Management Travis Green [Head Coach]

[ijif]

I'm so disappointed. All these years waiting and it starts out with a giant f***ing thud.

I'm even open to the idea that this could work out, but to already see the $'s being a major issue, it tells me they have no chance of ever winning anything. Budget teams don't win, simple as that.

It absolutely sucks that we cannot spend with anyone in the league, but I don’t think that means we cannot win anything. For example, and it is a different sport, but the Rays seem to do alright. Here is Sternberg’s page from MLB.com, might be fitting as we have new owner…

“Principal Owner Stuart Sternberg enters his 20th season with the Tampa Bay Rays. He joined as a general partner of the franchise in 2004 and became its principal owner after the 2005 season. Today, the massive rebranding of the club at the start of 2008 marks two distinct eras of Rays baseball. In the 15 seasons since then, the Rays own the 4th-best record in baseball at 1,267-1,062 (.544) and have made eight trips to the postseason, including four AL East division titles (2021, 2020, 2010, 2008) and two World Series appearances (2020, 2008). During this span, only three clubs (Dodgers, Yankees, Cardinals) have reached the postseason more often than the Rays, and only four (Astros, Dodgers, Giants, Phillies) have competed in more World Series. This success comes after the Devil Rays amassed the majors’ worst record at 645-972 (.399) over the club’s first decade of existence.”

I think in 15-20 years, if Andlauer’s page read like that, we’d all be pretty happy.

 

[Flamingo]

NJ fan here coming in peace. Green was the complete opposite of being fair. A few players got special treatment that no matter what they did wrong, nothing would ever change out of it. He even openly said in an interview that for some players, no matter how many mistakes they make, the minutes or usage won't be changed. Then you had other players who would make 1 mistake and get minutes reduced or benched immediately. There was a period of time when Luke Hughes played like utter trash & Nemec was playing like a true top pairing defender not making a single mistake. We were losing games so to shake things up he decided to bench Nemec for literally no reason. Meanwhile Luke was having a horrible stretch of hockey & he was the one worthy of being benched. Only reason why Nemec got benched in this scenario was because his last name wasn't Hughes. It had nothing to do with his play.

Green said in his press conference that he'd use the carrot or the stick to coach underperforming players, depending on his assessment of what they needed. Earlier in the speech, he'd said players are always held accountable, game in and game out. So he feels that performance/execution problems will all be addressed, but thinks he knows the players' psyche well enough to know when to bench a player, and when to handle him with kid gloves.

IMO, this would fustrate players. What Green thinks looks like transparency and even-handedness will look like favouritism.

 

[PlayOn]

Green said in his press conference that he'd use the carrot or the stick to coach underperforming players, depending on his assessment of what they needed. Earlier in the speech, he'd said players are always held accountable, game in and game out. So he feels that performance/execution problems will all be addressed, but thinks he knows the players' psyche well enough to know when to bench a player, and when to handle him with kid gloves.

IMO, this would fustrate players. What Green thinks looks like transparency and even-handedness will look like favouritism.

I think players can grasp when some of their teammates are struggling with confidence and need a pick me up vs when a guy maybe needs to be brought back down to earth. Sometimes it can apply to the same person, just at different stages of the season.

All coaches should be tailoring their approach, it’s really not a novel concept.

 

[otown]

If any of the Sens players were thinking about taking a few weeks off, they sure aren't now after the Travis Green hire!

 

[Micklebot]

Green said in his press conference that he'd use the carrot or the stick to coach underperforming players, depending on his assessment of what they needed. Earlier in the speech, he'd said players are always held accountable, game in and game out. So he feels that performance/execution problems will all be addressed, but thinks he knows the players' psyche well enough to know when to bench a player, and when to handle him with kid gloves.

IMO, this would fustrate players. What Green thinks looks like transparency and even-handedness will look like favouritism.

I think it would be frustrating if players don't understand expectations and there isn't communication that goes along with the carrot/stick approach.

The reality is you can't treat everyone equally and expect equal results, that's not how people work. You also can't treat guys in different roles the same way, a fourth liner whose job is to grind and defend making a risky play at his blue line to create offense shouldn't be treated in the same way as a top six forward whose job is to create offense, you need to accept some risk from your offensive players. Now, there are non negotiables that apply equally to everyone, but there are also aspects where some players will have more or less leeway.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Really interested to see who the assistants will be, I saw both Gruden and McKee were mentioned on Freidman and Marek's show as possiblies,

I'd like to see Gruden and Alfie

 

[Micklebot]

I'd like to see Gruden and Alfie

I'm reticent about Alfie as a coach since coaches will inevitably get fired... that said, he'd be a great guy to have as part of the staff imo.

 

[HoweHullOrr]

Not too keen on dump and chase, unless it's for a line change. These days, guys have too much puck and skating skills to do that reliably. And it also takes a ton of cardio that can hurt a team in the final period or last few minutes of periods.

I do want to see a more aggressive style of game. Force opponents to move the puck immediately or get hit. Force mistakes. Use what size we have to advantage. Crash the net.

Does anybody have a link to the interview/Podcast/article that mentioned the “dump & chase”? I’d like to listen to or read it. Many thanks.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

I'm reticent about Alfie as a coach since coaches will inevitably get fired... that said, he'd be a great guy to have as part of the staff imo.

I don't think they fire him if it comes to a sweeping coaching change. If the org and Alfie are ok with him filling that position.. I think he'd get a pass and would remain in the org and it would be left up to the new coach again. He could get kicked up stairs in an event like that as well.

 

[Gil Gunderson]

Keefe fired. I think we could have used him.

 

[Flamingo]

I think players can grasp when some of their teammates are struggling with confidence and need a pick me up vs when a guy maybe needs to be brought back down to earth. Sometimes it can apply to the same person, just at different stages of the season.

All coaches should be tailoring their approach, it’s really not a novel concept.

I think it would be frustrating if players don't understand expectations and there isn't communication that goes along with the carrot/stick approach.

The reality is you can't treat everyone equally and expect equal results, that's not how people work. You also can't treat guys in different roles the same way, a fourth liner whose job is to grind and defend making a risky play at his blue line to create offense shouldn't be treated in the same way as a top six forward whose job is to create offense, you need to accept some risk from your offensive players. Now, there are non negotiables that apply equally to everyone, but there are also aspects where some players will have more or less leeway.

Sure, easy to imagine everyone understanding. But it's not always easy for a player or fans to be so clinical about it.

My concern is when that discretion isn't applied so judiciously. I didn't want the end of the Devil's season, but @McDuffz88 's story paints a picutre.

 

[Micklebot]

Sure, easy to imagine everyone understanding. But it's not always easy for a player or fans to be so clinical about it.

My concern is when that discretion isn't applied so judiciously. I didn't want the end of the Devil's season, but @McDuffz88 's story paints a picutre.

The thing is the picture that's important is the one the players are seeing in this case. Did players on the Devils understand why Nemec was treated the way he was, while Hughes was treated the way he was? Did Nemec understand? Fans tend to try to build the puzzle with a third of the pieces, we don't know if Nemec was nursing an injury, or if he was blatantly going against what the coaches were asking him to do, we don't see the conversations they have between games, the tape sessions they do to help identify the gaps, we just see TOI and scratches, and need to put the pieces together.

Did Green handle Nemec and Hughes appropriately? Idk. I don't even think I can know as a fan. Long term results is what would have been the proof one way or another, but we'll never see that now since Green has moved on.

What I do know, is Green has a reputation of being tough but fair, and while perhaps he wasn't that in the case of Nemec, it remains true that he does carry that reputation, and players who have spoken about their experiences seem to have liked playing under him. If that reputation wasn't actually earned, I would hope that it would have come to surface during the hiring process,

 

[HoweHullOrr]

Yeah for sure its just that Sens fans on social media seem to get way to giddy based on a press conference

I am just not a fan of this hire and Green will really have to do some convincing

I think there’s at least some that were throwing out ideas before the press conference happened. If you’ve been reading and following along in here, you would have seen those posts. So, in this case, those posts & posters were not “giddy based on a press conference”.

It's OK to be a little more analytical and dig deeper rather than just looking at a coach’s record, especially if the coaching career at the NHL level is a relatively short one.

I get the skepticism and the emotional reaction. It's understandable given the dismal recent history of the Senators.

And, those digging a little deeper aren’t saying that they expect Green will be successful either. There could be multiple reasons behind the Senators not being successful as well if that were to occur.

I think it's just that some are wary & smart enough to know that things happen for a reason (to quote a cliche) and want to dig a bit deeper and be more analytical about why something happened. To use another cliche: Correlation does not imply causation.

 

[Dan Patrick]

The thing is the picture that's important is the one the players are seeing in this case. Did players on the Devils understand why Nemec was treated the way he was, while Hughes was treated the way he was? Did Nemec understand? Fans tend to try to build the puzzle with a third of the pieces, we don't know if Nemec was nursing an injury, or if he was blatantly going against what the coaches were asking him to do, we don't see the conversations they have between games, the tape sessions they do to help identify the gaps, we just see TOI and scratches, and need to put the pieces together.

Did Green handle Nemec and Hughes appropriately? Idk. I don't even think I can know as a fan. Long term results is what would have been the proof one way or another, but we'll never see that now since Green has moved on.

What I do know, is Green has a reputation of being tough but fair, and while perhaps he wasn't that in the case of Nemec, it remains true that he does carry that reputation, and players who have spoken about their experiences seem to have liked playing under him. If that reputation wasn't actually earned, I would hope that it would have come to surface during the hiring process,

I think Green has a reputation for being tough. I don’t agree that he has a reputation of being fair. I think if anything he has a reputation for picking favourites that have immunity from criticism. Especially on the defence.

We will have to see if that trend continues in Ottawa.

 

[Burrowsaurus]

Mendes with a nice question about New Jersey. Whatever. It is what it is now. Green has to be better than he has been and so do the players

I personally think staios sounds nervous. Dorion sounded nervous too but that’s because he was thinking about the next most batshit crazy thing he could say

 

[Micklebot]

I think Green has a reputation for being tough. I don’t agree that he has a reputation of being fair. I think if anything he has a reputation for picking favourites that have immunity from criticism. Especially on the defence.

We will have to see if that trend continues in Ottawa.

Well, Corrodo who played for him suggested he was firm but fair, Garrioch had an article suggesting that's how he's discussed around the league, so while fans might not think he's fair, I'm not convinced their opinion on whether he is fair is the one that matters.

 

[HoweHullOrr]

In the oft repeated words of Jacques Martin... "no doubt"! Staios shall be judged as much on player/roster moves he is expected to make this summer. Everybody knows his hands were somewhat tied last year. If SS makes no changes with goal tending, for example, there will be hell to pay if that tandem does a rinse, lather and repeat. SS must put his own stamp on this team, and own it, not unlike Green has to do coaching. Decision has been made - live with it. Both will be measured going forward. Not that it wasnt well earned and deserved, but time for there to be far less finger-pointing at the previous regime, organization and fans included. While we can and should demonstrate some patience, it's time to pony up. Personally I take much comfort in the fact that SS has surrounded himself with hockey minds (Martin, Alfie, Poulin) and respect that he's smart enough to seek input assessing options and moves.

If he rolls out the same 2 f***ing turds on opening night, I might just lose my mind. Guaranteed failure imo. We've seen enough.

There’s still a few constraints that Staois will have to deal with though. The first one is the salary cap. There’s less space for moves than some imagine even if they move a player like Chychrun for example.

Another reality is that there is limited amount of players available and there will be other teams with similar needs to the Senators vying for those same players as well. As it so happens, two of the highest demand with limited supply type positions happen to be RDs and goaltenders which are our 2 biggest needs.

Even if he moves Forsberg, or buys-out the Korpse, he’s going to have to fill that vacated position. We hope for a significant upgrade but it's also possible we get a much more modest upgrade given the supply/demand continuum. That’s why I think improving our team D is going to be imperative no matter what happens in the way of roster additions/subtractions if we have any hope at something more than a marginal improvement. I get that people don’t want to hear that idea or message though.

 

[BondraTime]

Him bringing this team to the playoffs next year is a long shot, at best. I think that’s agreed upon within Sens management.

He’s not going to turn this pumpkin into a carriage, no coach was. There are going to be bumps in the road, as we should expect with the “current” iteration of the team.

 

[Dan Patrick]

Well, Corrodo who played for him suggested he was firm but fair, Garrioch had an article suggesting that's how he's discussed around the league, so while fans might not think he's fair, I'm not convinced their opinion on whether he is fair is the one that matters.

Corrado only played a season and a half under him, in the AHL, a decade ago. I’ve heard more recently from someone connected to the NHL that Green has problems with picking favourites. The story from the NJ fan seems to corroborate what I’ve heard Green has struggles with in the NHL.

Again I’m willing to wait and see but it’s at least a yellow flag.

 

[Gil Gunderson]

Him bringing this team to the playoffs next year is a long shot, at best. I think that’s agreed upon within Sens management.

He’s not going to turn this pumpkin into a carriage, no coach was. There are going to be bumps in the road, as we should expect with the “current” iteration of the team.

There's no reason to believe this roster can't make the playoffs with average goaltending.

That's why I'm so confused by this "Hiring Green means we're still rebuilding" narrative. What are we going to do, rebuild without 1st rounder in one of the following two years?

Also, missing the playoffs before Brady's NMC kicks in pretty much means he's out next year. No way he's ok with this shit while his brother is competing for the Stanley Cup every year.

 

[RickyLafleur]

Keefe fired. I think we could have used him.

They will go after Berube and probably get him.

 

[BondraTime]

There's no reason to believe this roster can't make the playoffs with average goaltending.

That's why I'm so confused by this "Hiring Green means we're still rebuilding" narrative. What are we going to do, rebuild without 1st rounder in one of the following two years?

Also, missing the playoffs before Brady's NMC kicks in pretty much means he's out next year. No way he's ok with this shit while his brother is competing for the Stanley Cup every year.

Well they went through this rebuild giving away a 4th overall, 7th overall, 12th overall and botching a 10th.

Staios and Andlauer told us before the year started that this team wasn’t ready, and had a lot of work to do.

It seems they think it’s a retooling, and another year or two before they get to the point we all want to be.

This rebuild was a complete botch job, we’re witnessing the ramifications.

 

[DueDiligence]

Zero faith in this coach, even if he gave a good press conference today

Mike Babcock said all the right things in Columbus too

Not insinuating that Green and Babcock are similar but coach's will always say the right things in their introductory days

The only slight (very slight) bit of hope I have is that a handful of guys have been way better at their second gig

Peter Deboer, Bruce Cassidy, Mike Sullivan to name some and they are 3 of the best in the business today

Will see I guess but Green has a lot to prove before he wins most of the fans over, I actually don't envy the guy

Funny you would include a guy like Pete Deboer. In his first 7 seasons in the league he missed the playoffs in 5 and was fired part way through in a sixth. I'm sure lots of fans in San Jose had zero faith in him when he got hired there.

 

[DueDiligence]

Keefe fired. I think we could have used him.

Seriously? He had the best goal scorer of the past 10 years on his team, other offensive talent, extra money to put under performers on LTIR and won one playoff round.

 

[PlayOn]

Well they went through this rebuild giving away a 4th overall, 7th overall, 12th overall and botching a 10th.

Staios and Andlauer told us before the year started that this team wasn’t ready, and had a lot of work to do.

It seems they think it’s a retooling, and another year or two before they get to the point we all want to be.

This rebuild was a complete botch job, we’re witnessing the ramifications.

To be fair, Staios also said he didn’t expect the team to be where they were. And Friedman said, albeit earlier in the year, that the Sens intended on trying to get back on track quickly, saying Andlauer paid a lot of money for the team and they want to make the playoffs next year.

Staios won’t outright say it because there are too many question marks with this roster. I think ultimately it’s just smart of him to try and buy himself time with the fans. If he says they want to make playoffs and they don’t, he deals with the backlash. But if he says this is gonna take some time, if we do miss, he can always fall back on “hey, I told you guys this wasn’t a quick fix”.