HF Habs: Trade Proposal Thread #88: 2024 Off-Season Thread

[Habs Halifax]

I just can't see a single player available this UFA season that would improve this club in any tangible way. And I am really not into saddling long term contracts into older players. Look at all the whining that came with all the other long term contracts with under performing players. It just doesn't make sense.

Like realistically speaking, the habs arent a bottom feeder because they have bad depth guys. They are a bottom feeder because they don't have top end depth at the forward and d positions. There was none of that available outside Stamkos.

This roster is doing nothing until the D core reaches prime. We can have a dynamic offense all we want but if the D exposes the goalie, we loose the game.

D core combined with Suzuki/Dach is the key. Then sound goaltending. Doesn't have to be Price but we need someone who stops the easy ones. No soft goals killing team momentum. Once you have this, then that's when you see the true value from Demidov, Caufield, Slaf, etc.

 

[417]

Sure and maybe Ottawa does better if Pinto didn't gamble and Josh Norris doesn't get hurt. Maybe Columbus does better if Laine plays more than 18 games.

A lot of teams can do this.

But they’ve actually had those players on their roster and they still sucked.

The Habs haven’t had any of their identified core players on the roster together, for any significant period of time.

It’s not quite the same situation.

Hope isn't a strategy.

Isn’t thinking that the Habs could sign Stamkos or Marchesseaukt in free agency, just that?

Hope?

lol

 

[Spring in Fialta]

But they’ve actually had those players on their roster and they still sucked.

The Habs haven’t had any of their identified core players on the roster together, for any significant period of time.

It’s not quite the same situation.

Okay, see it this way then: we've also had Suzuki/Caufield/Slaf on the roster and still sucked. Now you can (rightfully) say well, natural progression! Suzuki has improved every single season and we've still been trash.

Can Columbus count of Fantilli taking another big step too? Can Ottawa rely on a Vezina winner giving them better goaltending?

We can do this all day. It's very easy for us to say this because they're our guys and we're familiar with them. But so can other teams.

 

[Miller Time]

Yes, Huberdeau is 6'3 and doesn't play a heavy game. That's why his production dipped in half wgen he went from playing with Barkov to Kadri.

That's very tenuous grounds to draw causal link to.

Much more went into Huberdeau's decline than simply the shift in roster. Plus, IIRC , some posters dug up the linemate time for hubby in Florida and it was far less with Barkov than many presumed.

Slaf, Dach, and Suzuki may be enough in the top 6 to make space for their linemates. At the end of the day time will tell and time will tell whether HuGo see it that way.

Sure. But this also assumes that Newhook will need others to "make space for him" because of his size... I don't share that assumption, and can point to several dynamic skating 6' & 5'11 NHLers who create their own space just fine...

In the short term, I'm in favor of signing Skinner to a 1 or 2 year deal. I think he may be a good offensive player for Dach to play with, and then get us a pick at the tdl of his ufa season.

I thought that as well. He's picked a perfect spot to prove that out lol. If he can't get to a playoff game riding shot gun to McD or Drai, he may well be cursed!

 

[Archijerej]

Basu just went hilariously defensive on the precise same points we're discussing here, raised very delicately by Godin.

I don't think I've ever seen him this irritated.

 

[Spring in Fialta]

Basu just went hilariously defensive on the precise same points we're discussing here, raised very delicately by Godin.

I don't think I've ever seen him this irritated.

What happened?

 

[vokiel]

Not sure how credible he is but David Ettedgui reported it yesterday.



They can still talk trade and have something agreed on before he is off the program. No doubt in my mind that they are talking and its not just "thoughts".

There isn't anything to talk about if they can't assess whether he can still play or not. You'd think there would be better usage of their time at this moment. If Laine had been out of the program for the draft, I think it may have been different, but as it stands, I think any "rumor" going out before training camps start is just snake oil.

To see many guys here wanting Laine is a terrifying thought.

The guy is a big floater, negative valued player and got burned out in Win and CLB but somehow would work in MTL? LOL

Havent you guys had enough of reclamation project or negative value player? We’ve had gamble and reclamation project in MTL for 10 f***ing years. About time we break our « bank asset » for a real f***ing player that fits our rebuild moving forwards.

We're not hoping it "works". We're hoping there's enough hockey in him that he can show some productivity and then be valuable for a contender at the Deadline. Same strategy as with Monahan or with Radulov, who also was a headcase according to some here.

 

[417]

Okay, see it this way then: we've also had Suzuki/Caufield/Slaf on the roster and still sucked. Now you can (rightfully) say well, natural progression! Suzuki has improved every single season and we've still been trash.

This line has only been together for about 50 games, prior to that Caufield missed a large portion due to injury and Slafkovsky wasn’t there.

Can Columbus count of Fantilli taking another big step too? Can Ottawa rely on a Vezina winner giving them better goaltending?

Fantilli? Most definitely

Ullmark? Unless the Sens completely change the way they play, I wouldn’t expect a Vezina type of season, no.

We can do this all day. It's very easy for us to say this because they're our guys and we're familiar with them. But so can other teams.

Well if you want to have a conversation about the Sens moves this offseason, I’m more than willing cause I’ve got a lot of thoughts on that lol but we’re talking about the Habs free agency, so that’s my focus.

It doesn’t mean I discount any potential improvements from other teams.

 

[morhilane]

I thought that as well. He's picked a perfect spot to prove that out lol. If he can't get to a playoff game riding shot gun to McD or Drai, he may well be cursed!

Skinner is cursed, Oilers won't make the PO next season.
But Buffalo will.


I'm just thankful he's not in the Habs division anymore, but that's ~10 less points for him.

 

[Spring in Fialta]

This line has only been together for about 50 games, prior to that Caufield missed a large portion due to injury and Slafkovsky wasn’t there.


Fantilli? Most definitely

Ullmark? Unless the Sens completely change the way they play, I wouldn’t expect a Vezina type of season, no.


Well if you want to have a conversation about the Sens moves this offseason, I’m more than willing cause I’ve got a lot of thoughts on that lol but we’re talking about the Habs free agency, so that’s my focus.

It doesn’t mean I discount any potential improvements from other teams.

I don't particularly give a crap about Ottahaha in and of themselves. They're a total trashcan franchise. I'm just trying to illustrate a point. I can go on the forum of every basement team and find the exact same organic improvement expectation of guys doing more than what they've shown previously shown and how that's going to lead to more wins. It will be true for some and not for others.

Who here only had Caufield scoring 28 (and below 20 late in the year) before the start of the season when he got 26 in 46? Like, this shit happens left and right to everyone.

 

[417]

@Spring in Fialta good discussion though, I appreciate your points of view and even agree with some of them to a certain degree.

I think mostly what you’re expressing is frustration at the lack of tangible progress. Which again, I understand.

I just look at it a bit differently, there’s phases to this “rebuild”. I don’t quite think we’re in the “results” phase of said rebuild yet.

 

[Spring in Fialta]

@Spring in Fialta good discussion though, I appreciate your points of view and even agree with some of them to a certain degree.

I think mostly what you’re expressing is frustration at the lack of tangible progress. Which again, I understand.

I just look at it a bit differently, there’s phases to this “rebuild”. I don’t quite think we’re in the “results” phase of said rebuild yet.

Oh no doubt. It's a great discussion and I agree with the conclusion of our viewpoints.

 

[Archijerej]

What happened?

I'm not sure I'm able to put it in English coherently. Listen to the podcast. It's about 20-minute mark.

 

[Spring in Fialta]

I'm not sure I'm able to put it in English coherently. Listen to the podcast. It's about 20-minute mark.

Would you happen to have a link by any chance? I'm not a podcast guy hahaha

 

[Habs Halifax]

There isn't anything to talk about if they can't assess whether he can still play or not. You'd think there would be better usage of their time at this moment. If Laine had been out of the program for the draft, I think it may have been different, but as it stands, I think any "rumor" going out before training camps start is just snake oil.

They are talking no doubt. This is not some nothing type news bud. Might not end up being a trade for us but no doubt in my mind, they are talking.

You don't have to wait for him to be moved off the assistance program. A lot of trades are weeks of chatter sometimes. Saying you shouldn't talk to them until he is off the assistance program is weird. That's reactive management and I think our management is proactive

 

[417]

I don't particularly give a crap about Ottahaha in and of themselves. They're a total trashcan franchise. I'm just trying to illustrate a point. I can go on the forum of every basement team and find the exact same organic improvement expectation of guys doing more than what they've shown previously shown and how that's going to lead to more wins. It will be true for some and not for others.

Who here only had Caufield scoring 28 (and below 20 late in the year) before the start of the season when he got 26 in 46? Like, this shit happens left and right to everyone.

But I’m not quite arguing that…I’m arguing just seeing what they have.

I don’t know what Dach is, just when we were starting to find out his knee got blown up.

So it’s not hopium as in, these guys are sure to improve by 25%, I just want to see what they have.

That’s more valuable to this franchise right now than paying guys to do what we know they can do and that won’t change much in the grand scheme of things.

It’s like…I like to taste my pasta sauce before I add salt and pepper to it. (Analogy lol).

I'm not sure I'm able to put it in English coherently. Listen to the podcast. It's about 20-minute mark.

Its the one they just posted today?

Let me go pree dis

 

[Habs Halifax]

Skinner is cursed, Oilers won't make the PO next season.
But Buffalo will.


I'm just thankful he's not in the Habs division anymore, but that's ~10 less points for him.

I think the Oilers improved after yesterday and Skinner has that experience now. Oilers are for real bud.

 

[overlords]

Would you happen to have a link by any chance? I'm not a podcast guy hahaha

 

[Archijerej]

Would you happen to have a link by any chance? I'm not a podcast guy hahaha

Sure thing.

 

[Spring in Fialta]

Appreciate it fellas

 

[Spring in Fialta]

I would have made Arpon Basu explode lmao someone show him this thread

 

[Zilo44]

Last year, the Habs spent the first half of the season fighting over 8-12, the tank thread was full of people panicking.

They only crashed to 5th after trading Monahan + Dvorak and Newhook getting injured. If they can avoid a decimated center line this year, staying at 10-12 shouldn't be impossible. And this coming season, the only UFA the team can trade that will have a negative impact is Savard...and only if the Ds take no steps forward.

As for teams improving, some regressed like the Canes because they lost those players. So that's a wash.

I’m not even a pro-tank for 2024-2025. The better this team is the better I’ll feel. But even teams like the Canes who lost a lot are better than us next year…

 

[Spring in Fialta]

Arpon Basu comparing Bertuzzi/Teravainen etc. etc. to Dvorak and Gallagher is such a poor argument. Yeesh.

EDIT: His arguments are arguably poor. Trying to make a link between Alzner's contract ending and Marchessault? Ignoring Ullmark in Ottawa? He's just butthurt and I think Godin is being really nice. At least Basu acknowledges that a lack of movement may hurt the young players.

 

[Deebs]

Arpon Basu comparing Bertuzzi/Teravainen etc. etc. to Dvorak and Gallagher is such a poor argument. Yeesh.

The main point Basu was trying to make and I agree with him was those teams didn't make massive improvements by signing those two specific players. It helps but not a game changer.

 

[Spring in Fialta]

The main point Basu was trying to make and I agree with him was those teams didn't make massive improvements by signing those two specific players. It helps but not a game changer.

I'm watching more and he goes more and more into what I've been saying yesterday. He acknowledged that it's on management's radar that not getting anyone after all this losing isn't a great look to the young players.

But the game changer thing is such a strawman to me. No one is saying we're going to the conference finals with a Marchessault or or or. Like Godin says, it's about helping the young guys take that next step even if the next step is just competing for a playoff spot instead of being in the basement again. There's real value in that both on and off the ice.