Win or look good trying?

[KINGS17]

I was saying it while the Kings were good and winning Cups: NHL hockey sucks for entertainment value unless your team is winning.

Getting blown out again in the 90s and 00's? Well, good thing you've got a 4th line of monsters that are going to go out and stir things up. Now all they do is bend over, take a 5-1 loss and just go through the motions for the entire 3rd period.

I knew it was happening when the Kings were winning and always worried about the entertainment value once they stopped being good. In a world where there is less hitting, fighting and hatred, being a fan of a losing team is horrific. I used to never leave a game early but now you know nothing is going to happen so might as well hit the road early: especially on a work night.

I went to the least games ever last season and didn't switch TV providers even without FSW all season. I used to record every game on VHS at one point in my life. Sure, I have more responsibilities now but the idea that we've just grown up and grown out of being obsessed to the point of not missing a game only looks at one side of the coin: the game has changed a lot as well. We can all argue if it has changed for the better but--more often than the not--the ones that feel it has changed for the better are the ones that aren't wondering why they aren't as in to it anymore.

Hopefully this season's schedule lends itself to a little more edge during the regular season. I hope this is the case and then we can see the NHL move to more of a baseball-type schedule moving forward. Only thing I don't like there is that you might be out of town for a weekend and miss a team coming through for the entire season. Will also be easier for the league to suspend a player long enough to not face retribution in a series format. I'm all for it though if it leads to more regular season animosity.

Yeah, I grew up watching the old Western Hockey League. Six teams, 72 games, which meant the teams played each other 13 or 14 times during the regular season. Pretty easy for players to develop some personal rivalries with this kind of schedule. Guys that like to run their mouth and not back it up may find it more difficult to do so this season, as they are likely to find themselves in games with individuals who get tired of it and may take action if a game gets out of hand on the scoreboard.

 

[BringTheReign]

I get your message, and I empathize for my own formative years as a Kings fan, but I think nostalgia is a real thing. Most people will tend to look wistfully back on the past favorably regardless of the quality of the present. I do understand your point about winning wholeheartedly though; there's an element to being a fan of a perennial underdog that I do miss. Other posters have brought up fighting and the physical element of the game, and I agree 100% that it is missed in today's game too.

All I'll say is that your Bure streaking in off the rush or Sakic burying a wrister could be a 12 year old today watching Svechnikov pull off the lacrosse goal or Crosby score by smacking it out of mid-air. We are adding moments to a memory bank that has decades of comparisons to stack up against, while the next generation is in the position we once were.

 

[MartinS82]

Not a Kings fan per se (live in SoCal and watch whatever hockey I can) - but it's been tough the last few years. I knew it was bad when I was watching the Kings and Coyotes in a shootout and the first 5 or 6 guys on each team skated in and just shot into the goalies pads. I was sure one of the players was just going to dump the puck into the corner and try to forecheck.

 

[BigKing]

I get your message, and I empathize for my own formative years as a Kings fan, but I think nostalgia is a real thing. Most people will tend to look wistfully back on the past favorably regardless of the quality of the present. I do understand your point about winning wholeheartedly though; there's an element to being a fan of a perennial underdog that I do miss. Other posters have brought up fighting and the physical element of the game, and I agree 100% that it is missed in today's game too.

All I'll say is that your Bure streaking in off the rush or Sakic burying a wrister could be a 12 year old today watching Svechnikov pull off the lacrosse goal or Crosby score by smacking it out of mid-air. We are adding moments to a memory bank that has decades of comparisons to stack up against, while the next generation is in the position we once were.

I agree regarding the skill level of old stars v. new stars. Nostalgia plays a part and it is also hard to do something that hasn't been done before. Kind of like rock guitar: some dude today might be faster or be able to do something better than say, Eddie Van Halen but everyone is going to say EVH is the best or whatever. Also, everything is more amazing when you are younger because you haven't seen it before and those guys are heroes. I still like Keith Tkachuk more than any of the Kings on the Cup teams because he was my favorite player growing up.

So with that said, I don't think I'm missing out on a wrist shot like Sakic's or speed like Bure but I am missing out on Bob Probert, Marty McSorley and a game that was more wide open before heading into the dead puck era. I've beat this drum a thousand times on HF over the years when people wonder why the game isn't this or that anymore and it is simple: you got rid of guys that played five minutes a night and were there to fight in favor of no-offensive skill defensive forwards that can skate with the sole purpose of not creating any offense or being scored on. This is even more pronounced when you look at how much tough defenseman were coveted...those guys might get 12 minutes a night or more but weren't very good at hockey.

Now, everyone can skate really well. The game is faster, sure, but it also has a bunch of Nick Shore types that completely ruin the entertainment value and help keep the game low scoring. It would be interesting to see how any current increases in scoring v. pre-2000s lockout hockey correlate to an increase in power plays. I'm not so sure that today's scoring would be any better than pre-lockout if the latter era allowed two-line passes, no line change after icing and also called penalties such as love taps that break a player's stick.

 

[MrGuyPerson]

The Russians played physically against Stuetzle, and it resulted in his worst performance at the WJC. He was also almost exclusively used as a winger all tournament.

For those whose preference is style over results, remember those Marc Crawford coached Kings? They scored plenty of goals...

I'm not disagreeing with you, but I would like to point out the Russians were shadowing him the whole game. Their entire gameplan revolved around eliminating Stützle's chances to touch the puck. When the puck managed to get on his tape they strategically doubled him. The strategy was in it didn't appear to be double because 1 player would apply immediate high intensity pressure while the second player would close distance slower with strategic positioning to block his first read outlet pass. When Timmy did escape the first high pressure player, the second player immediately pressed. What is the craziest part about that game, and I have never actually seen a team successfully do this at this high of level, is when Stützle did not have the puck the Russians had a player following him across the ice to prevent him from touching it. It was pretty wild to see. Obviously tightly following a single player without the puck all the way from one side of the ice(east west) through the middle then down along the boards creates an extremely vulnerable defense. If they did this against Cozens on Canada or Zegras on the US the other elite players on their teams would have exploited the increased open space and ravaged them. Germanys entire system essentially shut down though(honestly bad coaching. They should have started running the pp through Peterkas hands in the 2nd because they didn't play him the same way). The "Anyone but him Strategy" is bold but obviously effective against low depth Germany

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

I'm not disagreeing with you, but I would like to point out the Russians were shadowing him the whole game. Their entire gameplan revolved around eliminating Stützle's chances to touch the puck. When the puck managed to get on his tape they strategically doubled him. The strategy was in it didn't appear to be double because 1 player would apply immediate high intensity pressure while the second player would close distance slower with strategic positioning to block his first read outlet pass. When Timmy did escape the first high pressure player, the second player immediately pressed. What is the craziest part about that game, and I have never actually seen a team successfully do this at this high of level, is when Stützle did not have the puck the Russians had a player following him across the ice to prevent him from touching it. It was pretty wild to see. Obviously tightly following a single player without the puck all the way from one side of the ice(east west) through the middle then down along the boards creates an extremely vulnerable defense. If they did this against Cozens on Canada or Zegras on the US the other elite players on their teams would have exploited the increased open space and ravaged them. Germanys entire system essentially shut down though(honestly bad coaching. They should have started running the pp through Peterkas hands in the 2nd because they didn't play him the same way). The "Anyone but him Strategy" is bold but obviously effective against low depth Germany

Stuetzle also got hammered with some pretty big hits by the Russians. They were pretty unrelenting on him, and it hampered his play as a result. It kind of exemplified how having so much open ice is going to get more difficult as the level of competition ramps up. The WJC games we witnessed last night showed how pivotal it is to win those board battles, as most of the goals scored resulted directly from them.

 

[Lt Dan]

Stuetzle also got hammered with some pretty big hits by the Russians. They were pretty unrelenting on him, and it hampered his play as a result. It kind of exemplified how having so much open ice is going to get more difficult as the level of competition ramps up. The WJC games we witnessed last night showed how pivotal it is to win those board battles, as most of the goals scored resulted directly from them.

Bingo

 

[MartinS82]

I'm not disagreeing with you, but I would like to point out the Russians were shadowing him the whole game. Their entire gameplan revolved around eliminating Stützle's chances to touch the puck. When the puck managed to get on his tape they strategically doubled him. The strategy was in it didn't appear to be double because 1 player would apply immediate high intensity pressure while the second player would close distance slower with strategic positioning to block his first read outlet pass. When Timmy did escape the first high pressure player, the second player immediately pressed. What is the craziest part about that game, and I have never actually seen a team successfully do this at this high of level, is when Stützle did not have the puck the Russians had a player following him across the ice to prevent him from touching it. It was pretty wild to see. Obviously tightly following a single player without the puck all the way from one side of the ice(east west) through the middle then down along the boards creates an extremely vulnerable defense. If they did this against Cozens on Canada or Zegras on the US the other elite players on their teams would have exploited the increased open space and ravaged them. Germanys entire system essentially shut down though(honestly bad coaching. They should have started running the pp through Peterkas hands in the 2nd because they didn't play him the same way). The "Anyone but him Strategy" is bold but obviously effective against low depth Germany

Interesting. "Shadowing" was a popular method against Gretzky and Lemieux back in the 80's. Basically it's what Esa Tikannen was famous for. Its actually a good strategy when used correctly as it not only disrupts the Star player but I am sure that the German team was used to getting the puck then immediately looking for Stutzle. Tough to do when there is a player 3 feet from him at all times.

 

[Bandit]

Didn't you guys find it fun watching the Kings play in games that mattered?

That first Cup winning team was a bore to watch during the regular season, until Carter was brought in, Voynov was inserted as a regular into the lineup, and they were playing some intense hockey prior to the playoffs in order to clinch the 8th spot in the standings.

I think most have forgotten what it feels like to watch this team play in some meaningful games.

Anyone that didn't enjoy watching the Kings from the TDL in 2012 until Martinez put the puck past Lundquist in 2014 doesn't have a pulse. If they can get back there I'm sure watching will be fun again, but then again that was a 3 year stretch in a 50+ year history. It might take a while. At least the effort mostly returned last year, hopefully the ongoing infusion of young talent will continue that trend.

 

[Bandit]

Interesting. "Shadowing" was a popular method against Gretzky and Lemieux back in the 80's. Basically it's what Esa Tikannen was famous for. Its actually a good strategy when used correctly as it not only disrupts the Star player but I am sure that the German team was used to getting the puck then immediately looking for Stutzle. Tough to do when there is a player 3 feet from him at all times.

Yeah, but back in those days you could go water skiing all over the ice swinging from the guys balls and not get called for holding.

 

[No Name The Nameless]

Well, OP, it sounds like a few different problems wrapped up in one:

1. Will you ever be excited about winning in the same way again? I'm sure you'd be stoked if we won a SCF--and it may be easy to say this from a distance but I doubt I get as excited about a, say, 2025 stanley cup in the same way i did 2012. It's just different. We're a little desensitized in a good way after being a doormat for 40 years. Not sure that's something that can ever be replaced, especially together.

2. Are you a fan of the game, or a fan of the team? I think that affects things greatly. I loved this year's playoffs. Great pace, good balance of scoring, defense, checking. but of course, the Kings were far removed, and up until the end of the season, were nigh unwatchable most nights. I think the game itself is in a great state.

3. The team itself seems to be super up-tempo and is looking on paper to be one of the fastest in the league at the very least--that's obviously TBD a bit but we're watching a makeover from a 'competitive' but grindy Kings team that was descending to a more-poppy team that's slowly ascending.

4. You point out your personal situation as well. I know I'm no spring chicken anymore. I have a kid and a family of my own and I can't just waste a random Tuesday night glued to 6 hours of hockey including the Kings. YMMV, but I imagine a lot of us that have been here for years are also aging into having to be more deliberate with our interests.




God yeah, that was borderline old-Clippers-level managerial ineptitude. ZERO direction.

This is a good post to respond to since it covers all other responses in the thread.

I'll start with 4. You and I have known eachother for a long time. I'm not the 20 year waiting for life anymore. I'm almost 40 and life found me. It's very hard to enjoy the little things like I used to. Like you, responsibilities take the fun out of everything and the successes that I was so passionate about are no longer fun anymore. It's on to the next one. Hard for me to sit still and I suppose I'm looking for that youthful spark that made every other night a magical time. I'd give things back just to enjoy the moment. Just to have fun

This holds hands with your first question. I suppose I'll never get that excited again. However, winning will help.

I suppose at this stage I'm not in love with the game anymore. I am in love with the King's. The NHL does not push the sport so as I become more and more casual the new and exciting kids are hard to keep up with. There is a new toy from a new country every year. Hard to connect like I used to. That is why I quit fantasy hockey. I can't keep up.

I hope this team continues it's up temp ways. I keep going back to that Colorado line. God that was fun. Then watching Palfy, Deader and Allison just sealed my hockey love. What I would give to see a stud line playing tic tac toe. I hate hate hate the stud and scrubs lines.

Here's to a good year my dude.