I have a question about Latta. He came into the league through the Import Draft. I would assume that he is still considered an Import, which would mean that if we keep him, Kozhevnikov or Starikov would have to be released. Or did he somehow get "North Americanized" and no longer counts against the Import quota?
Windsor Spitfires 2018 Offseason Thread
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I have a question about Latta. He came into the league through the Import Draft. I would assume that he is still considered an Import, which would mean that if we keep him, Kozhevnikov or Starikov would have to be released. Or did he somehow get "North Americanized" and no longer counts against the Import quota?
thats my biggest point. we shouldnt have to rely on walk on and guys who have been cut 3 times by other teams. we should have a constant flow of talent, most other teams can do it, london does it, we should be able to do it.
why is it a bad thing to want this?
Spits
He is not considered an import,matter was decided prior to playing with Sarnia,parents are Canadian.
He is not considered an import,matter was decided prior to playing with Sarnia,parents are Canadian.
london traded 14 picks at the trade deadline, they still have a full stock of picks. how many did we lose, 3 1sts and 2nds, and we have no 2nd or 3rd round picks until 2023? london are great at trading their depth players for picks because they have younger players ready to go, our goal should be to do the same thing.
why not, why shouldnt we want to be that? we troll london, but if they are doing this, and some posters claim to be better then them, why shouldnt we want to have better asset management?
Spits
Better asset Management no guarantee to winning,proof London 1 Mem Cup last 12 years,and they played in Mem Cup tourney 4 times and won once.At the end of the day I will take 3 out of 3 all day long.
London didn't go all in once of the 4 last times they been to Mem Cup tourney,and they won once in 2016, Windsor in all 3 instances have gone all in and they have won 3 times,12 straight wins.,that's maximization of the assets at hand.
Better asset Management no guarantee to winning,proof London 1 Mem Cup last 12 years,and they played in Mem Cup tourney 4 times and won once.At the end of the day I will take 3 out of 3 all day long.
London didn't go all in once of the 4 last times they been to Mem Cup tourney,and they won once in 2016, Windsor in all 3 instances have gone all in and they have won 3 times,12 straight wins.,that's maximization of the assets at hand.
youngblood10
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Because Windsor sucks, is that what it will take to end this noise. The best solution for you my friend is save yourself all this torture of following the Spits and go be a Knights fan.
cub
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Our goal should absolutely be to have better asset management, no doubt. I completely agree with that. I'm saying having expectations having that the past so many years with the sanctions is unrealistic. Of course, if everything worked out perfectly, and even with the burden of the sanctions we managed to build an amazing team and prospect pool, great, but that would have been extremely unlikely. And yes, we did lose those picks, but London didn't "lose" their picks per say, but rather trade them away. Let's say each first round draft pick is worth 3 seconds and a 3rd. If those players didn't report and were traded purely for assets, we'd have 10 seconds and a 3rd that we lost. If we didn't trade them, we'd have 3 studs and a high pick to fill the lineup. But regarding the future, should this rebuild be done properly and the teams get's their picks back to be on neutral ground, yes, I completely agree that we should and will have the ability to build the team with many players. But to want that perfect filled out lineup of young studs after going for the Memorial Cup with the sanctions? I say that expectation is unrealistic. Could it have happened? Yes. Was it likely it would happen? Absolutely not.
and really thats all i want to talk about. i just dont get why othgl and hl11 absolutely refuse to look at what may have been a better course of action or maybe we screwed up somewhere along the line. great, we won, but were the only team that won a memorial cup that needs other teams cast offs to field a team the next year, thats worth looknig at. the only reason i bring up london is hl11s constant claim we do it better then them. if that was the case, we would have 15 players returning, 330 points and 7 nhl draft picks coming back after a memorial cup (i did the math after his last post lol, that was londons roster at the start of last year) i mean, he called them backdoor knights for years, using that logic shouldnt we be back door spits (i think calling anyone backdoor is dumb)
whats wrong with striving to be better? we dont have to agree, but at least be open to that dialog. simply saying 'we have other players, meh, be happy', sorry, but why cant we look a bit deeper then that? whats wrong with an open dialog about asset management, looking at what other teams too and looking at us critically to see if we can be better?
I hate that we dont have more 17 year olds to bring up, butwe can fix that, we can fi the pick sitatuion with proper asset maageement and much improved scouting. we can rectify it with trades of vilardi, dipietro and brown, hopefully get 3 2001 1st ronud picks and get a quick jump at the next cup, but again, why is it not ok to look at the past and say, hmm, many we could have done things better in the past.
i bring up that point and those two wont even open the dialog, i dont get it. why is conversation about us trying to do things better dissmissed?
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Impressed with the Spits 5-2 win over Sarnia tonight,solid efforts from Luchuk 2G1A, Larionov,1G, MacDougall 1G, McEneny 2A,Staios1A,and a gorgeous end to end rush,Latta1A,Mizzi 1G, as well as goalie Brock Baier who was very solid when tested, especially in the 1st when the Sting had a long 2 man advantage with no score in the game and Baier came up with a 10 bell save to keep the score goal less at the time.
On D impressed with the work of Stevenson and Corcoran, thought Starikov struggled at times on D
Based on tonight's game only,with Kitkevicius and Dipietro returning,the guy I would take out is Angle,had a bad night for the most part,drew 3 penalties, fortunately the Spits killed those and 6 in total out of 6 plus scored 2 shorties as well,along with going 2-2 on the PP.
Spits through 4 games in the exhibition season are now 4-0,17 goals for,9 against, they are 4/12 on the PP and 16/18 on the PK,with 2 shorties.
Overall pleased with the up tempo style of play, looking forward to continuing improvement.
On D impressed with the work of Stevenson and Corcoran, thought Starikov struggled at times on D
Based on tonight's game only,with Kitkevicius and Dipietro returning,the guy I would take out is Angle,had a bad night for the most part,drew 3 penalties, fortunately the Spits killed those and 6 in total out of 6 plus scored 2 shorties as well,along with going 2-2 on the PP.
Spits through 4 games in the exhibition season are now 4-0,17 goals for,9 against, they are 4/12 on the PP and 16/18 on the PK,with 2 shorties.
Overall pleased with the up tempo style of play, looking forward to continuing improvement.
youngblood10
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Honest question, why do you care so much what HL11 thinks of the Knights? Why do you feel you need to defend London? Do you not think that London's accomplishments can't stand on their own merit? I find it very odd that a "Spitfire" supporter would be so concerned that that Spitfire fans wouldn't view London as a better team.
its about us, not london. i look at what they do and see the team that they have, the picks they have, and ask why cant we do that. i dont care about them, other then they seem to be doing things right, always have picks, always have young talent, always use assets well, so why cant we have an open dialog about what we do, and see if there are ways we can improve. asset management being the top one. they are the best example, i just dont like the 'hey, we won, we cant ask questions or look at things, be happy' attitude, whats wrong with looking at what we do, see what others do and see how we can be better? why are those qeustions dismissed.
Spits
If they are best, why is it that in the last 9 years they have won it once and Windsor 3 times,and if u can't answer that one,I can tell u why.
If they are best, why is it that in the last 9 years they have won it once and Windsor 3 times,and if u can't answer that one,I can tell u why.
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well i like long term success, winning playoffs, deep runs year after year. i dont like that any question about the spits is dismissed. i dont think its fair to call one team back door and not do the same when our team does the same. london has won more ohl championships, i value that because its longer trip, more pride with 16 wins, longer trip, you can value whatever you want. my point being, they win, they sitll have enough players and picks to go again, we dont. why cant we look at why we dont? i dont even care how you measure success. we should be able to disagree about sucess and still be open to dialog about what we can do better. whats wrong with admitting we need to improve on things, while at the same time saying we did well. every team needs to improve on things, that discussion should be open and not dismissed.
randomhero4life
Registered User
What if this discussion is just overkill for the last week......can we just drop it?
i am. i asked hl11 a question about asset management 4 times and he just dodged it every time. it is what it is. apologize for talking over the board but when i'm told i shouldn't question something, it seems to go against the spirit of an open board.
Spits
The difference between the 2 teams is that when Windsor wants and feels it ready to win they go all in and win, London doesn't,and that's why I called them a back door entry, they didn't do all they could to succeed in 2014,as result as mentioned by Youngblood,they were embarrassed badly in that tournament, Windsor did on the other hand go all in despite sanctions, despite losing a key player too early graduation, Fischer,the abscence of a 1st rounder to deal or use, yet still won,so you have my answer why the difference.Satisfied.
Oh something London hasn't done win back to back like Windsor did in 09 and 10, I call maximization of asset management
The difference between the 2 teams is that when Windsor wants and feels it ready to win they go all in and win, London doesn't,and that's why I called them a back door entry, they didn't do all they could to succeed in 2014,as result as mentioned by Youngblood,they were embarrassed badly in that tournament, Windsor did on the other hand go all in despite sanctions, despite losing a key player too early graduation, Fischer,the abscence of a 1st rounder to deal or use, yet still won,so you have my answer why the difference.Satisfied.
Oh something London hasn't done win back to back like Windsor did in 09 and 10, I call maximization of asset management
randomhero4life
Registered User
I understand, as for asset management you should put some trust into what the Spit's brass is doing, we don't know what moves will happen in the next few months, but one thing the Spit's are very well known for is player development. Somethings cannot be answered on an open board as we don't know all of the inside scoop.
Only 1-16 year old dressed for Windsor last night vs Sarnia,dman Nathan Staios as the Spits with the exception of Dipietro and Kitkevicius dressed a lineup that's looks like it will be come opening night,also excluding Brown, Vilardi, Day and Sergachev.
I would think that youngsters Henault, D'amico and Frasca will dress tomorrow in the last exhibition game before the start of the season.
I would think that youngsters Henault, D'amico and Frasca will dress tomorrow in the last exhibition game before the start of the season.
There is clearly a huge chasm in thoughts/directions people can mention. I would say this in regards to Latta he was put on waivers through the OHL. It goes in reverse order of standings so Barrie had first crack. So Windsor had 14-15th crack at him? Yes Windsor lost a lot of forwards, of course there were a lot of worse teams than Windsor that had first crack at Latta. The teams ahead of Windsor in pecking order still aren't going to be great teams this year and have some bottom tier talent yet they didn't want to take a shot on Latta.
In regards to asset management etc.. There is merits in wanting better asset management especially if you want to consistently be a good franchise year after year, bringing in fans year after year. As they say it's good for business. Would you rather show off your arena to a top prospect with a filled building or 45% full, it goes without saying.
There are some that want to get into a petty battle of what organization has had more success. That depends on how you view all angles division titles, western conference title appearances/championships, ohl titles, memorial cups. Memorial Cups overall should hold the lowest % if you're to rank everything because it defeats the purpose of everything. You play 68 games, a maximum of 28 playoff games even though it never gets to that. There's a reason people refer to a season as a marathon and not a sprint because the season is valued more than a small snapshot of 4-5 games. If you want to get into a petty battle some have some type of inferiority complex when it comes to the London Knights, I understand and get it. Of course Windsor has won 3 Memorial Cups but there are certain individuals that have to put down the accomplishments of London. If Windsor has been so good their achievements should stand alone.
I understand there can be a narrative that trust management regardless hell or high water. Well it's a different group of scouts, different VP of player personnel, different director of player personnel. If you want to throw blind faith behind them that's fine. You can have a wait and see attitude and considering they don't have many draft picks the wait and see attitude is absolutely more prudent. If you don't have picks how do you expect those scouts to do their job? Of course that's on Rychel so if he doesn't go out and get a full compliment of picks you can't blame the scouts that much because Rychel is pretty much asking the scouts to scout with one hand tied behind their back. Of course then it comes down to selecting the right players. As in don't select a guy like Clayton Keller when you're trying to rebuild. For example Saginaw got Blade Jenkins good for them. It looks like they swung and missed on Bode Wilde because Mel Pearson is an elephant hunter bringing in great players to Michigan again.
If people still want to cite sanctions they can do that. It has nothing to do with the here and now. The sanctions didn't prevent the organization from selling high on players. Of course the drafting hasn't been at a high level so they haven't been able to sell high on certain players. The sanctions are done if the scouts do their job, the GM does his job, the coaching and development team do their job. There's no reason why the organization should go through a drought of only winning 4 playoff games in 6 seasons. If that happened again there shouldn't be a single apologist in the bunch.
OHLTG
Registered User
There's no refusal, but an understanding of what's currently happening.
They're free agents and Windsor has had plenty of success with free agents over the last four seasons. If it's not broke, why fix it? Does it really matter where players come from if they succeed with us?
Who's saying this?
It does, though. Windsor lost their 1st in 2013/2016 and 2nd in 2015/2017. The 1st in 2013 would have been a 97-birth and either a potential OA this year or a major factor last year. IF they were a factor last year, you perhaps keep picks and/or that would have been used for someone like Knott or Nattinen.
The 1st in 2016 was the year of Corcoran. Windsor would have picked mid-round and would have had a shot at a kid like Liam Foudy or Allan McShane. You deal McShane at the deadline for Bracco and you keep Cole Carter, who is then a key producer on this year's squad.
The seconds would have meant less assets dealt to gain other seconds, which puts more picks in the cupboard.
I still select Keller but not until a later round.
Which players?
While knowing it's only exhibition here are some of the scoring leaders,Luchuk tied for the lead in points with 4,3G1A, though he has played just 2 games, Larionov has 4 points well 3G1A, along with Joe Mizzi2G2A,though both have appeared in all 4 games to date, Mathew MacDougall has impressed with 3G in his 4 games plus a shootout winner, McEneny leads the D offensively with 3 assists in 2 games played,while Chris Playfair and Jake Smith both have 3 points, Playfair's in 3GP,Smith 3 assists in his last 2 games played.
Of the 21 skaters in camp, only 3 are pointless,all dmen, Corcoran,Nother and Stevenson,must say though all 3 have played well defensively,and push the puck up well in most cases.I have been impressed with the work of Stevenson particularly,very solid and dependable,uses his size of 6'2"-205 effectively.Through the 4 games Spits have scored 17 goals and have allowed 9.
PP has been quite effective going 4-12, and scoring on 4 of it's last 6 opps.PK wise they are 16-18 plus they have scored 2 shorties,both on the same penalty last night vs the Sting.A more up tempo game to date has helped the Spits outshoot the opposition an average of 38-28 over the 4 games.
Goaltending has been strong,Brock Baier has played 2 games, allowing 5 goals on 68 shots, average of 2.50,was very solid in both outings,last night was named 2nd star,plays a cool calm collective game,and at 6'4"-220 covers a huge part of the net,looks to have a bright future.Dipietro has played 1 game 3.00 average and Lucas Patton who will start tonight at Sarnia has allowed
1 goal in his 1 game appearance
looks to keep it going.
Overall impressed with the work ethic and deserved results to date,need to keep improving moving forward.
Of the 21 skaters in camp, only 3 are pointless,all dmen, Corcoran,Nother and Stevenson,must say though all 3 have played well defensively,and push the puck up well in most cases.I have been impressed with the work of Stevenson particularly,very solid and dependable,uses his size of 6'2"-205 effectively.Through the 4 games Spits have scored 17 goals and have allowed 9.
PP has been quite effective going 4-12, and scoring on 4 of it's last 6 opps.PK wise they are 16-18 plus they have scored 2 shorties,both on the same penalty last night vs the Sting.A more up tempo game to date has helped the Spits outshoot the opposition an average of 38-28 over the 4 games.
Goaltending has been strong,Brock Baier has played 2 games, allowing 5 goals on 68 shots, average of 2.50,was very solid in both outings,last night was named 2nd star,plays a cool calm collective game,and at 6'4"-220 covers a huge part of the net,looks to have a bright future.Dipietro has played 1 game 3.00 average and Lucas Patton who will start tonight at Sarnia has allowed
1 goal in his 1 game appearance
looks to keep it going.
Overall impressed with the work ethic and deserved results to date,need to keep improving moving forward.
Not trying to speak for OHL4Life but you're not grasping what he's saying about these free agents. These current free agents have most likely maxed out their potential in junior hockey. In other words they have hit their ceiling. No it doesn't particularly matter where players come from but age does certainly matter in some instances. Some of these guys are 19 certainly not overage candidates or shouldn't be. Like you ignored my comment earlier 14 other teams or so in the OHL passed on Latta and the Spits were there to scoop him up. Maybe the Spits see something other teams don't. Considering he's already 19 had a poor showing last year I would say a lot of other teams have more talented players.
They lost 2nd round picks that doesn't preclude them from acquiring other 2nd round picks which is an avenue you completely ignored not surprisingly.
Players that didn't develop or weren't good picks that they sold low on visa-vis Verity, Murray, Brown, Maletta, Webermin, Sanvido.
Multiple teams have said these guys are not good enough. it's not a situation where a 17 year old had a few bad days at another CHL camp and a month later is signed by us. That was a nice pick up. These guys are all old and cut multiple times by poor to average teams. our goal shouldn't be to get other teams scraps, our goal should be to have young players ready to go. all I can do is look at other teams who win and are able to have young players step in for those that graduate. It's fine that we are going to be sub par this year, but we shouldn't be happy that we're doing it with kids who are not good enough for other teams and too old to be around in 2 years when we start again. if they where 2000s and walk ons, great, let's see what then can do, but they are not.
we shouldn't have to rely on other teams scraps, and if other posters think that's fine and dandy, I'm not sure how else to say it. I'd like to think we are better then other teams cast offs.
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