Rumor: TOR and John Tavares close to a deal: 3 years at 7 million

[Racer88]

Yes: Leafs management.

Anyone that’s not delusional…..anyone…….anyone

 

[thewave]

They did it for Tanev. There must be a reason if they do not do it for Tavares. Maybe Tavares needs the money now so he can repay the CRA?

Lol probably.

Ok so we would have him for 4 years - 6 years 4.5m deferred? If the cap hit is actually 7m that is terrible for us

Yes: Leafs management.

It's got to be that defferal loophole. Marner should not come back no matter what. JT for a capnhit of like 4m may be OK considering what's available and the assets we have to spend. (Nothing)

 

[ToneDog]

Lol probably.

Ok so we would have him for 4 years - 6 years 4.5m deferred? If the cap hit is actually 7m that is terrible for us

Guessing they are looking at the rising cap and thinking it can work with JT making $7m. It is pretty much his market value. Hoping we would squeeze him from a significant discount is a pipe dream, just like not overpaying any of the 3 amigos.

 

[thewave]

Guessing they are looking at the rising cap and thinking it can work with JT making $7m. It is pretty much his market value. Hoping we would squeeze him from a significant discount is a pipe dream, just like not overpaying any of the 3 amigos.

Too old. 7m for 1 year only, what do they want to waste this whole rebuild?

 

[Fogelhund]

They did it for Tanev. There must be a reason if they do not do it for Tavares. Maybe Tavares needs the money now so he can repay the CRA?

Tavares has career earnings over $100mil. If he hasn't enough savings to cover whatever CRA wants, he should fire his financial advice team.

 

[ToneDog]

Too old. 7m for 1 year only, what do they want to waste this whole rebuild?

They wasted the rebuild the minute they handed the keys to a rookie GM who had his head in the clouds and was way in over his head. Tre probably has orders to keep doubling down on this core, so the Shanahan era will go down as another Leafs bust.

 

[Canadian Finn]

another perfect decision.

lets make sure we have all four core components all tied up.

to the moon alice.

 

[hotpaws]

I mean, 21 million over three years isn't grossly overpaid. In fact, as you can see if you actually pay attention to comparables, it's a little bit less than market value (if we looked at the cap from 2019-20 and now, probably significantly less).



Again, it's not a gross overpay, it's actually a little less than market for a player of his production and his age.

As said before, objectivity is not easy to come by in Leafs Nation.

ETA: Just for funsies, a less productive Joe Pavelski got 8.6% of the salary cap in 2019-20. This, based on the project cap next year, would be 7.3%. Anze Kopitar was 8% of the cap (and three years older than Tavares when he signed that).

Tampa according to reports offered SS 3m on a long term deal , they basically told him him thanks for your service including taking an actual discount on your last deal but we'd rather try to improve the team instead of running it back with a declining player . Kopitar is and has always been a much better all around player than JT and he was a major reason they won 2 cup in his tenure there.

Pavelski was also a much better all around player then JT and surprisingly aged extremely well justifying his deal with the Stars gave him as a ufa , JT is free to go sell himself to the highest bidder as a ufa like Pav did but i'm not going to base what he's worth to the Leafs considering he's failed for his 6 yrs in the playoffs on what he may get in the ufa market .

 

[hotpaws]

If you honestly have watched Stamkos, and JT the last few years, and are comparing them as similar.... hmmm. alright. Enough said. Terrible take.

they've never been the similar players, in fact Stamkos was producing much better than JT has , my point was their production was in inflated by playing with elite players

the Tampa GM realized this , too bad many in our fan base don't

 

[Gallagbi]

Opposite of the vision the rookie sold Shanahan. Small, soft. skill and weak goaltending does not win in the playoffs.

It's funny, this roster doesn't feel all that big or mean to me. Probably why I struggle with articulating the vision that seems to still be largely core 4 based

 

[Fogelhund]

they've never been the similar players, in fact Stamkos was producing much better than JT has , my point was their production was in inflated by playing with elite players

the Tampa GM realized this , too bad many in our fan base don't

So you actually haven't watched Stamkos much then? In all seriousness, he is a bad player now at 5v5. I've watched Stamkos for a few games the past few years, and I wouldn't have offered him a league minimum contract this past year. He doesn't do anything, he's terrible offensively, except a shot, and he doesn't do defense at all. He can't play C. Stamkos has no points in seven games, is a -10 over that period. He was -26 last year (regular season and playoffs) He has one even strength point in the last 11 games. His play time is being cut slowly, and it's likely he's bought out, or ends up on the 4th line soon and used as a PP specialist.

While playing with elite players, certainly does help with production, these two are not close to comparable. Stamkos isn't just not that good, he's terrible now. I'd rather have Holmberg in the lineup....

Tavares meanwhile is 27th in the league, for listed C's in scoring... probably top 20 if you remove the "C's" who don't play C. He's near the tops in the league in faceoffs.. I'm not sure if you realize it, but Tavares is nearly PPG this season. I mean, he's legitimately having a good season. You aren't replacing Tavares with a Holmberg, or Domi and getting near the same results.

His next pay should reflect his age, and decline in play... but if you think this is a player who compares to the Stamkos situation at all... you either haven't watched Stamkos, or are judging Tavares incorrectly. Tavares was in consideration for Team Canada, but wasn't selected... I guess they don't know what they are doing either.

 

[Mugzy97]

Tavares is only 34 and not turning 35 until September. He’s not as old as some people make him out to be.

 

[JT AM da real deal]

That's a lot for a slow 3rd line LWer .. I would pass

 

[NVious]

So you actually haven't watched Stamkos much then? In all seriousness, he is a bad player now at 5v5. I've watched Stamkos for a few games the past few years, and I wouldn't have offered him a league minimum contract this past year. He doesn't do anything, he's terrible offensively, except a shot, and he doesn't do defense at all. He can't play C. Stamkos has no points in seven games, is a -10 over that period. He was -26 last year (regular season and playoffs) He has one even strength point in the last 11 games. His play time is being cut slowly, and it's likely he's bought out, or ends up on the 4th line soon and used as a PP specialist.

While playing with elite players, certainly does help with production, these two are not close to comparable. Stamkos isn't just not that good, he's terrible now. I'd rather have Holmberg in the lineup....

Tavares meanwhile is 27th in the league, for listed C's in scoring... probably top 20 if you remove the "C's" who don't play C. He's near the tops in the league in faceoffs.. I'm not sure if you realize it, but Tavares is nearly PPG this season. I mean, he's legitimately having a good season. You aren't replacing Tavares with a Holmberg, or Domi and getting near the same results.

His next play should reflect his age, and decline in play... but if you think this is a player who compares to the Stamkos situation at all... you either haven't watched Stamkos, or are judging Tavares incorrectly. Tavares was in consideration for Team Canada, but wasn't selected... I guess they don't know what they are doing either.

Tavares ranks 36th in g/pg in the playoffs and 44th in pts/pg in the playoffs.

This was in his prime years, playing with prime Marner/Matthews/Nylander who in season are arguably the best trio in the NHL. Tavares was basically the 50th-60th best in the NHL come playoff time while having one of the biggest contracts/being in/around his prime and playing with arguably the best offensive trio in the NHL.

Good for him for having a good season, but in the same way that we took a massive haircut on his playoff results (performing at around a 6-7 million dollar player), it's time for him to take a haircut and not selfishly put himself first because at this point:
1.Season means nothing
2.He did nothing for us in the playoffs
3.He has a ton of help and isn't carrying anything on his own
4.He has no leverage
5.Apparently he wants to win??? (doubtful)

Or he can go to Detroit and probably get 8x4 from Yzerman. Or if he wins us a cup and has a massive run he can get that here for all I care, but is that really gonna happen? Well considering at one point he was in conversations with Crosby/Malkin/Ovechkin and got paid like them, it should have, but it didn't.

So what exactly has he done to earn "market value?" Aka what some dumb team will overpay him to?

Winning? No
Deep runs? No
Amazing individual seasons? Lol no

So if he wants to bring a cup to Toronto, time to prove it and take a haircut, if not, enjoy Detroit.

 

[ToneDog]

Tampa according to reports offered SS 3m on a long term deal , they basically told him him thanks for your service including taking an actual discount on your last deal but we'd rather try to improve the team instead of running it back with a declining player . Kopitar is and has always been a much better all around player than JT and he was a major reason they won 2 cup in his tenure there.

Pavelski was also a much better all around player then JT and surprisingly aged extremely well justifying his deal with the Stars gave him as a ufa , JT is free to go sell himself to the highest bidder as a ufa like Pav did but i'm not going to base what he's worth to the Leafs considering he's failed for his 6 yrs in the playoffs on what he may get in the ufa market .

Adding Geutzel for $1.5m more than what Stamkos got from Nashville is a brilliant move. It is what I would do with Tavares. Spend a bit more to get a younger, better player.

 

[ToneDog]

Tavares ranks 36th in g/pg in the playoffs and 44th in pts/pg in the playoffs.

This was in his prime years, playing with prime Marner/Matthews/Nylander who in season are arguably the best trio in the NHL. Tavares was basically the 50th-60th best in the NHL come playoff time while having one of the biggest contracts/being in/around his prime and playing with arguably the best offensive trio in the NHL.

Good for him for having a good season, but in the same way that we took a massive haircut on his playoff results (performing at around a 6-7 million dollar player), it's time for him to take a haircut and not selfishly put himself first because at this point:
1.Season means nothing
2.He did nothing for us in the playoffs
3.He has a ton of help and isn't carrying anything on his own
4.He has no leverage
5.Apparently he wants to win??? (doubtful)

Or he can go to Detroit and probably get 8x4 from Yzerman. Or if he wins us a cup and has a massive run he can get that here for all I care, but is that really gonna happen? Well considering at one point he was in conversations with Crosby/Malkin/Ovechkin and got paid like them, it should have, but it didn't.

So what exactly has he done to earn "market value?" Aka what some dumb team will overpay him to?

Winning? No
Deep runs? No
Amazing individual seasons? Lol no

So if he wants to bring a cup to Toronto, time to prove it and take a haircut, if not, enjoy Detroit.

JT and Marner can go get their money in Chicago and play on a line with Bedard. There's another galaxy brain named Kyle in Chicago handing out millions to Foligno, Perry, Mrazak etc.

 

[mjd1001]

This might turn into a bit of an overpay in year 2 and/or 3, but the 3 years make sense.

Matthews, Domi and OEL are here for just 3 more seasons.

In the 4th year (when this deal is done), Matthews, Domi, and OEL might be gone, or will be on new contracts. Nylander will be turning 31, Marner (if he's here) will be 30, and Reilly 33. This teams window is NOW. This year and next and the next.

If there was every a point in your 'cup window' to sign an aging-but-still-productive player this is it.

 

[Fogelhund]

Adding Geutzel for $1.5m more than what Stamkos got from Nashville is a brilliant move. It is what I would do with Tavares. Spend a bit more to get a younger, better player.

Awesome... and TB had that opportunity as Guentzel was a UFA who could be signed.

So who is the better younger C for us to sign?

 

[ToneDog]

Awesome... and TB had that opportunity as Guentzel was a UFA who could be signed.

So who is the better younger C for us to sign?

That's the trick. Bennett is the obvious answer if he is available. You could also put Tavares' $11m cap hit plus another $1.5m towards Rantanen or a Chychrun. Hell you should be able to sign Ranta and Chychrun with the money Mitch and Tavares free up.

 

[ToneDog]

Tavares @ 7m or Ehlers or Boeser @ $8+m?

 

[Fogelhund]

That's the trick. Bennett is the obvious answer if he is available. You could also put Tavares' $11m cap hit plus another $1.5m towards Rantanen or a Chychrun. Hell you should be able to sign Ranta and Chychrun with the money Mitch and Tavares free up.

I said better. Bennett isn't that, and based on play style, he's going to have the same time line regression as Tavares, and probably worse. I'll go so far as say, Bennett will never have a year with more points than Tavares... unless Tavares is injured or retires.

There is NOT a younger, better C available than Tavares as a Free Agent, like Tampa had with Guentzel. Your only option is to hope one becomes available as a trade... the Tampa situation does not apply here.

I'm all for signing Chychrun, and moving on from Rielly.

Rantanen is an interesting one. You bring up the point of playing with stars, and padding stats, and then point to Rantanen as someone to replace Tavares/Marner in the lineup. Rantanen has TWO points in SIX games away from his buddies in Colorado. You might want to think twice on that one.

Tavares @ 7m or Ehlers or Boeser @ $8+m?

A C, or another expensive winger? That can't be serious.

 

[Jmo89]

JT isn't worth the risk at 7M. He's putting up decent numbers and those numbers will likely be in line of what a 7M player brings, but they would be better off going after someone younger and long-term.

It would be different if JT ushered in an age of success in the playoffs and was a playoff warrior but he's been largely average. I don't even have an issue with the JT signing (the issue was the RFA contracts that followed) but it's time to move on if he doesn't want to take a steep discount.

As an aside, I was softening a bit on Marner but seeing him in this tournament and hearing how he wants to extract every dollar he can I think the Leafs will be better served moving on. These guys haven't gotten it done when it matters. They don't deserve the contracts they're asking.

Who knows, maybe Mcdavid goes to FA Summer of 2026.

 

[ToneDog]

I said better. Bennett isn't that, and based on play style, he's going to have the same time line regression as Tavares, and probably worse. I'll go so far as say, Bennett will never have a year with more points than Tavares... unless Tavares is injured or retires.

There is NOT a younger, better C available than Tavares as a Free Agent, like Tampa had with Guentzel. Your only option is to hope one becomes available as a trade... the Tampa situation does not apply here.

I'm all for signing Chychrun, and moving on from Rielly.

Rantanen is an interesting one. You bring up the point of playing with stars, and padding stats, and then point to Rantanen as someone to replace Tavares/Marner in the lineup. Rantanen has TWO points in SIX games away from his buddies in Colorado. You might want to think twice on that one.


A C, or another expensive winger? That can't be serious.

Let's give Ranta a bit more time before we write him off. You are the same guy who told me we should not give up on a prospect too early when I said Holmberg was crap and here you are questioning a stud after 6 games.

$8m with a rising cap is not expensive for a winger. $13+m is expensive for a soft winger.

 

[hotpaws]

Awesome... and TB had that opportunity as Guentzel was a UFA who could be signed.

So who is the better younger C for us to sign?

why are you so terrified at the thought of letting Mumbles walk , we can just as easily lose in the first rd without him as we have with him

but maybe and this is a scary thought , we can drastically improve without him just like the Islanders did when he walked out on them !

 

[NVious]

JT isn't worth the risk at 7M. He's putting up decent numbers and those numbers will likely be in line of what a 7M player brings, but they would be better off going after someone younger and long-term.

It would be different if JT ushered in an age of success in the playoffs and was a playoff warrior but he's been largely average. I don't even have an issue with the JT signing (the issue was the RFA contracts that followed) but it's time to move on if he doesn't want to take a steep discount.

As an aside, I was softening a bit on Marner but seeing him in this tournament and hearing how he wants to extract every dollar he can I think the Leafs will be better served moving on. These guys haven't gotten it done when it matters. They don't deserve the contracts they're asking.

Who knows, maybe Mcdavid goes to FA Summer of 2026.

I'd rather try Bennet at 8 and Rantanen at 13 than Marner at 12 and Tavares at 7. Proven hard nosed winners who have performed when it mattered most vs soft overpaid losers that are STILL trying to nickle and dime the f*** out of the team.

At least it's TRYING something different vs overpaying the same sad bozos.