Who was Detroit's last great Draft Pick out of Canada?

[FMichael]

If Primeau is considered great, so is larkin.

Larkin's father is from Toronto - so DBoss is half-Canadian

On a more serious note...Yzerman, Osgood, Primeau (who later brought us Shanahan), and could even throw in Martin Lapointe.

 

[HoweFan]

I watched a you tube video on Joe Murphy a few months ago. Great story. He had his problems but seems to be rid of the alcohol. He was in Kenora Ontario I believe at the time. Living on the streets I think. Sounded like everyone there liked him. Mentally he still has his problems but a great guy. Really pulling for him

 

[GarlicbreadTB]

Sebastian Cossa hopefully.

 

[DoMakc]

Imagine winning 4 Stanley Cups, first coming 14 years since the last great pick out of Canada. How awful.

 

[Run the Jewels]

I think our NA drafting has been noticeably better since the departure of Tyler Wright. I am not too concerned about anything we did prior to 2015 because 1) we were a playoff team, 2) we had different priorities, and 3) we had different leadership.

I think the tandem of Cossa/Augustine is one of the best (if not the best) young goalie tandems in the world. Cossa is one of the best goalies in the AHL, and Augustine is one of the best goalies in the NCAA. I mean full stop, I feel like either of those is hard to debate. Cossa has all the physical tools to be an elite goaltender. Augustine is one of the more technically consistent goalies you will find, especially for someone his age. That combo should give us a quality starter and might also give us our back-up for years to come. I am excited and encouraged by both the picking of those players as well as their development.

Danielson has faced some adversity this year but has all the tools to be a middle 6 center that is extremely hard to play against. He has a lot of similarities as Kasper, and I would not be surprised at all if he looks better when you drop him into the highest level. I think he has a lot of the traits you would want in a young center and I expect him to be impactful for us at the NHL level.

Plante is the one I feel like you really need to be more excited about. What he just did as a true freshman in college hockey was phenomenal. He has the upside to be a high end playmaker on the wing, which we could really use. Outside of Kane/Raymond, I don't know we have a lot of guys who can drive play from the wing, and Plante can do that 100%.

Lombardi has 27 pts in 35 games and Mazur has 15 pts in 20 games this year for Grand Rapids. I like both of these guys quite a bit. I think Mazur is your swiss army knife that can play anywhere in the lineup, and Lombardi is a + puck possession player.

So yeah as a whole, I feel good about the NA scouting since Yzerman took over and we moved on from Wright. I think the decisions of when to select a NA player or not with the top pick have been good decisions, and I think more recently we have done a good job scouting from the USNTDP, which has been one of my bigger criticisms. I think a few years from now we will see 3-4 forwards from NA we drafted in the lineup and at least 1 goalie. Given that we have not exhausted that many picks on NA players, I think that would be a pretty reasonably job well done by our scouts.

Thanks. I like the guys you have mentioned and I've said as much in their prospect threads. The problem is there aren't any guys who really make you think you got someone who can be a true difference maker at the NHL level. None of these guys are pushing their way into the conversation on a team that is crying out for skill and quality.

Part of that may be due to how the DRW tend to handle prospects, but the vibe you get from those who cover the team and talk to the organization is that none of these guys are making the case for playing in Detroit yet. That should concern you given the one good prospect we've drafted out of North America in the past decade turned pro after his D+1 season (Dylan Larkin).

Max Bultman is the absolute best in this regard, and I'll use his latest article on the organization's top prospects to guide what I say below.

Of the group, I think there's a real shot that Augustine is a plus goalie, if not a very good starting NHL netminder. He's been in two very good programs with the USNTDP and MSU. The concerning thing is he's dominated college hockey, yet his path is apparently contingent on what happens with Cossa next year. Yzerman is not going to push a goalie, and the fact he has two goalies (Talbot and Mrazek) next season suggests Cossa will spend another year in GR and as a call up, which would mean Augustine would spend another season in East Lansing.

There's nothing wrong with that, but it also indicates he's not pushing his way into the conversation on a team where goaltending has been a major weakness for nearly a decade.

I'll also agree that Plante's start is very impressive. Given how little I expected due to Minnesota-Duluth's boring style of hockey, I was very pleasantly surprised. Max Bultman thinks he's a top 9 playmaker, which is nice but again not a game changer. His D+2 season is going to be huge in this regard as far as rating him as a prospect. If there is an expectation for him to turn pro after his sophomore season it would be a great sign.

So while I do hope our NA scouting has improved, there's nothing to suggest they have drafted a great player who can provide the skill and quality Dylan Larkin provided very shortly after his draft year. That should be the measuring stick, although I will admit it is a bit unfair to d-men and goalies.

Then there are the other guys they've drafted in the first three rounds since 2020 when Wright was gone.

2020:

• Cross Hanas (2nd round): not even listed in Bultman's top 12 prospects
• Donovan Sebrango (3rd round): looks like an AHL'er in his D+4 year

2021:

• Shai Buiuum (2nd round): I like him, but destined to spend his D+4 year in GR
• Carter Mazur (3rd round): Nice depth guy

2022

• Dylan James (2nd round): 0.58 PPG guy at a very good NCAA program during his 3rd season

2023

• Andrew Gibson (2nd round): 24 pts over 54 games this season
• Brady Cleveland (2nd round): Pretty sure you hated this pick

Add it all up and what do you have?

• The guys drafted out of NA 3-5 years ago are mostly just guys with the hope Lombardi can turn into solid 3rd line scoring depth.
• The guys drafted 1-2 years ago still have that new draft pick smell, and the hope is they will be the ones to live up to their draft hype.

As I said in my previous post, I do not believe the Red Wings can win a Cup if they continue to fail at drafting quality players from the single biggest talent pool in the world. The clock is ticking as we likely only have 4-5 more years of prime Larkin.

 

[Run the Jewels]

Draper and Yzerman take the time to go to Europe and see these high end picks as well. Your first round pick is never done without the GM and Director of Scouting. I love Hakan, but I think people simplify this to fit a narrative too often.

Seider, Raymond, Edvinsson etc. are guys our entire organization was over the moon with during the process.

If you want to be pedantic, that's a life choice I guess. But the European contingent is surfacing the guys they think are best and then getting feedback from the NA guys.

 

[Run the Jewels]

Imagine winning 4 Stanley Cups, first coming 14 years since the last great pick out of Canada. How awful.

Imagine a league where there isn't a salary cap and you can force s**t teams to trade you guys like Brendan Shanahan, Domink Hasek and Chris Chelios.

 

[Frk It]

Thanks. I like the guys you have mentioned and I've said as much in their prospect threads. The problem is there aren't any guys who really make you think you got someone who can be a true difference maker at the NHL level. None of these guys are pushing their way into the conversation on a team that is crying out for skill and quality.

Part of that may be due to how the DRW tend to handle prospects, but the vibe you get from those who cover the team and talk to the organization is that none of these guys are making the case for playing in Detroit yet. That should concern you given the one good prospect we've drafted out of North America in the past decade turned pro after his D+1 season (Dylan Larkin).

Max Bultman is the absolute best in this regard, and I'll use his latest article on the organization's top prospects to guide what I say below.

Of the group, I think there's a real shot that Augustine is a plus goalie, if not a very good starting NHL netminder. He's been in two very good programs with the USNTDP and MSU. The concerning thing is he's dominated college hockey, yet his path is apparently contingent on what happens with Cossa next year. Yzerman is not going to push a goalie, and the fact he has two goalies (Talbot and Mrazek) next season suggests Cossa will spend another year in GR and as a call up, which would mean Augustine would spend another season in East Lansing.

There's nothing wrong with that, but it also indicates he's not pushing his way into the conversation on a team where goaltending has been a major weakness for nearly a decade.

I'll also agree that Plante's start is very impressive. Given how little I expected due to Minnesota-Duluth's boring style of hockey, I was very pleasantly surprised. Max Bultman thinks he's a top 9 playmaker, which is nice but again not a game changer. His D+2 season is going to be huge in this regard as far as rating him as a prospect. If there is an expectation for him to turn pro after his sophomore season it would be a great sign.

So while I do hope our NA scouting has improved, there's nothing to suggest they have drafted a great player who can provide the skill and quality Dylan Larkin provided very shortly after his draft year. That should be the measuring stick, although I will admit it is a bit unfair to d-men and goalies.

Then there are the other guys they've drafted in the first three rounds since 2020 when Wright was gone.

2020:

• Cross Hanas (2nd round): not even listed in Bultman's top 12 prospects
• Donovan Sebrango (3rd round): looks like an AHL'er in his D+4 year

2021:

• Shai Buiuum (2nd round): I like him, but destined to spend his D+4 year in GR
• Carter Mazur (3rd round): Nice depth guy

2022

• Dylan James (2nd round): 0.58 PPG guy at a very good NCAA program during his 3rd season

2023

• Andrew Gibson (2nd round): 24 pts over 54 games this season
• Brady Cleveland (2nd round): Pretty sure you hated this pick

Add it all up and what do you have?

• The guys drafted out of NA 3-5 years ago are mostly just guys with the hope Lombardi can turn into solid 3rd line scoring depth.
• The guys drafted 1-2 years ago still have that new draft pick smell, and the hope is they will be the ones to live up to their draft hype.

As I said in my previous post, I do not believe the Red Wings can win a Cup if they continue to fail at drafting quality players from the single biggest talent pool in the world. The clock is ticking as we likely only have 4-5 more years of prime Larkin.

Yeah, I guess it depends on what Danielson/Cossa/Augustine/Lombardi/Mazur become, which is still TBD. I think you will have 2-3 forwards in the top 9 from NA and potentially both your goalies from NA.

So relative to the draft picks they have exhausted, I would call that a good/solid job. Not nearly as concerning as what we were getting from NA prior to Yzerman, IMO.

But I do not think they have been amazing or infallible or anything like that. I think the Cleveland pick was outright terrible. I liked a number of players better than Dylan James in 2022.

If I were to have a concern it would be that we have not drafted more players from the OHL/WHL. I think the last few years there have been a lot of really good options from the OHL/WHL available to us in the first 2 rounds and we seem to pass on these guys more than I think we should.

But all in all, I am not that concerned with the NA scouting overall with this current front office. I was concerned with our USNTDP scouting after the Cleveland pick, but the Augustine/Plante picks gave me some confidence that we might have some competent scouts that watch that team.

As far as your last point, I think we will fail if we don't draft enough good players, and I don't care where they are from. So I guess we will just agree to disagree on that. If we were spending a whole bunch of 1st rounders on NA players that sucked, I think your point would be a lot more valid. But that hasn't really been the case for the most part. I think we have picked our spots pretty well the last 4-5 years with our picks in most cases.

 

[Pavels Dog]

When you consider it is the most talent-ladened geographic location on the planet, yes. Yes it is.

It's also the most well scouted geographic location on the planet, potentially making it harder to make good value picks. If they were Canadian, odds are Raymond, Seider and Edvinsson would all have been gone by the time we made our picks.

 

[Oddbob]

Riley Sheahan. His points-per-tinky winky are unmatched.

Nobody goes 0 for 80 any better.

 

[rbartnik]

Since 2010, just because it's a nice round number... Canadians we missed on that fit your criteria:

• Braden Point

... that's it. That's the whole list. Everyone else in the league missed out on him, too.

 

[PelagicJoe]

Nobody goes 0 for 80 any better.

What a waste of a first round pick. He sucked like most of our 2010s Holland era picks

 

[Run the Jewels]

What a waste of a first round pick. He sucked like most of our 2010s Holland era picks

As expected, zero good faith arguments from those who either want to bury their heads in the sand or defend the status quo. Wish I could say I'm surprised, but I've been here long enough to know how things go.

 

[better Red than Dead]

Technically Graves was not drafted, he was signed

 

[Run the Jewels]

Welp, Trey Augustine's rep as a big time goalie in pressure situations takes a hit: .810 SV% as Sparty gets bounced from the tourney. The B1G as a whole looks badly overrated based on admittedly very limited data - a one game playoff series.

 

[Run the Jewels]

Technically Graves was not drafted, he was signed

I thought Graves was drafted in the second round? I know Adam Oates was a free agent signing as he was not drafted.

 

[better Red than Dead]

Technically Graves was not drafted, he was signed

Actually, my bad, I stand corrected I was thinking of Adam Oates, not Graves

 

[better Red than Dead]

I thought Graves was drafted in the second round? I know Adam Oates was a free agent signing as he was not drafted.

Yes, he was, my bad was thinking of Adam Oates