Speculation: Will we sign Antti Raanta?

[moosemeister]

We should start a go fund me to sign him

 

[FinnishCoyote]

Raanta is now first in SV% in 2018 if you look at goalies who have played atleast 10 games. 1.97 GAA is also very impressive.

We definitely should sign this guy

 

[Jamieh]

I don't think he'll want to return to Chicago after what happened. But I'm fairly sure he'll look for another team somewhere in the middle of the pack, where he can be a starter but also have a fair chance for playoffs. I think the Panthers would make the most sense.

The Panthers have two goalies on decent NHL contracts for 3 more years, they aren't signing Raanta as a budget team. We need to tread very carefully here with a small sample size from Raanta as it's runs the risk of being a Smith, Talbot, or Darling situation. Not everyone is capable of being a 60 plus game NHL starter and so far Raanta doesn't have a season of showing that. I like him but I'd be very weary of both years and dollars. One would be OK IMO. 2 years at $4 million I'm OK with or 4 years at around $3 million. Either way the Coyote's butt is covered if he regresses. I think th edeal should include some protection for the Coyotes.

 

[cobra427]

Raanta is now first in SV% in 2018 if you look at goalies who have played atleast 10 games. 1.97 GAA is also very impressive.

We definitely should sign this guy

This is great but it is a small sample size. If he did it for a full season that would be better validation. I would be careful with term here. 2 years at more money would be safer then 4 years at less money. I wouldn't give term to an unproven starter with a 6 week hot streak.

 

[Jakey53]

He might be worth more at the TDL now?

I would rather sign him. We have to continue this rebuild and we need good goal tending. Not sure if we can find a replacement of his caliber in the off season.

 

[Jakey53]

The Panthers have two goalies on decent NHL contracts for 3 more years, they aren't signing Raanta as a budget team. We need to tread very carefully here with a small sample size from Raanta as it's runs the risk of being a Smith, Talbot, or Darling situation. Not everyone is capable of being a 60 plus game NHL starter and so far Raanta doesn't have a season of showing that. I like him but I'd be very weary of both years and dollars. One would be OK IMO. 2 years at $4 million I'm OK with or 4 years at around $3 million. Either way the Coyote's butt is covered if he regresses. I think th edeal should include some protection for the Coyotes.

I know what you are saying and I agree, but sometimes you have to take a gamble. He played so well for the Rangers last year some thought he was playing better than Lundqvist. Also, if we lose him, can we find someone who is as good or better, and will that involve a trade where we lose assets? If he is traded then we know he wants to go elsewhere and we have no choice but to look elsewhere.

 

[Jamieh]

I know what you are saying and I agree, but sometimes you have to take a gamble. He played so well for the Rangers last year some thought he was playing better than Lundqvist. Also, if we lose him, can we find someone who is as good or better, and will that involve a trade where we lose assets? If he is traded then we know he wants to go elsewhere and we have no choice but to look elsewhere.

Mike Smith, Cam Talbot, and Scott Darling all did that. We can't afford to be wrong on big dollars. The difference between a really good backup and a legit starter is massive, the sample size is way too small to known what Raanta is right now.

 

[Jakey53]

Mike Smith, Cam Talbot, and Scott Darling all did that. We can't afford to be wrong on big dollars. The difference between a really good backup and a legit starter is massive, the sample size is way too small to known what Raanta is right now.

Smith is a bit over payed but not a bad goalie, and I sure wouldn't blame Talbot with what Edmonton has for D. I believe we will have to pay Raanta $4 mill per to keep him.

 

[Jamieh]

Smith is a bit over payed but not a bad goalie, and I sure wouldn't blame Talbot with what Edmonton has for D. I believe we will have to pay Raanta $4 mill per to keep him.

Talbot is as much to blame as anyone in Edmonton, he has been bad. Smith has probably never been worth the contract he didn't deserve in any year of the deal. I would only pay Raanta $4 on a two year prove it deal.

 

[Jakey53]

Talbot is as much to blame as anyone in Edmonton, he has been bad. Smith has probably never been worth the contract he didn't deserve in any year of the deal. I would only pay Raanta $4 on a two year prove it deal.

You are a bit harsh my friend. I think Raanta is as good a bet and less of a gamble as any other available goalie out their. We now have a bit of history with him, we know what kind of character he has etc. I love his personality.

 

[The Feckless Puck]

Raanta has a plenty-big sample size. The idea of trading him at the deadline is ludicrous unless you're on the tank train.

 

[Jamieh]

Raanta has a plenty-big sample size. The idea of trading him at the deadline is ludicrous unless you're on the tank train.

He has no years as a full time NHL starting goalie, as in 60 plus games. I wouldn't trade him but I also wouldn't jump the gun with massive contract either. Hopefully Raanta is a reasonable guy??

 

[The Feckless Puck]

He has no years as a full time NHL starting goalie, as in 60 plus games. I wouldn't trade him but I also wouldn't jump the gun with massive contract either. Hopefully Raanta is a reasonable guy??

Raanta's not going to ask for a Smith-level contract, but he's going to want to get paid. 4 x $4.5M sounds good to me - no NMCs though.

 

[Jamieh]

Raanta's not going to ask for a Smith-level contract, but he's going to want to get paid. 4 x $4.5M sounds good to me - no NMCs though.

That's a lot of contract for a player with one year of over 30 starts. I highly doubt he gets that contract.

 

[cobra427]

Raanta's not going to ask for a Smith-level contract, but he's going to want to get paid. 4 x $4.5M sounds good to me - no NMCs though.

If he lead us to the WCF like Smith did and played 60+ games, he would get Smith money. 4 by 4.5 is too much in term and dollars for an unproven starter. Besides, we picked up Bryz/Smith/Duby/Greiss/Raanta at different times, all pretty good in net. There is no need to lock up any goalie with term unless they are proven starters and top 15. 2 years at 3.5-4 mill or 3 years at 3 mill and no more NMC's.

 

[The Feckless Puck]

If he lead us to the WCF like Smith did and played 60+ games, he would get Smith money. 4 by 4.5 is too much in term and dollars for an unproven starter. Besides, we picked up Bryz/Smith/Duby/Greiss/Raanta at different times, all pretty good in net. There is no need to lock up any goalie with term unless they are proven starters and top 15. 2 years at 3.5-4 mill or 3 years at 3 mill and no more NMC's.

Four years isn't stupid term, especially if there isn't any NTC/NMC in there. And $4.5M is fine, particularly for us since we have to hit the salary floor anyway.

I'm not advocating for a ridiculous Smith-type contract. That was terrible no matter what happened in 2012, because anyone who was paying attention knew that 2012 was an outlier and not a trend year for Smith. But Raanta's sample size isn't limited to this year alone. He's been steady and has had good numbers for years.

And while we have a couple of very promising goalie prospects in the system, they're not going to be NHL ready for at least three years - not even Miska.

 

[SniperHF]

The question isn't whether Raanta is a starter (proven) or sample size or whatever. Those are interesting peripheral details.
When you get down to it, the issue is what is available. On the list of goalies available, there is not one that is a "proven" starter under the type of qualifiers people talking about above.

Someone is gonna have to play goalie next season.

Raanta is at least equally proven to anyone else out there as a UFA this offseason.

Here's your UFA list:

2. Jaroslav Halák	New York Islanders		UFA	32	G	Left		41	-	-	-	-	-	18	18	1	3.17	0.912		$5,000,000	########
17. Antti Raanta	Arizona Coyotes		UFA	28	G	Left		35	-	-	-	-	-	12	14	1	2.45	0.924		$1,000,000	########
5. Cam Ward	Carolina Hurricanes		UFA	33	G	Left		30	-	-	-	-	-	17	8	2	2.58	0.912		$3,100,000	########
6. Jonathan Bernier	Colorado Avalanche		UFA	29	G	Left		30	-	-	-	-	-	17	11	2	2.82	0.914		$2,750,000	########
15. Carter Hutton	St. Louis Blues		UFA	32	G	Left		26	-	-	-	-	-	15	5	3	1.81	0.94		$1,000,000	########
68. Aaron Dell	San Jose Sharks		UFA	28	G	Left		24	-	-	-	-	-	14	4	2	2.51	0.917		$675,000	$625,000
8. Chad Johnson	Buffalo Sabres		UFA	31	G	Left		22	-	-	-	-	-	4	9	0	3.48	0.888		$2,500,000	########
13. Anton Khudobin	Boston Bruins		UFA	31	G	Left		21	-	-	-	-	-	12	3	1	2.34	0.923		$1,200,000	########
1. Kari Lehtonen	Dallas Stars		UFA	34	G	Left		19	-	-	-	-	-	10	5	0	2.3	0.918		$5,000,000	########
62. Darcy Kuemper	Los Angeles Kings		UFA	27	G	Left		18	-	-	-	-	-	9	1	3	2.04	0.934		$650,000	$650,000
12. Ondrej Pavelec	New York Rangers		UFA	30	G	Left		16	-	-	-	-	-	4	7	1	3.01	0.91		$1,300,000	########
72. Jeff Glass	Chicago Blackhawks		UFA	32	G	Left		14	-	-	-	-	-	3	6	0	3.31	0.898		$650,000	$612,500
38. Antti Niemi	Montreal Canadiens		UFA	34	G	Left		13	-	-	-	-	-	2	6	0	4.18	0.88		$700,000	$700,000
27. Harri Säteri	Florida Panthers		UFA	28	G	Left		9	-	-	-	-	-	4	4	0	2.92	0.911		$750,000	$750,000
7. Eddie Läck	New Jersey Devils		UFA	30	G	Left		7	-	-	-	-	-	2	3	0	4.23	0.869		$3,000,000	########
39. Reto Berra	Anaheim Ducks		UFA	31	G	Left		5	-	-	-	-	-	1	1	0	2.31	0.926		$700,000	$700,000
14. Michael Hutchinson	Winnipeg Jets		UFA	27	G	Right		1	-	-	-	-	-	1	0	0	1	0.958		$1,300,000	########
11. Andrew Hammond	Colorado Avalanche		UFA	30	G	Left		0	-	-	-	-	-	0	0	0	0	0		$1,500,000	########

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

There are some old starters out there we're not signing.
Then you have Kuemper and Dell and Raanta. Basically the best available. All 3 are in the exact same situation. Late 20's, mostly never played a starter's load.

Then there's Hutton who's either a late bloomer or a flash in the pan. Still 32 is beyond the current core.


And anyone you trade for instead of signing, is going to have the exact same question marks.

This is the world we're operating in, at some point you've gotta make a call when you don't have a homegrown goalie.

 

[varano]

If he lead us to the WCF like Smith did and played 60+ games, he would get Smith money. 4 by 4.5 is too much in term and dollars for an unproven starter. Besides, we picked up Bryz/Smith/Duby/Greiss/Raanta at different times, all pretty good in net. There is no need to lock up any goalie with term unless they are proven starters and top 15. 2 years at 3.5-4 mill or 3 years at 3 mill and no more NMC's.

Your not going to retain his services with that lowball offer.

You need to lock up a starting goalie for 4-5 years. Raanta proves over and over that he passes the eye test. I've watched both Canes games and coyotes games. The difference between Darling and Raanta is not even in the same realm. Raanta has elite level poise and is both fundamentally and athletically very good.

 

[Jamieh]

The question isn't whether Raanta is a starter (proven) or sample size or whatever. Those are interesting peripheral details.
When you get down to it, the issue is what is available. On the list of goalies available, there is not one that is a "proven" starter under the type of qualifiers people talking about above.

Someone is gonna have to play goalie next season.

Raanta is at least equally proven to anyone else out there as a UFA this offseason.

Here's your UFA list:

2. Jaroslav Halák	New York Islanders		UFA	32	G	Left		41	-	-	-	-	-	18	18	1	3.17	0.912		$5,000,000	########
17. Antti Raanta	Arizona Coyotes		UFA	28	G	Left		35	-	-	-	-	-	12	14	1	2.45	0.924		$1,000,000	########
5. Cam Ward	Carolina Hurricanes		UFA	33	G	Left		30	-	-	-	-	-	17	8	2	2.58	0.912		$3,100,000	########
6. Jonathan Bernier	Colorado Avalanche		UFA	29	G	Left		30	-	-	-	-	-	17	11	2	2.82	0.914		$2,750,000	########
15. Carter Hutton	St. Louis Blues		UFA	32	G	Left		26	-	-	-	-	-	15	5	3	1.81	0.94		$1,000,000	########
68. Aaron Dell	San Jose Sharks		UFA	28	G	Left		24	-	-	-	-	-	14	4	2	2.51	0.917		$675,000	$625,000
8. Chad Johnson	Buffalo Sabres		UFA	31	G	Left		22	-	-	-	-	-	4	9	0	3.48	0.888		$2,500,000	########
13. Anton Khudobin	Boston Bruins		UFA	31	G	Left		21	-	-	-	-	-	12	3	1	2.34	0.923		$1,200,000	########
1. Kari Lehtonen	Dallas Stars		UFA	34	G	Left		19	-	-	-	-	-	10	5	0	2.3	0.918		$5,000,000	########
62. Darcy Kuemper	Los Angeles Kings		UFA	27	G	Left		18	-	-	-	-	-	9	1	3	2.04	0.934		$650,000	$650,000
12. Ondrej Pavelec	New York Rangers		UFA	30	G	Left		16	-	-	-	-	-	4	7	1	3.01	0.91		$1,300,000	########
72. Jeff Glass	Chicago Blackhawks		UFA	32	G	Left		14	-	-	-	-	-	3	6	0	3.31	0.898		$650,000	$612,500
38. Antti Niemi	Montreal Canadiens		UFA	34	G	Left		13	-	-	-	-	-	2	6	0	4.18	0.88		$700,000	$700,000
27. Harri Säteri	Florida Panthers		UFA	28	G	Left		9	-	-	-	-	-	4	4	0	2.92	0.911		$750,000	$750,000
7. Eddie Läck	New Jersey Devils		UFA	30	G	Left		7	-	-	-	-	-	2	3	0	4.23	0.869		$3,000,000	########
39. Reto Berra	Anaheim Ducks		UFA	31	G	Left		5	-	-	-	-	-	1	1	0	2.31	0.926		$700,000	$700,000
14. Michael Hutchinson	Winnipeg Jets		UFA	27	G	Right		1	-	-	-	-	-	1	0	0	1	0.958		$1,300,000	########
11. Andrew Hammond	Colorado Avalanche		UFA	30	G	Left		0	-	-	-	-	-	0	0	0	0	0		$1,500,000	########

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

There are some old starters out there we're not signing.
Then you have Kuemper and Dell and Raanta. Basically the best available. All 3 are in the exact same situation. Late 20's, mostly never played a starter's load.

Then there's Hutton who's either a late bloomer or a flash in the pan. Still 32 is beyond the current core.


And anyone you trade for instead of signing, is going to have the exact same question marks.

This is the world we're operating in, at some point you've gotta make a call when you don't have a homegrown goalie.

Which one of those goalies do you think will be getting 4 years at $4.5 million? That's the present discussion. And tgere is a significant difference between being a really good backup( less than 50 games) and being a bonifide number 1 goalie(60 plus games). I'm not saying Raanta can't be a number 1 but it has not been proven yet. There are two guy suffering this season in Talbot and Darling that passed the backup and the eye test, they aren't doing so well.

 

[Jamieh]

I hope they manage to sign Raanta but if not there are a few possibilities on the list above that would be worth a try on a couple. Hutchinson, Bernier, Khodobin, Dell ......

 

[SniperHF]

Which one of those goalies do you think will be getting 4 years at $4.5 million? That's the present discussion. And tgere is a significant difference between being a really good backup( less than 50 games) and being a bonifide number 1 goalie(60 plus games). I'm not saying Raanta can't be a number 1 but it has not been proven yet. There are two guy suffering this season in Talbot and Darling that passed the backup and the eye test, they aren't doing so well.

Raanta might. Dell has an outside shot at 4 but he's fading a bit and won't have as any games played. Kuemper won't.

But I think it's close to irrelevant what the money is. The Coyotes need a capable goalie, if the prices are going high then they'll have to overpay a bit. If the prices come in lower then great.
One of these guys will be playing goal for the Coyotes, I don't think there will be another trade for one.

I'm not actually convinced the goalie market will be all that crazy and could come in lower than that number. But if that's the going rate, I'd pay it.
It's when you start to pay a goalie Smith money (5.5+) where the Coyotes get into trouble.

I don't think Talbot's situation is 1:1 either, he had two starter's load seasons before his current bad year.

The trade off in the world where Raanta gets the best UFA contract:
1. Keep Raanta even if you overpay a little, it's known he works with the team under terrible circumstances and is playing pretty close to a full starter's load for all but one month of the season.
2. Sign another UFA goalie who you don't know works here in the hopes he performs somewhat close to where Raanta did and save 1-1.5 million bucks?
3. Trade for another goalie and start the process again.

#3 is burning assets, I wouldn't do it twice in two years.
#2 is the backup plan if Raanta just wants to go elsewhere. But as I said Dell is fading and Kuemper's numbers while nice are mostly put up behind great defensive teams.

What exactly are we losing on #1? Less than 2 million per and some risk that Raanta falls flat. Well the risk of falling flat is always going to exist with any of these options. And while 1-1.5m is not nothing it's not that much either.

If someone offered Raanta something stupid like 5+? Hasta. Otherwise he should be retained.

 

[Jamieh]

Raanta might. Dell has an outside shot at 4 but he's fading a bit and won't have as any games played. Kuemper won't.

But I think it's close to irrelevant what the money is. The Coyotes need a capable goalie, if the prices are going high then they'll have to overpay a bit. If the prices come in lower then great.
One of these guys will be playing goal for the Coyotes, I don't think there will be another trade for one.

I'm not actually convinced the goalie market will be all that crazy and could come in lower than that number. But if that's the going rate, I'd pay it.
It's when you start to pay a goalie Smith money (5.5+) where the Coyotes get into trouble.

I don't think Talbot's situation is 1:1 either, he had two starter's load seasons before his current bad year.

The trade off in the world where Raanta gets the best UFA contract:
1. Keep Raanta even if you overpay a little, it's known he works with the team under terrible circumstances and is playing pretty close to a full starter's load for all but one month of the season.
2. Sign another UFA goalie who you don't know works here in the hopes he performs somewhat close to where Raanta did and save 1-1.5 million bucks?
3. Trade for another goalie and start the process again.

#3 is burning assets, I wouldn't do it twice in two years.
#2 is the backup plan if Raanta just wants to go elsewhere. But as I said Dell is fading and Kuemper's numbers while nice are mostly put up behind great defensive teams.

What exactly are we losing on #1? Less than 2 million per and some risk that Raanta falls flat. Well the risk of falling flat is always going to exist with any of these options. And while 1-1.5m is not nothing it's not that much either.

If someone offered Raanta something stupid like 5+? Hasta. Otherwise he should be retained.

We are a serious budget team, every dollar overspent on any player is a dollar not available to upgrade another position. We are also one if the rare teams that can offer Raanta a guaranteed starters job, there should be some consideration for that. Combine with low tax rate, great climate, and cost of living. It's a two way street so I don't think we should break the bank for a yet unknown starter. Give him financial security while being budget consious.

 

[Lilhoody]

I don't get some of the doubt on Raanta, or the Bernier love. Raanta has to play #1 to become #1. It appears he can do that, small sample size considered. Raanta has good numbers, despite an atrocious D in front of him for a portion of this sample. IMO his numbers are reflective of his skill; with better D, better numbers should come.

Bernier has been a #1, what, twice? You want cheap or good? Or, perhaps where they intersect at value?

 

[BB88]

That's a lot of contract for a player with one year of over 30 starts. I highly doubt he gets that contract.

I have to stop at this and say no it isn't.
Darling wasn't anywhere near as proven as Raanta will be this summer, Darling was a full backup(only in Chicago) at the time fo signing.
Raanta has shown to play great anywhere he has been, starting from Finland to Chicago, and from Chicago to Rangers and from Rangers to Arizona.

For the fans who want him re-signed the good thing is he's a Finn. Humble& modest is how one usually describes a Finn and even in NHL it has shown in contracts, none of Barkov, Granlund, TT, Ristolainen, Maatta have gone to sign massive contracts. They have all signed good deals, few of them steals from the moment they signed them.

4M in todays NHL is not that much, you don't buy a game changer with that money, especially from the UFA market.

 

[_Del_]

Raanta has a plenty-big sample size. The idea of trading him at the deadline is ludicrous unless you're on the tank train.

You can't say that without acknowledging his contract situation. Does he want to stay? How much does he want? We only get less leverage the closer he gets to free agency. Not more. So he either wants something reasonable to stay, or he doesn't.
If he wants to test the market or wants stupid money to stay, you have to deal him.