Confirmed with Link: Weekesbomb: Palat to NJ for five-year deal

hidek91

Registered User
Jan 13, 2014
1,823
1,471
Warsaw, PL
Running that Palat contract structure through the buyout calculator on capgeek.

Its a 4 yr deal disguised as a 5. A buyout into the last yr doesnt really hurt us.
What do you mean?

If we buy him before 2026-27, we get 2.7M cap hit in 2026-27 and 1.65M in 2027-28, for the total of 4.35M. If his salary was distributed evenly throughout the years, we'd get 2M cap hit in both years, for the total of 4M.
 

Captain3rdLine

Registered User
Sep 24, 2020
7,685
8,917
If his production is worth 6Mthen JG was worth 15M. Give your head a shake. Hes gonna make tatar look good
It’s almost like players are evaluated on more than just their production (his is still solid) Thought everyone knew that. Palat has gained a reputation for being good in all areas of the ice.

Didn’t know you could see into the future.
 
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FooteBahl

Took a big shitz for Nemec
Jul 19, 2005
5,491
7,530
Metuchen NJ
It’s almost like players are evaluated on more than just their production (his is still solid) Thought everyone knew that. Palat has gained a reputation for being good in all areas of the ice.

Didn’t know you could see into the future.
I was thinking that he could be our 2022 version of Claude Lemieux…so I went on hockey-reference; eerily similar production

6A88A4C2-F677-42BB-B060-0E4907C0259F.png
 

AfroThunder396

[citation needed]
Jan 8, 2006
39,630
25,184
Miami, FL
If we buy him out in 2025:

2026: 3.533M dead cap (2.466M savings)
2027: 2.533M dead cap (3.466M savings)
2028: 1.483M dead cap (1.483M penalty)
2029: 1.483M dead cap (1.483M penalty)

If we buy him out in 2026:

2027: 2.7M dead cap (3.3M savings)
2028: 1.65M dead cap (1.65M penalty)

Really not that bad at all.

For reference, Cammalleri's buyout was 1.667M in dead cap for 4 years and Schneider's buyout was 2M in dead cap for 4 years, both with a much lower cap.
 

tailfins

Registered User
Sponsor
Apr 20, 2005
2,794
1,791
I’m not clear on why people are SO upset with this deal. Evolving Hockey is normally pretty good on salary projections, and they were basically dead on with Palat’s contract.

I’m not a huge fan of this deal: feels like we bought a really nice dining table when still need to do work on our kitchen and baths.

Still, this is market rate for Palat.

And, you’re nuts if you think he is untradeable. If the Devils continue to suck, Palat is pretty quickly one of our top trade chips. The guy has been to four cup finals, won twice, and was a core part of those teams. Maybe the Devils have to retain salary or take back salary, but GMs will want that guy on their team - even in 4-5 years.

I appreciate that Fitz took a swing here even if this deal feels riskier than necessary to me. I would have been happy with Nino - he’ll likely cost less in $$ and term. But maybe Palat pans out? Worst case, the deal likely won’t hurt that bad.
 

Unknown Caller

Registered User
Apr 30, 2009
10,332
7,975
I’m not clear on why people are SO upset with this deal. Evolving Hockey is normally pretty good on salary projections, and they were basically dead on with Palat’s contract.

I’m not a huge fan of this deal: feels like we bought a really nice dining table when still need to do work on our kitchen and baths.

Still, this is market rate for Palat.

And, you’re nuts if you think he is untradeable. If the Devils continue to suck, Palat is pretty quickly one of our top trade chips. The guy has been to four cup finals, won twice, and was a core part of those teams. Maybe the Devils have to retain salary or take back salary, but GMs will want that guy on their team - even in 4-5 years.

I appreciate that Fitz took a swing here even if this deal feels riskier than necessary to me. I would have been happy with Nino - he’ll likely cost less in $$ and term. But maybe Palat pans out? Worst case, the deal likely won’t hurt that bad.
Palat will not be one of the Devils top trade chips lol. Do you think teams would clamor over Corey Perry at a $6 million aav just because he won a cup and went to a bunch of finals?

It’s fine to like the player and be willing to overlook the contract as a calculated risk. But a 34/35 year old Palat is just not going to be a tradeable asset with that cap hit, never mind one of our top trade chips.
 

glenwo2

JESPER BRATWURST
Oct 18, 2008
52,563
25,125
New Jersey(No Fanz!)
This contract runs through 2026-27. Our only other current commitments past next year are Hamilton at $9 million, Hughes $8 million, Hischier $7.25, Mercer $900k, and Brendan Smith just signed at 1.1, as well as other ELCs. Let's say we sign Bratt to a max term deal. Let's estimate high and say he gets the Thomas contract - 8 years, $8 million. We also need to sign Boqvist, Wood, Vanecek, Thompson, and Zetterlund. I forget the exact parameters of what Wood can get in ARB, but that's a 1 year commitment so it's basically meaningless. Boqvist I can see getting $1.5x2 as a player with a decent number of games played at this point. Zetterlund probably more like $1x2, Thompson probably less than that. Let's say Vanecek gets $2.5x2. Let's jump ahead to next offseason.

2023-24
Using our projections from above, we have $39,250,000 committed. We can probably safely assume Foote and Holtz make the team. They will still be on ELCs this year making less than $900k. Other forwards we have to re-sign are Sharangovich, Bastian, McLeod, Tatar, Johnsson, Haula, Wood. Let's say we keep Haula of the 3 UFAs and he get's $2x2 or something. Sharangovich, let's say he plays mostly on Jack's wing again this year and hits 30 goals. We can sign him to a 5 year deal that takes him through 27-28, past when Palat's contract will be gone. Let's say he gets $5.5 million. McLeod and Bastian are probably either non-tendered or sign for around $1 million. Wood is probably gone either because he came back and performed well enough to earn a bigger contract than I want to give him, or he fizzles.

On D, We expect Nemec and Luke will both begin playing on their ELCs this year and expect both to play for NJ. We have Severson, Graves Seigenthaler, Ty smith, and Bahl on expiring contracts. I really don't see a world where Ty Smith fits with us long term so let's assume he's traded for futures or something. Graves walks, Let's say Seigs gets the same defensive D contract that everyone got this offseason of something like 4x$4.25. Let's say Bahl gets 2x$1.2. I think the right move is to keep Severson. Let's say he gets 6x$7.

Impossible to guess what goalie looks like, so I'm just going to budget $5 million each year for that moving forward.
Total commitments: $67,139,000

2024-25

Projections from above, we have about $64,289,000 committed. after B. Smith, Mercer, and Foote all expire. It's tough to project Mercer, but let's assume we sign him to a bridge deal at a $5 aav. Foote maybe costs $2 million unless he is much better than I think he is. ELC D-man +850k. Holtz, again tough to predict but let's say he is good and we want to sign him long-term for $8 million aav.
Total commitments: $72,139.00

2025-26

Using our projections and continuing to just lump goaltending as $5 million, Zetterlund, Boqvist, and Thompson all need to be reupped. We had their contracts pegged at about $3.25 million before, so we have just under $70 million committed. Holtz is also off his ELC going into this year and will likely cost a lot unless he's a bust. At this point I'm less interested in projecting specific contracts as who the hell knows what these guys will be 3 more seasons from now. Point being that this is the year the cap is projected to jump big time and we're still nowhere near it.

2026-27
Now things get dicey as Palat will certainly not be worth his contract, Holtz may be much, much more expensive, and Nemec and Luke are coming off their ELC. At this point we will probably need to dump Palat and one of Severson or Hamilton to re-sign the younger D. But again, the cap should be much higher by this point and the cost to move one year of a $6 million contract won't be a lot. Or LTIR, or whatever. It's not going to be an issue until his last year and then we can just get rid of it. Hamilton will probably be the more costly contract to move.

Again, this isn't a good contract and we can't go around signing more of them every year, but we can basically re-sign every significant piece in our organization and still carry it for 4 of the 5 years. It doesn't matter if you signed Gaudreau, Palat, or whoever, it was always going to be a breeze up until Luke and Nemec come off their ELCs. That's the point where keeping whoever we actually want to keep gets tricky. Before then, we can still add one or more significant players and still keep the ones that are worth it. We will have a number of expendable prospects to trade for additional depth or future picks to replenish as our roster ages and gets more expensive. this contract is a non issue for 4 of the 5 years it exists, and then the 5th year the cap could be over $90 million.
OUTSTANDING POST!

Why aren't you working for Fitz instead of hanging around here? :laugh:
 

Zippy316

aka Zippo
Aug 17, 2012
19,671
4,843
New Jersey
I’m not clear on why people are SO upset with this deal. Evolving Hockey is normally pretty good on salary projections, and they were basically dead on with Palat’s contract.

I’m not a huge fan of this deal: feels like we bought a really nice dining table when still need to do work on our kitchen and baths.

Still, this is market rate for Palat.

And, you’re nuts if you think he is untradeable. If the Devils continue to suck, Palat is pretty quickly one of our top trade chips. The guy has been to four cup finals, won twice, and was a core part of those teams. Maybe the Devils have to retain salary or take back salary, but GMs will want that guy on their team - even in 4-5 years.

I appreciate that Fitz took a swing here even if this deal feels riskier than necessary to me. I would have been happy with Nino - he’ll likely cost less in $$ and term. But maybe Palat pans out? Worst case, the deal likely won’t hurt that bad.
Their projections are based on historical data as they have said. In general, I think even they’ve noted that teams tend to overpay players of Palat’s age and experience. So yes the Devils did pay the market rate, but in reality, Palat’s contract should be well under that.

Personally, I think it’s a year too long or a million to high on the AAV. But Palat is really needed on this team so I’m ok with Fitzgerald overpaying and outbidding other teams to fill a need.
 

glenwo2

JESPER BRATWURST
Oct 18, 2008
52,563
25,125
New Jersey(No Fanz!)
This person clearly either doesn't understand hockey or doesn't watch it at all. What an annoying troll.
*checks and sees @Blackjack has been around since 2003*

Yeah..he clearly only posts here without either understanding hockey or not watching. :skeptic:

Come on now...there's no need for this.

(and yes, this was a response to a post yesterday but I just saw it now as I was catching up)
 
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hidek91

Registered User
Jan 13, 2014
1,823
1,471
Warsaw, PL
I’m not clear on why people are SO upset with this deal. Evolving Hockey is normally pretty good on salary projections, and they were basically dead on with Palat’s contract.

I’m not a huge fan of this deal: feels like we bought a really nice dining table when still need to do work on our kitchen and baths.

Still, this is market rate for Palat.

And, you’re nuts if you think he is untradeable. If the Devils continue to suck, Palat is pretty quickly one of our top trade chips. The guy has been to four cup finals, won twice, and was a core part of those teams. Maybe the Devils have to retain salary or take back salary, but GMs will want that guy on their team - even in 4-5 years.

I appreciate that Fitz took a swing here even if this deal feels riskier than necessary to me. I would have been happy with Nino - he’ll likely cost less in $$ and term. But maybe Palat pans out? Worst case, the deal likely won’t hurt that bad.
I think it was the guy from Evolving Hockey himself who said that their model predicted it correctly but it doesn't mean it's a good deal because the model "learns" based on past UFA signings which mostly turn out to be bad. Yes, the guy said that about Palat signing.

Also disagree that he's going to be "a top trade chip", UFAs become that only if they outperform their contract, not very likely here, he has negative trade value. If you have to retain, add sweetener or take back salary, your asset has a negative trade value.

And I'm not that upset, it's just one mistake, however I'd prefer our management to not make mistakes at all. Ironically, it's interesting that people defending this deal don't use an argument that the point was to send a message to Bratt and others that we're about to next step and to me this would be the only justification of doing this move.

If we buy him out in 2025:

2026: 3.533M dead cap (2.466M savings)
2027: 2.533M dead cap (3.466M savings)
2028: 1.483M dead cap (1.483M penalty)
2029: 1.483M dead cap (1.483M penalty)

If we buy him out in 2026:

2027: 2.7M dead cap (3.3M savings)
2028: 1.65M dead cap (1.65M penalty)

Really not that bad at all.

For reference, Cammalleri's buyout was 1.667M in dead cap for 4 years and Schneider's buyout was 2M in dead cap for 4 years, both with a much lower cap.
You forgot to add that both of which have happened during the rebuild phase, while we were basement team and 2025-2029 is the latter half of Jack Hughes' prime.
 

Rhodes 81

grit those teeth
Nov 22, 2008
16,373
6,380
Atlanta
I don't think we're allowed to talk about that or something to that effect....but...YEAH, IT IS. :D

So about Palat....I think he will help the Devils more than any of us expect, imo.

He might end up causing certain naysayers to eat their words with a side order of humility when all is said and done.
I'm definitely optimistic about Palat.

As a data guy I hate talking about paying for intangibles, but I think he'll be able to help instill a winning culture here in a way that Dougie and PK just couldn't (and that's not a slam on them).

Bringing in Haula and Palat (and to an extent B. Smith), guys that have made deep playoff runs and understand what that takes, I think that's going to be huge.
 

JrFischer54

Registered User
Apr 4, 2017
10,888
4,490
If we buy him out in 2025:

2026: 3.533M dead cap (2.466M savings)
2027: 2.533M dead cap (3.466M savings)
2028: 1.483M dead cap (1.483M penalty)
2029: 1.483M dead cap (1.483M penalty)

If we buy him out in 2026:

2027: 2.7M dead cap (3.3M savings)
2028: 1.65M dead cap (1.65M penalty)

Really not that bad at all.

For reference, Cammalleri's buyout was 1.667M in dead cap for 4 years and Schneider's buyout was 2M in dead cap for 4 years, both with a much lower cap.

why would you buy him out when you can just trade him for a second round pick. also why would we even want to do that when the cap will be bigly higher by year 4 of that deal.
 

bossram

Registered User
Sep 25, 2013
16,689
17,134
Victoria
I’m not clear on why people are SO upset with this deal. Evolving Hockey is normally pretty good on salary projections, and they were basically dead on with Palat’s contract.

I’m not a huge fan of this deal: feels like we bought a really nice dining table when still need to do work on our kitchen and baths.

Still, this is market rate for Palat.

And, you’re nuts if you think he is untradeable. If the Devils continue to suck, Palat is pretty quickly one of our top trade chips. The guy has been to four cup finals, won twice, and was a core part of those teams. Maybe the Devils have to retain salary or take back salary, but GMs will want that guy on their team - even in 4-5 years.

I appreciate that Fitz took a swing here even if this deal feels riskier than necessary to me. I would have been happy with Nino - he’ll likely cost less in $$ and term. But maybe Palat pans out? Worst case, the deal likely won’t hurt that bad.
Market rate doesn't mean it's a good contract. EH had Erik Gudbranson's projected cap hit at $3.6M and I wouldn't have paid that either.
 
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OlfactoryHughes

Registered User
Aug 8, 2007
1,502
471
Northern California
why would you buy him out when you can just trade him for a second round pick. also why would we even want to do that when the cap will be bigly higher by year 4 of that deal.
By year 4 and 5 of this deal I’m praying we’re shopping at the deadline instead of selling. Probably keep him for the playoffs.

We have plenty of cap, and it’s not our money, so I really don’t see why anyone is stressing over this contract.

Meanwhile, we are tougher to play against, better in net and behind the bench, annnnd financially flexible enough to re-sign all our guys, and still add if need be. Celebrate devil fans, this is what we needed from this off-season.
 
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JrFischer54

Registered User
Apr 4, 2017
10,888
4,490
By year 4 and 5 of this deal I’m praying we’re shopping at the deadline instead of selling. Probably keep him for the playoffs.

We have plenty of cap, and it’s not our money, so I really don’t see why anyone is stressing over this contract.

Meanwhile, we are tougher to play against, better in net and behind the bench, annnnd financially flexible enough to re-sign all our guys, and still add if need be. Celebrate devil fans, this is what we needed from this off-season.

i dont know why either but its a bunch of posters i personally haven't noticed around here who came out of the woodwork and blasting the deal. is it a year too long and a million too much sure but who cares its not my money the team has money and space and they aren't going to need it in the next few years anyway. go out get some top line talent
 

tailfins

Registered User
Sponsor
Apr 20, 2005
2,794
1,791
...the point was to send a message to Bratt and others that we're about to next step...
I think this is right.

Though, I also think that Palat (and Haula to a lesser extent) change the room a bit. IMO, Fitz needs to see losing 12 of the last 15 (including OTL as losses) as unacceptable. Bringing in Palat (and Haula) should help by raising the level of what's acceptable.

Putting the veteran leadership burden all on Dougie and Severson probably wasn't fair.

I think Palat will really help hold people accountable.
 

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