OT: Washington Football Team: 2021 Training Camp and Preseason

[kicksavedave]

Well, I would prefer everyone get vaccinated... lol

But I think at this point, you are not going to get people who are already dug in by shaming them. Shaming them will only lead them to dig in more. I understood your point about that when you made it awhile back.

So if those that would rather not vaccinate are willing to take that risk, then the team has to take that risk.

But if we happen to lose out on a playoff berth because of forfeiture of games. Well, that's entirely on those players. And I hope they are ready for that.

I think the NFL is making a costly mistake by setting this "balancing act protocol". They will lose some games, which means revenue, which will impact players, fans, owners, sponsors, everyone involved. Plenty of other companies are making this mandatory as condition of employment, the NFL could too, but they are always political cowards. They are much better off losing a handful of stubborn players than losing even a single game because of those stubborn players. At least by making it mandatory the only one's who get punished are the ones who refuse to care about their teammates, fans or anyone other than themselves.

 

[kicksavedave]

That's the thing. If vaccinated players and staff are worried or are tired of wearing masks they can talk to their peers and co-workers about it. But it can't come as an order or directive from above. It has to come from within.

It can come from an order from above. Players have the RIGHT to not get vaccinated. They don't have the RIGHT to play in the NFL.

 

[g00n]

That's the thing. If vaccinated players and staff are worried or are tired of wearing masks they can talk to their peers and co-workers about it. But it can't come as an order or directive from above. It has to come from within.

Why? Football teams are not democracies. We can talk about locker room leaders but every coach I've been around or studied retains final authority and sets the rules on the most important items.

 

[g00n]

Like the meme says "I don't know how to convince you to care about other people".

He has me on ignore so he probably didn't see the meme.

 

[tenken00]

It can come from an order from above. Players have the RIGHT to not get vaccinated. They don't have the RIGHT to play in the NFL.

Of course, but an individual's health is a complicated thing even legal-wise for a sports league.

For example, the whole Eichel situation. The team has the right to order Eichel to get a particular surgery, but that's the one he doesn't want. Is it really moral to force that decision on him? Especially when it affects his health?

I understand there are differences in the two situations, but I'm just pointing out the moral ambiguity of forcing players to do something in health related matters.

 

[kicksavedave]

Of course, but an individual's health is a complicated thing even legal-wise for a sports league.

For example, the whole Eichel situation. The team has the right to order Eichel to get a particular surgery, but that's the one he doesn't want. Is it really moral to force that decision on him? Especially when it affects his health?

I understand there are differences in the two situations, but I'm just pointing out the moral ambiguity of forcing players to do something in health related matters.

Well it may be semantics, but the team does not have the right to order the player to get surgery. Their only real consequence if he doesn't, is to release him, I'd bet there is arbitration and some level of detail in the CBA, but the player doesn't have to get the surgery if he doesn't want to. Same with the NFL. They can't force players to get vaccinated. But they can prohibit them from working in their facilities, teams can release players for any reason. At some point employers have a responsibility to protect the health of their employees from those who put them all at risk.

 

[Jacoby4HOF66]

Well, I would prefer everyone get vaccinated... lol

But I think at this point, you are not going to get people who are already dug in by shaming them. Shaming them will only lead them to dig in more. I understood your point about that when you made it awhile back.

So if those that would rather not vaccinate are willing to take that risk, then the team has to take that risk.

But if we happen to lose out on a playoff berth because of forfeiture of games. Well, that's entirely on those players. And I hope they are ready for that.

I would prefer people get vaccinated as well but as you said those that haven’t probably aren’t and shaming them only makes them dig in their heals.

For those of us that are vaccinated, live your life and worry about yourselves. Enough of this lynch mob mentality.

 

[g00n]

I would prefer people get vaccinated as well but as you said those that haven’t probably aren’t and shaming them only makes them dig in their heals.

For those of us that are vaccinated, live your life and worry about yourselves. Enough of this lynch mob mentality.

How about you take your own advice and not tell everyone else how to act?

 

[Jacoby4HOF66]

I think the NFL is making a costly mistake by setting this "balancing act protocol". They will lose some games, which means revenue, which will impact players, fans, owners, sponsors, everyone involved. Plenty of other companies are making this mandatory as condition of employment, the NFL could too, but they are always political cowards. They are much better off losing a handful of stubborn players than losing even a single game because of those stubborn players. At least by making it mandatory the only one's who get punished are the ones who refuse to care about their teammates, fans or anyone other than themselves.

The NFL has the NFLPA to deal with in regards to mandating the vaccine. And just like other unions clearly the NFLPA is against mandating the vaccine.

 

[g00n]

The NFL has the NFLPA to deal with in regards to mandating the vaccine. And just like other unions clearly the NFLPA is against mandating the vaccine.

See, that isn’t talked about much in the news. Just about every union is against vaccine mandates but for some reason no one in the media or politics are shaming them. I wonder why?

Or, maybe you're living in a bubble and you don't realize this topic IS being discussed:

More companies are requiring vaccines for workers, but some unions could slow the effort down - CNN

The Madness of Teachers Unions Opposing a Vaccine Mandate

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2021/07/29/unions-shouldnt-stand-way-vaccine-mandates/

Unions divided over healthcare worker vaccine mandates


It's hilarious that you pretend we have no idea where you're coming from on this.

 

[tenken00]

Well it may be semantics, but the team does not have the right to order the player to get surgery. Their only real consequence if he doesn't, is to release him, I'd bet there is arbitration and some level of detail in the CBA, but the player doesn't have to get the surgery if he doesn't want to. Same with the NFL. They can't force players to get vaccinated. But they can prohibit them from working in their facilities, teams can release players for any reason. At some point employers have a responsibility to protect the health of their employees from those who put them all at risk.

I would prefer people get vaccinated as well but as you said those that haven’t probably aren’t and shaming them only makes them dig in their heals.

For those of us that are vaccinated, live your life and worry about yourselves. Enough of this lynch mob mentality.

All true. I don't know myself. I'm just trying to think of the best possible solution. Because people are people. All people, if that makes sense.

 

[kicksavedave]

All true. I don't know myself. I'm just trying to think of the best possible solution. Because people are people. All people, if that makes sense.

Well, people are people, but when it comes to this issue it seems people divide on one of two sides: Those that care only about themselves (my rights, my feelings, my choice) and those that care about other people (willing to make sacrifices to protect other people they don't know). This is how I see it, and in that light there is only one "best solution".

[MOD]

 

[tenken00]

Well, people are people, but when it comes to this issue it seems people divide on one of two sides: Those that care only about themselves (my rights, my feelings, my choice) and those that care about other people (willing to make sacrifices to protect other people they don't know). This is how I see it, and in that light there is only one "best solution".

The real work isn't "finding" the "best solution", but always getting people to buy in on the best solution. And shaming doesn't solve that problem unfortunately lol..

Gotta unite people. That's the toughie.

 

[CapitalsCupReality]

I agree, stop the shaming….just shit-can them all.

 

[AlexBrovechkin8]

Can we please just talk about football now, everyone has made their respective points.

 

[Ridley Simon]

Exactly. It’s mind your own ****ing business time.

Do we have to do this again?

 

[Ajax1995]

Can we please just talk about football now, everyone has made their respective points.

And with so much context and nuance. Well done all, Twitter and Facebook would be proud…

 

[Jacoby4HOF66]

 

[Jacoby4HOF66]

I wish.

 

[Calicaps]

Lynch mobs murdered people for being Black. They had picnics under dead bodies.

Insisting that people either not be selfish to the point of putting their neighbors and colleagues at mortal risk or be isolated and ostracized in order to keep the rest of us safe is not anything approximating a lynch mob.

Nor by the way is it anything approaching a concentration camp. Those are places where my grandparents’ entire families were gassed to death.

Please to be f***ing off with that kind of hyperbole.

 

[g00n]

Sheer madness.

 

[Jacoby4HOF66]

Lynch mobs murdered people for being Black. They had picnics under dead bodies.

Insisting that people either not be selfish to the point of putting their neighbors and colleagues at mortal risk or be isolated and ostracized in order to keep the rest of us safe is not anything approximating a lynch mob.

Nor by the way is it anything approaching a concentration camp. Those are places where my grandparents’ entire families were gassed to death.

Please to be f***ing off with that kind of hyperbole.

I was thinking more of the Wyatt Earp type lynch mob but, as the kids say, you do you.



Easy to imagine this being a mob of COVID nutters coming for the unvaccinated.

 

[Jacoby4HOF66]

 

[g00n]

I was thinking more of the Wyatt Earp type lynch mob but, as the kids say, you do you.



Easy to imagine this being a mob of COVID nutters coming for the unvaccinated.

Wow.

 

[Jacoby4HOF66]

That’s to bad.