Management Travis Green [Head Coach]

[Micklebot]

Why do people absolve Brady of floating defensively and cherry picking for breakaways though?

Like Sanderson, Greig, Pinto and Norris played under DJ, they didn't cheat to put up points.

Literally no one else on the roster did it to the extent Brady did.

Sanderson is a Dman, Norris, Pinto and Greig and Centers, players have different roles in a coaches system, wingers are typically the guys you have jumping the zone to stretch out the D, if the coaches didn't want him doing it, they'd presumably have reeled him in, though with DJ that's hard to say.

 

[BonHoonLayneCornell]

Robertson put up 109 points, outscored his closest teammate by 40 points and somehow you guys think Brady would have done better?

and that's the one you can actually argue.

Robertson obviously peaked a couple years ago and had a hell of a season. I've had a lot of viewings of him, and all I'm saying, is there is not some Grand Canyon sized split between these guys' ability. You can argue for either, legitimately, and at best, I think the differences would be small and more of a matter of preference and team needs. They each bring it and impact the game in different ways. And I do think it matters that the 2 guys mentioned have played for perennial contenders, while the other was on the worst organization in the league over the last 6 or 7 years.

 

[Agent Zuuuub]

Sanderson is a Dman, Norris, Pinto and Greig and Centers, players have different roles in a coaches system, wingers are typically the guys you have jumping the zone to stretch out the D, if the coaches didn't want him doing it, they'd presumably have reeled him in, though with DJ that's hard to say.

And Brady literally did not give a shit about D and evidently winning while doing it, he was chasing points.

Like isn't a player having personal accountability about how they are playing more important than even a coach keeping players accountable?

 

[Loach]

...mate I didn't say your scenario is wrong. Heck I even acknowledged that in another reality where Tkachuk plays on one of those teams, he might become a defensive juggernaut lol

I was saying in general. Not you. Sorry.

 

[Micklebot]

And Brady literally did not give a shit about D and evidently winning while doing it, he was chasing points.

Like isn't a player having personal accountability about how they are playing more important than even a coach keeping players accountable?

I truly have no idea what you are talking about.

 

[BonHoonLayneCornell]

Why do people absolve Brady of floating defensively and cherry picking for breakaways though?

Like Sanderson, Greig, Pinto and Norris played under DJ, they didn't cheat to put up points.

Literally no one else on the roster did it to the extent Brady did. But somehow it was all DJ's fault and Brady was a victim?

I think you exaggerate it, significantly, at least in comparison to the others.

 

[Beech]

I think you exaggerate it, significantly, at least in comparison to the others.

I have to defend him. The Mick and I got into this some 3 years ago.. Brady does not block shots. @Micklebot produced a chart of shots from his side of the ice (defensive zone).. Many!!! And he had few blocks.

I was actually defending Brady. And had to back down.

On this one Zuuub is somewhat accurate.

as for the rest, I am not sure if Brady is better or worse than the others. He brings Physicality and leadership. That may put him above the others.

But again, Zuuub is correct, he is far from being a game breaker/elite/super star, etc.

 

[Agent Zuuuub]

I think you exaggerate it, significantly, at least in comparison to the others.

I don't think so. it was pretty bad, and it was even more crazy because we were a pretty bad defensive team and Brady stood out even on that.

And if it was the system to cherry pick and blow the zone early and to not backcheck why weren't DBC, Giroux, and Batherson playing like that?

 

[Loach]

I don't think so. it was pretty bad, and it was even more crazy because we were a pretty bad defensive team and Brady stood out even on that.

And if it was the system to cherry pick and blow the zone early and to not backcheck why weren't DBC, Giroux, and Batherson playing like that?

DBC...lol. Call it a day bro

 

[BonHoonLayneCornell]

I have to defend him. The Mick and I got into this some 3 years ago.. Brady does not block shots. @Micklebot produced a chart of shots from his side of the ice (defensive zone).. Many!!! And he had few blocks.

I was actually defending Brady. And had to back down.

On this one Zuuub is somewhat accurate.

as for the rest, I am not sure if Brady is better or worse than the others. He brings Physicality and leadership. That may put him above the others.

But again, Zuuub is correct, he is far from being a game breaker/elite/super star, etc.

Was there more data than blocked shots? That seems like a narrow view to assess ones defensive ability. I'd be interested if someone can display this clearly through some form of advanced stats.

He is not their best defensive player by any means, but this narrative that he's mailing it in and blowing coverage at a rate far and above every one of his teammates is not something I agree with.

I don't think so. it was pretty bad, and it was even more crazy because we were a pretty bad defensive team and Brady stood out even on that.

And if it was the system to cherry pick and blow the zone early and to not backcheck why weren't DBC, Giroux, and Batherson playing like that?

I'm going to disagree both on the severity, and how seriously it needs to be considered given the state of the team at these times. I think there were shortcomings sometimes, also displayed by some teammates, including Batherson who you've named, but that the team was a poorly coached train wreck overall as well, and that impacted all of them.

 

[Agent Zuuuub]

I truly have no idea what you are talking about.

What makes Alfredsson, Jordan, Crosby etc such great competitors, leaders, and winners?

Personal accountability.

Not because any coach had to personally hold them accountable. They had higher standards for their own play and effort than even the coach.

So isn't it important for Brady esp as leader to be personally responsible for his defensive play even before the coach has to step in?

 

[Agent Zuuuub]

Was there more data than blocked shots? That seems like a narrow view to assess ones defensive ability. I'd be interested if someone can display this clearly through some form of advanced stats.

He is not their best defensive player by any means, but this narrative that he's mailing it in and blowing coverage at a rate far and above every one of his teammates is not something I agree with.

I'm going to disagree both on the severity, and how seriously it needs to be considered given the state of the team at these times. I think there were shortcomings sometimes, also displayed by some teammates, including Batherson who you've named, but that the team was a poorly coached train wreck overall as well, and that impacted all of them.

I mean his defensive effort is night and day now.

He was mailing it in defensively and blowing coverage, but since Martin/Green and Alfredsson took over its a big big difference. Especially last game. Hopefully it's the standard from now on.

And yea Batherson was absolute trash that year, turnovers and lazy backchecks but he sort of had an excuse. Brady had no excuse to be playing like that, especially with the C.

 

[BonHoonLayneCornell]

I mean his defensive effort is night and day now.

He was mailing it in defensively and blowing coverage, but since Martin/Green and Alfredsson took over its a big big difference. Especially last game. Hopefully it's the standard from now on.

And yea Batherson was absolute trash that year, turnovers and lazy backchecks but he sort of had an excuse. Brady had no excuse to be playing like that, especially with the C.

I think he's had some issues at times, like much of the team has, and is not the strongest defensive player on the team, arguably closer to the bottom than the top, but I still think you're exaggerating the reality with him specifically. I'm open to some advanced numbers that can demonstrate it, but I don't think describing the situation from your perspective is going to be enough to convince me it was a major issue, and I think there was a whole host of defensive and effort issues for the team under DJ.

 

[Micklebot]

What makes Alfredsson, Jordan, Crosby etc such great competitors, leaders, and winners?

Personal accountability.

Not because any coach had to personally hold them accountable. They had higher standards for their own play and effort than even the coach.

So isn't it important for Brady esp as leader to be personally responsible for his defensive play even before the coach has to step in?

The part I have no idea what you are talking about is the factual claims you made that he didn't give a shit and was whining when asked to defend. Those are some pretty bold claims that don't seem to align with how teammates and coaches speak about Brady.

As for the rest, the team very clearly had a strategy to stretch out the D by having wingers jump the zone, Giroux did it, Batherson did it, Tkachuk did it. If the coach doesn't like how he was doing it, their job is to make the adjustments. Even Alfredsson jumped the zone when Sweden invoked the torpedo strategy in the 2002 olympics, players play the system the coach asks them to, and if they don't the coach adjusts.

If the coach is telling him to push the D back, and he doesn't, is that personally responsibility? Is that leadership? He seems to have adapted to how Green wants them playing,

 

[Agent Zuuuub]

The part I have no idea what you are talking about is the factual claims you made that he didn't give a shit and was whining when asked to defend. Those are some pretty bold claims that don't seem to align with how teammates and coaches speak about Brady.

As for the rest, the team very clearly had a strategy to stretch out the D by having wingers jump the zone, Giroux did it, Batherson did it, Tkachuk did it. If the coach doesn't like how he was doing it, their job is to make the adjustments. Even Alfredsson jumped the zone when Sweden invoked the torpedo strategy in the 2002 olympics, players play the system the coach asks them to, and if they don't the coach adjusts.

If the coach is telling him to push the D back, and he doesn't, is that personally responsibility? Is that leadership? He seems to have adapted to how Green wants them playing,

i mean we all saw Brady cherry picking at the blue line and float on the back check. more than any other player, really the only player. when a player does that it's fair to say that they aren't that serious about winning. he had the worst defensive effort on the club.

didn't say anything about whining when asked to defend i mean pretty clear by now that the team was run by the young players who either ignored DJ or DJ catered to them.

big reason why a coach like Green was brought in and why all our additions were veterans and the words used were leadership and accountability.

AKA Brady and friends needed to be put in their place.

 

[JackieDaytona]

Whether or not it’s a direct consequence of coaching, system, buyin, or maturity: Brady’s been more dedicated to playing defense this season than in seasons past. He’s never going to contend for a selke, but it’s great to see him grow his game and defend as part of a 5 man unit.

 

[Micklebot]

i mean we all saw Brady cherry picking at the blue line and float on the back check. more than any other player, really the only player. when a player does that it's fair to say that they aren't that serious about winning. he had the worst defensive effort on the club.

didn't say anything about whining when asked to defend i mean pretty clear by now that the team was run by the young players who either ignored DJ or DJ catered to them.

big reason why a coach like Green was brought in and why all our additions were veterans and the words used were leadership and accountability.

AKA Brady and friends needed to be put in their place.

My bad, I misread winning as whining,

I don't think he cherry picked significantly more than the other wingers, Giroux and Batherson were doing it quite a bit too, it's evident players were told to.

The team has been pretty positive about Brady's leadership, they wanted to give him more support. I don't think you can use adding vets as a criticism of Brady

The team as a whole needed to change, that's a coaching issue, not a single player.