Post-Game Talk: Well poop: Sabres win 2-1

[EucaLEAFtys]

Have you watched the 3rd line? They've been the most dangerous at generating chances in the offensive zone thanks to Kadri.

I've watched both gaames. The only one on that line with points is Kadri, which clearly makes him the most dangerous (at this point in time) one of the three.

JrR and Komarov can "look" as dangerous as they want as they generate chance after chance, but until they actually start contributing on the score-sheet, their effectiveness is only as a pair of checkers.

 

[mix1home]

Not that Scrivens played badly but I think tonight is the perfect example of what a #1 goalie can do.
Good effort though really.

I'm sorry. One fluke goal and 3-on-1 after blown call by refs? What any goalie could have done in that situation?
In fact, Scrivens held the fort on few dangerous chances and gave our guys chance to win. Miller did the same though and it was essentially the draw that by chance ended not in our favor.

This game deserved OT at least.

 

[bobermay]

Perimeter team - Perimeter Chances.

This is not a broken record - The Leafs put up 30+ shots and 1or2 real scoring chances. The next day "OPPOSITION GOALIE STANDS ON HIS HEAD" Really? No. This top6 is simply tooo small and weak to play against. Its so easy to box them out - so easy to rub them off the puck.

I agree with this as well. Which is why I can see us shipping out guys like MacArthur, Bozak, or even Grabovski.

 

[bunjay]

Perimeter team - Perimeter Chances.

This is not a broken record - The Leafs put up 30+ shots and 1or2 real scoring chances. The next day "OPPOSITION GOALIE STANDS ON HIS HEAD" Really? No. This top6 is simply tooo small and weak to play against. Its so easy to box them out - so easy to rub them off the puck.

The Sabres did to us exactly what we did to the Habs.

 

[masyo88*]

We should have won, but it was an exciting game. Gunnar looks like he is coming down to earth, so is Kostka. Kuli is playing like he has to play and doesn't really want to be there. Mcarthur, should be dumped for a third round pick or something, he's been mostly awful. I was impressed with Fraser, I don't think many of you focused on Fraser, he was steady made some nice passes and showed the nasty. He was not bad at all, but Holzer did look shaky out there. I love our fourth line! Orr Mcclement Brown is a solid and tough as nails fourth line. Scrap with the best of them, play gritty and not be a liability.

 

[The Blue Devil]

I dont care what the record says, I never expect Toronto to win at home against Buffalo. I always expect the games to go exactly like last night. The Leafs outshoot the Sabres like crazy, Ryan Miller stands on his head, and the Leafs lose.

You do realize that before last night the Leafs won 5(?) straight at home against Buffalo?

 

[xyzz]

Perimeter team - Perimeter Chances.

This is not a broken record - The Leafs put up 30+ shots and 1or2 real scoring chances. The next day "OPPOSITION GOALIE STANDS ON HIS HEAD" Really? No. This top6 is simply tooo small and weak to play against. Its so easy to box them out - so easy to rub them off the puck.

Is there a site that has Save % against a team? If the general Save % vs. the Leafs (over the course of a season) is higher than average, then you'd be able to prove your point. It would prove that by outshooting a team (which we seem to do a lot) is not actually an advantage because our shot quality is lower.

Just did a quick google search and didnt come up with anything.

 

[Cor]

1. Everyone calm their ****, it's 2 games in, we aren't going to tear the house down because of 1 win, and Ryan Miller.

2. Most of these guys have only played 2 games since last april. It takes time to get into game shape, and even harder with no pre-season. Give them time.

3. Jake Gardiner is likely going to be in the lineup wednesday... so Yay!

 

[DaveT83*]

I agree with this as well. Which is why I can see us shipping out guys like MacArthur, Bozak, or even Grabovski.

Is there a site that has GAA against a team? If the general GAA vs. the Leafs (over the course of a season) is higher than average, then you'd be able to prove your point.

Just did a quick google search and didnt come up with anything.

I'm not sure - would be an interesting stat.

One can always just watch the game too?

 

[xyzz]

I'm not sure - would be an interesting stat.

One can always just watch the game too?

Yea one can watch the game, but if you want unbiased answers - go to the numbers =)

 

[bunjay]

Is there a site that has Save % against a team? If the general Save % vs. the Leafs (over the course of a season) is higher than average, then you'd be able to prove your point. It would prove that by outshooting a team (which we seem to do a lot) is not actually an advantage because our shot quality is lower.

Just did a quick google search and didnt come up with anything.

You could derive a league-wide save percentage against any team using total shots and goals for, or shots/game and goals/game.

For example last year Toronto average 2.77 goals/game on 28.3 shots/game, which without doing a full comparison looks to be fairly average. Or at least, certainly not unusually low.

 

[Leafsman]

I'm fully aware that it's only been two games and without the benefit of a proper training camp. I'm merely pointing out that in this situation a team, regardless of who they are, simply cannot afford to get off to a sluggish start if they have any designs on earning a play-off spot. The fact that the Leafs are 1-1 thus far is really a stroke of luck because the Habs were even worse offensively than the Leafs during that game.

Had the Leafs faced pretty much any other team that night, I'm pretty sure that they would have lost and their record would be 0-2 instead of 1-1.

I also base my opinion on what the team has done in the past and how much change has occurred to the roster from year to year. This team has a history of starting slow and going through long losing streaks, things that will quickly kill their chances of earning a play-off spot this season. Also, this team has yet to show any consistency from one game to the next, which doesn't help their case either.

Whether they can show any good consistent play this season with little time to rest and practice, remanis to be seen, but I believe that all of this will be too much for them to handle.

So your basing your opinions based on past performances, yet were criticizing them for being too defensive and not producing enough offensively which seems to contradict what last year actually showed.

So the win is a stroke of luck???? True, I guess! But then one could say the loss yesterday was a stroke of luck as for two periods they outplayed Buffalo. So it would still be 1-1. It is what it is! After 2 games they're at .500 and the first two games of the season had some stink on them but also some positives. Last year was last year! First game was a win, second a lost! It is exactly as you see it and only time will tell!

Perimeter team - Perimeter Chances.

This is not a broken record - The Leafs put up 30+ shots and 1or2 real scoring chances. The next day "OPPOSITION GOALIE STANDS ON HIS HEAD" Really? No. This top6 is simply tooo small and weak to play against. Its so easy to box them out - so easy to rub them off the puck.

I would not say at all that they only produced perimeter shots! The first period they passed too much maybe and didn't set up. They lack a physical net presence but they had much more than perimeter shots yesterday.

 

[xyzz]

You could derive a league-wide save percentage against any team using total shots and goals for, or shots/game and goals/game.

For example last year Toronto average 2.77 goals/game on 28.3 shots/game, which without doing a full comparison looks to be fairly average. Or at least, certainly not unusually low.

Yeah was just looking at the same stats on NHL.com. By just having a look, and without crunching the numbers it looks as if the leafs may be in the middle of the league... or if anything the opposite of what we thought. ie. last season, a toronto shot was above average quality.

 

[mix1home]

Where the hell was Grabo's line?

Busy.... allowing goals against.
Even though I thought that should have been Buf penalty on their second goal (though Mac was tripped at center ice to create that 3-on-1), but Kulemin should have never lost that puck battle on the boards. So uncharacteristic of him.

 

[xyzz]

You could derive a league-wide save percentage against any team using total shots and goals for, or shots/game and goals/game.

For example last year Toronto average 2.77 goals/game on 28.3 shots/game, which without doing a full comparison looks to be fairly average. Or at least, certainly not unusually low.

and looking at those stats, it is clear goals for or shots are not the problem. Goals against per game really sticks out as our weak spot. Second highest in the leauge

 

[I am Canadian]

So didnt get to catch this game... Can i assume that Toronto was all over them but Miller stole the game?
How did scrivens do?

 

[Mess]

This was a 4 pointer in the standings essentially and Leafs losing to a team they hope to finish ahead of in the standings was a blow to playoff chances in a shortened season.

The Leafs had by far the more sustained attack and unfortunately could solve Miller.

However giving up only 3 goals against in 2 games is a far cry from past seasons so that aspect is promising. As is "Play the kids" where Kadri the youngest player leads them in scoring.

 

[Hurt]

Yeah... Kadri>>>> Bozak. Not that I don't like Bozak he just can't seem to shoot or score.... he always dishes it off to lupul or kessel.

So players who pass first are worse players? Someone tell Henrik Sedin to cut it out!

 

[bunjay]

I would not say at all that they only produced perimeter shots! The first period they passed too much maybe and didn't set up. They lack a physical net presence but they had much more than perimeter shots yesterday.

I've said it twice already in this thread, but I'll say it again for everyone who thinks Miller stole the game for Buffalo:


Ask yourself the following questions:

How many odd-man rushes or breakaways did he face?

How many saves were made on pucks he never saw?

How many deflections did he have to contend with?

How many cross-crease plays did the Leafs manage?

How many uncontested shots from the slot?

How many juicy rebounds resulted in a second shot on net?



People have a strange way of evaluating a game when it comes to Miller. Sure we hit a few posts. Those are not saves or even shots on goal, they're misses. Most of our best scoring chances didnt even register a shot on goal. Miller made a lot of saves but the Leafs were handled well defensively, even on the 5-on-3 during which Miller was forced to make zero spectacular saves.

 

[htpwn]

Perimeter team - Perimeter Chances.

This is not a broken record - The Leafs put up 30+ shots and 1or2 real scoring chances. The next day "OPPOSITION GOALIE STANDS ON HIS HEAD" Really? No. This top6 is simply tooo small and weak to play against. Its so easy to box them out - so easy to rub them off the puck.

Buffalo looks to have fired more shots from the perimeter than we did and many of our shots were fired by Phaneuf and Kessel, who are more than capable of scoring from such a distance.

 

[bobermay]

Buffalo looks to have fired more shots from the perimeter than we did and many of our shots were fired by Phaneuf and Kessel, who are more than capable of scoring from such a distance.

Doesn't help the case for sticking with Scrivens.

 

[Chainshot]

Eh, from here (non-Leaf fan), they looked rusty and when timing gets going a few games in, they should be better. Gardiner in the mix gives them the transition that the forward speed will put pressure on most teams in the East. A lot of teams are having issues on specialty teams right now -- it's barely a week since they all hit the ice together again so basically the second week of camp.

 

[Chandrashekhar Limit]

Doesn't help the case for sticking with Scrivens.

You must not have watched the game.

 

[bunjay]

Buffalo looks to have fired more shots from the perimeter than we did and many of our shots were fired by Phaneuf and Kessel, who are more than capable of scoring from such a distance.

Nobody said the Sabres weren't also kept to the outside. They scored on their one great scoring opportunity, and the other wasnt even a shot on goal until it bounced off someone.

But looking at that graphic is only useful if you also watched the game and remember what each of those dots represents. You might otherwise be tempted to think that the Leafs were all over Miller. What it's actually showing us is a grand total of 3 shots from the slot (none of which I recall being totally open and uncontested like Pominville's goal was), a lot of point shots that he saw all the way, and a lot of attempted stuff-ins where all Miller had to do was keep his pads on the ice.

 

[bunjay]

Doesn't help the case for sticking with Scrivens.

It does if you actually watched the game.