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Trade and Free Agency - 2024-25

ThatGuy22 said:
I'm kind of in the same boat with it. He said/she said situation. We have no idea what happened beyond the league and the rangers felt their wasn't enough in the independent law firms investigation to take action. An an undisclosed sum of money was paid to make it go away. The accusation details usually come from the accuser, who try to paint things in the worst possible light because it's to their benefit.

Maybe it happened exactly as laid out. Maybe she was caught on the player floor and had to have an excuse why she was there.

I don't know, but my gut says given the blackhawks situation, I absolutely think the league would have nuked Paanarin from orbit if there was any evidence of substance.
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Exactly , I typically will tend to side with the victim in most instances but this one kind of smacks as more to the story if you ask me.
 
f7ben said:
Exactly , I typically will tend to side with the victim in most instances but this one kind of smacks as more to the story if you ask me.
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I always think back to 2014 when this stuff comes up. Two players of similar stature in the league were charged with DV situations. Both were shredded and crucified on these boards.

Slava Voynov was nuked from orbit immediately by the NHL, and never played a game in the league again. NHL even fined the Kings a 100k for letting him step foot on the ice in a practice.

Semyon Varlamov never missed a game due to his charges, which were also much worse initially than Voynov's. Low and behold Varlamov's charges got dropped a few months later, and he won a civil suit against his accuser where in open court it became clear he absolutely did not do it.

There is always more to the story than the initial accusation, and the league acts based on what it knows.
 
Saga of the Elk said:
Sticking to saints might mean teams playing at 3 on 3. And only two teams. No goalies, obviously.
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ThatGuy22 said:
I always think back to 2014 when this stuff comes up. Two players of similar stature in the league were charged with DV situations. Both were shredded and crucified on these boards.

Slava Voynov was nuked from orbit immediately by the NHL, and never played a game in the league again. NHL even fined the Kings a 100k for letting him step foot on the ice in a practice.

Semyon Varlamov never missed a game due to his charges, which were also much worse initially than Voynov's. Low and behold Varlamov's charges got dropped a few months later, and he won a civil suit against his accuser where in open court it became clear he absolutely did not do it.

There is always more to the story than the initial accusation, and the league acts based on what it knows.
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I just wish there were some middle ground.
"We take these accusations very seriously and continuing to monitor the situation. If evidence proves that X did Y then we will act accordingly"

Unfortunately, the court of public opinion doesn't really allow that and forces people to take sides one way or another.
 
BagHead said:
Is this in response to people not wanting Panarin on the Wild, or something else?

If it's the former, there's a voluminous cavern between a man who assaults women and sainthood, and the vast majority of Earth falls within it. I think we can find enough people to ice a couple of teams in there. If it's the latter, you have my apologies for my clueless response and I'll move on.
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we can undoubtedly all agree we don't want that on our favorite team but I'm honestly not sure how you could have grown up in Minnesota and be a fully-functioning adult in 2025 and not realize that the vast majority of pro athletes, especially hockey players, have committed far worse acts of "SA" than what is alleged to have happened here with Panarin. It's the devil's bargain of following sports, watching movies and voting for politicians.

This is a league that foregrounds two of the dirtiest players ever (Subban and Messier) in its broadcast booth, but hides from the culture of exploitation and violence whenever it can.
 
Saga of the Elk said:
we can undoubtedly all agree we don't want that on our favorite team but I'm honestly not sure how you could have grown up in Minnesota and be a fully-functioning adult in 2025 and not realize that the vast majority of pro athletes, especially hockey players, have committed far worse acts of "SA" than what is alleged to have happened here with Panarin. It's the devil's bargain of following sports, watching movies and voting for politicians.

This is a league that foregrounds two of the dirtiest players ever (Subban and Messier) in its broadcast booth, but hides from the culture of exploitation and violence whenever it can.
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It's not that I am unaware of it happening inside hockey circles, it's that I don't want it to continue happening. How does one stop that? By not enabling it. If "hockey" is synonymous with "misogyny" or "assault", maybe we should consider changing that. I'm not asking for hockey players to be "saints", I'm looking for them to merely meet the bare minimum of "not doing illegal, physically and/or emotionally harmful crap to other people." What they do on the ice notwithstanding.

tl;dr It's possible to be an athlete without being an asshole.
 
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BagHead said:
It's not that I am unaware of it happening inside hockey circles, it's that I don't want it to continue happening. How does one stop that? By not enabling it. If "hockey" is synonymous with "misogyny" or "assault", maybe we should consider changing that. I'm not asking for hockey players to be "saints", I'm looking for them to merely meet the bare minimum of "not doing illegal, physically and/or emotionally harmful crap to other people." What they do on the ice notwithstanding.

tl;dr It's possible to be an athlete without being an asshole.
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What was Guerin's role in that thing that happened in Pittsburgh? I don't remember any of the details I just remember him being named in a lawsuit.

EDIT: Got home and looked it up now, he was named in connection to covering up a sexual assault in Wilkes-Barre.
 
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BagHead said:
It's not that I am unaware of it happening inside hockey circles, it's that I don't want it to continue happening. How does one stop that? By not enabling it. If "hockey" is synonymous with "misogyny" or "assault", maybe we should consider changing that. I'm not asking for hockey players to be "saints", I'm looking for them to merely meet the bare minimum of "not doing illegal, physically and/or emotionally harmful crap to other people." What they do on the ice notwithstanding.

tl;dr It's possible to be an athlete without being an asshole.
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totally agree with the first part but I don't think this is true. Being a pro athlete, that is, requires a single-minded dedication to yourself and implies a set of gifts that most don't have. So not only is the mindset of single-minded self-improvement a precursor to assholery, so is the fawning admiration of parents, coaches, fans and community members -- including often impressionable females. So culture and psychology play a role in creating an individual who may pay lip service to team and good deeds but who most often remains an asshole, convinced that the self-negation of destroying "Timmy Jones" in order to become "Timmy Jones the Star" means "Timmy Jones the Star" plays by "Timmy Jones's" rules. There are far more examples of pro athletes who are assholes than those who aren't. And it's hard to blame them: they're rich, good-looking for the most part, insulated from every day life, and treated as special by everyone they encounter. Very hard to avoid. And while every now and then you get extreme examples of violence (from your Dany Heatley rage driving to OJ Simpson), there's a more quotidian form of sociopathy that is inherent to the profession.
 
Saga of the Elk said:
totally agree with the first part but I don't think this is true. Being a pro athlete, that is, requires a single-minded dedication to yourself and implies a set of gifts that most don't have. So not only is the mindset of single-minded self-improvement a precursor to assholery, so is the fawning admiration of parents, coaches, fans and community members -- including often impressionable females. So culture and psychology play a role in creating an individual who may pay lip service to team and good deeds but who most often remains an asshole, convinced that the self-negation of destroying "Timmy Jones" in order to become "Timmy Jones the Star" means "Timmy Jones the Star" plays by "Timmy Jones's" rules. There are far more examples of pro athletes who are assholes than those who aren't. And it's hard to blame them: they're rich, good-looking for the most part, insulated from every day life, and treated as special by everyone they encounter. Very hard to avoid. And while every now and then you get extreme examples of violence (from your Dany Heatley rage driving to OJ Simpson), there's a more quotidian form of sociopathy that is inherent to the profession.
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You are a smart person and I enjoyed your post.
 
AKL said:
What was Guerin's role in that thing that happened in Pittsburgh? I don't remember any of the details I just remember him being named in a lawsuit.

EDIT: Got home and looked it up now, he was named in connection to covering up a sexual assault in Wilkes-Barre.
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I remember. That was sort of the beginning of my standoffish attitude toward him. I've seen some yellow if not red flags with him (his reaction to Fiala, his reaction to Talbot, his drunk drafting) that make me seriously wonder what he's like behind closed doors. Hot and cold, I would imagine. Or maybe hot and too hot.

Saga of the Elk said:
totally agree with the first part but I don't think this is true. Being a pro athlete, that is, requires a single-minded dedication to yourself and implies a set of gifts that most don't have. So not only is the mindset of single-minded self-improvement a precursor to assholery, so is the fawning admiration of parents, coaches, fans and community members -- including often impressionable females. So culture and psychology play a role in creating an individual who may pay lip service to team and good deeds but who most often remains an asshole, convinced that the self-negation of destroying "Timmy Jones" in order to become "Timmy Jones the Star" means "Timmy Jones the Star" plays by "Timmy Jones's" rules. There are far more examples of pro athletes who are assholes than those who aren't. And it's hard to blame them: they're rich, good-looking for the most part, insulated from every day life, and treated as special by everyone they encounter. Very hard to avoid. And while every now and then you get extreme examples of violence (from your Dany Heatley rage driving to OJ Simpson), there's a more quotidian form of sociopathy that is inherent to the profession.
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Yeah, I think the odds of someone who has been told repeatedly that they're special turning into an asshole is higher, for sure, simply because we are products of our environment. Acting like it's an unsolvable problem so we might as well enable it, however, is not something I am willing to accept... because we are products of our environment. If someone crosses the line, you make sure they know it and, if you have the power to, incentivize them not to do so again. Not all people dedicated to their craft are assholes, and plenty of unmotivated slobs are assholes.

In any case, if someone on the Wild has a massive character problem, I hope they get incentivized to change it. If someone who is not on the Wild has a massive character problem, I'd just prefer the Wild avoid them.
 
BagHead said:
I remember. That was sort of the beginning of my standoffish attitude toward him. I've seen some yellow if not red flags with him (his reaction to Fiala, his reaction to Talbot, his drunk drafting) that make me seriously wonder what he's like behind closed doors. Hot and cold, I would imagine. Or maybe hot and too hot.
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He was officially cleared of wrongdoing in that case, to be clear, but yeah a lot of yellow flags like you said.
 
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AKL said:
He was officially cleared of wrongdoing in that case, to be clear, but yeah a lot of yellow flags like you said.
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Wasn't the timing off for him to be really involved in anything? A lot of those types lawsuits just put every name they can without due diligence being done. Throw stuff at the wall and see what sticks type of thing.
 
Saga of the Elk said:
totally agree with the first part but I don't think this is true. Being a pro athlete, that is, requires a single-minded dedication to yourself and implies a set of gifts that most don't have. So not only is the mindset of single-minded self-improvement a precursor to assholery, so is the fawning admiration of parents, coaches, fans and community members -- including often impressionable females. So culture and psychology play a role in creating an individual who may pay lip service to team and good deeds but who most often remains an asshole, convinced that the self-negation of destroying "Timmy Jones" in order to become "Timmy Jones the Star" means "Timmy Jones the Star" plays by "Timmy Jones's" rules. There are far more examples of pro athletes who are assholes than those who aren't. And it's hard to blame them: they're rich, good-looking for the most part, insulated from every day life, and treated as special by everyone they encounter. Very hard to avoid. And while every now and then you get extreme examples of violence (from your Dany Heatley rage driving to OJ Simpson), there's a more quotidian form of sociopathy that is inherent to the profession.
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Fact is, most of them are also kinda... dim. Like, you've got Timmy Jones who's been playing hockey since he was a kid. He's been a star before his balls dropped. He grew up in locker rooms as much as a home, and it takes tremendous luck to get a well-balanced coach who not only can say the right things but get them across at every level. Kids are kids and teens are teens. You grow up a bit, start to discover yourself. You're the hot shit at school cuz you're Timmy Jones, the local star, just as you mentioned. And you'll grow to be Timmy Jones the star, shining brightly in the night skies of NHL. Draft, limos, big contracts, champagne, silverware, the whole good shit. Instead of Tolkien and Aristotle, there's different kinds of T&A on offer. When teacher said 'study Posterior Analytics', they didn't mean that, Timmy.

I'm not saying professional sports and book smarts (not to be confused with intelligence; mind) can't coexist. And I'm not saying one necessarily needs the ability to knowingly quote Descartes in their draft interview. Still, growing up in mainstream, conservative, male-dominated environments where humour and subjects tend to be low-brow, is it truly a wonder their ethics can sometimes turn out crooked? I'm not justifying it, by the way, not by any means. I'm just not surprised. By its very nature a system of high, tribal-like competition and testosterone-enriched company combined with plenty of social lubricants and being conditioned to get what you want leads to a lot of f***ing around and very little of finding out.

...I wish we had, like, an abridged version of history's important works taught in school. Yeah, yeah, that's what the curriculum mostly is, but tailored more towards "aight, here's 5 minutes of background, and here's why Plato, Aristotle, Archimedes, et al were totally lit" sort of crowd. But that's a whole different convo altogether.

-----

As for topic at hand? We've got an interest offseason to come. Sadly not so much the draft, which is more or less a skipped year, but summer has me a bit excited and an equal bit scared.
 
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Rossi for Pinto, extend pinto to Ek deal (6.7Mx8)
Find some to take Spurgeon
Find someone take Hartman
Sign Yurov
Extend Kaprizov(15Mx8)
Sign Marner (14.25Mx7) (Biggest contract given I a winger since Ovechkin)
1st + 2nd + Heidt for Alex Romanov (probably an overpay, but for arguments sake. He can be our Gavrikov).
Extend Romanov- 6.25M x8.
Sign Puljujarvi or pulju equivalent ~2M

Next season:
Kap(28, 9M)-Pinto(25,3.75M)-Zucc(50, 4.1M)
Boldy(25, 7M)-Yurov(22, ELC)-Marner(28, 14.25M)
Foligno(Old, 4M)-Ek(28, 5.25M)-Pulju(26, 2M)
Trenin(3.5M)-Freddy(2.1M)-Ohgren(22, ELC)

Romanov(26, 6.25M)-Faber(23. 8.5M)
Buium(20, ELC)-Brodin(32, 6M)
Middleton(30, 4.35M)-Jiricek(22, ELC)

Gus(27, 3.75M)
Wallstedt(23, 2.2M)

Extras:
Hinistroza or equivalent contract
Booger

Leaves us with 2M of wiggle room for underpricing, but I think those deals are mostly overpays to begin with.

The following year, I bridged Jiricek at 3.5Mx3, and Pinto/Kaprizov deals kicked in. We have 10M to fill 7 spots, one of those being a Gus extension if we are going to keep him. Brodin’s deal is very moveable at that point though, and you’d have to think Trenin could be bought out. So you could make it work.

Opens up a clear 5 year window with 2 Franchise forwards (Marner, Kaprizov), one elite forward (Boldy), 2 Top pair defenseman, possibly more (Buium, Faber), 2 Middle pair defenseman (Romanov, Jircek hopefully), Potential top 6 forwards (Yurov, Ohgren), and two young Starter+ caliber goalies (Gus, Wally hopefully. I still believe in him).
 
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Pinto or no pinto, it doesn’t really matter. If you want to give that same deal to Rossi, that’s ultimately fine with me as well. I think we have a real chance at a window opening up, but we need to 1. Retain Kaprizov, and 2. Get one more elite+ level player, think Boldy or better. These real cup contenders have 3 or 4 elite level forwards. Our 1-2 punch can only take us so far. Maybe that guy is Yurov, but I wouldn’t rely on that.
 
DemidovSaveUs said:
Pinto or no pinto, it doesn’t really matter. If you want to give that same deal to Rossi, that’s ultimately fine with me as well. I think we have a real chance at a window opening up, but we need to 1. Retain Kaprizov, and 2. Get one more elite+ level player, think Boldy or better. These real cup contenders have 3 or 4 elite level forwards. Our 1-2 punch can only take us so far. Maybe that guy is Yurov, but I wouldn’t rely on that.
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MacKinnon, Necas, Nichuskin
Rantanen, Johnston, Hintz, Robertson
Eichel, Stone, Hertl
Kucherov, Point, Hagel, Guentzel
Tkachuk, Barkov, Reinhart

Kaprizov, Boldy, Ek, _____

I really think we are closer than people think. We need better depth and people are going to hate to hear this, but more size. Our next group behind our stars is Rossi, Zuccarello. Too easy to play against. Compare that to Lundell, Marchand, Bennett who all are tough as nails and it’s clearly an issue. Or Nelson, Lehkonen, Coyle.
 
DigitalBoldy said:
Me too but you never know what a player is thinking.
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I'd ask, 'How bad does he want to spend half his career getting bounced in the first round of the playoffs.'

However, even if by some outlandish stroke of luck he did get traded and by an even more ridiculous margin, gets traded to the Wild...

He'd have to spend half his career doing the same thing here.
 
DemidovSaveUs said:
Rossi for Pinto, extend pinto to Ek deal (6.7Mx8)
Find some to take Spurgeon
Find someone take Hartman
Sign Yurov
Extend Kaprizov(15Mx8)
Sign Marner (14.25Mx7) (Biggest contract given I a winger since Ovechkin)
1st + 2nd + Heidt for Alex Romanov (probably an overpay, but for arguments sake. He can be our Gavrikov).
Extend Romanov- 6.25M x8.
Sign Puljujarvi or pulju equivalent ~2M
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I think I’m at the point of trading Spurgeon for a bag of pucks if it meant we could sign Marner.
 
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