What are the Flames missing?

[Conbon]

I'm saying this as a lifelong Flames fan so don't think that I'm trashing them. They just don't seem like a dangerous team. First line is producing, second line with Backlund is solid. Third line centered by Jankowski and Bennett is finally producing, though guys like Lazar, Brouwer and Bartkowski probably shouldn't be in the NHL. Even Hathaway who was great in the AHL is producing.

The defence should be the least of the problems but it seems like every game they get hemmed in their own zone for minutes at a time and have to rely on goaltending to bail them out. Smith has done way better than I expected him to do this season but even that is unsustainable unless you've got a guy like Price or Quick in net. It seems like our defence core was built with name value in mind more than actual play and chemistry. In theory, adding Hamonic should have really shored up any defensive holes that we had but here we are still, looking weak on defense.

Maybe Giordano has regressed? Maybe Hamilton and Brodie (who has gone cold since the first quarter of the year) aren't as solid defensively as we thought they were? From watching games I've noticed that Gaudreau seems to disappear for extended lengths of time. Maybe he shouldn't be relied on to be the sole catalyst of our offence? Even in games where he produces plenty of points, he does so in small spurts and seems irrelevant the rest of the time. I just don't see the Flames doing much with the core they have currently unless they get really lucky and someone pans out to be a superstar. Maybe its Bennett who has to save them, who I've been defending for a season and a half now. Everytime he's on the ice, he seems like a difference maker, even during his awful start this year.

What I ask is this, what are the Flames missing? What do you do in Treliving's shoes to push the Flames into being a legitimate contender. I mean of course they need a goalie soon, they have some high end goalie prospects and Smith seems to be a perfectly capable stop gap until then, but what else?

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[X66]

Franchise center.

 

[Conbon]

Franchise center.

I feel this way but what really is the difference between say Monahan and Johansen who seems to be considered a legit #1C

 

[Bjornar Moxnes]

Our best RW (Who is injured) would be a mep 2nd liner on most teams, add to the fact his offensive game is predictable. So we need a legit top line RWer that is a LHS sniper or a RHS playmaker/defensive catalyst. And even then we just need a RHS forward for the power play.

 

[JurassicTunga]

Another top offensive weapon, I think.
Perhaps a better coaching staff too.

 

[Tage2Tuch]

I feel this way but what really is the difference between say Monahan and Johansen who seems to be considered a legit #1C

DO they though?

No one calls Johansen elite, or a "TRUE" #1C. He may be a #1 C but to say he's legit is something else.

And all playoffs long that's what people said would be Nashville's demise, up the middle. Come cup final comparing centers did not look very good with the Preds.

They even went out to get Turris.

How many people would call Johansen a top 15 centre? He's really good but he's not. Same with Monahan. There's so many good centre's.

Crosby
McDavid
Stamkos
Malkin
Matthews
Scheifle
Kopitar
Getzlaf
Mackinnon
Seguin
Eichel
Giroux
Bergeron
Barkov
Toews
Pavelski
Schenn/Stastny




That's 20 right there off the top of my head and there's arguably more. (That's not even taking into account some 2C's that could be argued as better like Horvat, ROR, Trochek, Draisaitl, Turris, Kadri, etc. )

However I think Monahan and Johansen are both great.

 

[Tage2Tuch]

Another top offensive weapon, I think.
Perhaps a better coaching staff too.

Well, they have Tolvanen coming so.....

 

[vcanuck]

a 1st and 2nd round picks

 

[ESH]

I'm saying this as a lifelong Flames fan so don't think that I'm trashing them. They just don't seem like a dangerous team. First line is producing, second line with Backlund is solid. Third line centered by Jankowski and Bennett is finally producing, though guys like Lazar, Brouwer and Bartkowski probably shouldn't be in the NHL. Even Hathaway who was great in the AHL is producing.

I think a big problem for the Flames has been that it never seems like every line is producing at the same time. Earlier in the year when Gaudreau was on a hot streak it was only the top line that was really producing. Now that Bennett finally has some life in him, the top two lines have gone colder.

The defence should be the least of the problems but it seems like every game they get hemmed in their own zone for minutes at a time and have to rely on goaltending to bail them out. Smith has done way better than I expected him to do this season but even that is unsustainable unless you've got a guy like Price or Quick in net. It seems like our defence core was built with name value in mind more than actual play and chemistry. In theory, adding Hamonic should have really shored up any defensive holes that we had but here we are still, looking weak on defense.

The Hamonic-Brodie pairing has been largely disappointing. Brodie started off great, but had a horrible stretch of games where it was like he forgot how to play defense. They've been better as a pairing recently, but Brodie's offense has also gone cold. It's shocking to see a player as good at skating as Brodie is get beat wide multiple times a game. I don't think Smith's play is unsustainable. He started off hot, cooled off a little, but I don't see why he can't maintain his current numbers. His play with the puck is better than I could have ever imagined, though teams figured that out quickly and he hasn't had as much of a chance to show that part of his game off.

Maybe Giordano has regressed? Maybe Hamilton and Brodie (who has gone cold since the first quarter of the year) aren't as solid defensively as we thought they were?

Giordano is the least of the Flames' problems right now. He might not be at the same level as he was from 2013-2015, but he's still easily the Flames best defenseman and definitely one of the better defenseman in the entire league in terms of defensive zone play. Giordano-Hamilton is still one of the best pairings in the league, and Hamilton looks better with each game.

From watching games I've noticed that Gaudreau seems to disappear for extended lengths of time. Maybe he shouldn't be relied on to be the sole catalyst of our offence? Even in games where he produces plenty of points, he does so in small spurts and seems irrelevant the rest of the time. I just don't see the Flames doing much with the core they have currently unless they get really lucky and someone pans out to be a superstar. Maybe its Bennett who has to save them, who I've been defending for a season and a half now. Everytime he's on the ice, he seems like a difference maker, even during his awful start this year.

Yeah, it would be nice to see some more consistency from Gaudreau. It seems like sometimes he gets into a funk and starts overthinking everything. Tonight especially it seemed like he was over-passing, a lot of blind passes and trying to force passes through bodies and sticks. Bennett's play in the last ~15 games has been night-and-day compared to his play at the start of the year. He only had points in 2 of his first 23 games. It's encouraging to see the young line of Bennett-Jankowski-Hathaway doing so well. They did a great job tonight, largely matched up against the Sharks' top line. Bennett has been prone to massive cold streaks throughout his young career, so I'm still cautiously optimistic at this point.

What I ask is this, what are the Flames missing? What do you do in Treliving's shoes to push the Flames into being a legitimate contender. I mean of course they need a goalie soon, they have some high end goalie prospects and Smith seems to be a perfectly capable stop gap until then, but what else?

I think Treliving has done a great job building this team. I'm not a fan of trading high picks, and Hamonic hasn't exactly proven that he was worth what we gave up for him yet, but Treliving has done a fine job at assembling a roster that looks like one of the best teams the Flames have had in awhile (atleast on paper). Aside from the Brouwer signing, he hasn't done much to hamper the team. Gulutzan is someone you didn't mention and he definitely needs to be talked about. He is waaaaay too stubborn. It's ridiculous how unflexible he is. Once he puts a line together, you can bet they won't be taken apart no matter how they're performing for atleast 10 games. It was shocking to see how long it took for him to finally take Chiasson off the top line last season after watching him kill plays in the offensive zone game after game. When he finally did take Chiasson off, Gaudreau (and the Flames as a whole) went on a mighty hot streak. Since game 1 of last year he hasn't tried changing anything about the way the Flames play. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. Dave Cameron should also be long gone.

To summarize, I'd say the Flames need some consistency from every forward line, improved play from the Brodie-Hamonic pairing, and less rigid coaching.

 

[FlamerForLife]

Offence

In those 11 games they only gave up 3 or more regulation goals 3 times (PHI,SJ,MTL), it's really been the offence that's been hampering us the past couple of weeks.

 

[FlamesFan18]

1. Scoring and Special Teams

The offense is mediocre af, needs another scoring winger.

Our PP and PK suck and needs major improvement soon.

2. Defense Depth

Yes, Brodie had a really bad slump but he looked great before that and is looking pretty good lately. We aren't getting 1D Brodie this season but he is still an excellent mobile 3D when having a bad season. Gio and Hamilton are both top pairing defenseman and are in no way whats wrong with the Flames. That top 3 is still near the top of the league or else this team is bottom 3.

Hamonic and Stone have hardly been NHL caliber. The trade and signing for them in the offseason really made me skeptical about BT who I thought had done a fantastic job previously. Halfway through the season, they have played even below my low expectations and the Flames are out of the playoffs without their first round pick... that says enough about those moves.

Goaltending has been very good which is weird to say.

 

[BigRangy]

The biggest hole with respect to being a serious contender is franchise center for sure.

Monahan is probably a top 5 player in the league at putting pucks in the net when someone can find him in the slot but other than that he plays like a soft 3rd liner.

Why they're meh right now I think,

Their special teams are garbage. I can't even imagine them being worse than they are but they're not 31st in either category so there's possibility of getting even worse.

Their worst player has an A and does absolutely f***ing nothing to deserve it. The Brouwer signing was awful but it could at least be mitigated by stuffing him in the pressbox or AHL but he continues to get icetime.

The coaching is not working to the strengths of the roster. Giordano, Hamilton, and Brodie should be locks for 40 points from the backend. They have more than enough talent to do so. However, the coach has them sitting back and making stupid breakout passes off the boards all game.

Lack of confidence. The Flames have been meh for decades and there is just never any positive energy around the team. The fanbase and team media are full of people who expect the worst yet aren't satisfied with anything but the best. I know that that would make it hard for me to do my job, so it likely weighs on the players and management as well.

 

[Hynh]

Right handed forwards. Put all their right handed forwards together and their stat line is 7-22-29 in 105 games. Basically all of their good forwards are lefties. This might seem like a weird nitpick but I think a team that suffers from an imbalance this extreme begins to suffer from chemistry issues offensively. This extends throughout the organization. Their top 3 scoring forwards in the AHL are all left handed. 2 of their top forward prospects in junior, Dube and Ruzicka (both at the WJHC) are both lefties. I'm not saying they need a 50/50 balance but adding a middle 6 RHC would help.

Also their defence is overrated and Monahan is what people think Draisaitl is.

 

[crazyfisherman]

Scoring.... the ability for this team to generate offense has been atrocious recently. the D has been solid, and goalies are making the saves they are suppose to, offense is letting them down right now. Its time to shake up the lines, ferland has been a ghost for a month now, play someone else up there. I might be dreaming but i think JG can play rw, try tkachuk or bennett up there on the top line lw.
Also i think gully is a terrible offensive coach, our D was great at generating offense before he got here, in 1.5 seasons its been non existent. And my god dont get me started on cameron and his stupid drop pass over and over again on the pp, a blind bat can see it coming a mile away, im surprised teams still let us set up that way sometimes.

 

[njdevils1982]

this….

 

[Reinhart]

I think the biggest piece missing is actually utilizing their defence. Agree with it or not, but I would say that the Flames have one of the best mobile puck-moving bluelines in the league, but instead of moving the puck quickly out of the zone and using the D-men to help generate offence, they do some D-to-D passes and set-up for the transition, which allows the other team to prepare. I just don't think that the system being employed right now is a strong fit for Calgary's roster.

 

[Boomstick]

No heart, no killer instinct. Seems like they'll all coast out there and wait for the other team to amp up the game.
Laziness at times. Not really sure. My expectations were high at the beginning of the year, but I don't think these guys are going to get it done. It's just the same thing game after game. Too much hype, not enough proof that they can get it done. Goaltending has been great this year and I'd hate to see where they'd be without Smith and Rittich.

 

[Bjornar Moxnes]

Right handed forwards. Put all their right handed forwards together and their stat line is 7-22-29 in 105 games. Basically all of their good forwards are lefties. This might seem like a weird nitpick but I think a team that suffers from an imbalance this extreme begins to suffer from chemistry issues offensively. This extends throughout the organization. Their top 3 scoring forwards in the AHL are all left handed. 2 of their top forward prospects in junior, Dube and Ruzicka (both at the WJHC) are both lefties. I'm not saying they need a 50/50 balance but adding a middle 6 RHC would help.

Also their defence is overrated and Monahan is what people think Draisaitl is.

I agree with all but defense is overrated. Our best RHS forward prospect is Matthew Phillips (And yes the point is "who?") who is a long shot to make the NHL.

 

[MessierII]

People don’t want to admit it but their defence sucks. Gio is aging and Brodie and Hamilton are 2 of the most overrated players in the nhl. Hamonic is solid but he’s not much more than a 3-4 these days. Their 5-7 guys are awful. Never seen a team give up so many odd man rushes and breakaways. Habs are the only team I can think of in recent history to be comparably bad defensively.

 

[PunkRockLocke]

Good players.

 

[Javaman]

I'm saying this as a lifelong Flames fan so don't think that I'm trashing them. They just don't seem like a dangerous team. First line is producing, second line with Backlund is solid. Third line centered by Jankowski and Bennett is finally producing, though guys like Lazar, Brouwer and Bartkowski probably shouldn't be in the NHL. Even Hathaway who was great in the AHL is producing.

The defence should be the least of the problems but it seems like every game they get hemmed in their own zone for minutes at a time and have to rely on goaltending to bail them out. Smith has done way better than I expected him to do this season but even that is unsustainable unless you've got a guy like Price or Quick in net. It seems like our defence core was built with name value in mind more than actual play and chemistry. In theory, adding Hamonic should have really shored up any defensive holes that we had but here we are still, looking weak on defense.

Maybe Giordano has regressed? Maybe Hamilton and Brodie (who has gone cold since the first quarter of the year) aren't as solid defensively as we thought they were? From watching games I've noticed that Gaudreau seems to disappear for extended lengths of time. Maybe he shouldn't be relied on to be the sole catalyst of our offence? Even in games where he produces plenty of points, he does so in small spurts and seems irrelevant the rest of the time. I just don't see the Flames doing much with the core they have currently unless they get really lucky and someone pans out to be a superstar. Maybe its Bennett who has to save them, who I've been defending for a season and a half now. Everytime he's on the ice, he seems like a difference maker, even during his awful start this year.

What I ask is this, what are the Flames missing? What do you do in Treliving's shoes to push the Flames into being a legitimate contender. I mean of course they need a goalie soon, they have some high end goalie prospects and Smith seems to be a perfectly capable stop gap until then, but what else?

Not enough top end talent. IMO you need elite talent in at least 2 out of 3 key positions to make a serious run at the Cup: centre, defence, goalie. Or, at the very least, elite calibre play during the playoffs from typically very good players.

I just don't see that in the Flames roster. Lots of very good, but not enough elite.

 

[ComixZone]

A good coach.

 

[JoVel]

Well, they have Tolvanen coming so.....

He was drafted by Nashville.

 

[Mav3rick07]

Brian Elliot .

 

[Eternal Leaf]

A great starting point would be the special teams since it can be fixed in-house.

Good teams can't be sitting in the bottom third for PP and PK because it indicates a real issue with coaching and how personnel is being deployed/set up. The defensive talent on the Flames shouldn't be this bad on the special teams.

The bigger problem is an additional scoring threat and that can't be fixed in-house.