Tyler Ennis Contract Thread

[JLewyB]

Why wasn't this playoff stuff talked about with Hodgson? He doesn't necessarily seem like a guy who can handle a tougher and faster game. I'm beginning to think I drank the Coho Cool-aid. Are we not watching this year's games to make a decision? It's sad to say, but Ennis is by far the tougher and faster player out of the two. Coho has been injured more since he's been on the team as well.

Why don't we acknowledge that because we gave Coho a long term deal then committing that long to a guy with similar amount of question marks is not a good idea. If the Ennis camp wants a long term deal then stonewall until he gives in or goes to arbitration.

 

[wunderpanda]

I think you are asking people to stop thinking entirely

Can't stop what hasn't started yet apparently.

Not my problem if people are unaccustomed, unable, unwilling to put aside personal bias, or incapable of comprehending that I can.

 

[Push Dr Tracksuit]

Why wasn't this playoff stuff talked about with Hodgson? He doesn't necessarily seem like a guy who can handle a tougher and faster game. I'm beginning to think I drank the Coho Cool-aid. Are we not watching this year's games to make a decision? It's sad to say, but Ennis is by far the tougher and faster player out of the two. Coho has been injured more since he's been on the team as well.

Why don't we acknowledge that because we gave Coho a long term deal then committing that long to a guy with similar amount of question marks is not a good idea. If the Ennis camp wants a long term deal then stonewall until he gives in or goes to arbitration.

according to TSN since 2011 Hodgson has missed 10 games due to injury [2013/12/17 Missed 2 games (lower body injury), 2014/01/11 Missed 8 games (finger injury)] and Ennis has missed 35 games due to injury [(2011/12/02 Missed 17 games (sprained ankle), 2012/01/31 Missed 17 games (left ankle injury), 2013/03/16 Missed 1 game (head injury)]

Ennis is obviously faster, if you are just realizing this now I dont know what to tell you, I dont know what your arbitrary 'tougher' includes but outside of a back injury when he was 19(?) he's been healthier than Ennis, including an 83 game season the year we acquired him

theyre 2 players that put up the same numbers, Ennis does it with speed and agility, Hodgson does it with brains and muscle which style do you prefer? neither one is a game changing player, if Im gonna chose between 2 players who put up the same stats I'll take the one thats 3 inches taller and 40lbs heavier, ideally we get better than both

 

[bluengold72]

theyre 2 players that put up the same numbers, Ennis does it with speed and agility, Hodgson does it with brains and muscle which style do you prefer? neither one is a game changing player, if Im gonna chose between 2 players who put up the same stats I'll take the one thats 3 inches taller and 40lbs heavier, ideally we get better than both

i take the skater 100% of the time especially when the bigger guy plays softer than the small guy.

 

[stokes84]

according to TSN since 2011 Hodgson has missed 10 games due to injury [2013/12/17 Missed 2 games (lower body injury), 2014/01/11 Missed 8 games (finger injury)] and Ennis has missed 35 games due to injury [(2011/12/02 Missed 17 games (sprained ankle), 2012/01/31 Missed 17 games (left ankle injury), 2013/03/16 Missed 1 game (head injury)]

Ennis is obviously faster, if you are just realizing this now I dont know what to tell you, I dont know what your arbitrary 'tougher' includes but outside of a back injury when he was 19(?) he's been healthier than Ennis, including an 83 game season the year we acquired him

theyre 2 players that put up the same numbers, Ennis does it with speed and agility, Hodgson does it with brains and muscle which style do you prefer? neither one is a game changing player, if Im gonna chose between 2 players who put up the same stats I'll take the one thats 3 inches taller and 40lbs heavier, ideally we get better than both

Health doesn't necessarily = toughness. I think he was referring to play style - compete level, going into dirty areas, playing with that grit Nolan talks about. In these areas, Ennis is a far tougher player than CoHo.

 

[Push Dr Tracksuit]

i take the skater 100% of the time especially when the bigger guy plays softer than the small guy.

doesnt seam to matter how they play, same numbers, they both arent good enough

enjoy the Ennis/Hodgson, its like asking paper or plastic

 

[joshjull]

I still don't understand why its turned into an either or discussion when it comes to Ennis and Hodgson. The idea that one has to go for the other to stay is daft to me.

 

[Karate Johnson*]

I still don't understand why its turned into an either or discussion when it comes to Ennis and Hodgson. The idea that one has to go for the other to stay is daft to me.

You didn't hear?

They are mortal enemies.

 

[joshjull]

You didn't hear?

They are mortal enemies.

I didn't know that. I can see now why one has to go.

 

[joshjull]

Getting back to Ennis' contract.

I'd like to see him re-signed for 3 years at roughly 4mil per. I don't see Murray giving him a long term deal a la Hodgson.

 

[BananaSquad]

I still don't understand why its turned into an either or discussion when it comes to Ennis and Hodgson. The idea that one has to go for the other to stay is daft to me.

Agree.

 

[EichHart]

Getting back to Ennis' contract.

I'd like to see him re-signed for 3 years at roughly 4mil per. I don't see Murray giving him a long term deal a la Hodgson.

Sounds about right to me as well. He has been playing much better recently and will be a perfect 2nd line winger that can chip in 50-55 pts a year. We don't have many people on our team or pipeline that can skate as well as Ennis can.

 

[Jame]

Your statement didn't have any qualifications on it. You were proven wrong, and quickly try to downplay his success. How about this qualification - both seasons he was considered a rookie.

So rookie Tyler Ennis played well in the playoffs, but players like him can't succeed. And these are the people who are constantly calling out "agendas". Unbelievable.

Summarized:

" My uncontextualized stats proved you wrong before you called out that you were looking at his performance in a subjective context! Everyone knows you have to announce this qualification at the forefront of any conversation! "

 

[Jame]

Well, I watch NHL tonight nightly, and watch highlights of every game. There are no more "big hits" in the a single playoff game than there is in a single regular season game.

Is playoff Steve Ott any different than regular season Steve Ott? Do his checks and hits get harder in the playoffs than the regular season?

Its a farce that the playoffs are so much more physical than the regular season. The big hits and physical nature are more glorified in the playoffs than the regular season because it means so much more. The playoffs are more competitive than the regular season. You have the best teams putting forth a much more desperate effort.

I don't really know what "big hits" have to do with anything... But alas there is nothing to discuss when we are watching completely different things.

My advice...Watch more games and less highlights

 

[JLewyB]

according to TSN since 2011 Hodgson has missed 10 games due to injury [2013/12/17 Missed 2 games (lower body injury), 2014/01/11 Missed 8 games (finger injury)] and Ennis has missed 35 games due to injury [(2011/12/02 Missed 17 games (sprained ankle), 2012/01/31 Missed 17 games (left ankle injury), 2013/03/16 Missed 1 game (head injury)]

Ennis is obviously faster, if you are just realizing this now I dont know what to tell you, I dont know what your arbitrary 'tougher' includes but outside of a back injury when he was 19(?) he's been healthier than Ennis, including an 83 game season the year we acquired him

theyre 2 players that put up the same numbers, Ennis does it with speed and agility, Hodgson does it with brains and muscle which style do you prefer? neither one is a game changing player, if Im gonna chose between 2 players who put up the same stats I'll take the one thats 3 inches taller and 40lbs heavier, ideally we get better than both

I was including Coho's lockout stint in the AHL as well. He was injured for a bit there as well. But now I think of it, Ennis was injured in Europe(I think). The toughness, as stokes said, I was referring more to style of play. Posters are saying the playoffs intensity level is much higher then the regular season. I would say Ennis's style/play translates better then Coho's. I think it's important to note that because we gave Coho this long-term deal. It's tough to do the same for Ennis which is probably a good thing. But If I was Ennis, I would be looking for something similar.

 

[Jame]

Can't stop what hasn't started yet apparently.

Not my problem if people are unaccustomed, unable, unwilling to put aside personal bias, or incapable of comprehending that I can.

Your entire argument is that the player you don't like, got a contract he didn't deserve, and therefor the player you like should get at least what the guy you don't like got... And you are accusing others of personal bias?

Team Alice in Chains

 

[stokes84]

Your entire argument is that the player you don't like, got a contract he didn't deserve, and therefor the player you like should get at least what the guy you don't like got... And you are accusing others of personal bias?

Team Alice in Chains

It's called a "comparable."

 

[Jame]

It's called a "comparable."

The premise is what YOU think thy should do with him (contract wise).

His argument is being made as if he's Ennis agent, which is to be expected if you have a personal bias.

You don't compare him to a contract you dislike to make your case unless you have an agenda (which everyone agrees he does)

Simple question: Tyler Ennis is RFA this offseason, what do you believe the Sabres should do with him.

 

[Zip15]

Your entire argument is that the player you don't like, got a contract he didn't deserve, and therefor the player you like should get at least what the guy you don't like got... And you are accusing others of personal bias?

Team Alice in Chains

You left out the part where he called the guy who has the contract he wants bought out comparable to the guy he wants to get the same contract.

It's called a "comparable."

As a fan of the Sabres, one should want the players to have reasonable contracts on their merits. One should not want one player to have a certain contract simply because he perceives that player to be an equal of a player he thinks has a bad contract.

If the Sabres gave Hodgson $5.5m last summer, would the same people argue that's what Ennis should get, too?

 

[wunderpanda]

Your entire argument is that the player you don't like, got a contract he didn't deserve, and therefor the player you like should get at least what the guy you don't like got... And you are accusing others of personal bias?

Team Alice in Chains

Actually, no, you really aren't understanding this.

 

[wunderpanda]

You left out the part where he called the guy who has the contract he wants bought out comparable to the guy he wants to get the same contract.

Do you really need me to continue to explain this? By putting aside my bias, I am ceding the Hodgson deal is appropriate, what the majority opinion seems to be. Therefre citing said player as a cmparable isn't some confusing, confounding twist or insurmountable narrative you seem to be looking for.

As a fan of the Sabres, one should want the players to have reasonable contracts on their merits. One should not want one player to have a certain contract simply because he perceives that player to be an equal of a player he thinks has a bad contract.

If the Sabres gave Hodgson $5.5m last summer, would the same people argue that's what Ennis should get, too?

Again, if my bias is that the contract is bad, removing my bias also invalidates your perception of my statement. Is this getting through to you yet? As for the merits of the contract, they are comparable players, so are Gagner and Henrique, salary between 4 and 5 million for a 24 year old, 40 point centre.

It is convenient that everyone fails to mention I advocated for a shorter term on Ennis deal with the same salary.

 

[enthusiast]

I see where wunderpanda is coming from

I think Y, Majority thinks X regarding case 1. X occurs.

I cede X in order to gauge case 2.

 

[wunderpanda]

I see where wunderpanda is coming from

I think Y, Majority thinks X regarding case 1. X occurs.

I cede X in order to gauge case 2.

Thank you

 

[jBuds]

Getting back to Ennis' contract.

I'd like to see him re-signed for 3 years at roughly 4mil per. I don't see Murray giving him a long term deal a la Hodgson.

Too high for me, and if our situation didn't call for us to spend money to stay around the floor, I'd rather us have parted ways with him.

That said, I think we can afford to pay him for three more years and see what he can mature into.

I've said it before, and it bears repeating: Ennis and Stafford remind me of bad times, and taste of failure. I would prefer that we moved on from both of them.

 

[Push Dr Tracksuit]

I see where wunderpanda is coming from

I think Y, Majority thinks X regarding case 1. X occurs.

I cede X in order to gauge case 2.

You should stick to your beliefs instead abandoning them. You could be using this opportunity to show how Ennis and Hodgson are similar players and since Ennis doesn't deserve more money Hodgson didn't either. But instead it's "my favorite player deserves more money, see I'm not biased." Hodgson got a bad contract but Ennis is similar so he should get the same contract is the stupid reasoning I've seen on the forums.