Why do we hate this team?

[IronBloodedLion]

For me it's not so much a dislike of the team, as it is a dislike of the management of this team since the 04/05 Lockout.

Everyone lauds Glen Sather for his trades, but in reality, they're trades to try and correct his Free Agent mistakes.

We've had 2 really good teams (06/07, 11/12), and instead of adding to the success of those teams and going for it one more time, dramatic rosters are made, and we're back to being a 7/8th seed that MIGHT win a round.

Also the amount of 1st round misses has really hurt. I'm sure McIlrath will be a fine player, but when you have a chance to grab Fowler or Tarasenko, you don't pass on that chance.

 

[chosen]

The reason fans here seem to hate this team is because they hate everything except winning every game, including sweeping through the playoffs.

Anything less is unacceptable to many here.

Heck, if the team loses a single period of hockey, the usual group of idiots wants to trade at least one player immediately and then explains why said player is an abomination.

These are either lonely or brain-impaired people.

 

[True Blue]

II think this mentality has been one of the biggest recipes for disaster. 'Just get in and anyone can win' is alot of malarkey

That and "the team can do some damage". I have been hearing about the damaging possibilities seemingly forever.

The bottom line is that for the better part of our fandom, the on ice product has always lacked. The team has mostly been deficient in more ways than one. And there has NEVER seemed to be a game plan from the front office. No more perfectly is the latter though brought to the forefront than what has been with Sather as the care taker.

It is not hate. It is just the head scratching way that there is no game plan and , except for a few blessed years here and there, ALWAYS a flawed team that is worse than the sum of its parts.

 

[NGgator60]

My reasons for having much less excitement reserved for this iteration of the Rangers:

1) Expectations: After lockout v1.0 the Rangers were coming off an absolutely brutal near-decade of futility that saw aging mercenaries cycled through the roster on what seemed to be a monthly basis. Our expectations for the on-ice product had been so beaten down that our fanbase was euphoric when Jagr and his merry bunch of Czech's actually *gasp* coalesced as a functional team and won hockey games. Imagine that; a star player comes to New York and actually maintains his elite level of performance!

Additionally, we started to see homegrown players sprinkled throughout the lineup and develop into valuable hockey players. We were amazed to learn that 3rd line centers did not necessarily need to be pried away from rivals for $9mm a season. Our fans also were amazed to see that players under the age of 30 were actually permitted to play meaningful minutes on the 7th floor of Madison Square Garden. For years we were convinced that there was some sort of city zoning rule that prohibited such an occurrence.

As a fanbase we realized that our team wasn't yet a serious Cup contender but after a decade of missing out on the post-season, who the hell cared? Heck, we had prospects, draft picks, and money...for sure we'd be able grow as a team and leverage our accumulation of assets sometime down the road to land a few young superstars to replace Jagr and put us over the proverbial "hump".

Then 2011 came. Jagr's production had effectively been replaced by Gaborik and Torts had a group of blue-collar and largely homegrown players to implement his grinding system. As fans we once again expected to be in the playoff mix but we knew we were flawed and not really true Cup contenders. However, this team embraced their identity more so than any Ranger team in over a decade and actually EXCEEDED our expectations en route to making the Conference Finals. I'm sure we all agree that each of us wanted to reach the SCFs and felt that we had a great chance of beating the Devils but we also knew that we were effectively gambling with house money because no one could've realistically envisioned us making the Finals prior to the season.

From then to now, what has happened? Expectations have risen. We have tasted success and know that the Rangers had the resources and talent to at least reach the Conference Finals, it was time to raise the bar and expect to exceed that watermark. Again, we should have the resources and assets to achieve this. Instead, the team has taken a clear step back while our resources have significantly deteriorated. We are now years removed from the Conference Finals and significant components of our flawed core have aged, and we really have nothing in the pipeline that can help this team raise its profile. We now know that we can develop homegrown players, as can the rest of the league, this no longer excited us. Where we are today is most likely where we will be for the foreseeable future without significant changes. This may be acceptable for the 2007 Ranger fan but it is not acceptable for the 2014 fan that knows where the Rangers have been and where they should be right now.

2) Identity of the team: For me the current iteration of the Rangers lacks an identity, or at least an identity that I have pride in. Simply put, this Ranger team is easy to play against. Call me a brute (hopefully you'll acknowledge me as an intellectual brute) but a large component of this, in my opinion, is directly correlated to toughness. Intensity, physicality, intimidation, grit, mean demeanor, and fighting. Perhaps I have an inferiority complex but for the life of me I cannot stand to see a Ranger get pushed around with no retribution and I am obsessively bothered when I see Rangers rag-dolled by tougher opponents. Brian Boyle is an effective role player but I am ashamed when I witness him get pulverized on a bi-weekly basis. It's as if he wagered his manhood and busted, and I dont necessarily fault Boyle because I dont think that he should've been put into the situation to be an "enforcer" of sorts in the first place. Boyle could be a "tough" player if he was complemented with a guy that could throw the mitts or if we had a consortium of players that could and did impose their physical will often. The 2011 Rangers embodied this of what I type and this team is in stark contrast.

For me, I find it very difficult to root for a team that doesn't seem to share the same physical intensity for the game that I do, or prefer, as a fan.

 

[HFsNumber1Heel]

The last post by NGgator60 summed it up.

This year's team just isn't a likeable group. No young players (Kreider's been on the roster for parts of three years already so he doesn't truly count) except Talbot, they are awful in third periods, and the two most important forwards to this team's identity (Callahan and Hagelin) are having bad years coming off shoulder surgeries.

This team took a gamble with Nash and gave away all the substance in Dubi, Anisimov, and let Prust and Mitchell walk. Feds is no longer an NHLer. Brassard went from looking like Dave Gagner on the North Stars post deadline and turned back into Brassard.

It's just not fun to watch this team. Too soft and inconsistent. It doesn't need to be blown up, they just need a major facelift and get tougher to play against.

 

[aufheben]

I don't hate them. I love them, I'm just not in love with them.

 

[SingnBluesOnBroadway]

I don't hate this team. I hate the rudderless direction the front office is so comfortable with.

 

[haveandare]

My Ranger memories go back to 1958 so I have lived and died with this team for a long time.

Sometimes I am staggered by the hatred and venom I see here on the boards: hatred towards players, coaches, front office people, scouts, announcers and so one.

If all you feel is hatred and you come away from games angry (upset is OK), why bother?

Of course we all want to win....life is always sweeter when you win, but sports is supposed to be a distraction from real life, entertainment and escape from real life....its male soap opera and male currency. I must admit that I got more upset with defeats when I was younger, but still, if rooting for a team makes you endlessly angry, what's the point?

On every team, good, bad, mediocre, there are fascinating stories, including this one. Every player has a tale, an arc of a career, adjustments to make to new coaches systems, developing or eroding skills. I always try to see each player as an individual. Sure there are guys I like more than others. Sure there are guys who puzzle me no end as they waste their talent. Sure there are guys who frustrate me no end, but hate, no. As I always say to my son, who is a regular poster here, even though I don't know them, anyone who plays for the Rangers becomes part of my extended family. You can be upset by what family does, but hate? Sorry, no way.

What have I gotten for being a fan for 55 years? One unforgetable Cup.....2 other Cup final appearences. Not much really. A lot of years that ended in disappointment. Of course I wish there were more, of course I question draft picks, trades, strategies.

But being a Ranger fan has been one of the great joys of my life. I still find myself whistling the Ranger Victory Song. Some might say that fans like me are the problem, that I am to ready to accept failure. But this is sports....only one team wins the last game of the year.

This team is frustrating yet fascinating. I like and admire some players more than others, but hate? Sorry, no.

Very, very well said. I've put forth some of the same thoughts in other threads. For me, and I get that this is individual and subjective, the stories are the entertainment, both the story of the franchise on a macro level and the story of each player on the micro. I'm fascinated by it on many levels, and that keeps me interested, and more often than not, gives me something to be pleased with and validate the time spent following.

Also, I really, truly wonder how some posters justify the time spent on this team based on almost exclusively negative and heated posts. If you get nothing but misery out of this, what's the point?

Who hates this team?
Based on the attendance at MSg, not a lot of people do.
Based on this board? Well that's a totally different question.
It's pretty sad that this board has been taken over by a lot of immaturity. Sorry to be brutally honest. But some of the blame has to lay at the feet of the mods.

Sometimes when I am out I used to look at the score then the GDT to get some context and one of the hilariously funniest and recurring questions towards the end of the thread is this:

Who are we going to blame for this loss?

Now how does that raise the give and take about the team?I think it's a problem is not an eye test but an eye Q test.

Instead of having an intelligent discussion about the merits of one system over another, or one player over another we are stuck with people trying to amek a name for themselves.
You want to have your name known? The message is clear, pick a player and crap on them over and over again until people start associating your name whenever the said player screws up.

I am noticing the trend, a lot of rooks are throwing tantrums, going bonkers to establish the same notoriety and it's sad that the behavior is getting rewarded.

Edit: BTW, great thread, it's always nice and rewarding for me to see long standing fans come out and post. Wish they would post more often.

I also think there's something to this. I know we're not supposed to question the mods about specific situations in threads, so I won't, but I have seen quite a few posts disappear that didn't seem to break any rules, while so, so many posts that contain nothing but petty personal insults and maybe some fluff stay, either because they're missed or they're from posters who have apparently earned some sort of leash that others haven't.

 

[Samuel Culper III]

Why do you dislike these Rangers?

We have such a vanilla, interchangeable offense. Sure, Callahan plays differently than Pouliot and Hagelin is distinguishable from Richards but, really, aside from Nash, Zucc and Kreider, it's like they're all the same guy. And our system, despite being stocked with some decent talent, is really just more of the same. Miller, Fast, Lindberg. They all just fill in to a similar outcome. If those three replace Richards, Pouliot and Moore/Boyke next year does anyone expect us to produce more offense? I'm not suggesting they will, just demonstrating the sameness of our guys. They may play different games from those guys, but the results will be the same. There's no Tatar or Jurco in our system. No Nichuskin. No Spooner. No Strome. No Scheifele. No Armia. Yes, some of those guys are high picks. Some are mid picks. Point is we have a very deep pool of "bland" hockey players (can't think of a better word, don't literally mean bland) so the hope of change or progress isn't really there.

There also ALWAYS seems to be a distinct problem with producing a consistent effort. With the guys we do have, the reality is the offense could come from anywhere on any night and be spread throughout the lineup. Since the lineup is fairly interchangeable, outside of the few dynamic forwards, it could be Richie or Cally or Poo or Step or Brass or... you get it. The only way that kind of lineup is going to win games if every guy is looking for his opportunity to be 'the guy' each night. Since there's nothing remarkable about our forward lines, they all need to be going. But so often it feels that at least some of them just don't show up ready to game.

And then our defense. When Staal is on, he's great and I love G and McD. I like the Klein trade. No qualms with Stralman and Moore has been disappointing. But when you've got (with the addition of Klein) four legitimate defensive stalwarts you hope to see some puck movers in the system. We moved Erixon in the Nash trade (no big loss, not sure he'll even pan out) but we're left with McI, Allen, Skjei and none of then have any offensive talent. Guys like Skjei and McI are 28th and 10th overall picks. We have nothing like a Ryan Sproul (55th overall) or Beaulieu (17th) or Vanelli (47th). In our system. So again, there's no hope of change or seeing the need for offense (or even a good slap shot) addressed. Just more of the same. Can anyone even imagine the current D if McD's offense hadn't manifested?

No hope of the offense changing. No hope of the defense changing. Unless we actually sell guys like Callahan and Girardi and acquire assets that are unlike the ones we already have in return and/or utilize the cap space they free up to sign players that actually alter the look of the team. So do I actually want to move those guys? Well, no, I love those two. But yes, because you start to resent the feeling of inertia that surrounds the current group of sameness we have. I almost feel its essential in order to actually taking a step forward.

 

[Cassano]

I also think there's something to this. I know we're not supposed to question the mods about specific situations in threads, so I won't, but I have seen quite a few posts disappear that didn't seem to break any rules, while so, so many posts that contain nothing but petty personal insults and maybe some fluff stay, either because they're missed or they're from posters who have apparently earned some sort of leash that others haven't.

Agreed.

 

[alkurtz]

Very, very well said. I've put forth some of the same thoughts in other threads. For me, and I get that this is individual and subjective, the stories are the entertainment, both the story of the franchise on a macro level and the story of each player on the micro. I'm fascinated by it on many levels, and that keeps me interested, and more often than not, gives me something to be pleased with and validate the time spent following.

Also, I really, truly wonder how some posters justify the time spent on this team based on almost exclusively negative and heated posts. If you get nothing but misery out of this, what's the point?



Exactly.

Perfect example: Derek Stepan, a player I am currently very down on. But for me, he is a fascinating player whose career revolves around a simple question: can a smart, creative, fine playmaking center become a number one center when his skating is just average? The jury is still out but it is playing out before our eyes. Fascinating.

Another: Pouliot and Brassard: both extremely high draft picks whose careers have not lived up to the draft slot? Why? Were they over hyped? Is it something in their internal makeup? We're learning a lot about them and making us think about why some players succeed and others don't.

Another: Zucc...his story speaks for itself.

Richards: how does a former elite player deal with eroding skills? Fascinating.

I could do something like this for each and every player on the team. It keeps me interested, keeps me thinking, keeps me involved, keeps me tuning in.

Of course I want to win, of course I'm frustrated but the process of building and constructing a hockey team is intellectually and emotionally stimulating. It can't be only about wins and loses because almost all years we go home losers.

 

[Brooklyn Rangers Fan]

Its an easy team not to like. Nobody sticks up for one another, aside from 1 guy who has a broken leg and another who gets 5 minutes a night. Kreider gets a butt end in the face nowhere near a puck and we fold like a cheap suit in our own building. Nothing but feeble attempts at retribution and the classic "excuse me, I didn't see you there" body checks.

Damn it, almost made it a whole page before toffness was mentioned.

 

[Ail]

Who hates this team?
Based on the attendance at MSg, not a lot of people do.
Based on this board? Well that's a totally different question.
It's pretty sad that this board has been taken over by a lot of immaturity. Sorry to be brutally honest. But some of the blame has to lay at the feet of the mods.

Sometimes when I am out I used to look at the score then the GDT to get some context and one of the hilariously funniest and recurring questions towards the end of the thread is this:

Who are we going to blame for this loss?

Now how does that raise the give and take about the team?I think it's a problem is not an eye test but an eye Q test.

Instead of having an intelligent discussion about the merits of one system over another, or one player over another we are stuck with people trying to amek a name for themselves.
You want to have your name known? The message is clear, pick a player and crap on them over and over again until people start associating your name whenever the said player screws up.

I am noticing the trend, a lot of rooks are throwing tantrums, going bonkers to establish the same notoriety and it's sad that the behavior is getting rewarded.

Edit: BTW, great thread, it's always nice and rewarding for me to see long standing fans come out and post. Wish they would post more often.

Oh please. These boards are almost exclusively dedicated to having a serious and (sometimes) intelligent discussion about the team. The GDT is the ONE exception where people are given a little bit more freedom in the form of being able to go somewhat off-topic and, god forbid, have some fun. Every other thread here is limited to serious discussion. Yes, some posts with what could be considered flaming are missed, the mods are not infallible. If you see something, you can report it.

As far as immaturity goes, that's subjective. There are plenty of posters here who can go so far off-topic and participate in the stupidity of the GDT, and then do a total 180 and post incredibly intellectual and compelling posts in another. These two things are not mutually exclusive. It's your problem if the only thing that interests you is having a 100% serious and intelligent discussion every single minute of your time here.

Too many times here people take someone disagreeing with their opinion (often proposed as fact) as being immature, stupid, and ignorant.

 

[NYR Sting]

The treatment of Callahan and Lundqvist on these boards this season has been pathetic. Guys who have been terrific night in and night out for years, backbones of the team, struggle for a few months for the first times in their career, and suddenly, they're the scum of the Earth.

But, overall, you just get the same **** from this franchise year in, year out. There's always a Brassard, a Pouliot, a Pyatt, etc. This team always has numerous holes filled by incredibly unlikable, inconsistent players who are filling roles they clearly are not suited for.

 

[Brooklyn Rangers Fan]

I don't hate the team. I love the team.

What I hate is that the front office is unwilling to take the steps necessary to acquire true foundational offensive talent. You don't win without a Crosby/Toews/Getzlaf. And you do NOT get those guys through free agency. You MUST do what is necessary to draft them - or, if you are very lucky, trade for them early on in their careers.

Until we have such a foundational talent, any move that is not geared towards upside, is a wasted move - and a sign that the organization is still not willing to do what is necessary to put us on the path to continual contention. That's why I am very meh on the MDZ trade. I like Klein as a player, but he is a guy you should be adding to a team that already has its top line in place and is solidifying the foundation for a run. If you don't have a legit first line center around whom to build, putting those complementary pieces in place is actually COUNTERproductive. You're guaranteeing the continual mediocrity we've seen for two decades now - and, in so doing, propping the team far enough up in the standings that they won't be able to draft a kid who could actually come in and be the foundational piece we need.

The team has a unique opportunity with Girardi and Callahan to go out and get some pieces that could be truly franchise-altering. If they make the appropriate moves, I will be thrilled - and will watch the growing pains of the kids with great joy. If they sign them up - or, worse, let them walk for nothing - I will be extremely discouraged.

 

[Doctyl]

To anyone complaining about how we don't have a Crosby, Toews, Tavares, Stamkos because our management sucks at tanking and we are terrible in the draft, we do have one. Henrik ****ing Lundqvist absolutely has the same impact on the game as these guys do. He completely takes over games. So yea we do have a superstar maybe even generational talent on this team. Not every superstar has to be a forward.

 

[Brooklyn Rangers Fan]

To anyone complaining about how we don't have a Crosby, Toews, Tavares, Stamkos because our management sucks at tanking and we are terrible in the draft, we do have one. Henrik ****ing Lundqvist absolutely has the same impact on the game as these guys do. He completely takes over games. So yea we do have a superstar maybe even generational talent on this team. Not every superstar has to be a forward.

You need a superstar FORWARD to win. An OFFENSIVE talent. The game is won by scoring more goals than you give up - going at it by focusing first on holding the other guy off the board is playing not to lose.

 

[Doctyl]

You need a superstar FORWARD to win. An OFFENSIVE talent. The game is won by scoring more goals than you give up - going at it by focusing first on holding the other guy off the board is playing not to lose.

You don't need a superstar forward. Boston won without a superstar forward. Vancouver had both the Sedins and the superstarless bruins best them. The penguins have had a meltdown each year since their cup. They have the 2 best forwards in the league.

 

[chosen]

You don't need a superstar forward. Boston won without a superstar forward. Vancouver had both the Sedins and the superstarless bruins best them. The penguins have had a meltdown each year since their cup. They have the 2 best forwards in the league.

Their goalie had a meltdown. If the Pens had almost any goalie besides Fleury, they would have had a couple more Cups. As bad as I have ever seen in a big spot.

 

[chosen]

You don't need a superstar forward. Boston won without a superstar forward. Vancouver had both the Sedins and the superstarless bruins best them. The penguins have had a meltdown each year since their cup. They have the 2 best forwards in the league.

Krejci has performed at a superstar level twice in the playoffs.

 

[Callagraves]

Some fantastic responses, especially Ngator60.

I think there's alot of frustration with the abandonment of the homegrown movement. To think, if Sather had elected to not make a single trade, our top 9 would look something like this

Kreider-Richards-Gaborik
Dubinsky-Stepan-Callahan
Hagelin-Anisimov-Zucc

When you compare that possibility to our current line-up, how could we possibly be content?

 

[chosen]

Some fantastic responses, especially Ngator60.

I think there's alot of frustration with the abandonment of the homegrown movement. To think, if Sather had elected to not make a single trade, our top 9 would look something like this

Kreider-Richards-Gaborik
Dubinsky-Stepan-Callahan
Hagelin-Anisimov-Zucc

When you compare that possibility to our current line-up, how could we possibly be content?

I hate that first line. Much prefer the one we currently have.

 

[bathgate]

Very, very well said. I've put forth some of the same thoughts in other threads. For me, and I get that this is individual and subjective, the stories are the entertainment, both the story of the franchise on a macro level and the story of each player on the micro. I'm fascinated by it on many levels, and that keeps me interested, and more often than not, gives me something to be pleased with and validate the time spent following.

Also, I really, truly wonder how some posters justify the time spent on this team based on almost exclusively negative and heated posts. If you get nothing but misery out of this, what's the point?



Exactly.

Perfect example: Derek Stepan, a player I am currently very down on. But for me, he is a fascinating player whose career revolves around a simple question: can a smart, creative, fine playmaking center become a number one center when his skating is just average? The jury is still out but it is playing out before our eyes. Fascinating.

Another: Pouliot and Brassard: both extremely high draft picks whose careers have not lived up to the draft slot? Why? Were they over hyped? Is it something in their internal makeup? We're learning a lot about them and making us think about why some players succeed and others don't.

Another: Zucc...his story speaks for itself.

Richards: how does a former elite player deal with eroding skills? Fascinating.

I could do something like this for each and every player on the team. It keeps me interested, keeps me thinking, keeps me involved, keeps me tuning in.

Of course I want to win, of course I'm frustrated but the process of building and constructing a hockey team is intellectually and emotionally stimulating. It can't be only about wins and loses because almost all years we go home losers.

I too have been a fan for well over 50 years with season tickets for 35 of those years. I love the team just like you and it is a wonderful diversion from every day life. Nevertheless, I do object to the last fourteen years. As a New Yorker, I would tolerate a rebuild if attempted in a thoughtful way. Sather has no vision and attempts short term gratification at the expense of taking one step back to take two steps forward. I am not getting any younger . However, give me a meaningful rebuild and I will buy back my season tickets

 

[Callagraves]

I hate that first line. Much prefer the one we currently have.

The lines were made on a whim. Stick Stepan up there instead, move players around. For some reason I always think of Zucc as a left winger.

My point is that while I root for Brassard, what with him being a Ranger and all, I sorta resent him for not bringing the same game that Anisimov does. I know I'll piss a certain contingent off, but I miss the type of game Brandon Dubinsky brings. I don't expect Rick Nash to go out there and be the energizer bunny, but it kills me that he doesn't work as hard as any of the players we gave up for him.

I don't want to invoke the Tortorella argument, but I don't think it's a coincidence that he looked much better last year; Torts was more than willing to bench a star. I'm afraid that type of "I don't get a **** who you are, you're going to work as hard as every other player" coaching was the only way to get the most out of a guy like Nash. A.V's "clean slate" was great for a guy like Richards, or other players who struggled, but is it possible it sent the message to guys like Rick Nash that the expectations on him had changed?

I'll admit: I think Rick Nash is better than Gaborik. Right now, anyways. But while Nash, Callahan, Zucc is better down the right wing than if Gabby were there, Kreider, Dubi, Hags down the left wing is THAT much better than Kreider, Hags, Pouliot (vomits).

I can't aim the same anger at Dorsset. He hasn't brought the 3rd line offense that he was advertised as offering, but he's absolutely given everything he has every step in the way. He's not Prust, but he's a player that has earned Ranger fans.

I was so proud of that 2011 team. The year before they exploded to finish 1st in the east, The Pack line carried the team, Marc Staal was one of the best shutdown men in the league, and McD came out of nowhere to jump right onto the 2nd pairing and wow us all.

Home grown players. I remember us all practically gushing over the fact that the players either were not allowed to/refused to walk over the Rangers shield. Hard working, hard nosed players who managed to outwork other teams to the degree that they were beating teams they had NO RIGHT beating.

Now? They have talent, but find new ways to lose games every night it seems.

 

[HFsNumber1Heel]

It all comes down to two basic things; is the team fun to watch and are they winning? This year the answer is no.

This is the least fun Rangers team to watch since before lockout #1 and that includes 2009-10 which was an awful team until they made the Higgins/Kotalik for Jokinen/Prust swap.

There are two ways to watch sports. One is to just root for a team and not care about the players, roster moves ,etc. which is fine, and then there is how we all watch here and root for the draft picks, armchair GM, the players stories, etc.

They had a nice identity for two years (2010-11 and 2011-12) and then changed the identity. It didn't work. Now they're trying to build a new one.

This year has just been no fun to watch. It's a season of a television show or an album of a band you love that you hope eventually gets good because so far, it's not.