Which active players are top 20 playoff performers of all-time, or expected to reach that high? How about top 10?

[bobholly39]

I know a few years ago we did a top 40 playoff performer ranking on this forum. I think it was a great project, but I think even during the process a lot of people were saying how it was hard to rank for playoffs, and a lot of people weren't necessarily thrilled with the final list. At least, that's how I remember it.

Back then, the highest active players ranked were:

Crosby at 27, Duncan Keith at 38. Duncan Keith didn't really add anything significant beyond then - Crosby did add a very strong smythe/cup in 2017, and another strong run in 2018. And considering we generally include international performances, he added some there too.

So my question is - are any active players today worthy of a top 20 all-time playoff performer ranking? How about top 10? Is anyone seemingly well on their way to rank that high?

Does Crosby crack the top 10? I'd say he definitely cracks the top 20, but top 10 is a bit more difficult.
How about someone like Kucherov? Is he top 20? Maybe Hedman or even Vasi also from Tampa?

I know it's hard to predict the future - especially for playoff performances - but are any of McDavid, Draisaitl or MacKinnon seemingly on route to such a high standing? McDavid especially has some significant peak playoff stuff so far.

Anyone else outside of those names who should factor? Does Malkin reach top 20 for you?

Here's a link to the top 40 ranking we did a few years ago:

Thread 'HOH Top 40 Stanley Cup Playoff Performers of All Time'

Apr 25, 2017

The following is the final list of the top Stanley Cup playoff performers as determined by the History of Hockey community.

Report any errors to quoipourquoi.

Top Stanley Cup Playoff Performers of All-Time

		Pos.	Born	Nationality	First Playoff	Last Playoff	St. Cups	OT P/W
1	Wayne Gretzky	C1	1961	Canada	1980	1997	4
2	Patrick Roy	G1	1965	Canada	1986	2003

[TBODY] ...

• quoipourquoi
• Replies: 508
• Forum: The History of Hockey

 

[MadLuke]

McDavid is en route (if not already well there and had time to look around) for that for sure..

Best 70 games stretch adjusted for the defense faced:

full_name	start_date	end_date	avgDef	games	goals	points	adj_goals	adj_points
Wayne Gretzky	4/8/1981	4/12/1986	3.75	70	57	159	56.5	158.3
Connor McDavid	4/16/2017	6/18/2024	2.7	70	36	115	48.6	156.6
Mario Lemieux	4/23/1989	5/11/1996	3.23	70	60	132	68.3	151
Leon Draisaitl	4/18/2017	6/21/2024	2.7	70	41	108	55.2	148.7
Gordie Howe	3/22/1955	4/21/1964	2.42	70	35	95	54.6	147.5
Phil Esposito	4/6/1968	4/11/1975	2.56	70	46	101	66.3	145.8
Peter Forsberg	5/11/1999	4/17/2004	2.39	70	31	87	47.6	134.6
Jaromir Jagr	5/10/1995	5/10/2001	2.55	70	42	92	61	134.1
Nikita Kucherov	8/8/2020	4/18/2023	2.66	70	23	94	31.5	132
Sidney Crosby	4/9/2008	5/17/2013	2.71	70	36	97	48.9	131.9
Guy Lafleur	4/13/1975	4/8/1980	3.04	70	49	108	58.9	130.4
Bobby Orr	4/2/1969	4/11/1975	2.57	70	26	90	38.1	129.7
Nathan MacKinnon	4/11/2019	5/7/2024	2.78	70	42	95	55.2	128.5
Joe Sakic	4/26/1993	5/30/1999	2.64	70	38	90	52.6	126.9
Ryan Getzlaf	4/16/2009	5/5/2017	2.47	70	25	85	36.6	126.6
Mikko Rantanen	4/11/2019	5/7/2024	2.78	70	32	94	43.5	126.5
Bernie Geoffrion	4/16/1953	4/7/1960	2.58	70	43	89	62.6	126
Evgeni Malkin	4/9/2008	5/14/2013	2.72	70	35	90	47.9	121.4
Jean Beliveau	3/23/1954	3/27/1962	2.56	70	37	84	52.9	120.5
Bobby Hull	4/19/1962	5/2/1971	2.65	70	42	85	58.1	119.2
Ted Lindsay	4/18/1950	3/26/1960	2.28	70	35	72	56.4	118.5
Johnny Bucyk	4/6/1968	4/8/1975	2.55	70	36	81	52.1	116.8
Henrik Zetterberg	4/24/2008	5/12/2013	2.59	70	37	81	53.2	115.9
Mike Bossy	4/21/1980	5/17/1983	3.58	70	60	109	63.4	114.4
Martin St. Louis		4/27/2014	2.38	68	35	74	53.7	113.9
Brad Richards	4/12/2004	5/25/2012	2.42	70	27	72	41.5	111.2
Patrick Kane	5/31/2010	5/7/2015	2.35	70	28	70	43.8	110.1
Brad Marchand	4/28/2018	4/24/2024	2.8	70	35	82	47	109.3
Daniel Brière	5/6/2007	4/29/2012	2.59	70	37	76	52.7	109.2
Alex Delvecchio	4/1/1954	4/2/1964	2.37	70	29	69	45.7	109
Brett Hull	4/10/1990	4/23/1998	3.07	70	50	89	59	108.9
Stan Mikita	4/12/1961	4/19/1970	2.66	70	29	77	40.6	108.6
Mark Messier	4/8/1987	4/4/1991	3.6	70	33	107	33	107.3
Bryan Trottier	4/17/1980	5/17/1983	3.57	70	34	102	35.4	107.1
Yvan Cournoyer	4/18/1968	4/14/1974	2.74	70	42	80	55.4	106.9

Most career playoff points adjusted for defense faced:

full_name	games	points	adjpts	ppg	goals	adjgoals	gpg	player_rank
Wayne Gretzky	208	382	409.8	1.97	122	130.9	0.63	1
Mark Messier	236	295	317.8	1.35	109	116.8	0.49	2
Sidney Crosby	180	201	284.9	1.58	71	99.4	0.55	3
Joe Sakic	172	188	274.4	1.6	84	122.4	0.71	4
Jaromir Jagr	208	201	273.8	1.32	78	105.3	0.51	5
Evgeni Malkin	177	180	257.7	1.46	67	95.4	0.54	6
Nicklas Lidstrom	263	183	256.7	0.98	54	75.2	0.29	7
Peter Forsberg	151	171	252.6	1.67	64	93.7	0.62	8
Jean Beliveau	162	176	249.3	1.54	79	111.2	0.69	9
Gordie Howe	157	160	246.9	1.57	68	105.4	0.67	10
Brett Hull	202	190	243.5	1.21	103	129.1	0.64	11
Jari Kurri	200	233	238.6	1.19	106	109	0.55	12
Sergei Fedorov	183	176	237.3	1.3	52	71.2	0.39	13
Nikita Kucherov	147	167	236.9	1.61	53	75.6	0.51	14
Steve Yzerman	196	185	236	1.2	70	88.4	0.45	15
Marian Hossa	205	149	224.2	1.09	52	77.8	0.38	16
Glenn Anderson	225	214	222.4	0.99	93	96.4	0.43	17
Paul Coffey	194	196	213.3	1.1	59	63.5	0.33	18
Ray Bourque	214	180	212.2	0.99	41	47.4	0.22	19
Doug Gilmour	182	188	207.1	1.14	60	65.4	0.36	20
Stan Mikita	155	150	205.7	1.33	59	80	0.52	21
Mario Lemieux	107	172	204.6	1.91	76	89.3	0.83	22
Claude Lemieux	234	158	203.8	0.87	80	100.7	0.43	23
Joe Pavelski	201	143	202.8	1.01	74	104.2	0.52	24
Patrick Kane	143	138	202	1.41	53	77.2	0.54	25
Mark Recchi	189	147	201.8	1.07	61	85.7	0.45	26
Mike Modano	176	146	200.8	1.14	58	77.9	0.44	27
Bryan Trottier	221	182	198.7	0.9	71	77.5	0.35	28
Joe Thornton	187	134	198.6	1.06	32	47.9	0.26	29

Actives bolded (well "active" in case of Jagr)

Crosby-Malkin-Kucherov could all be in contention of course.

Looking at the list with no Jagr-Hasek-Bourque (3 of the best playoff performer ever), wonder if there was not grading on a curve relative to their regular season record that could have happened (almost impossible to avoid).

 

[Nadal On Clay]

Crosby/McDavid/Kucherov will/are probably right there.

MacKinnon/Draisaitl have a chance if they add up a bit more (A cup for Draisaitl with a solid performance probably puts him in the top 20).

 

[GlitchMarner]

McDavid is en route (if not already well there and had time to look around) for that for sure..

Best 70 games stretch adjusted for the defense faced:

full_name	start_date	end_date	avgDef	games	goals	points	adj_goals	adj_points
Wayne Gretzky	4/8/1981	4/12/1986	3.75	70	57	159	56.5	158.3
Connor McDavid	4/16/2017	6/18/2024	2.7	70	36	115	48.6	156.6
Mario Lemieux	4/23/1989	5/11/1996	3.23	70	60	132	68.3	151
Leon Draisaitl	4/18/2017	6/21/2024	2.7	70	41	108	55.2	148.7
Gordie Howe	3/22/1955	4/21/1964	2.42	70	35	95	54.6	147.5

It's highly impressive that McDavid is just behind Gretzky and is ahead of Mario and Howe.

I like that best 70 games stretches were used. In that sample size, the data is based on much more than a career-best playoff run; at the same time, one can't complain that many pre or post prime games were included for players.

I'm sure many of McDavid's 70 games were against the Kings. That team is and has been good defensively despite talk from some people (read: Penguins fans) that the 2022 (and maybe 2023) Kings were among the worst teams to qualify for the playoffs in the salary cap era.

 

[Gerulaitis]

Kucherov, Crosby, McDavid in top 20-25.

 

[Crosby2010]

No question about it Crosby is in the top 20. Top 10 maybe. Top 20 for sure. Only dynasty Oilers have more playoff points than him in their careers. It isn't like Malkin is THAT far behind Crosby either since we mention it. Kucherov still being young enough to spring past 200 points makes him a prime candidate. Three straight Smythe worthy runs in a row without a Conn Smythe. MacKinnon has just never had a bad postseason. From a PPG standpoint, and the amount of great runs at a torrid pace, he's getting up there.

Draisaitl and McDavid both need to have more runs. And at least one Cup. But yeah they are candidates for the top 20 someday. But man that is a hard list to crack.

 

[daver]

No question about it Crosby is in the top 20. Top 10 maybe. Top 20 for sure. Only dynasty Oilers have more playoff points than him in their careers. It isn't like Malkin is THAT far behind Crosby either since we mention it. Kucherov still being young enough to spring past 200 points makes him a prime candidate. Three straight Smythe worthy runs in a row without a Conn Smythe. MacKinnon has just never had a bad postseason. From a PPG standpoint, and the amount of great runs at a torrid pace, he's getting up there.

Draisaitl and McDavid both need to have more runs. And at least one Cup. But yeah they are candidates for the top 20 someday. But man that is a hard list to crack.

He is the top playoff producer of his era on a team that won the most playoff games and had the most team success (Three Cups, another SCF, and another ECF). Like his regular season resume, he is lacking nothing on his playoff resume other than the best playoff run that is befitting his stature as the highest per game producer during his prime. Like his regular season resume, one doesn't need look closely to see that isn't a big deal in the overall picture. He should be comfortably in the Top 20.

Kucherov is an interesting one that as he also been the top producer during his era on the most successful team of his era. He also has four SCFs in his resume.

How do his four SCFs rate vs. Crosby head to head?

Tier One

1. Crosby 2009 - He was having argubly one of the best playoff performances outside of Mario/Wayne through 3 rounds before being slowed down by the Wings who threw everything defensive weapon they had into that effort in a gamble that lost them the Cup.

2. Kucherov 2021 - Lead the playoffs in scoring by 9 points.

3. Crosby 2017 - Won Conn Smythe with a notable SCF performance

4. Crosby 2008 - Tied for lead in playoffs in two less games.

5. Kucherov 2020 - Lead playoffs in scoring but Point was deemed the better forward and Hedman the better player

6. Crosby 2016 - 2nd in team scoring, great 2-way play, won the Conn Smythe

7. Kucherov 2022

8. Kucherov 2015


Not quite sure that Kucherov is knocking on the door of the Top 20.

 

[Hockey Outsider]

In this post, I argued that Sakic and Crosby are close in terms of playoff performances, with Sakic probably slightly ahead. Since then, Crosby has scored 15 points in 16 games (not bad, but it doesn't really change anything).

The HOH list ranked Sakic 12th. By analogy, that means Crosby is probably around 15th?

 

[Moridin]

In this post, I argued that Sakic and Crosby are close in terms of playoff performances, with Sakic probably slightly ahead. Since then, Crosby has scored 15 points in 16 games (not bad, but it doesn't really change anything).

The HOH list ranked Sakic 12th. By analogy, that means Crosby is probably around 15th?

I don't think Crosby has done anything to improve his playoff ranking. He is a great, definitely top25 all time playoff performer, its just that there are some players that are worse players than him that had even better playoff resumes.

If I had to pick a center for my franchise, I'd pick Crosby ahead of lets say Trottier or Forsberg, AINEC. If its a single playoff run at their peaks though, its a much closer debate..

 

[bobholly39]

In this post, I argued that Sakic and Crosby are close in terms of playoff performances, with Sakic probably slightly ahead. Since then, Crosby has scored 15 points in 16 games (not bad, but it doesn't really change anything).

The HOH list ranked Sakic 12th. By analogy, that means Crosby is probably around 15th?

It took me way too long to realize that your "this post" is an actual link to a post. I thought this above paragraph was your argument lol

I think Sakic is a good comparable with Crosby, as there are a lot of similarities.

Some advantages Crosby has over Sakic:

- More high performance deeper runs than Sakic (4 finals vs 2)
- Sakic's lows are lower than Crosby. ie - Crosby more consistent overall
- More overall points (like you say, adding 15 more points in 16 games isn't groundbreaking, but more volume is better when it's already close)
- Crosby has an edge in international resume (which on this forum at least, we often look at as a combo with playoffs)

Flipside is, you summarize nicely some of the Sakic advantages. Not sure I agree with your point about Sakic playing a bigger role on his teams deeper runs though. To me - in absolutely any Crosby era playoff run that was somewhat successful, he was a top 2 player for Pittsburgh minimum. For Sakic - I'd argue he often fell below that.

 

[Hockey Outsider]

It took me way too long to realize that your "this post" is an actual link to a post. I thought this above paragraph was your argument lol

I think Sakic is a good comparable with Crosby, as there are a lot of similarities.

Some advantages Crosby has over Sakic:

- More high performance deeper runs than Sakic (4 finals vs 2)
- Sakic's lows are lower than Crosby. ie - Crosby more consistent overall
- More overall points (like you say, adding 15 more points in 16 games isn't groundbreaking, but more volume is better when it's already close)
- Crosby has an edge in international resume (which on this forum at least, we often look at as a combo with playoffs)

Flipside is, you summarize nicely some of the Sakic advantages. Not sure I agree with your point about Sakic playing a bigger role on his teams deeper runs though. To me - in absolutely any Crosby era playoff run that was somewhat successful, he was a top 2 player for Pittsburgh minimum. For Sakic - I'd argue he often fell below that.

One thing that bugs me about Crosby's playoff resume is, out of the five times Pittsburgh made it to the conference finals, he only led them in scoring once. Of course, we need to look beyond just the stats (for example, he was clearly their best forward in 2016, despite Kessel outscoring him). Still, for arguably the #5 player ever, it seems somewhat underwhelming.

Sakic had six trips to the conference finals. He was Colorado's best player in 1996. For what it's worth, I also thought he was their best player in 2001 (Roy won the Smythe - in any case, Sakic would have been their best forward). He was probably their 2nd best player 1997 (behind Roy), 2nd best again in 2002 (behind Forsberg), and 3rd best in 1999 (behind both). He was a huge disappointment in 2000 (playing through injuries - this is similar to Crosby's 2013 postseason).

 

[Nadal On Clay]

He is the top playoff producer of his era on a team that won the most playoff games and had the most team success (Three Cups, another SCF, and another ECF). Like his regular season resume, he is lacking nothing on his playoff resume other than the best playoff run that is befitting his stature as the highest per game producer during his prime. Like his regular season resume, one doesn't need look closely to see that isn't a big deal in the overall picture. He should be comfortably in the Top 20.

Kucherov is an interesting one that as he also been the top producer during his era on the most successful team of his era. He also has four SCFs in his resume.

How do his four SCFs rate vs. Crosby head to head?

Tier One

1. Crosby 2009 - He was having argubly one of the best playoff performances outside of Mario/Wayne through 3 rounds before being slowed down by the Wings who threw everything defensive weapon they had into that effort in a gamble that lost them the Cup.

2. Kucherov 2022 - Lead the playoffs in scoring by 9 points.

3. Crosby 2017 - Won Conn Smythe with a notable SCF performance

4. Crosby 2008 - Tied for lead in playoffs in two less games.

5. Kucherov 2021 - Lead playoffs in scoring but Point was deemed the better forward and Hedman the better player

6. Crosby 2016 - 2nd in team scoring, great 2-way play, won the Conn Smythe

7. Kucherov 2022

8. Kucherov 2015


Not quite sure that Kucherov is knocking on the door of the Top 20.

There's no objective argument to put 2016 Crosby ahead of 2022 Kucherov. None.

You also have two 2022 Kucherov. #2 on your ranking should be 2021 and #5 should be 2020

 

[daver]

One thing that bugs me about Crosby's playoff resume is, out of the five times Pittsburgh made it to the conference finals, he only led them in scoring once. Of course, we need to look beyond just the stats (for example, he was clearly their best forward in 2016, despite Kessel outscoring him). Still, for arguably the #5 player ever, it seems somewhat underwhelming.

1. Is there as good a non-Smythe winning playoff performance than Crosby's in 2009 since the lockout or even since 1993? He was the leading the Smythe candidate, albiet somewhat marginally, going into the SCF then Malkin, to his credit, produced when the opportunity presented itself to exploit weaker matchups as the Wings threw their very best defensive forwards ( Zetterberg and Datsyuk when he came back) and GOAT d-man at Crosby like they did in 2008.

2. 2013 was a dissappointment but he did technically lead the team in PPG as he missed one game due to his broken jaw and tied for the team league in goals

3. Yes, Crosby gets underrated for his 2016 performance as he does for his 2014 Olympic performance; he was the centrepiece on a dominant puck possession team who upped his offensive game in key moments

4. Crosby again misses one game due to yet another concussion but he lead again in PPG. Malkin wins the playoff scoring title by one point on the strength of 11 points against an overwhelmed Blue Jackets team, 9 of which are assists, with 7 secondary assists.

5. He has two notable 2-round runs in 2010 and 2017 and another promising run in 2022 cut short by, you guessed it, another concussion.

Like his regular season resume, but not quite to the same extent, you could be left for wanting more, or at least that signature Cup winning run like Sakic's 1996, Howe's 1955 or Beliveau's 1956. The same can be said about his international resume as his dominant 2016 World Cup is downplayed.

Then you realize that all this guy does is win at every level he has ever played.

No issue with ranking someone like Sakic above him but as noted by another poster, that doesn't necessarily mean you pick him over Crosby for a playoff run.

 

[daver]

There's no objective argument to put 2016 Crosby ahead of 2022 Kucherov. None.

Sure there is.

His team won the Cup on the strength of his solid 2-way play and his solid SCF performance, one that pushed him ahead of Kessel for the Conn Smythe, while the Bolts lost in the 2022 SCF as Kucherov's PPG went from 1.35 through the ECF to 0.67 in the SCF.

There is no argument that the 2016 and 2017 version of Crosby was a great 2-way player. The 2008 and 2009 version was still a better 2-way player than Kucherov has ever been but not so much as to close the gap on superior offensive performances.

To that latter point, was Kucherov's 2021 performance better offensively than Crosby's 2017 performance?

His point total was 6th best over the time period where league scoring has been above 2.90 (since 2018) and his PPG is 16th best (min. 12 games). In the eight year period where scoring was under 2.75 (2011 to 2017) Crosby's 2017 point total is 3rd best and his PPG is 7th best (min. 12 games).

Kucherov leading his team in scoring by nine points is a good argument for him but Crosby was notably great in the SCF and again, the superior 2-way player.

So take your pick, move 2016 Crosby lower but move 2017 Crosby higher.

 

[TheLegend27]

“Is there as good a non-Smythe winning playoff performance than Crosby's in 2009 since the lockout or even since 1993?”

Logan Couture 2016 and Nikita Kucherov 2021 come to mind. Both Led their teams(and playoffs) in points by a significant margin. They may not have had a higher level of play than Crosby, but they were arguably more important for their respective teams. I believe the larger critic of Crosby’s 2009 run is his playoff performance in the SCF. You’re right, he was a Smythe favorite after round three, and was expected to have a cup final that Malkin ended up having. There’s a lot of reasons of course, such as the wings focusing to shut down Crosby, but playing the way he did in the most important series didn’t leave a good reflection on most fans.

 

[The Panther]

One thing that bugs me about Crosby's playoff resume is, out of the five times Pittsburgh made it to the conference finals, he only led them in scoring once. Of course, we need to look beyond just the stats (for example, he was clearly their best forward in 2016, despite Kessel outscoring him). Still, for arguably the #5 player ever, it seems somewhat underwhelming.

I basically agree with this, and it's part of the reason he's not the #5 player ever.

That said, his playoff stats / performances are generally very good. (I have generally not found Crosby particularly outstanding in International Hockey 'big' games either, "Golden Goal" notwithstanding.)

 

[Nadal On Clay]

Sure there is.

His team won the Cup on the strength of his solid 2-way play and his solid SCF performance, one that pushed him ahead of Kessel for the Conn Smythe, while the Bolts lost in the 2022 SCF as Kucherov's PPG went from 1.35 through the ECF to 0.67 in the SCF.

There is no argument that the 2016 and 2017 version of Crosby was a great 2-way player. The 2008 and 2009 version was still a better 2-way player than Kucherov has ever been but not so much as to close the gap on superior offensive performances.

To that latter point, was Kucherov's 2021 performance better offensively than Crosby's 2017 performance?

His point total was 6th best over the time period where league scoring has been above 2.90 (since 2018) and his PPG is 16th best (min. 12 games). In the eight year period where scoring was under 2.75 (2011 to 2017) Crosby's 2017 point total is 3rd best and his PPG is 7th best (min. 12 games).

Kucherov leading his team in scoring by nine points is a good argument for him but Crosby was notably great in the SCF and again, the superior 2-way player.

So take your pick, move 2016 Crosby lower but move 2017 Crosby higher.

For the number of times I see you excuse Crosby for his poor performance in the 2009 Finals because he played against a really solid team.. why wouldn’t you do the same for Kucherov, who happened to play against an even better team in 2022?

Once again, I see you’re holding on the “two-way player” narrative for Crosby. Lets be real, it’s not something that will propulse Crosby above other contemporaries. Think of it as a tie breaker when 2 players are real close offensively to use as a tie-breaker. 2016 Crosby and 2022 Kucherov were not close offensively. I am well aware of their performances as a watched pretty much every game from their 2 runs. If you are being honest and look at it objectively, here is the correct order :

2021 Kucherov - Led playoffs/closest teammate by 9 pts. Dominant performance, solid through 4 rounds.

2020 Kucherov - Another dominant performance, but less dominant vs his peers (Hedman and Point). Solid through 4 rounds yet again.

2009 Crosby - A good Finals away from being 1st on the list. Tremendous first 3 rounds.

2008 Crosby - Hesistated between 2008 and 2017, but ultimately decided to go 2008. Pittsburgh’s Finals opponents were night and day during those years. Credit to Crosby for actually producing that time against the Wings.

2017 Crosby - See above. Best player on the Pens in the last 2 rounds.

2022 Kucherov - Good first 3 rounds, below average performance in the Finals. Was still clearly Tampa’s best player that year.

2015 Kucherov - Really good performance despite playing 14 mins per game. 1 point away from leading the playoffs in scoring at 21.

2016 Crosby - While I agree that the statline doesn’t justify the level of play, it is still not enough for me to put that run over any of the 7 others (you could maybe argue it is better than Kucherov in 2015, but I won’t).

 

[bobholly39]

I basically agree with this, and it's part of the reason he's not the #5 player ever.

That said, his playoff stats / performances are generally very good. (I have generally not found Crosby particularly outstanding in International Hockey 'big' games either, "Golden Goal" notwithstanding.)

It feels like your statement is odd. I think Crosby has generally done very well in "big games" on the international stage - what he's lacked is production outside of big games.

2010 olympic finals - golden goal
2014 olympic finals - goal, +2
2016 World cup finals - 3 points in 2 final games

He usually comes through in the big games. He was solid overall in 2010 and 2014 olympics, but didn't necessarily dominate the scoring overall in tournament - but in the big games, he certainly showed up.

 

[bobholly39]

“Is there as good a non-Smythe winning playoff performance than Crosby's in 2009 since the lockout or even since 1993?”

Logan Couture 2016 and Nikita Kucherov 2021 come to mind. Both Led their teams(and playoffs) in points by a significant margin. They may not have had a higher level of play than Crosby, but they were arguably more important for their respective teams. I believe the larger critic of Crosby’s 2009 run is his playoff performance in the SCF. You’re right, he was a Smythe favorite after round three, and was expected to have a cup final that Malkin ended up having. There’s a lot of reasons of course, such as the wings focusing to shut down Crosby, but playing the way he did in the most important series didn’t leave a good reflection on most fans.

Logan Couture didn't win the cup. I assume that's what he meant, among cup winners only. Because if we expand that to non cup winners, there are probably more candidates since 1993 (among goalies alone, you have Price, Hasek - Pronger in 2006 maybe).

Also - for me, Crosby 2009 > Couture in 2016. Definitely disagree with that one.

Kucherov 2021 & 2020 too - those are good ones. I can see those 2 runs and Crosby 2009 ranked in any order, similar tier.

 

[BigBadBruins7708]

1. Is there as good a non-Smythe winning playoff performance than Crosby's in 2009 since the lockout or even since 1993? He was the leading the Smythe candidate, albiet somewhat marginally, going into the SCF then Malkin, to his credit, produced when the opportunity presented itself to exploit weaker matchups as the Wings threw their very best defensive forwards ( Zetterberg and Datsyuk when he came back) and GOAT d-man at Crosby like they did in 2008.

Kucherov 2020
Kucherov 2021
McDavid 2022

His team won the Cup on the strength of his solid 2-way play and his solid SCF performance, one that pushed him ahead of Kessel for the Conn Smythe

What part was solid again? the 3 points in 6 games? his 0 goals? the +/- of 0? ooooh, right you're using the "he sacrificed offense to be Bergeron" argument. Only Crosby is generational enough to get pushed ahead in the Smythe race by being outscored by the guy he's chasing...

 

[MadLuke]

Is there as good a non-Smythe winning playoff performance than Crosby's in 2009 since the lockout or even since 1993?

Pronger 2006, Sakic 2001, Kucherov 20&21, Bure-Messier 1994, Hasek 1999, Brodeur 2003, Gilmour 1994-Gretzky 1997-Forsberg-2002-McDavid 2022 for those with less games played could all be in the conversation (not better but in the as good), Kane-Toews-Keith had strong run when one of the other won as well.