Leafaholix said:
Neither fit the description of mid to late first rounders.
So I have to pick a player who was a mid to late 1st round pick who was playing on a contender who is the same age or younger than Carlo?
Colaiacovo's injuries during camp (10 days or so) gave Kondratiev enough time to leave an impression. We have established Morrisonn already. The only other player that fits the description of a mid to late 1st round pick who is playing on a contender is Mark Stuart. That is why I had to go deeper in the draft.
Leafaholix said:
He was the last cut from the blue line last year, considering he had a pretty bad injury, Carlo made a serious bid for that spot.
The injury was obviously not that bad considereing he was only out 10 days. Blowing an ACL is a bad injury, Quinn called his injury a "tweak".
Leafaholix said:
Sullivan was really good NHL player at the age of 25, Pat Quinn messed it up and let him go. That had nothing to do with development.
Actually, Sullivan is a bad example, he was developed by the Devils.
Leafaholix said:
Modin was doing well in his first 3 seasons as a NHL player and was traded away because he was far too inconsistent and could have gone two ways, up or down... and from the looks of his play from night to night, it was impossible to predict he'd be a really good top 6 forward.
What? Consistancy is not a developement trait?
Leafaholix said:
Mike Johnson... same guy the Leafs plucked out of the NCAA as an UFA? Same guy that was a ROY candidate? Same Mike Johnson that had 120 points in his first two and a half years as a Leaf? I'd say the Maple Leafs developed him from nothing to a NHL top 6 forward.
Johnson was signed, came in for his first full season and had a great year. He was not developed by the leafs when he was signed as a free agent. Much like Kaberle, after his first year, he didn't get any better under Quinn.
Leafaholix said:
Jason Smith was a top 4 defenseman in Toronto, Pat Quinn didn't stunt his development, but he had a personal problem with Jason and decided to trade him. That wasn't poor player development, it was poor management.
Smith was developed by the Devils, and under Quinn he did not get any better. He then went over to the Oilers and turned his career around. I do agree Quinn dropped the ball on this one thoguh and it had more to do with Quinn's not liking him than his play.
Leafaholix said:
Alyn McCauley would be the only guy that was developed poorly. The coaching didn't help his game and the players infront of him in the lineup affected his growth.
He had 51 points in 65 games as a rookie in the AHL, the Leafs traded him when his value was high. When he was the top prospect. The fact that he's managed only 1 NHL game during his departure has nothing to do with Toronto. He may have been hyped a lot more following his draft, but that's natural. Many folks like you overhype new players and when they're not in the NHL at the age of 20, you automatically assume they were "better prospects" a couple years ago.
I think Boyes was a better prospect a draft, hype had nothing to so with it. Oh, and as for the "many folks like you" part, can you give me some examples?
Leafaholix said:
He has the potential to be a first line forward, but I'd say it's unlikely. He's more likely a good 2nd liner to a great 3rd line player, especially on top teams in the NHL. I also agree, Joe Nieuwendyk carried the line and Ponikarovsky was the better of the two last season.
Well, we seem to be closing the gap anyways.
Leafaholix said:
So you admit they haven't drafted well, I guess that contradicts your argument about player development being the major weak spot. Because how can you develop players when you start with little talent?
Not really, you can do both poorly. I am not saying they have dropped the ball with Carlo, I just don't think his stock is where it was before.
Leafaholix said:
Since 2001 the drafting has been very good. Since 2002 it's been top notch, atleast compared to what we've seen over the last 25 years.
The leafs 2002 draft looks pretty good, but I think saying the 2003 and 2004 draft is a success is very premature.