HF Habs: Trade Proposal Thread #88: 2024 Off-Season Thread

[DAChampion]

They're most definitely a bottom 5 team again with that roster.

I expect the Habs to improve to 10th from the bottom. They'll benefit from a healthier roster, better performances from Slafkovsky and Caulfield, and no Jake Allen.

I think it's likely that we see one impact trade.

Perhaps they'll get a better power play coach.

 

[Zilo44]

I expect the Habs to improve to 10th from the bottom. They'll benefit from a healthier roster, better performances from Slafkovsky and Caulfield, and no Jake Allen.

I think it's likely that we see one impact trade.

Perhaps they'll get a better power play coach.

Utah, Washington and Seattle improved significantly more than us. I was hoping like you to draft 10, but I have a hard time seeing it even with proper development from youth

 

[Andy]

I expect the Habs to improve to 10th from the bottom. They'll benefit from a healthier roster, better performances from Slafkovsky and Caulfield, and no Jake Allen.

I think it's likely that we see one impact trade.

Perhaps they'll get a better power play coach.

The d-core is still so young. The habs will improve as those players improve.

If any combo of Guhle, Xhekaj, Huston, Struble, Barron, Mailloux, Reinbacher, Harris take big leaps in their development, the habs will see major improvement. Additional improvements will occur if Dach comes back at the same pace he left off two years ago.

 

[Spring in Fialta]

I expect the Habs to improve to 10th from the bottom. They'll benefit from a healthier roster, better performances from Slafkovsky and Caulfield, and no Jake Allen.

I think it's likely that we see one impact trade.

Perhaps they'll get a better power play coach.

I think that's overly optimistic IMO. I hope we see a trade for some immediate help as well but I'm not expecting it.

Don't forget that every other team expects improvements and based on what's been done, I feel like they're a lot more justified than us in that feeling.

If things stand as they do today, forget a 10th place finish. I'd be flabbergasted if that happened.

The d-core is still so young. The habs will improve as those players improve.

If Guhle, Xhekaj, Huston, Struble, Harris take big leaps in their development, the habs will see major improvment.

How big of a leap do we expect from guys like Harris, Struble and Xhekaj? And to become what?

It came out yesterday that the league doesn't value our young D the way Hughes does and I don't think the league is particularly wrong on that one. They're dime-a-dozen guys. Decent enough but they don't tilt the ice one bit.

 

[Mcdonaldz]

Rumors are the Habs are in deep talks for Laine so Hughes, Gorton, MSL, and probably Suzuki want him to join our team. Laine has top end skill with his shot and he's not a problem child. He's going through a problem and I believe Montreal brings out the best from him.

Where ? Source ? Not that David Ettidegui crap ?

 

[Spring in Fialta]

Like also expecting Dach to step into the ice and carry guys even more raw than him on the 2nd line after a full season out seems like a massive IF to me. If we lose one of Suzuki/Dach we're back to Evans/Dvorak as pure centers to back him with Newhook who performed admirably but you're still looking at a club that's going to lose a shit ton. We don't have serious depth.

 

[26Mats]

Watch this and remember the good old days, it's going to be a another long year and with a high draft pick coming next draft. Have a quiet summer , relax .. we will be kicking the shit out of each other all season, now is the time to heal up from last year.

Engels: "I still think there is going to be something. I think there are going to be some players subtracted. And I think there are going to be some players added."

 

[TesseractPrice]

Man I swear Newhook is the most underated player on this team. In his first season on the Habs, he had 34 points in 55 games (50 points pace). He had a 55-point pace when he came back from injury while playing with mostly plugs. He even got Armia and Gallagher going. When he played wings with Dach or Suzuki at the beginning of the season, he scored at 0.5G/G pace (short sample though). All this in his first season with the org while being yanked around the lineup due to injuries

Newhook is exactly the same size and weight as Crosby who is not considered a size concern and perhaps the best skater of all the forwards on the Habs. He can also play center in a pich, which happened last season. Good teams need W/C hybrids for exactly these reasons

The amount of people in here who want to trade him or burry him on the 3rd line to play 13 minutes a game because of his chemistry with Armia and Gallagher baffles me. The path to success for the Habs next season is to play the core 5 forwards of Suzuki, Slafkovsky, Caufield. Dach, Newhook over 18 minutes a game in a normal setting (not constantly on the PK, not leading by 4 goals) and spread the rest to the others. One last spot is open for a winger, maybe it's Roy or a trade

 

[Gaylord Q Tinkledink]

Rumors are the Habs are in deep talks for Laine so Hughes, Gorton, MSL, and probably Suzuki want him to join our team. Laine has top end skill with his shot and he's not a problem child. He's going through a problem and I believe Montreal brings out the best from him.

The "rumours" are one dude who's a fraud.

Marinaro: Laine what do you think ?
Engels: I-I'd be really surprised.

 

[Galaxydoggystyle]

The people that are all doom and gloom and its only july 2nd are hilarious maybe bitch and moan once we are in September??

 

[Archijerej]

Highly, highly disappointed with Canadiens management today and the subsequent snippets I've heard from the presser.

'I expect us to get better organically.' and 'We tried to make trades but couldn't it work.'

Seriously? How? That's polished Bergevin-esque talk. When does that ever happen? I never saw Boston, Tampa Bay, Florida sit around idly waiting to get better 'organically'. They went out and got shit done, just like they did today. What happens if one of Suzuki or Dach goes down? We're there again with a single center playing on an island, for a fourth straight year. And to not block who? Joshua Roy? Don't get me wrong, he seems like he'll be a pretty decent player but that sort of talk is absurd.

I get not wanting to go above 3 years but at this point, you're just defacto killing all negotiations from the start. Players aren't going to leave money on the table even if you go a little bit higher on the yearly money. We're pretty much a nondescript, losing franchise. And we're walking around like we're just on the cusp of doing something great with a couple of tinkers. No. We need help. We really need proven veteran help for our youth.

We're going into another season where we can kiss any chance of playing meaningful hockey down the stretch before the puck even drops. I fully expect that at some point during the season with a couple of guys on IR and a 28-37-10 record that we start getting Athletic stories about how 'disheartened' management is by 'the lack of internal progress' and how some players are completely jaded in another losing season because these guys are human beings and not numbers on a stat sheet. Motivation matters. Having something to play for helps guys improve. Not getting hemmed in all the time keeps guys off IR too.

HuGo can f*** right off with this. I really like what they've done so far but this is a failure IMO and reminiscent of Bergevin (right around the same time in their respective tenure too) at the 2015 deadline where there was CLEARLY a need to do something and we sat with our thumbs up our ass because we're scared of taking a swing. Hell, I remember criticizing Bergevin then when he was still popular for that (and not trading for a goalie when Price went down was what really killed him for me after that) and getting a ton of pushback too.

Again, they still have the trade market to reshape the roster, so I'm not going to criticize them just yet.

That said, going into next season with the exact same roster would create such a contrast with their end of season presser, that it surely merits a raised eyebrow at least.

I remember Bergevin waiting until Galchenyuk and Bealieau "internally develop" and fill the roles the team needed them to fill.

Regarding UFAs, something came to my mind today. Let's say, we signed one for too much term. Surely, by the time we are hoping to contend all of the other bad contracts will be off the books. So this year's UFA would be the only toxic asset and you deal with it then, just like other teams do. Meanwhile, you provide your young squad with the support you've promised them, allowing them to begin a gradual climb up the standings.

 

[ReHabs]

Again, they still have the trade market to reshape the roster, so I'm not going to criticize them just yet.

That said, going into next season with the exact same roster would create such a contrast with their end of season presser, that it surely merits a raised eyebrow at least.

I remember Bergevin waiting until Galchenyuk and Bealieau "internally develop" and fill the roles the team needed them to fill.

Regarding UFAs, something came to my mind today. Let's say, we signed one for too much term. Surely, by the time we are hoping to contend all of the other bad contracts will be off the books. So this year's UFA would be the only toxic asset and you deal with it then, just like other teams do. Meanwhile, you provide your young squad with the support you've promised them, allowing them to begin a gradual climb up the standings.

There were pretty much no interesting players to sign even if they wanted to. Outside of Stamkos and Marchessault the rest of the field sucked and were looking to cash in with maximal returns— we can’t commit for longer than 2-3 years. Bad fits.

 

[Spring in Fialta]

The people that are all doom and gloom and its only july 2nd are hilarious maybe bitch and moan once we are in September??

I remember reading that same cope when Bergevin was sitting on millions too.

How often do we see significant trades after the big days?

Again, they still have the trade market to reshape the roster, so I'm not going to criticize them just yet.

That said, going into next season with the exact same roster would create such a contrast with their end of season presser, that it surely merits a raised eyebrow at least.

I remember Bergevin waiting until Galchenyuk and Bealieau "internally develop" and fill the roles the team needed them to fill.

Regarding UFAs, something came to my mind today. Let's say, we signed one for too much term. Surely, by the time we are hoping to contend all of the other bad contracts will be off the books. So this year's UFA would be the only toxic asset and you deal with it then, just like other teams do. Meanwhile, you provide your young squad with the support you've promised them, allowing them to begin a gradual climb up the standings.

Yeah, I don't particularly give a shit about an extra one or two bad year. Teams deal with them all the time.

For God's sakes, we just watched the Kings manage to get rid of Dubois' deal without retaining to make more space for (ultimately laughable) improvements but the money can be moved.

 

[morhilane]

Utah, Washington and Seattle improved significantly more than us. I was hoping like you to draft 10, but I have a hard time seeing it even with proper development from youth

Last year, the Habs spent the first half of the season fighting over 8-12, the tank thread was full of people panicking.

They only crashed to 5th after trading Monahan + Dvorak and Newhook getting injured. If they can avoid a decimated center line this year, staying at 10-12 shouldn't be impossible. And this coming season, the only UFA the team can trade that will have a negative impact is Savard...and only if the Ds take no steps forward.

As for teams improving, some regressed like the Canes because they lost those players. So that's a wash.

 

[Andy]

Dach, Newhook, Beck, Roy, Guhle, Mailloux, Hutson, Harris, Xhekaj, Barron, Struble, Reinbacher....all these players have a lot of room to grow.

I honestly feel like the group of prospects are vastly superior than the slew of prospects during the MB regime.

Some of these folks have fairly decent ceilings, and I think any combo of these players breaking out would get the team out of the lottery tier. I dont think DAChampion is too out of line for seeing this team moving out of the top 10 draft range.

 

[DAChampion]

Don't forget that every other team expects improvements

Not true. Many teams should expect to get worse, say if their core includes older players or if they did badly in free agency or if they were very healthy last year.

 

[Captain Mountain]

Again, they still have the trade market to reshape the roster, so I'm not going to criticize them just yet.

That said, going into next season with the exact same roster would create such a contrast with their end of season presser, that it surely merits a raised eyebrow at least.

I remember Bergevin waiting until Galchenyuk and Bealieau "internally develop" and fill the roles the team needed them to fill.

Regarding UFAs, something came to my mind today. Let's say, we signed one for too much term. Surely, by the time we are hoping to contend all of the other bad contracts will be off the books. So this year's UFA would be the only toxic asset and you deal with it then, just like other teams do. Meanwhile, you provide your young squad with the support you've promised them, allowing them to begin a gradual climb up the standings.

Outside of editorializing, when did they actually say they were going to "reshape the roster"?

The most consistent comment management has made is that they want to improve the current roster but not at all costs, sacrificing too much in the future. That's not just about acquisition cost, its also about cap management.

I'm not sure why so much of this fanbase wants to go back to the messy Bergevin "retool" era, but I much prefer focusing on developing the young guys on the team and seeing how they grow so they can determine which roles need to be filled.

Montreal's not done either (in free agency or trades). There are players available and teams that need to create cap space.

 

[Spring in Fialta]

Not true. Many teams should expect to get worse, say if their core includes older players or if they did badly in free agency or if they were very healthy last year.

Like who? Older teams like Boston, Tampa and Nashville definitely improved. Ottawa - a direct competitor - just got a recent Vezina winner.

Off the top of my head the Hurricanes are an obvious one but they're not going from contender to bottom feeder.

What I think the truth is is that HuGo are still (understandably) in the honeymoon with the fanbase and the rebuild has given them an enormous amount of goodwill in the same way that Bergevin initially insisting on keeping his 1st round picks even if the team was high in the standings made the folks here happy because they didn't think the team was as good as it actually was (they were wrong and I was saying it then). I'm not saying that HuGo are trash or anything but I think if they go into the year with this roster this is their first flagrant and massive mistake of their tenure and it's at a key juncture.

 

[417]

You don't go from basement to contender overnight. Progress should be made gradually and continuously and after 3 years at the bottom, I think the organization should be actively working to ensure that they're not out of the picture by game 25. I swear, too many posters here have like two or three talking points and seem unable to hold multiple ideas at once.

I've been hit with that same strawman all day.

Thing is, when Hughes took over the team they were already at the bottom and their mandate at least that year, was to continue to stir that ship into the bottom, which they did.

 

[417]

Nah, McGroarty is a good prospect but has not turned pro yet. Most offers the Jets will receive are futures or NHL ready guys like Barron+. Go look up H Borgstrom and see how well he did in the NCAA.

Trading a player under RFA team control like Newhook for a magic bean is reaching. McGroarty doesn't have that kind of value.

Cheveldayoff (sp?) is notorious to letting things play out, he doesn’t have to move him right now and he won’t until he gets the offer he wants.


He’s going to slow play that one like he slow plays everything.

 

[Spring in Fialta]

Thing is, when Hughes took over the team they were already at the bottom and their mandate at least that year, was to continue to stir that ship into the bottom, which they did.

Which was the correct move. I was completely on board with selling off Lehkonen, Toffoli, etc. I think how they stripped down, the players they picked, trading a couple of mid-low 1sts for Dach and Newhook was solid (and even if Dach ends up being an injured mess, I'll never diss the attempt). They've done a really good job so far.

But I'm not a guy who looks at things with bleu-blanc-rouge glasses on (not that you are either) and there's a gaping hole in our top-6 that needs filling and refusing to do so in the name of Joshua Roy ain't it in my opinion. The kid can totally start in the middle-6. Throw your young vets who have stuck it out a bone. Help Dach with an excellent, proven winger. He'll just be coming from a lost season.

 

[yianik]

People wanting to trade D, this is the way I see it.

Guhle is likely a no.2 D and he isnt going anywhere. He is in year 3 and I expect him to start polishing his role, maybe take some more risk offensively to see what he can do.

Harris is likely a vanilla safe kind of bottom pair guy who right now will not get us much of anything back, so why bother trading him. And he can be a useful bottom pair guy. But sure, right now next to Barron he is 2nd likeliest to get pushed out.

Xhekaj is a wild card for me and definite keeper until we know what we have in him and this year is year 3 and an important development year. He could be a great no.4, maybe more ?

Barron, many people have written him off and I get why. Consistency is a real big issue for him, maybe more than other young guys and he seems to be real good if things are working out but nose dives if things get a bit difficult. Again, you give him a full shot this year because he has shown that upside and he is one of the few offensive minded D we have, so what the heck.

Struble is just entering year 2 so he is in the early stages of developing his pro game. We have not seen enough of him. He can play in the AHL.

Most of the above guys need to clear waivers or close to having to clear waivers and my view is you give them full chances. The guy most at risk to me is Barron and if he doesnt get it together this year he gets pushed out.

Hutson, Reinbacher and Mailleux dont need to clear waivers but they will get NHL playing time, maybe a good amount. But they must not be rushed, let them play in the AHL first, no harm will be done except our need for instant gratification will be delayed in the interest of development.

 

[Archijerej]

Outside of editorializing, when did they actually say they were going to "reshape the roster"?

They made several disclaimers (which I, by the way, agree with), but they also talked a lot about climbing up the standings, liking the progress of the group and exploring every avenue to support that progress.

I'm gonna be generous and not mention how many times the word playoffs was uttered.

The most consistent comment management has made is that they want to improve the current roster but not at all costs, sacrificing too much in the future. That's not just about acquisition cost, its also about cap management.

How much is too much? I'm not proposing anything that would cripple our future cap structure.

I'm not sure why so much of this fanbase wants to go back to the messy Bergevin "retool" era, but I much prefer focusing on developing the young guys on the team and seeing how they grow so they can determine which roles need to be filled.

I'm not really sure how did you find a longing for Bergevin in what I wrote.

We have a gaping hole on Dach's wing, created by Anderson's decline and Monahan's departure. Is addressing it moving into Bergevin territory?

Would a bottom 6 player that can kill penalties, provide some grit and push Rafael Harvey-Pinard into #13 forward slot be acceptable during a rebuild, after 3 consecutive bottom 5 finishes, or would it be Bergevin territory again?

What's the plan for the next two years? Are we going to magically switch from a bottom 5 team next year, to a playoff team the year after. Because a lot of folks here seem to believe that is exactly what will happen. I have my doubts.

Montreal's not done either (in free agency or trades). There are players available and teams that need to create cap space.

Fair enough. I've made that disclaimer.

 

[417]

Which was the correct move. I was completely on board with selling off Lehkonen, Toffoli, etc. I think how they stripped down, the players they picked, trading a couple of mid-low 1sts for Dach and Newhook was solid (and even if Dach ends up being an injured mess, I'll never diss the attempt). They've done a really good job so far.

But I'm not a guy who looks at things with bleu-blanc-rouge glasses on (not that you are either) and there's a gaping hole in our top-6 that needs filling and refusing to do so in the name of Joshua Roy ain't it in my opinion. The kid can totally start in the middle-6. Throw your young vets who have stuck it out a bone. Help Dach with an excellent, proven winger. He'll just be coming from a lost season.

Sure, but not sure that’s an urgent/needs fixing NOW type of hole. I think they’ll explore the trade market to see if they can find a solution there, or they’ll continue to try to fill it internally by rotation.

Demidov coming over next season is already an “in-house” solution that is on the horizon.

Better to slow play this than to rush it, the answer might be from within.

I think it would have been premature to throw say…5 years at Marchesseault, only to find out soon after that Newhook/Roy/Demidov are more than capable.

 

[Ieatsht4brkfst]

lll continue to say it, the people complaining about others complaining are the most toxic mfers