Post-Game Talk: Welcome to the Boneless Oiler Ranch

[Arpeggio]

This isn't even the same team we were watching in December. They're getting handily outshot and outplayed every single game. Earlier in the season they were losing games where they were outshooting teams 40-20. That's acceptable.

It's difficult to reconcile considering nothing has really changed with the roster. Either adjustments by opponents were made that the team is having a difficult time accounting for, or the team has collectively decided to take a month off.

 

[belair]

He’s under contract to play for the Edmonton Oilers, how the f*** is that tying the teams hands?

Nuge is also on the 3rd line, the pk is ranked 26th and on the pp anyone can do whatever it is he does (basically a back pass to Bouch) but go ahead and give him the special teams props.

He'd be tying the team's hands because it doesn't allow them to use Kane's LTI space at the deadline. Instead we'd be getting a winger we don't really need who hasn't played a game in eight months.

I don't know what's so difficult about this line of thought. Kane is a 33 year old regressing winger, who now has a significant injury history in his brief time in Edmonton.

Trade his ass.

 

[Stoneman89]

He'd be tying the team's hands because it doesn't allow them to use Kane's LTI space at the deadline. Instead we'd be getting a winger we don't really need who hasn't played a game in eight months.

I don't know what's so difficult about this line of thought. Kane is a 33 year old regressing winger, who now has a significant injury history in his brief time in Edmonton.

Trade his ass.

Sure, trade an important piece that this team needs and will need going forward. Give the guy a chance before throwing him under the bus. He's undergone some significant surgeries to correct things that have been plaguing him for a while. Let's see how things shake out on March 1 before making rash decisions.

 

[belair]

Sure, trade an important piece that this team needs and will need going forward. Give the guy a chance before throwing him under the bus. He's undergone some significant surgeries to correct things that have been plaguing him for a while. Let's see how things shake out on March 1 before making rash decisions.

He's been given numerous chances since his one playoff run that earned him the extension. He's proven to be a luxury depth scorer that ties up necessary cap space.

That being said, nothing is going to happen prior to March 1st. But if he's rushing his return, you make that move when he gives his 16-team list.

 

[K1984]

This isn't even the same team we were watching in December. They're getting handily outshot and outplayed every single game. Earlier in the season they were losing games where they were outshooting teams 40-20. That's acceptable.

It's difficult to reconcile considering nothing has really changed with the roster. Either adjustments by opponents were made that the team is having a difficult time accounting for, or the team has collectively decided to take a month off.

Its this. They take a sabbatical for a month every season, this is the one this time I guess.

 

[Stoneman89]

He's been given numerous chances since his one playoff run that earned him the extension. He's proven to be a luxury depth scorer that ties up necessary cap space.

That being said, nothing is going to happen prior to March 1st. But if he's rushing his return, you make that move when he gives his 16-team list.

When he's healthy he's proven to be an important piece, not a "luxury depth scorer". This team has nothing close to him in terms of what he can bring. Again, let's see what happens when more info is given. I doubt he'll rush a return if he' not ready. But if he's ready, then we're paying him to play, so he plays. Not his fault management has screwed up in so many other areas.

 

[oXo Cube]

This isn't even the same team we were watching in December. They're getting handily outshot and outplayed every single game. Earlier in the season they were losing games where they were outshooting teams 40-20. That's acceptable.

It's difficult to reconcile considering nothing has really changed with the roster. Either adjustments by opponents were made that the team is having a difficult time accounting for, or the team has collectively decided to take a month off.

The Oilers are top heavy at both forward and defense, and McDavid, RNH, Hyman, Ekholm, and Bouchard have all performed somewhere from poor to awful for a month now.

When something like that happens the team simply cannot function the way it's been constructed.

 

[K1984]

The Oilers are top heavy at both forward and defense, and McDavid, RNH, Hyman, Ekholm, and Bouchard have all performed somewhere from poor to awful for a month now.

When something like that happens the team simply cannot function the way it's been constructed.

When I see blame tossed at the bottom 6, although it isn't unfounded, it doesn't make a difference.

They could all be in their individual top form, but we would still lose if the top pair is a turnover factory and the #1C goes -3 every game without pissing a drop of offence 5v5. Although production is extremely poor, it isn't like the bottom 6 is getting blasted 5v5 the other way.

Bottom 6 over their individual last 5 games:

Henrique +1
Brown +3
Janmark -1
Kapanen -5 (he needs to get gone)
Perry -1
Podkolzin -2
Skinner +1

Conversely, the Top 6 over their individual last 5 games:

McDavid -12
RNH -3
Hyman -8
Draisaitl -1
Arvidsson -3
Savoie E

Bottom 6 is generally not getting blasted on the scoreboard even if producing nothing. Other than Leon, the Top 6 is producing nothing while getting absolutely murdered on the board. Nobody is batting an eye at the Bottom 6 if the Top 6 was playing remotely close to their level, but they aren't. \

It makes no sense to me whatsoever that the Bottom 6 can generally be playing how they mostly always play, but they are the ones that take the heat the moment our top players all collectively decided to implode. Unless they have the very best of Bottom 6's, no team is surviving their top 6 posting the results I highlighted above.

 

[oXo Cube]

When I see blame tossed at the bottom 6, although it isn't unfounded, it doesn't make a difference.

They could all be in their individual top form, but we would still lose if the top pair is a turnover factory and the #1C goes -3 every game without pissing a drop of offence 5v5. Although production is extremely poor, it isn't like the bottom 6 is getting blasted 5v5 the other way.

Bottom 6 over their individual last 5 games:

Henrique +1
Brown +3
Janmark -1
Kapanen -5 (he needs to get gone)
Perry -1
Podkolzin -2
Skinner +1

Conversely, the Top 6 over their individual last 5 games:

McDavid -12
RNH -3
Hyman -8
Draisaitl -1
Arvidsson -3
Savoie E

Bottom 6 is generally not getting blasted on the scoreboard even if producing nothing. Other than Leon, the Top 6 is producing nothing while getting absolutely murdered on the board. Nobody is batting an eye at the Bottom 6 if the Top 6 was playing remotely close to their level, but they aren't. \

It makes no sense to me whatsoever that the Bottom 6 can generally be playing how they mostly always play, but they are the ones that take the heat the moment our top players all collectively decided to implode. Unless they have the very best of Bottom 6's, no team is surviving their top 6 posting the results I highlighted above.

You could make a case from a macro perspective that this is a bad philosophy, but Edmonton's bottom 6(and bottom 3) has been purpose built to do things:

- Contribute on the PK
- Tread water in soft 5v5 minutes

While the PK thing is a little bit short term dubious they have been pretty consistent about keeping their end of the deal with the exception of Kapanen and the explanation for him is that he simply sucks.

 

[oobga]

There was a stretch of about 10 games before the break where the effort wasn't necessarily bad, but the mistakes, the execution, and the goaltending buried them. The engine was there, but the details were way, way off.

They came back from the break making the same stupid mistakes and the same shitty goaltending, but now the effort is half cocked being generous. Impossible to win with that.

I thought the play was pretty weak leading in the break, but we still did pull off enough wins to get into 1st in the division (Vegas playing bad for a stretch helped). We were giving the team a pass though thinking there were 2 waves of sickness going through the room. Hat tip for still pulling off some wins even going through illness.

But then they come back, likely now all healthy again, and they play even worse.

 

[K1984]

You could make a case from a macro perspective that this is a bad philosophy, but Edmonton's bottom 6(and bottom 3) has been purpose built to do things:

- Contribute on the PK
- Tread water in soft 5v5 minutes

While the PK thing is a little bit short term dubious they have been pretty consistent about keeping their end of the deal with the exception of Kapanen and the explanation for him is that he simply sucks.

And that's how the roster needs to be constructed with our payroll allocated up top.

When you have two superstars in the Top 6, arguably the #1 and #2 players in the world at that, a bottom 6 that pushes the puck in the right direction, kills penalties, and doesn't give up goals is literally all you need. When the top line is getting skull f***ed every game, the house of cards collapses.

I'll never understand why when the top players are playing obviously poor hockey, it's everyone else that gets blamed by some people. For the most part, those players are generally doing their jobs. It makes no sense to be mad that Adam Henrique isn't all of a sudden scoring for no reason other than McDavid is probably playing the worst hockey of his career.

 

[belair]

When he's healthy he's proven to be an important piece, not a "luxury depth scorer". This team has nothing close to him in terms of what he can bring. Again, let's see what happens when more info is given. I doubt he'll rush a return if he' not ready. But if he's ready, then we're paying him to play, so he plays. Not his fault management has screwed up in so many other areas.

'When he's healthy' is the key take away here. And it's been a while since he's been just that. And odds are, in a season where anything short of a Cup is a failure, the Kane coming back early from multiple injuries likely won't be 100% healthy. And the cap he ties up limits the team's ability to add reinforcements.

Sitting the remainder of the season is a strategic play that benefits both the team and the player. Rushing his return would be a selfish move that sees little benefit. And quite honestly increases the likelihood he reaggravates those previous injuries considering his style of game.

 

[Drivesaitl]

What do you mean "you guys"?
The board was almost universally at least ok with the moves this offseason even with some concerns about getting older and slower, mainly before the offer sheets, so that's some serious hindsight shit to be throwing around "I told you so" as if it was some obvious thing that JJ and Bowman had terrible summers and rubbing that in when the team is down and everybody is frustrated isn't a great look. I don't think anybody is happy with the current state of the team.

You know that I sure wasn't OK with the offseason moves and considered it the worst offseason in quite sometime. Really to the extent of being disillusioning. Unfortunately I figured Arvid would be crap here, Pods was already a bust, and that J Skinner wouldn't fit in well. Meanwhile the forwards we lost all hitting it out of the ballpark on 20something goal campaigns and Holloway confirming that he's a stud topsix player in this league.

Losing the players, particularly Holloway was gutting. That the org somehow continued with old players like Ryan, Perry, Brown, Janmark etc indicated lack of diligence in even bothering to replace them. There wasn't even a plan. Just load up with Vets and pretend its 1990s Dallas Stars with a big name roster. This only continuing as the team adds Klingberg.

 

[rboomercat90]

This isn't even the same team we were watching in December. They're getting handily outshot and outplayed every single game. Earlier in the season they were losing games where they were outshooting teams 40-20. That's acceptable.

It's difficult to reconcile considering nothing has really changed with the roster. Either adjustments by opponents were made that the team is having a difficult time accounting for, or the team has collectively decided to take a month off.

When the same roster goes from consistently getting 40+ shots a game to struggling to hit 20 I’m not sure you can come up with any other conclusion than the players are gassed. We’ve got the oldest forward group in the league and in addition to that we’re a team that gets outhit in games by a 3-1 margin regularly. That type of physical domination takes it toll over time and I think we’re seeing the results of that now.

 

[CrazyJoeDavola]

This isn't even the same team we were watching in December. They're getting handily outshot and outplayed every single game. Earlier in the season they were losing games where they were outshooting teams 40-20. That's acceptable.

It's difficult to reconcile considering nothing has really changed with the roster. Either adjustments by opponents were made that the team is having a difficult time accounting for, or the team has collectively decided to take a month off.

it's because the team is full of old slow vets that have run out of gas. Prepared to get molly wopped, injured, battered, and have to rely on mcdrai in the playoffs. Only for them to run out of steam and then have zero support

 

[5 Mins 4 Ftg]

You know that I sure wasn't OK with the offseason moves and considered it the worst offseason in quite sometime. Really to the extent of being disillusioning. Unfortunately I figured Arvid would be crap here, Pods was already a bust, and that J Skinner wouldn't fit in well. Meanwhile the forwards we lost all hitting it out of the ballpark on 20something goal campaigns and Holloway confirming that he's a stud topsix player in this league.

Losing the players, particularly Holloway was gutting. That the org somehow continued with old players like Ryan, Perry, Brown, Janmark etc indicated lack of diligence in even bothering to replace them. There wasn't even a plan. Just load up with Vets and pretend its 1990s Dallas Stars with a big name roster. This only continuing as the team adds Klingberg.

I heard you were gone while I was gone. I have a little more time right now so I am back, glad to see you are back too.

 

[Dazed and Confused]

This isn't even the same team we were watching in December. They're getting handily outshot and outplayed every single game. Earlier in the season they were losing games where they were outshooting teams 40-20. That's acceptable.

It's difficult to reconcile considering nothing has really changed with the roster. Either adjustments by opponents were made that the team is having a difficult time accounting for, or the team has collectively decided to take a month off.

Teams are revving up for the stretch run, while the Oil are still in 2nd gear trying not to tax the engine and conserve gas.

 

[CupofOil]

You know that I sure wasn't OK with the offseason moves and considered it the worst offseason in quite sometime. Really to the extent of being disillusioning. Unfortunately I figured Arvid would be crap here, Pods was already a bust, and that J Skinner wouldn't fit in well. Meanwhile the forwards we lost all hitting it out of the ballpark on 20something goal campaigns and Holloway confirming that he's a stud topsix player in this league.

Losing the players, particularly Holloway was gutting. That the org somehow continued with old players like Ryan, Perry, Brown, Janmark etc indicated lack of diligence in even bothering to replace them. There wasn't even a plan. Just load up with Vets and pretend its 1990s Dallas Stars with a big name roster. This only continuing as the team adds Klingberg.

Sorry, late reply.

You were one of the few who were right about this so you deserve credit.
I still want to see how the vets do in the playoff before making final judgment but it all looks pretty awful now and even worse with the departed younger speedsters having good to great years.
Even if they have a good playoffs, the Oilers have shrunk their Cup window significantly with the offseason moves.

 

[Stoneman89]

'When he's healthy' is the key take away here. And it's been a while since he's been just that. And odds are, in a season where anything short of a Cup is a failure, the Kane coming back early from multiple injuries likely won't be 100% healthy. And the cap he ties up limits the team's ability to add reinforcements.

Sitting the remainder of the season is a strategic play that benefits both the team and the player. Rushing his return would be a selfish move that sees little benefit. And quite honestly increases the likelihood he reaggravates those previous injuries considering his style of game.

Who says the return will be rushed? That will be up to the team, the doctors and Kane himself, not some fan. Again, we need to see how this plays out before setting our hair on fire.

 

[Drivesaitl]

Teams are revving up for the stretch run, while the Oil are still in 2nd gear trying not to tax the engine and conserve gas.

This. Exactly. We were playing whole games and sometimes weeks against clubs that weren't even at their game or making reasonable attempts. Teams that have a chance are gearing up their games now. The other thing is that it was predictable that a club that got a lot older and a lot slower was going to have more trouble as the season dragged on. You look at guys like Brown, Janmark, Henrique Perry etc and they are gassed.

 

[Drivesaitl]

Sorry, late reply.

You were one of the few who were right about this so you deserve credit.
I still want to see how the vets do in the playoff before making final judgment but it all looks pretty awful now and even worse with the departed younger speedsters having good to great years.
Even if they have a good playoffs, the Oilers have shrunk their Cup window significantly with the offseason moves.

Thanks for the reply. Not that I feel I need credit but I sure got the gears for my views offseason and precious few posters even acknowledging that they were lapping up the offseason like Kitty drinks milk. So credit you for honesty.

It shocked me somewhat then how quickly a board turned on its own good prospects like Holloway or McLeod. Classic grapes were sour anyway. Posters just bought the terrible offseason instead of having expectations of this org to even look after their own, and to even put best team forward for its fans.

Its weird. I actually learned how good Holloway was as a prospect on this board. I became quite a fan. I took notes and observed that everything stated about the player was ringing true. But its as if the fanbase became jilted by the offersheet and took it personal. So that Holloway then devalued and ironically on hfboards. Holloway is the best prospect since McD that we've had, due to his consistency more value than even Bouchard. Anyway.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

Thanks for the reply. Not that I feel I need credit but I sure got the gears for my views offseason and precious few posters even acknowledging that they were lapping up the offseason like Kitty drinks milk. So credit you for honesty.

It shocked me somewhat then how quickly a board turned on its own good prospects like Holloway or McLeod. Classic grapes were sour anyway. Posters just bought the terrible offseason instead of having expectations of this org to even look after their own, and to even put best team forward for its fans.

Its weird. I actually learned how good Holloway was as a prospect on this board. I became quite a fan. I took notes and observed that everything stated about the player was ringing true. But its as if the fanbase became jilted by the offersheet and took it personal. So that Holloway then devalued and ironically on hfboards. Holloway is the best prospect since McD that we've had, due to his consistency more value than even Bouchard. Anyway.

Eberle was nailed to the cross after the 2017 playoffs and was deemed complete crap by the fans.

Years later and we still don't have a sniper of his calibre on the wing. And he's had some pretty decent playoff runs since his first.

 

[Drivesaitl]

Eberle was nailed to the cross after the 2017 playoffs and was deemed complete crap by the fans.

Years later and we still don't have a sniper of his calibre on the wing. And he's had some pretty decent playoff runs since his first.

Eberle experienced different problems and one of them being playing for years on a very bad club where its possible to develop bad and non 200ft game habits. When teams don't even stand a chance of being a winning club then they cut corners, take shortcuts and start cheating on individual results. Take the same Eberle and put him on a better club and maybe he's a different player. I can see it somewhat then the fans were tired of having to see players from the dark years which ironically had no hope.


What was odd was to see young can't miss turks like Holloway and posters saying he's completely nothing and the results are in. Holloway was finding his way here and in AHL. Was always can't miss. Was always going to end up being quality. He's a fan favorite in STL,. Maybe the favorite player on that team now.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

Eberle experienced different problems and one of them being playing for years on a very bad club where its possible to develop bad and non 200ft game habits. When teams don't even stand a chance of being a winning club then they cut corners, take shortcuts and start cheating on individual results. Take the same Eberle and put him on a better club and maybe he's a different player. I can see it somewhat then the fans were tired of having to see players from the dark years which ironically had no hope.


What was odd was to see young can't miss turks like Holloway and posters saying he's completely nothing and the results are in. Holloway was finding his way here and in AHL. Was always can't miss. Was always going to end up being quality. He's a fan favorite in STL,. Maybe the favorite player on that team now.

It's obvious that people are just upset because he went elsewhere. The only reason people could come up with for him to stay is "A chance at the Stanley Cup", which is by no means a guarantee. He gets more money, a better opportunity, and presumably a quieter life in STL. Even then the Oilers could've just matched it. Letting him for the pittance they did is laughably bad management. The chances that the 3rd round pick they got from the Blues turning into anything useful one way or the other is extremely slim.

The only people Oilers fans should be mad at in regards to Holloway et al is management. They dropped the ball so hard it cracked the pavement.

 

[Drivesaitl]

It's obvious that people are just upset because he went elsewhere. The only reason people could come up with for him to stay is "A chance at the Stanley Cup", which is by no means a guarantee. He gets more money, a better opportunity, and presumably a quieter life in STL. Even then the Oilers could've just matched it. Letting him for the pittance they did is laughably bad management. The chances that the 3rd round pick they got from the Blues turning into anything useful one way or the other is extremely slim.

The only people Oilers fans should be mad at in regards to Holloway et al is management. They dropped the ball so hard it cracked the pavement.

Most offseasons here have blindfaith as a soundtrack. Been like that for decades. I'd referenced the "HOPE" years and to highlight two names in that being the laughable Omark and Paajarvi. The latter were pretty clear imposters at this level. Neither had the balls to stomach 82 game seasons of NHL physicality. Their game wasn't made for this league.

But even with McLeod posters hyperinflated the non physical aspects even though McLeod was very effective on a TKA/GVA level and was zone exit zone entry gold. Exactly the kind of no nonsense player with speed a team should want to advance pucks north.

My concern immediately with the McLeod trade is we lost a guaranteed value NHL player for a prospect. The proverbial bird in hand stuff.

Holloway was clear topsix. Gave him away. Didn't even get anything of value.

It is as if fans need to limit cognitive dissonance about who's running the ship, to have that blanket faith agreement. I'm not really built out that way. Really as we've been mentioning for years its inane to have a decade of McD/Drai and not have been able to do more with that.