Value of: Trevor Zegras this offseason

[Habs Halifax]

The context is

Zegras isn’t a pv player, speculation but not factual

Zegras wasn’t a pv pick, and since drysdale was moved people want to think zegras is next

Ducks have 4 top 6 centers potentially in carlsson zegras mctavish gauthier, plus maybe another this year…. So it’s a move form a posistion of strength potentially.

Contract negotiations and hold out…. pV wanted to send a msg that you are going to need to earn your money as a RFA…. And set the tone of his negotiations going forward(with a lot of young players signing in the next couple years)

If you trade Zegras, you are looking for a D? I'm assuming so

 

[FiveTacos]

Zegras is not trending well but he still got value.

It came out he was playing hurt earlier this year. Outside of that 12 games he was pretty much as good as usual offensively, and improved defensively.

The consensus among Ducks fans seemed to be that his return had him playing the best hockey of his career, and he finished with 8 in his last 8. So in that regard he's trending up.

 

[Zegs2sendhelp]

There is no way to spin this, Zegras's trade value today is not the same as it was last year at this date. Context/excuses can be talked about yes. It's fair to assume a rebound and it happens but it doesn't always happen 100%. He's a skilled young forward no doubt.

However, at the end of the day, it's the Ducks who decide on his value and if they trade him or not. It's not like he is a pending UFA or something like that.

Maybe the Ducks/Habs circle back after a year of more evaluation on Zegras and the Habs youth we might trade. It's an interesting case and the Zegras trade talks won't go away (like or not)

Oh I don’t mind fantasy talk about zegras as long as it’s in the realm of possibility…. Generally people think you are getting a bargain bin price

 

[Habs Halifax]

It came out he was playing hurt earlier this year. Outside of that 12 games he was pretty much as good as usual offensively, and improved defensively.

The consensus among Ducks fans seemed to be that his return had him playing the best hockey of his career, and he finished with 8 in his last 8. So in that regard he's trending up.

I just wonder how other fan bases would attack that comment if the Habs said it about one of our players in a similar situation. You know there is truth to that.

Anyways, I am a Zegras fan. Hopefully he stays and does well for the Ducks. If traded, I'm very curious to see the return (from the Habs or any other team).

 

[Zegs2sendhelp]

If you trade Zegras, you are looking for a D? I'm assuming so

Idk… trading zegras does create a hole….

I’d say our needs are, so prob safe to assume these pieces would be the on top of the wish list

Rhd, rw top 6 forward

But I think they’d need to be pretty high end to get any traction, and there is a good chance we get a RHD at the draft. And right handed shot forwards we can prob just trade lesser pieces for

 

[Fatass]

Is Zegras’s value about what the Habs paid for Dach?

 

[bud12]

Is Zegras’s value about what the Habs paid for Dach?

It's more imo

 

[Zegs2sendhelp]

Is Zegras’s value about what the Habs paid for Dach?

Dach had less points in his career than zegras average at the time of the trade…. And dach has no where near the upside of zegras.

I’d say zegras Is much more

 

[Zegs2sendhelp]

I just wonder how other fan bases would attack that comment if the Habs said it about one of our players in a similar situation. You know there is truth to that.

Anyways, I am a Zegras fan. Hopefully he stays and does well for the Ducks. If traded, I'm very curious to see the return (from the Habs or any other team).

A lot of the reports and misinformation is coming from habs fans / podcasts to be fair

Pv said he wants to start pushing for playoffs as soon as this year, and that the spots he’s like to improve are

Top 4 rhd
Top 6 forward (pref right handed /rw)
Penalty killers

We have a lot of cap space , plus RFA/prospects and picks we can use to fill those spots. So I don’t really see the point in moving zegras unless the piece coming back is a top tier piece and zegras is part of a package to get that guy.

Zegras is the heart of the team, he has his flaws but he’s working on them. Team is much better when he’s in the line up

 

[FiveTacos]

I just wonder how other fan bases would attack that comment if the Habs said it about one of our players in a similar situation. You know there is truth to that.

I accept that 11 games healthy is a small sample size, so fair enough. However the "trending down" crowd seems to think playing injured for 12 games is NOT too small a sample size to draw conclusions.

Pick one or the other ... Either the two sets are too small so we throw out the whole season in terms of positive or negative, or the sets are significant and thus we'd conclude he was better than ever when healthy but did not produce well while hurt.

I don't believe it's wrong to dismiss games where a guy plays hurt as long as we acknowledge the truth of it (ie that he didn't produce much during that time). But it would be intellectually dishonest to cry small sample size for the 11 games fully healthy but claim he's trending down because of 12 games playing hurt and acting like he was 100% then. Hell at least give him credit for toughing out an injury that sidelined Couture completely.

 

[Zegs2sendhelp]

I accept that 11 games healthy is a small sample size, so fair enough. However the "trending down" crowd seems to think playing injured for 12 games is NOT too small a sample size to draw conclusions.

Pick one or the other ... Either the two sets are too small so we throw out the whole season in terms of positive or negative, or the sets are significant and thus we'd conclude he was better than ever when healthy but did not produce well while hurt.

I don't believe it's wrong to dismiss games where a guy plays hurt as long as we acknowledge the truth of it (ie that he didn't produce much during that time). But it would be intellectually dishonest to cry small sample size for the 11 games fully healthy but claim he's trending down because of 12 games playing hurt and acting like he was 100% then. Hell at least give him credit for toughing out an injury that sidelined Couture completely.

Yep they can frame the first 12 games and say he sucks, but we can’t frame the most recent 11 game stretch and say he’s fine

 

[Gliff]

I just wonder how other fan bases would attack that comment if the Habs said it about one of our players in a similar situation. You know there is truth to that.

Anyways, I am a Zegras fan. Hopefully he stays and does well for the Ducks. If traded, I'm very curious to see the return (from the Habs or any other team).

The difference is the Ducks fans are not trying to convince other fan bases that they should pay through the nose. We are trying to explain that the Ducks have no reason to trade him and these reasons that people bring up are generally bullshit. His off ice perception, his coach doesnt like him, he doesnt play defense, he is regressing, its all fabricated bullshit for clicks.

Literally everyone he plays with or for has nothing but good things to say about him.
He played the best 2-way game he has ever played in the NHL this year.
Even early in the year when he was playing hurt, he was still snakebitten and should have been on the scoresheet way more.
He played the best hockey of his career to finish out the season. The onlky time he was healthy all year.

Just please think critically for a second. Have you seen any Ducks fans trying to trade Zegras?

 

[Gliff]

Is Zegras’s value about what the Habs paid for Dach?

Well, Dach was 21 with 69 career points in 3 NHL seasons. Zegras is 23 with a 61 and 65 point season under his belt. Does that sound similar in value?

 

[Kalv]

There is no way to spin this, Zegras's trade value today is not the same as it was last year at this date. Context/excuses can be talked about yes. It's fair to assume a rebound and it happens but it doesn't always happen 100%. He's a skilled young forward no doubt.

However, at the end of the day, it's the Ducks who decide on his value and if they trade him or not. It's not like he is a pending UFA or something like that.

Maybe the Ducks/Habs circle back after a year of more evaluation on Zegras and the Habs youth we might trade. It's an interesting case and the Zegras trade talks won't go away (like or not)

Fair posts from you, thank you for using common sense.

Regarding trade value, here I'd disagree here but maybe I'm also kind of splitting hairs, but to Ducks I'm pretty sure the value has only increased – he's a player we need (high skill) who is fast trending in the direction we need which is be a more complete player, there is little reason to trade him. Is trade value diminshed in the eyes of other teams? Maybe, but the Ducks don't care, I'm pretty sure.

 

[FiveTacos]

Is trade value diminshed in the eyes of other teams? Maybe, but the Ducks don't care, I'm pretty sure.

I think his value to other teams is diminished only in the sense of a team that would have preferred to sign him for 8 years last summer might not like the idea of having to negotiate a potentially higher deal in 2 years. But said team that likes him that much probably also doesn't mind paying him and having him for the next 10 years.

I really doubt his 12 games playing hurt at the start of the season moved the needle on his value at all. If it did, then that GM probably wasn't that interested to begin with, since apparently they think he'll be chronically injured.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Idk… trading zegras does create a hole….

I’d say our needs are, so prob safe to assume these pieces would be the on top of the wish list

Rhd, rw top 6 forward

But I think they’d need to be pretty high end to get any traction, and there is a good chance we get a RHD at the draft. And right handed shot forwards we can prob just trade lesser pieces for

Newhook, Jets 1st, and Barron? Newhook is a left handed shot but he can really play all 3 positions. He had an injury type season as well but still managed to put up 34 pts with 15 goals in 55 games.

 

[Zegs2sendhelp]

Newhook, Jets 1st, and Barron? Newhook is a left handed shot but he can really play all 3 positions. He had an injury type season as well but still managed to put up 34 pts with 15 goals in 55 games.

Again I feel like that’s a scraps offer…. Newhook isn’t much of a need he tops off as a 2nd liner but more likely a 3rd liner.

Barron is a 6-7 stop gap…. And the jets 1st is around the oiler/ducks 2nd we already need.

If zegras is moved it’s to make the team better…. This trade makes us significantly worse and does very little for us going forward

 

[Habs Halifax]

Again I feel like that’s a scraps offer…. Newhook isn’t much of a need he tops off as a 2nd liner but more likely a 3rd liner.

Barron is a 6-7 stop gap…. And the jets 1st is around the oiler/ducks 2nd we already need.

If zegras is moved it’s to make the team better…. This trade makes us significantly worse and does very little for us going forward

Call them crazy but some Habs fans don't have much of a gap between Newhook and Zegras and also declined that trade.

 

[mightyquack]

Call them crazy but some Habs fans don't have much of a gap between Newhook and Zegras and also declined that trade.

They are certainly crazy if they think there isn't much of a gap between Newhook and Zegras.

 

[Kalv]

These trade proposals would work if:

1. We'd actively want to get rid of a player
2. Other teams wouldn't trump that IF #1 was true in the first place

Hence these proposals are trash for Anaheim and wouldn't work in real life. Fans usually think only from their POV in these threads. Can't really blame it, but it is what it is. Some of the fans eventually will get frustrated "boy, why our GM didn't did this or that..." thinking that trades work just like on NHL 23 or easier.

 

[WhatTheDuck]

Call them crazy but some Habs fans don't have much of a gap between Newhook and Zegras and also declined that trade.

They are crazy, Newhook in his "breakout" third year wasn't close to matching Zegras' production as a rookie, and Newhook isn't some amazing defensive beast to close the gap. They aren't on the same level at all.

Besides that it also just makes no sense. If Anaheim is moving Zegras, it's to balance out their future which is heavy on young left shot forwards. They aren't trading Z for a downgraded lefty forward, just to get those spare parts. Zero thought behind it

 

[Essenege]

Dach had less points in his career than zegras average at the time of the trade…. And dach has no where near the upside of zegras.

I’d say zegras Is much more

More? Yes. Much more? No. Dach was also a recent #3 pick with size and skill with a lot of upside.

Zegras has good production but also obvious flaws. There’s a reason he received the most vote from players to the question : « Who is the most overrated player in the league »

 

[Habs Halifax]

They are crazy, Newhook in his "breakout" third year wasn't close to matching Zegras' production as a rookie, and Newhook isn't some amazing defensive beast to close the gap. They aren't on the same level at all.

Besides that it also just makes no sense. If Anaheim is moving Zegras, it's to balance out their future which is heavy on young left shot forwards. They aren't trading Z for a downgraded lefty forward, just to get those spare parts. Zero thought behind it

I would say Newhook is a 60 pts player if he reaches his ceiling and Zegras is 60-80 if he reaches his. There is a gap but the gap will vary depending on what fan you ask

All good. You rather a different return. I get it.

They are certainly crazy if they think there isn't much of a gap between Newhook and Zegras.

See post above. I bet you think Newhook is a 40 or 50 pts forward and Zegras is 80. I would say Zegras has the edge for sure but the gap between them is debatable.

 

[WhatTheDuck]

I would say Newhook is a 60 pts player if he reaches his ceiling and Zegras is 60-80 if he reaches his. There is a gap but the gap will vary depending on what fan you ask

All good. You rather a different return. I get it.



See post above

Zegras already has two 60+ point years and a high of 65, Newhook has yet to eclipse 35 (yes I realize he paced for more). I know I'm not arguing with you here, but those suggesting there isn't a sizable gap in value, are definitely out to lunch. One can become a really useful/high end support player but the other has star potential and has proven way more at the NHL level.

 

[Zegs2sendhelp]

What

More? Yes. Much more? No. Dach was also a recent #3 pick with size and skill with a lot of upside.

Zegras has good production but also obvious flaws. There’s a reason he received the most vote from players to the question : « Who is the most overrated player in the league »

His ppg was half as much as zegras at the time of the trade.

He got a highish pick because he prob wasn’t openly available so Montreal had to make Chicago a deal that was hard to pass up. Was all based around potential tho…. Are we suggesting zegras has little potential or can’t be more than he is already?

The reason he was considered most overrated by players is because it was an easy pick. Due to the type of hype/talk and promotion he gets by the league. And literally guys like Matthew tkachuk, robertson and ovie are in the top 5. You could argue tkachuk and robertson being top 5 wingers in the league… and ovie a top 5 winger of all time

The reasons guy like dach isn’t on this list is because he doesn’t generate any hype…. He doesn’t get any attention league wide.


Every young player has flaws… caufield has flaws…. Does that mean you would consider his value near dach? Maybe Montreal fans should aim at turcotte or even Dylan cozens…. He seems to fit the mold better of what your looking for