potential in Kovacevic. But we developed him through the Moose and now we are really lacking his exact player type, which is also a type every contender can use. Big, mobile, can move puck consistently, and good defensively.

It's nice to have 6'5 defensemen out there against the Eichel and Hintz size centers. We don't have one big guy left without Samberg. Except for Stan of course.

Stan isnt even that uber terrible, it's just that the mistakes we have made surrounding him seem to keep compounding with guys we chose to let go succeeding elsewhere


Just like our hot start... we not yet 25% of the way through the season. I have hope Ville wins that job with his play, even if it takes longer than we would like.

I really hate that we let Dillon go if our primary plan to replace him was Stanley. But again, not ready to go full flamethrower yet. Even if Stan is back in next game.

Dillon's replacement wasn't Stanley, it's Samberg. It looks like Samberg's replacement is Stanley, though... for now

They've been "lucky" with injuries in the D corps so far and haven't needed to waive anyone, and it looks like it'll be that way for the next 6-8 weeks if they're willing to carry 8 Dmen (which they've done so far). Their hand will be forced to REALLY make a decision if/when all 9 guys are healthy