Dr Pepper
Registered User
Maybe they can lure Rick Bowness out of retirement and see if he wants the 2026 gig.
Would certainly provide better results than we saw from Cameron.
WJC: Whats wrong with Canada?
- Thread starter Hockeyfrilla
- Start date
Maybe they can lure Rick Bowness out of retirement and see if he wants the 2026 gig.
Would certainly provide better results than we saw from Cameron.
I agree with this 100%. The players are simply not able to adapt to not being the top dog. Speaks to a range of issues. One that hasn't been discussed enough but is clear to me: as "top dogs" in a system that has primarily been geared towards skill development over tactics and positional play throughout their earlier years of development, these kids are incredibly skilled but haven't necessarily been forced into acquiring basic positional knowledge that would have been made a more central part of their development in decades past (see, for example, the coverage on the 3 on 2 from the third Czech goal, which was the straw that broke the camel's back for me this tournament). In sum: they are more skilled as individuals, but they don't know how to play the game as well as they used to, and this becomes a much more pressing issue as quality of competition increases. The number of basic coverage lapses off the rush was really disturbing. Also a function of not getting on the ice together it would seem based on other comments here.
JackSlater
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- Apr 27, 2010
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Bad coach worse GM. Players were not good enough to overcome it this year or last. That's about it, there isn't a deeper issue to address at the junior level.
End on a Hinote
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I'm split on this.
On one hand, this is IMO the first time in history that Canada has encountered a legitimate problem. I can understand 10 years ago when we failed to medal in consecutive years for the first time ever. That was bound to happen and one of those times came as a result of a bad bronze medal game.
But bowing out in the QF consecutively is probably the first legitimate problem canada has encountered that can't simply be explained by "just a bad tournament".
On the other hand, way back in '98 we finished a dismal 8th and were nearly relegated. And this was back when we were much more dominant of the sport and this tournament. I can't even fathom, despite our recent struggles, to even perform that poorly today.
I think next year will be the time to truly decide of something needs to be fixed.
On one hand, this is IMO the first time in history that Canada has encountered a legitimate problem. I can understand 10 years ago when we failed to medal in consecutive years for the first time ever. That was bound to happen and one of those times came as a result of a bad bronze medal game.
But bowing out in the QF consecutively is probably the first legitimate problem canada has encountered that can't simply be explained by "just a bad tournament".
On the other hand, way back in '98 we finished a dismal 8th and were nearly relegated. And this was back when we were much more dominant of the sport and this tournament. I can't even fathom, despite our recent struggles, to even perform that poorly today.
I think next year will be the time to truly decide of something needs to be fixed.
Bad luck with reffing and injuries, no practices.
But most importantly the talent left off the roster were mostly the same type of (likely) ineffective player, there's no excuse for Sennecke, as well Hage and Misa should've had better shots at making the team but you can't have both of Catton/McKenna and Heidt/Cristall.
But most importantly the talent left off the roster were mostly the same type of (likely) ineffective player, there's no excuse for Sennecke, as well Hage and Misa should've had better shots at making the team but you can't have both of Catton/McKenna and Heidt/Cristall.
SoundAndFury
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- May 28, 2012
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Exactly, surely many reputable coaches wouldn't mind a short tournament like in their home country.
I mean Team Canada in the Spengler Cup had Gerard Gallant as their coach this year, Bruce Boudreau last year, Travis Green the year before. You can like some of these guys more than others but the point is, those are 3 NHL coaches that didn't mind spending a week coaching hockey players out there in Switzerland. Surely luring one of a similar caliber to those to coach for WJC isn't out of the question.
NyQuil
Big F$&*in Q
I remember a colleague telling me that you can’t ever waste a good crisis when it comes to opportunity for improvement.
Unfortunately, I don’t think it’s sufficient for fulsome re-examination of Hockey Canada’s approach but identifying areas for improvement and acting on them would be positive.
Continuous improvement is a bit of a corporate-speak mantra but I’m sure there are some systemic issues in our development programme that people already know about that just need a little traction to address.
Moose Head
Registered User
The deepest issue at the Canadian junior level is the goalie development pipeline, and ironically, that wasn’t the issue at this tournament.
ryan callahan
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- Jan 25, 2014
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Players tuned out Cameron and coach gave up. I think Cameron's comments and the players body language align fairly well with my theory. Not excusing the management or the players, but no one showed an ability to be a leader and be an example.
Rob
Registered User
Yep, they wasted a great performance from Carter George. In the past Canada has lost out on gold because of bad goaltending.
2015 - Canada Gold
2016 - Canada wins gold if they have McDavid, Ekblad, Bennet
2017 - Canada wins gold if they have McDavid, Marner, Crouse,
2018 - Canada Gold
2019 - Canada wins gold if they have Rasmussen, Vilardi, Robert Thomas
2020 - Canada wins gold
2021 - Missing Dach, Laf Canada got silver losing to US who was missing Jack Hughes so that’s a toss up.
2022 - Gold
2023 - Gold
2024 - Missing Bedard, Fantilli, Benson, Wright, Korchinski to the NHL or they win
2025 - missing Bedard, Celebrini, Benson to the NHL, or they win
Just looking at the last 11 WJC, including this year, of all players are there Canada wins at least 10 goals and 1 silver.
I would have said the same thing in 2016 and 2017 especially when they were missing the best hockey player in the world
Someone pointed out that Misa assisted on a goal by Parekh against the 67s last night. A nice present for Cameron.
Hockey Canada is notorious for being an old boy's club, it's that simple:
-Scott Salmond played one total game in the WHL, and has no other accomplishments besides being with HC for 20+ years and BC Hockey before that. He somehow survived a 2020 scandal where he prevented a doping test from being performed at an Olympic prep tournament... not to mention the whole sexual assault slush fund thing. It seems from an interview after the loss last night he's not going anywhere and no one knows why. Lots of questions should be asked here.
-Peter Anholt has spent 30+ years in the WHL, and hasn't won a league or CHL championship in his ten years as GM of Lethbridge. The Hurricanes are 10th of 22 teams, so not world beaters this year... yet he was still adjudged to be the best person for helping pick the national junior team. Also, remember this is the guy who gave Bill Peters his second chance after the Aliu scandal. Weird.
-Cameron's shitty resume is well-known. He has 0 Memorial Cups and 0 OHL championships despite coaching nearly 900 games in that league (wtf, how?) and his team was mid this year before he went to the WJC. His only major accomplishment is WJC Gold during COVID.
Hockey Canada doesn't select people or players on the basis of how they perform, only based on who they know.
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NyQuil
Big F$&*in Q
Who gives a shit?
The reason they aren’t there is because it’s a tournament for kids and they are already men.
Thats what playing in the NHL means.
EpochLink
Canucks and Jets fan
Luigi Lemieux
Registered User
Ok sure, if you want to make yourself feel better you can make this argument. But it still shows that Canada is starting to fall back to the pack, even if they do have the best overall under 20 talent. % of Canadian NHLers is dropping every year, and not making it out of the quarters at the wjc two years in a row is a first in history.
I agree that Canada still produces the best NHL talent. But the margin by which it does is getting smaller with every passing year.
thegazelle
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- Nov 11, 2019
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In my opinion, lack of humility - from the management down. Refusal to select players that can adapt to different situations, not selecting players that are known not for performance but for fortitude, refusal to admit when mistakes were made in coaching and on ice strategy. Players who did not have the humility to admit they were a liability but egos were stroked by both management and the media, and I think an underestimating of one's opponent.
In other words, an entitled mentality, thinking more highly of oneself both collectively and individually, and ultimately a stubborn unwillingness to acknowledge clear weaknesses and pivot and adjust accordingly.
In other words, an entitled mentality, thinking more highly of oneself both collectively and individually, and ultimately a stubborn unwillingness to acknowledge clear weaknesses and pivot and adjust accordingly.
JackSlater
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Yes there should be changes made, but I doubt it. The team building process is flawed.
Oilslick941611
Registered User
Nothing. this an overreaction.
Bedard, and Celebrini were still eligible for the tournament and they left 3 100 point scorers at home.
The team they send was picked poorly due to hubris from hockey canada. Theres nothing wrong with the talent levels of Canadian hockey.
JackSlater
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I originally wrote goaltending but then deleted it and changed it to the junior level. In general Canada has had solid goaltending at the WJC. It is a significant issue overall though.
I simply won't blame it on roster composition, sure there's a factor there, but with any of the top 50 players in the country you should win, period.
The failure actually started about 8-12 years ago. When everything went only high skill, now that's great, but you end up with exactly the team and game you saw.....
Latvia played hard, (aggressive, hitting) and as a team and came away with a win.
Canada used to win, because it would pound you out of the rink all night above everything else. Go watch games from the last 25 years, all superstars are hitting everything. Crosby, Tavares, you name it.
There was also no real forecheck, or down low play, no cycle (aside from working it up to the point). Shots were weak, with no screens or tips in front of the net. They just carried it In, delayed at the hash marks, went back to the point. Nothing wrong with that, but won't do anything for you without the other ingredients.
It was still somewhat entertaining, but ultimately an incomplete game and philosophy for success that's been compounded at all levels now.
Same as NHL regular season vs playoffs, totally different games.
Canada will be an average team overall in Hockey at all levels until it returns to a complete game. (this will only get worse as this was really the first complete wave of players).
The failure actually started about 8-12 years ago. When everything went only high skill, now that's great, but you end up with exactly the team and game you saw.....
Latvia played hard, (aggressive, hitting) and as a team and came away with a win.
Canada used to win, because it would pound you out of the rink all night above everything else. Go watch games from the last 25 years, all superstars are hitting everything. Crosby, Tavares, you name it.
There was also no real forecheck, or down low play, no cycle (aside from working it up to the point). Shots were weak, with no screens or tips in front of the net. They just carried it In, delayed at the hash marks, went back to the point. Nothing wrong with that, but won't do anything for you without the other ingredients.
It was still somewhat entertaining, but ultimately an incomplete game and philosophy for success that's been compounded at all levels now.
Same as NHL regular season vs playoffs, totally different games.
Canada will be an average team overall in Hockey at all levels until it returns to a complete game. (this will only get worse as this was really the first complete wave of players).
Oilslick941611
Registered User
slapping together a team 2 weeks before a torunament isn't a good way to do things. Especially against teams that play together more and the UTDP.
The problem is the CHL. Has time goes on and JR programs around the world get better slapping together a team 2 weeks before the WJC is going to be less effective. It wasn't much of a problem when the other teams were basically shit. Its different now and HC should rethink the way it does business.
- Apr 20, 2016
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If you look back at the 98 tourny, they lost in the Quarter finals in OT to Russia (who lost the gold medal game in OT themselves). The only major difference was there was placement games after they lost in the QF that they don't have anymore. They went out at the same stage of the tourny.
End on a Hinote
Registered Abuser
Fair enough. I think we've officially got to that inevitable point in Canadian hockey where shit has hit the fan, unfortunately.
I don't care what anyone says, there's no excuse to finish 5th-6th in consecutive years in a tournament we once owned.
