HF Habs: Trade Proposal Thread #90: 2024-2025 season part III

[tazsub3]

Trading one reclamation project for another is nothing dramatic. Aside from prime assets, we should be willing to shake the deck.

And if both fail at c I much rather have dach on the wing

 

[tazsub3]

I’m not sure why it’s not being used a lot more. It’s not a sine qua non correlation that all contracts should be structured like that since it takes a player willing to defer. I could understand players in very favorable tax jurisdictions not being inclined. It should however be an attractive option to players in a highly taxed location such as ours.

Only reason I responded with it’s allowed is that you alluded to cap circumvention earlier.

I don’t know that it’s not advantageous, it could just be that it was a little used provision that could get more mileage. We’ll see, I guess.

I guess player has to gain from tax saving more then he loses with time value of money and opportunity cost of not having that money so he can invest it .otherwise why would a player do that ?
It’s not a linear equation based only on taxes

 

[Guiness time]

But for one year why care if we have 15 mil in cap space?

Would you rather have the cap space or an overpaid Bennett?

In our current situation, I would do NEITHER!
I rather pay market value for my UFA. Yes, I understand and accept we might have to pay a bit more due to us not being the most desirable place to sign for a number of reasons but I will not significantly overpay for 1 player who is not a game changer, especially if its ONLY for 1 or 2 years. What is the point???
As well, what does this say to all of your other UFAs and RFAs? You show that you are willing to overpay for UFAs but will not pay your home grown talent? Seems like a recipe for disaster.
If I have cap space and no one worth while to sign, well, I rather look for similar deals like the Laine or Monahan trade. The only reason we got them is that we had cap space.
If we approach contender status, I completely understand being a bit more aggressive, but I do not see why we would do this at this stage of our rebuild.

 

[Scriptor]

There are other ways to make the tax situation more advantageous to players playing in Montreal. Laurent Duvernay-tardif's agent had gone over the question to debunk those claiming that radulov was taking more money home after taxes while playing in Dallas compared top playing in Montreal with the same salary as a correlation.

Using the provisions of both tax laws, a structured deal based on Bonus-laden contracts was more advantageous for a player in. Montreal than other avenues for structured deals in Dallas.

Bonus-laden contracts ere also lockout-proof, with players needing to be paid under those situations regardless of anything.

The bulk of the contracts were also paid up front prior to the start of the season and the bulk of the capital could be invested immediately, rather than waiting to receive the pay in increments over the season.

To structure a favourable contract that rivals other jurisdictions in terms of taxes paid, the team in Montreal needs to be willing to fork over the money before the player earns it over a season.

It only makes sense that you would want to limit those types of contracts because it increases the cost of doing business, so players that are not franchise or core players shouldn't expect that kind of treatment.

 

[Hockeyfan200]

Who would the wind want?
Evans, Arima
Savard

The wild literally have less than zzero need for any 4 wing, or 3c /4c. They have no room. Freddy G whose being paid alot of money is there 3c. Russian stud is theitr 4c. they aren't trading for bottom line C. or 4 wing. They are going after Brock Nelson. They also don't need D. they are stacked in d

I would think Kent wants a prospect that is close to NHL ready or already in the NHL. The Wild are loaded there.

Montreal doesn't have anything wild need or want. They are going after Brock Nelson and Brock Boeser.

 

[Deus ex machina]

I’m not sure why it’s not being used a lot more. It’s not a sine qua non correlation that all contracts should be structured like that since it takes a player willing to defer. I could understand players in very favorable tax jurisdictions not being inclined. It should however be an attractive option to players in a highly taxed location such as ours.

Only reason I responded with it’s allowed is that you alluded to cap circumvention earlier.

I don’t know that it’s not advantageous, it could just be that it was a little used provision that could get more mileage. We’ll see, I guess.

Just to be clear, all my comments are referring to your ''1.5M in deferred money = 1.5M saved on the cap'' theory in your Jake Evans contract offer, which i highlighted.
I was just saying that IF that were true, it would be cap circumvention and teams would take advantage of it.

But it's not and i understand it's perfectly legal the way it's actually used and that Habs could make use of it too.

 

[Kobe Armstrong]

In our current situation, I would do NEITHER!
I rather pay market value for my UFA. Yes, I understand and accept we might have to pay a bit more due to us not being the most desirable place to sign for a number of reasons but I will not significantly overpay for 1 player who is not a game changer, especially if its ONLY for 1 or 2 years. What is the point???
As well, what does this say to all of your other UFAs and RFAs? You show that you are willing to overpay for UFAs but will not pay your home grown talent? Seems like a recipe for disaster.
If I have cap space and no one worth while to sign, well, I rather look for similar deals like the Laine or Monahan trade. The only reason we got them is that we had cap space.
If we approach contender status, I completely understand being a bit more aggressive, but I do not see why we would do this at this stage of our rebuild.

Cap space isn’t valuable anymore is the point, every team will have the cap space to keep their players for the next 3 years

 

[Boss Man Hughes]

Cap space isn’t valuable anymore is the point, every team will have the cap space to keep their players for the next 3 years

It's still smart to sign players to reasonable deals and be able to ice a team with 9 scoring line forwards for example and be able to keep a contending team together for years.

 

[salbutera]

There are other ways to make the tax situation more advantageous to players playing in Montreal. Laurent Duvernay-tardif's agent had gone over the question to debunk those claiming that radulov was taking more money home after taxes while playing in Dallas compared top playing in Montreal with the same salary as a correlation.

Using the provisions of both tax laws, a structured deal based on Bonus-laden contracts was more advantageous for a player in. Montreal than other avenues for structured deals in Dallas.

Bonus-laden contracts ere also lockout-proof, with players needing to be paid under those situations regardless of anything.

The bulk of the contracts were also paid up front prior to the start of the season and the bulk of the capital could be invested immediately, rather than waiting to receive the pay in increments over the season.

To structure a favourable contract that rivals other jurisdictions in terms of taxes paid, the team in Montreal needs to be willing to fork over the money before the player earns it over a season.

It only makes sense that you would want to limit those types of contracts because it increases the cost of doing business, so players that are not franchise or core players shouldn't expect that kind of treatment.

Bonus laden contracts are only advantageous for US resident players, as in players who physically reside in the US for 6-months + 1-day unlike Tavares who tried to scam the system by claiming US residency but physically remaining present in Canada for most of the calendar year - which is why Revenue Canada is after him

IRS does not view bonuses as income and taxes at a very low rate, which is about to disappear altogether with pending Trump tax cuts - this is why it was so advantageous for Matthews to sign his last two contracts w a Canadian team. He resides in low tax Arizona + 80% of his present & previous deals were paid in bonus. Same Huberdeau (Ft Lauderdale primary residency)

Bonus structured contracts are also a big reason why Habs have been successful in attracting US resident UFAs - Gionta, Hamrlik (primary residence Fla), Cammy (primary residence Fla), Cole, Petry, Toffoli

 

[HuGort]

If Zegras is available for cheap, say a 2nd, Struble, and Mesar, is he worth taking a Flyer on?

Probably no, you'll regret it and be stuck with another unmovable contract. he's another Laine

 

[Kobe Armstrong]

It's still smart to sign players to reasonable deals and be able to ice a team with 9 scoring line forwards for example and be able to keep a contending team together for years.

How are we going to achieve that by not signing Bennett as opposed to signing him?

Wouldn’t signing him with the available cap space at a 1 year commitment help us ice a team with 9 scoring line forwards?

 

[Whalers Fan]

How are we going to achieve that by not signing Bennett as opposed to signing him?

Wouldn’t signing him with the available cap space at a 1 year commitment help us ice a team with 9 scoring line forwards?

My question is why would Bennett want to sign a one year deal? It's awful risky for him.

 

[Jurivan Demidovsky]

Probably no, you'll regret it and be stuck with another unmovable contract. he's another Laine

Isn't Zegras fast? If he is, it's worth taking him on at a good price, he probably can return to 60+ point form

 

[Kobe Armstrong]

My question is why would Bennett want to sign a one year deal? It's awful risky for him.

He probably wouldn’t, but with the crazy cap increases he could net a significant career earnings increase by signing short term deals with teams with tons of cap space

 

[BigDaddyLurch]

Isn't Zegras fast? If he is, it's worth taking him on at a good price, he probably can return to 60+ point form

...want another Newhook, just with fancier hands??...

 

[ReHabs]

Can we sell anything to Vegas?

 

[HabsWhiteKnightLOL]

Can we sell anything to Vegas?

Price contract , they love LITR dont they

 

[26Mats]

...want another Newhook, just with fancier hands??...

Isn't Newhook's biggest knock his lack of hands?

 

[Egresch]

Isn't Zegras fast? If he is, it's worth taking him on at a good price, he probably can return to 60+ point form

No, he is not.

 

[DAChampion]

That figure indicates that Zegras has better hair than Newhook.

 

[Rapala]

I hope not, too many smurfs ain't good for our health.

Particularly when our non-smurfs are the ones who keep going down.

 

[HuGort]

Isn't Zegras fast? If he is, it's worth taking him on at a good price, he probably can return to 60+ point form

You can't build on those kind of players. Done it over and over with Laine and Dach types. They got a screw loose, it's going to come back and bite ya. No sense bothering with them to start with. All you doing is wasting your caproom.

 

[HuGort]

Can we sell anything to Vegas?

Friedman on his 32 podcast said Knights working on big name player. He mentioned Schenn. They usually get the guy they want.

Montreal on other hand are trying to package Evans with Armia and possibly a draft pick or prospect for big name. That can help them now and in the future.

 

[Rapala]

9M still seems high for Bennett but maybeeee if it’s on a 1 or 2 year deal

Would it really hurt us to pay him 9mil next year if we have the cap space anyways?

Sam Bennett would have to stick out in a very good way in this best on best and then follow it up with a stellar post season to warrant 9M from my point of view. I like Sam but I don't think he does enough to warrant that type of money.

 

[morhilane]

I think people just remember Zegras Michigan goal and don’t actually watch how frustrating he is as a player.

You can say that about most of the players people brings up. It's all about highlights, not so much how they would fill an actual team need.