What Team Has the Top Future D Corp

[Dirtyf1ghter]

Are you trying to act dumb? No Vlasic isn’t prospect. Yes Rinzel Levshunov are prospect.

You “have a hard time imagining them reaching the playoffs before 2031. The current base is very weak, and so is the prospect pool. The team has regressed again this year” which is a wild statement that you didn’t support so you got into stupid semantic debates what what is a prospect. Perhaps hawks don’t make playoffs by 2031 but if you can’t imagine how young guys plus cap space could possibly lead to a playoff appearance before then you obviously lack deeper level thinking of possibilities.

Well, in the end, your message has nothing to do with the original subject and I have to repeat things that I have already explained.

1. I have a hard time seeing the worst team in the league with San Jose but with a much weaker group of young players than San Jose in the playoffs in the next 5 years. Not a crazy idea.

2. The current team is unworthy of the NHL. Nine points from 30th, 16 points from 29th. It's a fact.

3. The prospect pool will remain the players who are not on the NHL team. Demidov, Hutson, and Slafkovsky are not prospect pool players, but NHL players. Fowler, Hage and Reinbacher are in the prospect pool. I'll stick to this definition, which I've always heard. Not a vague definition without specific criteria.

4. Young players will eat up your cap space. Simply. To reach the playoffs, you don't just have to improve a few points by recruiting experienced players. You have to be better than more than half the league. And it's very difficult to quickly go from last to more than half. You don't move on to any number 1 goalie, no number 1 and 2 defenseman, no efficient forwards in a top 6 next to Bedard to have this set + sufficient depth quickly. I believe in a bright future for Chicago with the 2026/2027/2028 draft picks for the 2030s. Not in the next 5 years.

But in advance, when your next belittling message arrives, I'll concede. I'm useless, pathetic, ignorant. You're talented, brilliant, knowledgeable. I'm wrong. You're right. But I'll stick to my opinion : Chicago doesn't have the best defense, Chicago is struggling, Chicago has gotten off to a very bad start to its rebuild compared to San Jose, I don't believe in Chicago's chances, and even if my opinion, shared by former NHL players on French-language podcasts, doesn't please you, it remains as it is. Welcome to democracy. Good continuation.

 

[Dirtyf1ghter]

Notion that Vlasic wouldn’t be Top 4 on the Habs is hilarious. After 10 games as a Hab, we’d be drowning in Vlasic = Pronger threads

I don't remember reading a topic presenting Guhle as Pronger 2 years ago.

Technically, Vlasic would be on the third pair with Savard. The seats are already taken on the top four on the left, and the lack of a right-hander is already a problem, so Carrier wouldn't be remove from the top 4.

I think you're answering the question : to talk about the best young defenseman, we're talking about Alex Vlasic, 24 years old, a solid top 4 defender as the first name. I prefer Lane Hutson, 21 years old, an elite defender as the first name.

And there's no question of imagining a defender in big difficulty like Levshunov or Korchinski currently get progressing. He's already elite. From his first game in the league.

 

[Parliament]

Definition of prospect pool : drafted players who aren't on the team. I only see Boisvert. The others are already on the team.
...

So, it's the multiple podcasts I listen to that are stupid then because they all systematically remove players who reached the NHL from the prospect pool. Otherwise, always the same. Another demeaning message with no idea outside of this writing perspective.
...

I've always had this definition, and it's always the one I've heard. I've never heard of a definition related to age or game limits. And even so, Chicago's recent drafts have been very disappointing.
...

Do you mind sharing your list of multiple podcasts that you listen to that systematically remove players from prospect pools once they reach the NHL?

 

[Dirtyf1ghter]

Do you mind sharing your list of multiple podcasts that you listen to that systematically remove players from prospect pools once they reach the NHL?

RDS
BPM
TVA
Toutsurlehockey
La Relève

When there is a top 15 prospect pool in Montreal, players who play for Montreal are removed.

The prospect pool is the group of players who will be in the future. Not players who are already here. Demidov will not be in the next prospect pool rankings.

If I had talked about age categories, I would have talked about U21-U23.

Hutson and Slafkovsky, soon Demidov —they're established NHL players. Reinbacher, Hage and Fowler are players in the prospect pool. Yet they're all U21 players.

The same goes for Rinzel, Moore, Bedard or Levshunov. From the moment they play in Chicago, they can no longer be considered non-Chicago players who can join the team, since they already have.

If I had wanted to join that group of players - I wouldn't have said weak. I would have said good.

With the exception of Boisvert, there are no more players in the prospect pool who could join the team. So, it's a weak stock.

Now that you understand the meaning of my words, which I have explained at length several times, there is no need to pretend you don't understand.

 

[Chan790]

It's going to be Carolina. They're a defenseman factory. It's unseemly.

Y'all gonna debate prospect pools...and in three years, the Canes will still have a better defense because they have the ability to pull top-4 defensemen out of the day-2 picks and other team's cast-off specs.

 

[Dirtyf1ghter]

Yep Nikishin, for example. Although he was a U24 player, he was a member of the prospect pool because he didn't play for Carolina. Soon, he won't be anymore, as he'll be on the team.

 

[Ajex12x]

I find it odd all this prospect pool age cutoff stuff. The question and thread is future D, yes, a lot of that's going to be prospects, but you're making this into a flat out prospect pool ranking based on your rules that are different than what the league recognizes. Start a new thread if you want to do that.

 

[Prior]

We’re in the prospect section of the forum so grain of salt and all that in prospect evaluations.

Thread topic is however about top NHL level corps in the coming years. Chicago belongs nowhere near that discussion.

Too many high level actual elite NHL defensemen who will be going nowhere soon on sound (or better) current corps to rely on best case scenarios for Chicago’s kids making up th wide golf of elite NHL players to promising prospects.

 

[Mrfenn92]

?

 

[MNRube]

We’re in the prospect section of the forum so grain of salt and all that in prospect evaluations.

Thread topic is however about top NHL level corps in the coming years. Chicago belongs nowhere near that discussion.

Too many high level actual elite NHL defensemen who will be going nowhere soon on sound (or better) current corps to rely on best case scenarios for Chicago’s kids making up th wide golf of elite NHL players to promising prospects.

They have a boatload of cap space and are poised to add a couple vets to Vlasic, Levshunov, Rinzel and Korchinski,

Obviously teams with super young bluelines rarely win, and odds are at least one of them completely busts but Chicago is loaded with size and has two very high upside RHD. They 100% belong in this particular discussion, IMO. But I’m also very high on both Vlasic and Rinzel so may not be more than just a personal opinion

A big part of it for me is finding the two most rare archetypes. A massive shutdown guy (Vlasic) and having two cracks at having an elite RHD in Rinzel & Levshunov

 

[dj Mahoney]

Levshunov : probably top 4
Vlasic : solid top 6
Korchinski : very incertain top 4 (maybe a bust)
Rinzel : solid top 4
Del Mastro : 6th/7th DEF
Allan : 6th/7th DEF
Kaiser : AHL Player
Phillips : AHL player

No guy matches an elite (#1) or very good (#2) defender. These guys are in place and Chicago's level is catastrophic.

This is very insufficient. Some are no longer young either (players born in 2001 are already 24 years old).

Very worried for Chicago. A very complicated 7th season. Very questionable choices over the last 7 years with many failures (the Dach project, Seth Jones, the profile of the forwards drafted to surround Bedard who always seems alone in the world, the selections of Levshunov and Korchinski so high).

And what's more, the guy who was supposed to be a leader isn't really that strong and needs to be well supported (which isn't the case at all).

There's still a lot missing in Chicago. They've fallen behind and are at the level of a team after two years of rebuilding. However, this has been going on for seven years. San Jose is much further ahead in the rebuild.

WTF???????? LOL

 

[Dirtyf1ghter]

WTF???????? LOL

You trade a solid top 4 for Vlasic and I'll change nothing. Del Mastro as a 6/7 is very generous considering he's not even a top 6 player on a regular basis on the worst team in the league.

Otherwise, I don't see any top 2 defensemen on an NHL team that's making the playoffs.

Levshunov and Korchinski's level is really not reassuring for a top 2 in the future.

Let's just say there's a lot, a lot of progress to be made.

But I'm arguing. It's too easy to send toxic messages with a clown, a laugh, and a burst of laughter.

 

[matt trick]

RDS
BPM
TVA
Toutsurlehockey
La Relève

Don't listen to any of these, I'll obviously trust you they say once you're in the NHL=no longer a prospect. Ironically, I listen to just about every english prospects podcast (Sharks fan- it's what we have!), and it's the opposite. Universally there is some type of games played/age metric to be considered not a prospect. Typically 30-50 games, in some cases there age limits as well. Will Smith was included in the athletics prospect rankings a few weeks back despite being over 50 games and having not played anywhere but the NHL all season. Since that publication (~20+ games), he's like .95 PPG.

Calling Leonard, Demidov, Buium, or Nikishin prospects might be a little silly as they're going to be NHL-caliber on day 1. Smith a few weeks ago, was even more so. That said, I'd argue calling garbage time call-ups on shit teams (who sold talent at the deadline), NHL established rather than prospects a bit silly. Moore or the Sharks Cam Lund wouldn't be on average NHL teams, even if they happened to jump to the NHL (likely for the primary benefit of contract massaging). Think everyone agrees Rinzel is NHL caliber now, however.

 

[Dirtyf1ghter]

Don't listen to any of these, I'll obviously trust you they say once you're in the NHL=no longer a prospect. Ironically, I listen to just about every english prospects podcast (Sharks fan- it's what we have!), and it's the opposite. Universally there is some type of games played/age metric to be considered not a prospect. Typically 30-50 games, in some cases there age limits as well. Will Smith was included in the athletics prospect rankings a few weeks back despite being over 50 games and having not played anywhere but the NHL all season. Since that publication (~20+ games), he's like .95 PPG.

Calling Leonard, Demidov, Buium, or Nikishin prospects might be a little silly as they're going to be NHL-caliber on day 1. Smith a few weeks ago, was even more so. That said, I'd argue calling garbage time call-ups on shit teams (who sold talent at the deadline), NHL established rather than prospects a bit silly. Moore or the Sharks Cam Lund wouldn't be on average NHL teams, even if they happened to jump to the NHL (likely for the primary benefit of contract massaging). Think everyone agrees Rinzel is NHL caliber now, however.

What you're saying distorts the evaluations. A 21-year-old player like Hutson, who's already dominating in the NHL, is no longer a prospect, while a hard-working 22-year-old like Del Mastro still is. So, you're saying that Chicago has better 21-year-old prospects than Montreal, while Montreal is being carried in the playoffs by 21-year-old players who are no longer prospects.

So, we might as well talk about age categories. My conception isn't interchangeable and based on a subjectivity that can be influenced by changing the statistic depending on what we want to see.

If you consider Demidov no longer a prospect, then why would Levshunov be? You see, your point of view is subjective and leads to a subjective decision on a case-by-case basis.

Let's say, to return to my point of view, that the only remaining prospect to be added to the team is Boisvert, not yet with Chicago. Until the 2025 draft, which will change the game.

Then we can talk about the notion of young player. But here it's the same: when does a player stop being considered young ? 23, 25, 27 years old? Knowing that in sports we subjectively go from young to old in the space of a few years, I like precise terms. Chicago has a good U21 group. Not convinced by certain choices (the accumulation of small forwards, the choice of Korchinski and Levshunov) to say very good. I think Chicago lost 1 year of reconstruction and fell behind a team like San Jose. Schaefer would be good. There Chicago would really have a nice D Corp and you don't hear me wondering about the elite def potential anymore.

 

[matt trick]

What you're saying distorts the evaluations. A 21-year-old player like Hutson, who's already dominating in the NHL, is no longer a prospect, while a hard-working 22-year-old like Del Mastro still is. So, you're saying that Chicago has better 21-year-old prospects than Montreal, while Montreal is being carried in the playoffs by 21-year-old players who are no longer prospects.

So, we might as well talk about age categories. My conception of pool prospect is not scientific, but very precise and objective, and not interchangeable based on a subjectivity that can be influenced by changing the statistic depending on what we want to see.

If you consider Demidov no longer a prospect, then why would Levshunov be? You see, your point of view is subjective and leads to a subjective decision on a case-by-case basis.

Let's say, to return to my point of view, that the only remaining prospect to be added to the team is Boisvert, not yet with Chicago. Until the 2025 draft, which will change the game.

Frankly, I don't give a shit. I'm merely providing the context from english language podcasts of why you and the Hawks fans seemed to be speaking past each other.

I said it could be a little silly, I didn't make a definitive claim on the matter- merely aligned with you (and the hawks fans) that it couldn't be open to interpretation. I didn't mention Levshunov, but I'd group him in with the other 'elite prospects' who have played NHL games. Unlike Moore or Lund, they're very unlikely not to go to the AHL from this point forward.

My point is that there's a difference between cup of coffee and probably never going to/back to the AHL.

Hopefully that clears up my thoughts, but if not, perhaps someone else can make a better argument.

 

[Dirtyf1ghter]

Frankly, I don't give a shit. I'm merely providing the context from english language podcasts of why you and the Hawks fans seemed to be speaking past each other.

I said it could be a little silly, I didn't make a definitive claim on the matter- merely aligned with you (and the hawks fans) that it couldn't be open to interpretation. I didn't mention Levshunov, but I'd group him in with the other 'elite prospects' who have played NHL games. Unlike Moore or Lund, they're very unlikely not to go to the AHL from this point forward.

My point is that there's a difference between cup of coffee and probably never going to/back to the AHL.

Hopefully that clears up my thoughts, but if not, perhaps someone else can make a better argument.

The French language has the advantage of being much more precise than the English language. There are many vague terms, words that mean 20 different things, whereas the French language has a word for each specific meaning.

 

[Putt Pirate]

The French language has the advantage of being much more precise than the English language. There are many vague terms, words that mean 20 different things, whereas the French language has a word for each specific meaning.

There are literally 17 French words for surrender. Amazing that was the one they couldn’t be ‘precise’ on.

 

[Dirtyf1ghter]

There are literally 17 French words for surrender. Amazing that was the one they couldn’t be ‘precise’ on.

I would be very pleasantly surprised if you mastered the subtleties of the French language. It's a nightmare for me to translate my thoughts into English because translations often distort my words and can be interpreted in 17 different ways, even though my thoughts are very precise.

And overall, american hockey shows don't convince me. The speakers seem fake, with the forced laughter, overplayed emotions, you feel like it's acting. The debates are never very deep. Too often, they're just a collection of banalities. English doesn't help you refine your thinking. It's a much more emotional language.
Prefer to listen calm, natural guys who are passionate like these guys.

They also take up the concept of prospect pool in the sense that I understand for Ottawa.

 

[Toews2Bickell]

Levshunov : probably top 4
Vlasic : solid top 6
Korchinski : very incertain top 4 (maybe a bust)
Rinzel : solid top 4
Del Mastro : 6th/7th DEF
Allan : 6th/7th DEF
Kaiser : AHL Player
Phillips : AHL player

No guy matches an elite (#1) or very good (#2) defender. These guys are in place and Chicago's level is catastrophic.

This is very insufficient. Some are no longer young either (players born in 2001 are already 24 years old).

Very worried for Chicago. A very complicated 7th season. Very questionable choices over the last 7 years with many failures (the Dach project, Seth Jones, the profile of the forwards drafted to surround Bedard who always seems alone in the world, the selections of Levshunov and Korchinski so high).

And what's more, the guy who was supposed to be a leader isn't really that strong and needs to be well supported (which isn't the case at all).

There's still a lot missing in Chicago. They've fallen behind and are at the level of a team after two years of rebuilding. However, this has been going on for seven years. San Jose is much further ahead in the rebuild.

get ready to learn Rinzel

 

[Dirtyf1ghter]

get ready to learn Rinzel

I known him since three years. I'd be very surprised if he became an elite defender. A solid top 4 is already a high estimate.

It seems premature to me to validate him as such. I only recently did it for Hutson, who I had in the top 4 after 7 NHL games. I will see in the next game if he is at the same level as Hutson.

 

[Toews2Bickell]

I've known him for three years. I'd be very surprised if he became an elite defender. A solid top 4 is already a high estimate.

generational talent

 

[wetcoast]

Yet most of the players listed in the topic were selected before the official reconstruction (Vlasic, Kaiser, Allan, Del Mastro, Phillips.

Martinez, Brodie and Murphy are old. Vlasic is 24. Korchinski still in AHL at 21 (and he is far from dominating). Del Mastro doesn't even have the level to impose himself on this team. Levshunov's first season has fallen short of what he had hoped for at the beginning of the year, Kaiser is already 23 and is only there to fill a void.
With the list of defenders listed in the topic, you are heading for failure. Besides, Chicago is a bitter failure.
Come on, I'll give you credit for Vlasic as a solid 4th defenseman on an average NHL team. It doesn't change much in my analysis. Especially since for other players like Del Mastro, I was generous in listing him as 6th/7th and I was very light in talking about the Korchinski case.

First of all , none of the ages here are correct as you are adding an their ages for next season not this one.

Vlasic is a very good young Dman and your #6 appraisal just doesn't pass the smell test, like at all.

Levshunov might never be a stud but both him and Korchinski are way too young to right off or come to any conclusion yet.

The other guys besides Rinzel are #5 or 6 guys so no big deal but one of them could still emerge.

If the whole team is a complete mess after next year that will be one thing but your interesting analysis is only overshadowed by a premature conclusion here.

Also any of these teams drafting Schaefer immediately helps their core like a ton, especially Chicago.

 

[Dirtyf1ghter]

generational talent

Speaking of generational talent, Bedard has declined in status in my mind and is now nothing more than an elite offensive player with defensive shortcomings. A guy like Jack Hughes.

There won't be only positive surprises in Chicago. There will be cases like him, too.

 

[Dirtyf1ghter]

First of all , none of the ages here are correct as you are adding an their ages for next season not this one.

Vlasic is a very good young Dman and your #6 appraisal just doesn't pass the smell test, like at all.

Levshunov might never be a stud but both him and Korchinski are way too young to right off or come to any conclusion yet.

The other guys besides Rinzel are #5 or 6 guys so no big deal but one of them could still emerge.

If the whole team is a complete mess after next year that will be one thing but your interesting analysis is only overshadowed by a premature conclusion here.

Also any of these teams drafting Schaefer immediately helps their core like a ton, especially Chicago.

1. I memorize the year of birth. A guy born in 2004 is 21 years old in 2025. It doesn't change the debate. Most of the guys listed will reach the age I mentioned in 1 month, and the season is already over.

What difference does it make if the player is 20 years and 11 months old, even though I said 21 ?

2. I already admitted my mistake with Vlasic.

3. Regarding Levshunov and Korchinski, they are certainly young but they are struggling and well below the expected level. Both have major defensive shortcomings. Korchinski is struggling even in the AHL. So I'm talking about an uncertain top 4. I don't see how I can validate them as a definite top 4. Same thing for Levshunov. Impossible to classify him as a top 2. A guy like Reinbacher has shown more defensive certainty (he's impressive with Laval) and I don't have him higher than top 4.

4. I'm doing the analysis as it seems to me today. It's not forbidden to make an update. Some guys have moved up, others have moved down.

 

[Putt Pirate]

Before college players came in Lev wa sthen2nd youngest player in the NHLwith a few games played. He also has played at least one new level each of the last 4 years and adjusted/learned well to each of those instances. And you are making your assumptions based on a few games (for both Hughes and Lev) which pretty much submarines anything you have said or will say on that subject.

Nothing wrong with being a homer…..just eat you poutine and admit it. We all are to some degree. It basing things on ‘French Canadian podcasts’ as gospel is laughable.