Where did Yzerman go wrong with the rebuild?

[KillerMillerTime]

I like how it's treated as some tiny minor point. Like sure, you guys have only had one pick in the top five in decades, but geez, why aren't you contending yet? Where's your mega-elite 22 year old center?? You're doing it wrong!!!

Bruins haven't had a top 10 pick in 14 years (Seguin) and have DNQ'd 2 times in that span while winning a Cup and going to 2 other SCF. Not having Lottery luck excuses
not going to a Conf Final but sure doesn't excuse 4 years of DNQ's, when literally half the NHL makes the PO.

 

[PelagicJoe]

Yep, the days of adding Hull, Hasek, Robitaille are long gone. Detroit as a city has its limited appeal to free agents. It's not a no income tax state, nor what most would say a glamour city like NY, Bos, Chi, LA, etc.

I don't think Det was going to out tank Chi, SJ, Ana, CBJ the past couple of seasons even without their free agent signings. Larkin, Raymond, Seider probably still able to keep Detroit ahead of those clubs. Upgrading Danielson to pick 5/6 in 2023 or their most recent pick into a 5-7 pick probably doesn't move the needle that drastically.

Something has to hit big for them. Be it a 2nd rounder onwards who is their version of Point/Cernak etc. or they trade for someone, Detroit needs another impact player, particularly up front.

With any GM of a rebuilding club, always have to wonder about pressure from ownership group. Not Yzerman's fault, but Det has missed the PO since 16/17 season (3 seasons before he took over). So, 8 seasons now.

We need better scouting for anyone to hit after the first round.

 

[SirloinUB]

The simplest and most likely explanation is that some people around here need to make peace with the idea that they may have been wrong about Walman's trade value.

I completely agree with you here. Unless people want to believe Yzerman did zero due diligence on Jake Walman, the reality is he just didn't have trade value across the league. It sucks but it is what it is.

 

[HisNoodliness]

I keep beating a dead horse here...

Walman was said to have been a locker room problem child - got worse when Larkin went out with an injury (Walman's behavior got worse that is - bad enough our best player was out) - Walman spent time as a healthy scratch...He needed to GO!

THAT

PLUS

Yzerman wanted Trouba - that fell apart AFTER being desperate and moving Walman and a 2nd to SJ as a dump job.


1 Dman gone
We still got 7 pieces of pie - err 7 Dmen left

View attachment 923333

I'm not sure why we have all of this character on the team if we can't keep a single "problem child" in check. We're never going to hear what was actually going on. We've all read the same vague stuff. Even if I decided that Walman was a problem player who needed to go and we couldn't get anything for him, I'd give him twenty games this year to recover his stock and move him then. I'm not sure how he could go from being worth an extension at the beginning of the year to "we can't let you dress for us ever again," in one year. If we're going to pay to move a player, it should be one of the obviously bad players. We have so many to choose from. Alternatively, if we're okay with having a bad defense (we are apparently) then just wait out the deal. There's no sense using picks to change up our defense, and then roll out the same bad players.

There was no reason this needed to be rushed and if the reason was Trouba then that's an even bigger issue! I'd have loved Trouba 4 years ago. That contract was always a "give us a few good years and we'll pay for the bad ones at the end." Taking that on now would have been a disaster. The idea that we looked at a defense with Jeff Petry and Ben Chiarot on it and said to ourselves "you know what this is lacking? Jacob Trouba" is insane.

The idea that a potential Trouba addition justifies trading a second to move Walman is even crazier. It's pouring soggy pasta on top of moldy bread and mushy rice. All of it's bad, and beyond that, why are we adding more carbs to this disgusting mess?! Why are we paying restaurant prices for this "meal?"

 

[lilidk]

We have 8 defansman and only 2 good ones and one of those haven't play one season yet. Too much talking about defense and

 

[Frk It]

I keep beating a dead horse here...

Walman was said to have been a locker room problem child - got worse when Larkin went out with an injury (Walman's behavior got worse that is - bad enough our best player was out) - Walman spent time as a healthy scratch...He needed to GO!

THAT

PLUS

Yzerman wanted Trouba - that fell apart AFTER being desperate and moving Walman and a 2nd to SJ as a dump job.


1 Dman gone
We still got 7 pieces of pie - err 7 Dmen left

View attachment 923333

Trouba as Plan A with no Plan B is a good way to operate in your book?

 

[Winger98]

Trouba as Plan A with no Plan B is a good way to operate in your book?

 

[Lazlo Hollyfeld]

I completely agree with you here. Unless people want to believe Yzerman did zero due diligence on Jake Walman, the reality is he just didn't have trade value across the league. It sucks but it is what it is.

Agreed. Which is why I'm morbidly curious as to what the hell happened with Walman.

 

[Rzombo4 prez]

I sense that the people who struggle most with the Walman trade are those who really don't want to entertain the possibility that he could have been a true locker room problem (as if only bad players have professionalism issues).

 

[Steve Yzerlland]

Seriously what is the plan for this team? How are we old and bad?

 

[Frk It]

Seriously what is the plan for this team? How are we old and bad?

Our top defensive pairing is 21 and 23 years old.

Our top forward line is 28, 26, and 22 years old.

 

[AlwaysSunnyInDetroit]

Seriously what is the plan for this team? How are we old and bad?

ummm maybe it's because most of our top prospects aren't old enough to drink yet

 

[wingsfannn919191]

Seriously what is the plan for this team? How are we old and bad?

I dont understand how ppl thought we'd be a playoff team with that defense. Bottom 6 isn't something to brag about either

Sooner we can move some guys and give bigger role to Johansson, give some games to soderblom ,mazur whenever he returns,danielson etc... the better

 

[schuelma24]

Seriously what is the plan for this team? How are we old and bad?

I think it's actually much clearer to see this year compared to last year.

Ed, Kasper, Bergrren, AlJo all up.

A ton of mediocre contracts coming off the books the next 2 years.

Cossa and ASP look just about ready.

I feel a lot better than I did last October about the long term, current play not withstanding.

 

[SirloinUB]

Our top defensive pairing is 21 and 23 years old.

Our top forward line is 28, 26, and 22 years old.

Our top prospects are fairly highly regarded as well - The AHL team is certainly off to a good start.

Unfortunately the "future is now" is not relevant to Detroit just yet.

 

[FMichael]

Trouba as Plan A with no Plan B is a good way to operate in your book?

I’m not the GM here if you haven’t noticed - just reminding people here how things were played out.

 

[FMichael]

I sense that the people who struggle most with the Walman trade are those who really don't want to entertain the possibility that he could have been a true locker room problem (as if only bad players have professionalism issues).

I 1st read about it on a Red Wings subreddit (poster there claiming to know a roster player) just a few days after the season had ended back in April and I was surprised to say the least…Fast forward to this past summer and outta the blue Walman gets moved - no rumors via the usual sources - just sent packing along with an additional 2nd rounder…Sometimes shit does happen.

 

[Sadekuuro]

Bruins haven't had a top 10 pick in 14 years (Seguin) and have DNQ'd 2 times in that span while winning a Cup and going to 2 other SCF. Not having Lottery luck excuses
not going to a Conf Final but sure doesn't excuse 4 years of DNQ's, when literally half the NHL makes the PO.

Yeah, and the Red Wings built an elite team centered on late picks to keep a 25 year run going. It works until it doesn't. And it certainly can [work], but the point is the time horizon. Without getting those guys, the ones who are slam dunk elite players before their ELC is up, or soon after, it takes longer. When you're building more or less completely from scratch (as in this case), even moreso. I don't think there's ever been another NHL team that was bottom three in the league over a 9 year span without ever picking in the top three, so this isn't just garden variety "no luck" either. Nor is just making the playoffs any kind of real goal for this team.

 

[Steve Yzerlland]

I think it's actually much clearer to see this year compared to last year.

Ed, Kasper, Bergrren, AlJo all up.

A ton of mediocre contracts coming off the books the next 2 years.

Cossa and ASP look just about ready.

I feel a lot better than I did last October about the long term, current play not withstanding.

I love this idea. Basically wait two more years max then ascend. It's also best case scenario. I hope these prospects are who we think they are. Sounds like Yzerman is really banking they drafted well enough for rapid growth incoming.

 

[Pavels Dog]

Bruins haven't had a top 10 pick in 14 years (Seguin) and have DNQ'd 2 times in that span while winning a Cup and going to 2 other SCF. Not having Lottery luck excuses
not going to a Conf Final but sure doesn't excuse 4 years of DNQ's, when literally half the NHL makes the PO.

I don't quite get why people say this as if it's ever been more difficult to make the playoffs?

- Multiple expansions but there are still just 16 playoff teams
- Salary cap to prevent rich teams from buying success
- Draft lottery designed to punish some bad teams

On top of that Detroit's in probably the best division in hockey over the last 5 years (Boston, Tampa, Toronto and Florida are 4 of the top 6), making it a fool's errand to rush any attempt to sneak into the playoffs. I personally don't think lack of lottery luck will prevent us from becoming a successful team, but I absolutely do think it slows down the timeline.

 

[Oddbob]

I've found that, this fall season, the best kindling for your backyard woodland fires are 2nd round picks. Enjoy some hot cider and s'mores while singing such campfire classics as "Let's Go Red Wings" while you stay toasty warm around a blazing fire fueled by "Smoldering Seconds," as we're marketing them. For a limited time, we are offering buy one, get one. Don't worry about any more pesky walmans ever again!

I'll take 45 please! I never have campfires, but I can just light those suckers up for funsies! I can get my nephew to do the Griddy while we we're at it.

Time to get over it.

One damn Walman or 2nd round pick does not change the big picture.

It does if you were painting a picture of Walman and a 2nd round pick!

Bruins haven't had a top 10 pick in 14 years (Seguin) and have DNQ'd 2 times in that span while winning a Cup and going to 2 other SCF. Not having Lottery luck excuses
not going to a Conf Final but sure doesn't excuse 4 years of DNQ's, when literally half the NHL makes the PO.

Pretty sure the Bruins were never so bare when any of the GMs in that time came around as what Yzerman inherited from previous GM.

 

[Oddbob]

I sense that the people who struggle most with the Walman trade are those who really don't want to entertain the possibility that he could have been a true locker room problem (as if only bad players have professionalism issues).

More than one person with connections to the team, have said that Walman alienated himself from some of the Wings locker room after his injury and while Larkin was out with his injury. I doubt highly Steve just traded him for some very small issue. The 2nd is a head scratcher as even if he was a problem it seems that there were teams who would have just claimed him anyways. The Trouba trade obviously was also part of it, and I get from Trouba being upset with Drury for the handling of it, that Drury may have made Steve believe as though that trade was a basically done and ready to go.

 

[KillerMillerTime]

I'll take 45 please! I never have campfires, but I can just light those suckers up for funsies! I can get my nephew to do the Griddy while we we're at it.



It does if you were painting a picture of Walman and a 2nd round pick!



Pretty sure the Bruins were never so bare when any of the GMs in that time came around as what Yzerman inherited from previous GM.

You should still be able to avoid a DNQ by year 4-5. I will give a GM a mulligan of even
winning a round but not being one of 16 freaking teams? Not giving any mulligans for that.

 

[ArGarBarGar]

Our top defensive pairing is 21 and 23 years old.

Our top forward line is 28, 26, and 22 years old.

Too old.

 

[Vandalay Industries]

Problem is Yzerman maybe painted himself into a corner by throwing in a 2nd rd. pick with Walman. Maybe other GM's will want that now to take Matta. I don't understand that Walman trade.

That aged badly pretty fast...