Proposal: Toronto & Arizona (Chychrun)
- Thread starter rt
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Tasteless Beaver
Here for the hot takes
Chychrun at 50% would return a lot more than a lateish 1st and spare parts.
rt
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*Looks at “User Status” and…”yep, that checks out”.
rt
Clean Hits on Substack
For anyone interested, Fischer and Matthews are best friends: Matthews set to celebrate 100th game with old friends - TSN.ca
Chychrun and Capobianco are former Ontario League players.
Meanwhile, Knies is an Arizona native. And soon to be teammate of LIKELY Coyotes draft pick (hopefully) Logan Cooley.
Tasteless Beaver
Here for the hot takes
Do you have any valid arguments or no? I can think of a dozen NHL teams that would easily beat that.
rt
Clean Hits on Substack
Sorry OP… this is a garbage offer. I guess we can expect to see a bunch more silly proposals from Leaf fans over the next few days.
rt
Clean Hits on Substack
I’m not a Leafs fan. I dislike the Leafs strongly. I’ve been a die-hard Coyotes fan since 1996. I’ve watched at least 90% of the games they’ve ever played in their history.
If you think the proposal is too generous to Toronto, then suggest a change. What makes it more fair? Remove the retention from Chychrun? Does that balance it out?
If you’re actually a Coyotes fan, why would you make that deal? What does that deal do for the Coyotes given where they are at?
mouser
Business of Hockey
Too many pieces. Take out Capiobanco and Fischer. Take out Mrazek (or propose a second trade for him as a cap dump). Then rebalance your proposal for Chychrun would be my suggestion.
Coach Reggie Dunlop
Registered User
Horrible trade for Arizona, they take on a shit contract and lose a good player that they will be retaining on while only getting knies and a late first rounder. I bet a leafs fan made this.
rt
Clean Hits on Substack
“Given where they are at”? I assume you mean at the beginning of a full blown rebuild where they’ve been adding piles and piles of “futures” assets in exchange for established players like OEL, Garland, Kuemper, and Dvorak?
Or maybe by “where they are at” you mean evaluating the best place to trade Jakob Chychrun, who is very patiently and respectfully awaiting a trade that he has welcomed in the most professional way possible?
So given that they’re definitely trading Chychrun and that they’re definitely going to be looking for “futures” in return, I guess the answer to “what does that deal do for the Coyotes” is that it gives them a 1st round draft pick (last I checked, typically coveted by rebuilding teams), a high-end, bluechip prospect in Knies, and a young roster player who is a former 1st round pick and has some upside.
Mrazek and Holl are dumps. But they’re short term dumps. Arizona has shown a willingness to take on many of these types of short term dumps. Just last off-season they accepted Eriksson, Roussel, Beagle, Ladd, Gostisbehere, and Stralman. I’d say Mrazek and Holl fit perfectly into this category of unwanted player, who’s CapHit exceeds their on-ice value, but remaining term is two years or less.
Capobianco and Fischer are worthless. Just contracts. Zero trade value. I don’t care if they’re there or not. I don’t even want to re-sign them and waste the contract slots.
Mrazek is already proposed as a cap dump in this trade. That’s why he’s there. If he throws the value off too far and it seems AZ isn’t getting compensated fairly for absorbing his crappy contract, then I’d prefer to leave him in the deal and nix the retention on Chychrun, instead.
No. They take on TWO shit contracts. And they get Knies, a late first rounder AND Sandin.
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rt
Clean Hits on Substack
The people poo-pooing this should have seen what Boston fans were offering closer to the deadline. Or the whole Knight + Tippett for Chychrun rumor.
Sandin helps us now, and would be a great bridge piece for the team. He will make it much easier to move Gostisbehere at the deadline, something that our GM seemed hesitant to do this year despite Ghost having a career year.
We have so much draft capital but right now our additional 1sts look like they will be picks 30-32 rather than in the 20's. We also have four 2nds. If we want to get back into the teens I think it will take multiple 2nds to do so from pick 31. A pick in the late 20's could be bundled with pick 31/32 to get into the late teens to get another one of "our guys".
Knies has that hometown factor but also seems to be exactly what Armstrong is looking for in a player. Many on the AZ board were hoping for Slafkovsky, but since that most likely wont happen Knies would be a nice consolation prize.
I think we could do better than this, especially when taking back Mrazek and retaining. But at the end of the day BA has made it all but clear that Chychrun is going to be moved, to the point where the other GM's most likely have leverage.
LAK weren't willing to put in Clarke. NYR said the asking price was too much. FLA went for Giroux instead. Going to be interesting to see what he gets moved for, but value wise it this wouldn't upset me.
Sandin helps us now, and would be a great bridge piece for the team. He will make it much easier to move Gostisbehere at the deadline, something that our GM seemed hesitant to do this year despite Ghost having a career year.
We have so much draft capital but right now our additional 1sts look like they will be picks 30-32 rather than in the 20's. We also have four 2nds. If we want to get back into the teens I think it will take multiple 2nds to do so from pick 31. A pick in the late 20's could be bundled with pick 31/32 to get into the late teens to get another one of "our guys".
Knies has that hometown factor but also seems to be exactly what Armstrong is looking for in a player. Many on the AZ board were hoping for Slafkovsky, but since that most likely wont happen Knies would be a nice consolation prize.
I think we could do better than this, especially when taking back Mrazek and retaining. But at the end of the day BA has made it all but clear that Chychrun is going to be moved, to the point where the other GM's most likely have leverage.
LAK weren't willing to put in Clarke. NYR said the asking price was too much. FLA went for Giroux instead. Going to be interesting to see what he gets moved for, but value wise it this wouldn't upset me.
rt
Clean Hits on Substack
[REMIX] *digital airhorn record skipping sound*
To Toronto
Chychrun (full price - 4.6aav)
To Arizona
Mrazek (3.8aav)
Holl (2.00aav)
Sandin (RFA)
Knies
‘22 1st
To Toronto
Chychrun (full price - 4.6aav)
To Arizona
Mrazek (3.8aav)
Holl (2.00aav)
Sandin (RFA)
Knies
‘22 1st
If this is your price, the Canucks offer Hoglander, Rathbone and the 2022 1st for Chychrun at 50%.
Big bonus if we can send more back to get OEL back in your hands. In that case, retention wouldn't be necessary.
Big bonus if we can send more back to get OEL back in your hands. In that case, retention wouldn't be necessary.
rt
Clean Hits on Substack
MMC
Global Moderator
Leaf Fans
Registered User
- Sep 29, 2017
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Sure, that is why the OP didn't include spare parts.
Pepper
Registered User
- Aug 30, 2004
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- 274
Mrazek, Holl are pure cap dumps with negative value. I don't think Sandin has much value. Late 1st rounder and unsigned prospect is a very poor return for the Yotes.
I can't think of a single reason why Yotes would accept that, it's horrible IMHO.
rt
Clean Hits on Substack
Do it!
Sandin doesn’t have much value? Why do you think that? I guess he’s similar value to JJ Moser or Victor Soderstrom. Somewhere in that same zone.
Knies would be Arizona’s 2nd best prospect today. After the Coyotes selected Logan Cooley, then Knies would be their 3rd best prospect.
Of course Mrazek and Holl are dumps. That’s why they’re in the deal.
Peter Griffin
Registered User
Pepper
Registered User
- Aug 30, 2004
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Sandin is a nice smallish left-shooting d-man, I can see him being worth a late 2nd - early 3rd or so, if he was playing in Nashville or Arizona nobody would talk about him.
Knies is unsigned and he can potentially walk without any return in 3 years, is Yotes in a place to take that risk even though Knies is from Arizona?
Chychrun at 50% is very valuable and Yotes would most likely get much better return from other teams.
Honestly, value is fair (especially with retention on Chychrun which AZ might as well do to extract maximal value on him), but I think the deal breaker here is Sandin — not because he’s better than JC or because of the value, but because the Leafs really need to be adding to their D while not simultaneously he subtracting from it…
Epecially because Muzzin will not be long for TOR whether that’s due to age/contract/cap/health and you have to assume one way another he’s gone in 2 years when his contract is up (if not before).
Additionally, the Leafs really need RHD more than LHD, so swapping one (Sandin) for another (Chychrun) isn’t worth giving Sandin up for. Because although JC is better now, they still see Sandin as a top 4 guy perhaps as soon as next season. While JC is a better player, they may not feel the delta between JF and Sandin is worth losing Knies for. So do they see JC playing RHD for them?
I just don’t think TOR is a good trade partner for Chychrun.
Perhaps BOTH the Coyotes (Chychrun) and Leafs have the same team that would be an ideal trade partner for them, the LA Kings:
1) Chychrun to LAK for a package built around Helge Grans, 1st round pick and a F prospect (one of Turcotte, Chromiak, Villardi, Kupari, Madden, Anderson-Dolan)
2) Sandin+ to LAK for Sean Durzi+
LAK get TWO LHD which fills their organizational need, while keeping the trio of Doughty/Clarke/Faber on RD which are their top 3 RHD (besides Durzi) for the next several years.
And each the Coyotes and Leafs get a RHD which is a need for each team organizationally.
Now THAT is a good idea all around….if I may say that for myself and Pat myself on the back lol
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