Who was the biggest omission from the Four Nations Cup rosters?

[cneely]

You proved my point, Bergeron got paid after he won the cup in 2011, 8 yr extension in 2014
Kopitar won in 2012/2014 8 yr extension in 2016.

And as i said, it was over a decade ago when players would need to win before getting the $10m contracts, Kopitar and Bergeron are one of the last, followed by Toews and Kane. Crosby was the only exception and worthy of the big contract.

Who are you suggesting has a big contract who hasn't earned it? Who has 150 points and is a -50?

 

[lawrence]

I personally prefer

Bouchard Mark Schiefele and Zach Hyman
over Hagel, Sanhiem Cirelli . Clearly cooper added those guys to team Canada because hes their tampa bay players.

 

[Toby91ca]

Who are you suggesting has a big contract who hasn't earned it? Who has 150 points and is a -50?

The majority of big contracts these days are signed with guys who haven’t earned it, but for guys you hope will earn it. It makes sense I guess, you want to pay guys for what they are going to do, not what they have already done

 

[cneely]

The majority of big contracts these days are signed with guys who haven’t earned it, but for guys you hope will earn it. It makes sense I guess, you want to pay guys for what they are going to do, not what they have already done

In the context of the guys named to this team, I have no idea who he's referring to.

 

[Toby91ca]

In the context of the guys named to this team, I have no idea who he's referring to.

I didn't read the full 8 pages.....obviously he's not referring to anyone specifically and is exaggerating stats, but you have a point.....it's not just in the context of this team, I can't really think of anyone in the league that would meet that type of criteria. Even some forwards that don't seem to play defense at all, if they are scoring a ton, they don't tend to be minus players.

One guy that scores and doesn't play defense and is a minus most years is Karlsson though.

 

[Golden_Jet]

I didn't read the full 8 pages.....obviously he's not referring to anyone specifically and is exaggerating stats, but you have a point.....it's not just in the context of this team, I can't really think of anyone in the league that would meet that type of criteria. Even some forwards that don't seem to play defense at all, if they are scoring a ton, they don't tend to be minus players.

One guy that scores and doesn't play defense and is a minus most years is Karlsson though.

In a day where offensively gifted players in the NHL are being paid over $10m a season, who need to hit offensive marks or face scrutiny, all they know is to try and score, they can have 150 pts and be a -50, they will call it a success. It's hard to blame them honestly, all the fans want to see is goals from the stars or they are a failure. It' very rare that you have players who are willing to sacrifice offence for defence in todays NHL, they need to live up to their contracts, and that means POINTS not CUPS. Up until a decade ago, a players worth was how far the team advanced in the playoffs and how many cups they won, hefty contracts were granted only after success was achieved, today it's the big contracts first then hope for the success....it doesn't work.

 

[Toby91ca]

Yeah, I saw that, but obviously there is no player that scores 150pts and is -50

 

[LeafLoyalist]

Who are you suggesting has a big contract who hasn't earned it? Who has 150 points and is a -50?

It was a point that i was making, as I had said, elite offensive players are only focusing on offense and don't spend energy working on their defensive games, because the big contracts have to live up to expectations. Of the top 12 salaries in the NHL, only 2 have won a Stanley Cup and they got their contracts after they won cups, the new age NHL has changed. The dynamic 2 way players will never fetch the big contracts, but those are the type of players you need to win championships.

 

[Golden_Jet]

It was a point that i was making, as I had said, elite offensive players are only focusing on offense and don't spend energy working on their defensive games, because the big contracts have to live up to expectations. Of the top 12 salaries in the NHL, only 2 have won a Stanley Cup and they got their contracts after they won cups, the new age NHL has changed. The dynamic 2 way players will never fetch the big contracts, but those are the type of players you need to win championships.

So it really wasn’t a point then, since you had no examples.
Would have been just easier to just say the 150/-50 was hyperbole.

 

[LeafLoyalist]

So it really wasn’t a point then, since you had no examples.
Would have been just easier to just say the 150/-50 was hyperbole.

The statement started with an IF, which would suggest that IF a player would hit 150 points, with a -50 (which is exaggerated) it would be viewed as success.....do you still not get my point?

 

[Golden_Jet]

The statement started with an IF, which would suggest that IF a player would hit 150 points, with a -50 (which is exaggerated) it would be viewed as success.....do you still not get my point?

No it didn’t start with an IF.
and there is no point there, since it’s never happened in history.

can you now say it was hyperbole.

In a day where offensively gifted players in the NHL are being paid over $10m a season, who need to hit offensive marks or face scrutiny, all they know is to try and score, they can have 150 pts and be a -50, they will call it a success. It's hard to blame them honestly, all the fans want to see is goals from the stars or they are a failure. It' very rare that you have players who are willing to sacrifice offence for defence in todays NHL, they need to live up to their contracts, and that means POINTS not CUPS. Up until a decade ago, a players worth was how far the team advanced in the playoffs and how many cups they won, hefty contracts were granted only after success was achieved, today it's the big contracts first then hope for the success....it doesn't work.

 

[Habssince89]

Leaving Suzuki off of a tournament roster is a blunder.

 

[gritdash60]

Other, Lane Hutson.

 

[cneely]

It was a point that i was making, as I had said, elite offensive players are only focusing on offense and don't spend energy working on their defensive games, because the big contracts have to live up to expectations. Of the top 12 salaries in the NHL, only 2 have won a Stanley Cup and they got their contracts after they won cups, the new age NHL has changed. The dynamic 2 way players will never fetch the big contracts, but those are the type of players you need to win championships.

A guy putting up 150 points a year is probably not the guy you should be asking to play defence. That just might be an inefficient use of talent.

How many of the top 12 salaries regularly put up 150 points?

Anze Kopitar just signed a 2 year extension for $14 million, but prior to that was paid $10 million AAV over 8 years and has been a PPG player once in his career.

 

[LeafLoyalist]

No it didn’t start with an IF.
and there is no point there, since it’s never happened in history.

can you now say it was hyperbole.

No didn't say IF specifically, but it was implied, I did not say it as fact, but simply a scenario to express the opinion that an offensively gifted player CAN have 150 pts, and be a -50, and no one will show any concern, the fact he hit the offensive marks is what matters. In today's NHL the highest paid salaries are paid to perform OFFENSIVELY, and there is no merit placed on their defensive game....AS IT WAS more than a decade ago. You may not agree, but if you ask the top 12 players in the NHL if they feel pressure to perform offensively in the eyes of the fans/media, they will all tell you YES, but no fan/media care about their defensive game....only the coaches and GM care about that.

 

[LeafLoyalist]

A guy putting up 150 points a year is probably not the guy you should be asking to play defence. That just might be an inefficient use of talent.

How many of the top 12 salaries regularly put up 150 points?

Anze Kopitar just signed a 2 year extension for $14 million, but prior to that was paid $10 million AAV over 8 years and has been a PPG player once in his career.

Again, let's set this straight, the stats i provided is exaggerated to prove a point....the highest paid salary players are judged on points total...NOTHING ELSE.

You picked 1 player out of the top 12 highest salaries, and he got paid AFTER winning a Stanley Cup. Now analyze the other top 10 players, with the exception of Mackinnon...who once again, got his big contract AFTER he won a Stanley Cup.

 

[Golden_Jet]

No didn't say IF specifically, but it was implied, I did not say it as fact, but simply a scenario to express the opinion that an offensively gifted player CAN have 150 pts, and be a -50, and no one will show any concern, the fact he hit the offensive marks is what matters. In today's NHL the highest paid salaries are paid to perform OFFENSIVELY, and there is no merit placed on their defensive game....AS IT WAS more than a decade ago. You may not agree, but if you ask the top 12 players in the NHL if they feel pressure to perform offensively in the eyes of the fans/media, they will all tell you YES, but no fan/media care about their defensive game....only the coaches and GM care about that.

Lol
You: I said IF …
Shown post with no IF
You: ok, I didn’t say IF …..

So was like I said originally, a bunch of hyperbole.

 

[cneely]

Again, let's set this straight, the stats i provided is exaggerated to prove a point....the highest paid salary players are judged on points total...NOTHING ELSE.

You picked 1 player out of the top 12 highest salaries, and he got paid AFTER winning a Stanley Cup. Now analyze the other top 10 players, with the exception of Mackinnon...who once again, got his big contract AFTER he won a Stanley Cup.

Seth Jones?

Alex Pieterangelo?

Hamilton? Dahlin? Aho? Barkov? Fox?

All noted 150 point players apparently.

 

[Golden_Jet]

No didn't say IF specifically, but it was implied, I did not say it as fact, but simply a scenario to express the opinion that an offensively gifted player CAN have 150 pts, and be a -50, and no one will show any concern, the fact he hit the offensive marks is what matters. In today's NHL the highest paid salaries are paid to perform OFFENSIVELY, and there is no merit placed on their defensive game....AS IT WAS more than a decade ago. You may not agree, but if you ask the top 12 players in the NHL if they feel pressure to perform offensively in the eyes of the fans/media, they will all tell you YES, but no fan/media care about their defensive game....only the coaches and GM care about that.

The statement started with an IF, which would suggest that IF a player would hit 150 points, with a -50 (which is exaggerated) it would be viewed as success.....do you still not get my point?

 

[Voight]

Leaving Suzuki off of a tournament roster is a blunder.

Not really, he isn't some glaring omission. They rent worse off without him, i.e. hes a good player but not a game breaker/difference maker in a setting like this. I dont even think hes the best player left off Team Canada (Rob Thomas, Scheifele)

 

[Duffy13]

It's been awhile but they always used to take younger superstar in the making players along for the ride, even if they didn't get minutes. Just to have them get accustomed to how the best in the game prepare for big tourneys, games, how they handle practices and routines. It's a shame that Bedard will not get a chance to hang out with Crosby, Mackinnon or Marchand and others.... guys who have won and played at high levels throughout their careers. Same for Tage and getting to know how the best prepare themselves. Lemieux didn't start winning until he played with a bunch of the Oilers and NYI dynasty guys.... it's a nice way to pass on that experience, that I think guys like McDavid, and Marner, Matthews could have picked up some stuff from guys like Crosby, Doughty, Toews, Kane etc etc.

Anywhooooooo Maybe Eklund is the biggest snub... Rakell is coming on strong but he wasn't a player that was super strong to be an initial snub, more of a hindsight shit god damn it snub.

 

[LeafLoyalist]

Seth Jones?

Alex Pieterangelo?

Hamilton? Dahlin? Aho? Barkov? Fox?

All noted 150 point players apparently.

Not once did I say a player actually reached 150 pts and had a -50, i guess education is not a prerequisite on this board...but keep going off topic

Not sure what any of those players have input in this discussion

Lol
You: I said IF …
Shown post with no IF
You: ok, I didn’t say IF …..

So was like I said originally, a bunch of hyperbole.

You talked more about vocabulary than the actual topic of discussion

 

[Golden_Jet]

Not once did I say a player actually reached 150 pts and had a -50, i guess education is not a prerequisite on this board...but keep going off topic

Not sure what any of those players have input in this discussion


You talked more about vocabulary than the actual topic of discussion

Haha your just mad, as you got owned by numerous posters, for talking hyperbole.