Post-Game Talk: Trade Deadline Day: March 7, 2025: Montreal stands pat

[Grate n Colorful Oz]

Do you respond this way to every poster that doesn't share your opinion?

Laine was a fine gamble for a rebuilding team looking to add offense and move up in the standings. He's just too much of a liability for a contender and has been that type of player his entire career. It's not the injury, this is who he is. Of course, anything can happen and the world is full of possibilities. People thought Monahan's career was over when we acquired him due to hip issues, but he got back to health, improved his value and parlayed that into a long term contract. A team could very well trade for Laine if we make him available at next years TDL. I just think the return and his impact on a playoff team will be more like Vanek than anything meaningful.

It's not a quesrion of disagreeing, but of you having an inflated ego to think you know the perception of all GMs and the future performance and value of Laine, let alone the fact that despite his shortcomings and rehabilitation into game shape, he is producing right now. Now, you're backtracking from zero value to some value, which tells me my post struck where it needed to.

 

[Habssince89]

Laine has zero trade value, this offseason or next year's TDL. We took on his contract essentially for free as a gamble and his value hasn't improved since then. He's a major liability 5-5 to the effect that no serious contender could play him in the top-9 for a regular shift 5-5. In the playoffs he'd be pinned to the bench until a power play rolled around. How much can that possibly be worth? Oh yeah, and his cap hit is $8.7M.

Can't agree. Your post is full of circular logic based on a lot of speculation.

It would be more accurate to saw Laine has low value right now. You haven't shown any reason to take the bolded as fact

 

[26Mats]

Laine has zero trade value, this offseason or next year's TDL. We took on his contract essentially for free as a gamble and his value hasn't improved since then. He's a major liability 5-5 to the effect that no serious contender could play him in the top-9 for a regular shift 5-5. In the playoffs he'd be pinned to the bench until a power play rolled around. How much can that possibly be worth? Oh yeah, and his cap hit is $8.7M.

1. We got a 2nd round puck to take on his contract.

2. We don't know how he'll play next year, if he will come back stronger from his knee injury, having more reps, and potentially playing with Demidov amd a new 2c.

3. He can be traded with 50% retained, which brings his cap hit to 4.35M, or 2.175 if a 3rd party is brought into a deal.

 

[BLNY]

That's fair but there is also a thread on here questioning whether MSL is the right coach for the team. This has been building for awhile; yesterday just revealed it a little more.

Same illness. Goes back to last year. Rational thought doesn't enter into it.

 

[Grate n Colorful Oz]

1. We got a 2nd round puck to take on his contract.

2. We don't know how he'll play next year, if he will come back stronger from his knee injury, having more reps, and potentially playing with Demidov amd a new 2c.

3. He can be traded with 50% retained, which brings his cap hit to 4.35M, or 2.175 if a 3rd party is brought into a deal.

4.35m at 3/4 of the season is only about 1.1 mil that has to be added to the cap burden for the whole season. It's peanuts and a non-issue.

 

[japhi27returns]

Newhook is a better hockey player than Zetterlund. Bookmark this post and let's revisit in 5 years.

I was thinking the same thing. While I don’t watch the Sharks as much as everyone here seems to - fascinating that so many east coast posters stay up late to watch Zetterlund - I don’t see a huge delta in the numbers. And Zetterlund played almost 19 mins pg last year and had 44 points, and is a year older.

Not sure I understand why we need more bottom 6 talent.

 

[lamp9post]

1. We got a 2nd round puck to take on his contract.

2. We don't know how he'll play next year, if he will come back stronger from his knee injury, having more reps, and potentially playing with Demidov amd a new 2c.

3. He can be traded with 50% retained, which brings his cap hit to 4.35M, or 2.175 if a 3rd party is brought into a deal.

We also gave up Harris, who I think at the time had value roughly equivalent to a 2nd so I left that out. Though I do think the 2nd is slightly more valuable but no point splitting hairs. After you take out Harris and the 2nd, it's Laine for nothing. I agree with the rest of your post.

It's not a quesrion of disagreeing, but of you having an inflated ego to think you know the perception of all GMs and the future performance and value of Laine, let alone the fact that despite his shortcomings and rehabilitation into game shape, he is producing right now. Now, you're backtracking from zero value to some value, which tells me my post struck where it needed to.

Where in my post did you get the idea that I think I know the perception of all GMs? I have an opinion on the future performance and value of Laine.

Do we really need to qualify every post with *Of course I don't know the future, I can't read minds, and there is a possible universe in which my opinion may not exactly align with how things unfold?*

Can't agree. Your post is full of circular logic based on a lot of speculation.

It would be more accurate to saw Laine has low value right now. You haven't shown any reason to take the bolded as fact

No, he has zero value right now. As I mentioned above and earlier, we took on his contract for free and his value has not improved since then.

Circular logic and speculation? Dude, its an opinion! And most of the posts on these boards are speculation - that's kind of the point. I stated that Laine was a liability 5-5 and because of that, likely wouldn't be sought after by serious contenders. I'm sorry but that type of player archetype (one dimensional pp specialist) isn't that valuable, especially in the playoffs.

 

[26Mats]

We also gave up Harris, who I think at the time had value roughly equivalent to a 2nd so I left that out. Though I do think the 2nd is slightly more valuable but no point splitting hairs. After you take out Harris and the 2nd, it's Laine for nothing. I agree with the rest of your post.



Where in my post did you get the idea that I think I know the perception of all GMs? I have an opinion on the future performance and value of Laine.

Do we really need to qualify every post with *Of course I don't know the future, I can't read minds, and there is a possible universe in which my opinion may not exactly align with how things unfold?*



No, he has zero value right now. As I mentioned above and earlier, we took on his contract for free and his value has not improved since then.

Circular logic and speculation? Dude, its an opinion! And most of the posts on these boards are speculation - that's kind of the point. I stated that Laine was a liability 5-5 and because of that, likely wouldn't be sought after by serious contenders. I'm sorry but that type of player archetype (one dimensional pp specialist) isn't that valuable, especially in the playoffs.

Yeah, I'm remaining hopeful on Laine.

Clearly the talent is there. But clearly there are major flaws in his game right now? Can he overcome them with reps, coaching, getting back to 100% health mentally and physically? Time will tell. I don't have the answer, just can hope for the best. I think playing with good offensive players would help.

 

[HabsWhiteKnightLOL]

man what id give to get marner and trade Laine for peanuts with Demidov and a new center. Team would be so much dangerous as passing

 

[lamp9post]

man what id give to get marner and trade Laine for peanuts with Demidov and a new center. Team would be so much dangerous as passing

Demidov and Marner would be insane. Defenders would pass out from dizziness* on extended shifts of offensive zone possession.

Also, how dare you suggest that Laine value is peanuts? You can't read the minds of all 32 gms or predict the future so that means you have an inflated ego /s


* I'm not a doctor so I must admit that I don't know for a fact if defenders would actually pass out from dizziness.

 

[Erika]

He'll be a similar impact player as Lehkonen I think. I would have loved to see a Heineman-Beck-Zetterlund line when we're more competitive.

100% agree with you on that. I see a future Lehkonen in Zetterlund. But stronger, heavier and with even better scoring instincts. No idea why San Jose got rid of him for trash and a B grade prospect in Ostapchuk. It makes no sense.

 

[salbutera]

We also gave up Harris, who I think at the time had value roughly equivalent to a 2nd so I left that out. Though I do think the 2nd is slightly more valuable but no point splitting hairs. After you take out Harris and the 2nd, it's Laine for nothing. I agree with the rest of your post.



Where in my post did you get the idea that I think I know the perception of all GMs? I have an opinion on the future performance and value of Laine.

Do we really need to qualify every post with *Of course I don't know the future, I can't read minds, and there is a possible universe in which my opinion may not exactly align with how things unfold?*



No, he has zero value right now. As I mentioned above and earlier, we took on his contract for free and his value has not improved since then.

Circular logic and speculation? Dude, its an opinion! And most of the posts on these boards are speculation - that's kind of the point. I stated that Laine was a liability 5-5 and because of that, likely wouldn't be sought after by serious contenders. I'm sorry but that type of player archetype (one dimensional pp specialist) isn't that valuable, especially in the playoffs.

It was narrowed down to Habs vs Canes for Laine, Habs were willing to take on entire cap hit which is why it was free, Canes didn’t have the space and wanted to send a contract back to CBJ.

Prior to official trade to Habs, Minny had a deal in place w CBJ, but Laine refused to waive …

 

[TomKosto]

100% agree with you on that. I see a future Lehkonen in Zetterlund. But stronger, heavier and with even better scoring instincts. No idea why San Jose got rid of him for trash and a B grade prospect in Ostapchuk. It makes no sense.

Yea that’s a real weird trade from SJ

 

[Habssince89]

We also gave up Harris, who I think at the time had value roughly equivalent to a 2nd so I left that out. Though I do think the 2nd is slightly more valuable but no point splitting hairs. After you take out Harris and the 2nd, it's Laine for nothing. I agree with the rest of your post.



Where in my post did you get the idea that I think I know the perception of all GMs? I have an opinion on the future performance and value of Laine.

Do we really need to qualify every post with *Of course I don't know the future, I can't read minds, and there is a possible universe in which my opinion may not exactly align with how things unfold?*



No, he has zero value right now. As I mentioned above and earlier, we took on his contract for free and his value has not improved since then.

Circular logic and speculation? Dude, its an opinion! And most of the posts on these boards are speculation - that's kind of the point. I stated that Laine was a liability 5-5 and because of that, likely wouldn't be sought after by serious contenders. I'm sorry but that type of player archetype (one dimensional pp specialist) isn't that valuable, especially in the playoffs.

There's a difference between well-founded speculation and your writing out narrative that you can't give any evidence to support. Opinions can be wrong and shitty, it doesn't protect you from responses and disagreement

 

[Erika]

It's fair, if you look at asset management in a vacuum.
For the record, I don't think they will make the POs this year, so if everything is just black or white they should have taken the pick.

BUT...
The team is 1pts out of a WC spot at the TDL, the team was seller for the 3 previous season and accumulated a few nice prospects along the way. It's fine to not dick punch the team for a meager 2nd rd pick in that context.

Also I can't think of a single scenario where the Habs would find themselves a 2nd rd pick short of acquiring a #2C, we have the assets to pull it off already.

The dissapointing thing with Kent Hughes is that he did absolutely nothing at the trade deadline...
Either you acquire some help for the last stretch of the season or you unload some UFA veterans that will not be with the club next season.

You try to min-max as much as possible. Doing nothing is like the worst option he took and that's a sign of an undecisive state of mind/no adaptative skills to be proactive with your plan.

Take Steve Staios for example, he took the initiative to swap Norris and Cozens. It's a risk for Ottawa, but a good risk if Cozens turn into something imo.

He also added a stud like Fabian Zetterlund for almost nothing. A future Arturri Lehkonen entering his prime. Ottawa transformed their top 6 just like that. That's what I call GM creativity and I'm sorry, but KH demonstrated none at this year's trade deadline and that's the biggest issue for me.

 

[JianYang]

The reward is that they are going to let the team see this through.... that they won't pull the rug on the work that this group has done to be in this position. I would be so pissed off if I was someone like suzuki and they ended up going that route. I'd never be able to trust the management again, and that's not good for anybody moving forward.

It doesn't mean that they were going to start trading their future for rentals. If any deals were to be made, they were going to be hockey deals where they are looking at long term fits.

 

[Runner77]

His defense, while not great, I don’t think is the REAL problem. It’s his inconsistent effort level to me, which I also think contributes to his lack of footspeed. Barring us making the playoffs and Laine all of a sudden goes full beast mode, I could see him being moved during the summer.

As for the TDL, I think it went as I expected. We really are in the mix and still have a relatively easier strength of schedule. The vets we held on to may be enough to get us through. I didn’t see any point moving Savard for a 4th or 5th. We know Armia is a solid tandem with Evans and they may as well ride it out rest of this season to try to get to the playoffs. Dvorak I’m convinced had like zero value. As other said anyways, all these guys are worth more to the team than a couple picks after pick #120.

I do expect an AHL deal or two coming.

Not suggesting there isn’t an attitude issue that is contributing to Laine’s play but a lot of it may be due to him choosing to forego an operation in order to return to play this season.

We don’t know how much of his footspeed is the result of physical limitations vs his effort level. Best gauge might be how well he performs at camp next season, where he’d be coming in presumably with his ailments/ physical limitations from injury, behind him.

 

[Grate n Colorful Oz]

We also gave up Harris, who I think at the time had value roughly equivalent to a 2nd so I left that out. Though I do think the 2nd is slightly more valuable but no point splitting hairs. After you take out Harris and the 2nd, it's Laine for nothing. I agree with the rest of your post.



Where in my post did you get the idea that I think I know the perception of all GMs? I have an opinion on the future performance and value of Laine.

Do we really need to qualify every post with *Of course I don't know the future, I can't read minds, and there is a possible universe in which my opinion may not exactly align with how things unfold?*



No, he has zero value right now. As I mentioned above and earlier, we took on his contract for free and his value has not improved since then.

Circular logic and speculation? Dude, its an opinion! And most of the posts on these boards are speculation - that's kind of the point. I stated that Laine was a liability 5-5 and because of that, likely wouldn't be sought after by serious contenders. I'm sorry but that type of player archetype (one dimensional pp specialist) isn't that valuable, especially in the playoffs.

Dude, you wrote zero value now and next TDL. That in of itself is exactly what I described. You can backpaddle all you like, I'm not the only one who saw it.

 

[Natey]

The dissapointing thing with Kent Hughes is that he did absolutely nothing at the trade deadline...
Either you acquire some help for the last stretch of the season or you unload some UFA veterans that will not be with the club next season.

You try to min-max as much as possible. Doing nothing is like the worst option he took and that's a sign of an undecisive state of mind/no adaptative skills to be proactive with your plan.

Take Steve Staios for example, he took the initiative to swap Norris and Cozens. It's a risk for Ottawa, but a good risk if Cozens turn into something imo.

He also added a stud like Fabian Zetterlund for almost nothing. A future Arturri Lehkonen entering his prime. Ottawa transformed their top 6 just like that. That's what I call GM creativity and I'm sorry, but KH demonstrated none at this year's trade deadline and that's the biggest issue for me.

The biggest problem is we are still handcuffed with a handful of bad contracts that don't expire anytime soon and he's still building the team.

Personally, I would have at least traded Savard and given an AHL player the call-up, but I also understand not wanting to weaken Laval for their run.

I like that Hughes is giving the core a chance to compete. Will they make it? Who knows. But stripping them of multiple players would have for sure sealed the fate of the team.

And acquisitions would have cost to much for where we are at.

Zetterland is probably costing us Beck.. and I don't want to do make that deal.

 

[ReHabs]

It's fair, if you look at asset management in a vacuum.
For the record, I don't think they will make the POs this year, so if everything is just black or white they should have taken the pick.

I think we’re aligned on this. I don’t think it’s remotely a deal-breaker or a black stain or anything. But it’s perfectly fine to disagree with the decision, which I do. I would’ve liked a middle6er acquired with or without term.

BUT...
The team is 1pts out of a WC spot at the TDL, the team was seller for the 3 previous season and accumulated a few nice prospects along the way. It's fine to not dick punch the team for a meager 2nd rd pick in that context.

Also I can't think of a single scenario where the Habs would find themselves a 2nd rd pick short of acquiring a #2C, we have the assets to pull it off already.

I can think of many scenarios where Hughes says he doesn’t want to trade Michael Hage or Owen Beck and thus a deal is scuppered. We need more Michael Hages and Owen Becks in our prospect pool. It isn’t about the merger 2nd round pick, it’s about asset management. More good prospects means more trade pieces.

Again — I think we’re aligned in spirit but no one will convince anyone that they aren’t allowed to disagree with a decision made by the team’s GM. We don’t have to be completely 100% in total agreement to enjoy the team and be hopeful for its future success.

 

[ReHabs]

Is it just me or did some teams really give up a lot for what they got? A lot of not only 1st picks but 2x1st picks etc. Glad the team stood pat and didn't add anyone. Could have traded Armia maybe and Savard but I guess there was not a deal to be made.

A lot of teams are in their peak competitive window and don’t stand to benefit by sitting on the sidelines. A lot will be disappointed by their performance in the months to come but the regret of not trying would be more painful.

Shame on Bergevin for sitting on his hands all those years.

 

[Team_Spirit]

They cut the part when he text Elliotte for the scoop.

 

[Grate n Colorful Oz]

I stated that Laine was a liability 5-5 and because of that, likely wouldn't be sought after by serious contenders. I'm sorry but that type of player archetype (one dimensional pp specialist) isn't that valuable, especially in the playoffs.

And is not factual in regards to actual trade value or wants from other teams. Hoffman in 2018 was a worst overall player than Laine and got traded for a 2nd, a 4th and a 5th, while being attached to a 7th. Salaries were different, time of the year was different, but in the case of Laine, you'll probably be looking at a sellers market again, with very little salary remaining even without retention.

 

[ReHabs]

the Habs won’t be sellers next trade deadline and will simply retain the highly talented sniper Laine who will hopefully not be hobbled on one leg next year.

 

[OnTheRun]

I think we’re aligned on this. I don’t think it’s remotely a deal-breaker or a black stain or anything. But it’s perfectly fine to disagree with the decision, which I do. I would’ve liked a middle6er acquired with or without term.


I can think of many scenarios where Hughes says he doesn’t want to trade Michael Hage or Owen Beck and thus a deal is scuppered. We need more Michael Hages and Owen Becks in our prospect pool. It isn’t about the merger 2nd round pick, it’s about asset management. More good prospects means more trade pieces.

If Hughes doesn't want to trade Hage or Beck then an extra 2nd rd pick wouldn't change a thing, this hypothetical 2nd rd pick cannot reasonably be considered as a linchpin for things to come. "I would be willing to float Hage in a trade if I had 3 2nd rd pick in 2025. Alas! I only have 2." isn't going to be a thing.

There is more to the GM job than managing assets. He need to manage the real people currently on his team. And right now, the people carrying the mail for his team wanted the opportunity to try to fight for a playoffs spot and as the GM he decided to allows them to do so. There is clear upside and a clear downside to this decision, but you can't have your cake and eat it too.

Again — I think we’re aligned in spirit but no one will convince anyone that they aren’t allowed to disagree with a decision made by the team’s GM. We don’t have to be completely 100% in total agreement to enjoy the team and be hopeful for its future success.

I'm not sure why you feel you're not allowed to disagree with a decision made by someone else. Because you are free to do so and by extension other people are free to disagree with you, and round we go.