30 games in the fall is a good little start.
it's the 300 before that that keep him out of my top 20 D
And everyone's top 10.
Top 10 defensemen
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it's the 300 before that that keep him out of my top 20 D
And everyone's top 10.
Phrasing
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- Nov 16, 2007
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when the team stinks this bad.....you always have to look at the core.
Fox's rep and how he is playing this season - huge gap
benfranklin
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Without looking at others posts first:
1. Cale Makar
intentional space
2. Zach Werenski
3. Adam Fox
4. Josh Morrissey
5. Quinn Hughes
6. Roman Josi
7. Victor Hedman
8. Rasmun Dahlin
9. Douglie Hamilton
10. Miro Heiskanen
HM
Slavin for actual defense
Toews for balanced, non-pp
McAvoy
Sergachev
Bouchard for PP specialist
Carlson for old man still doing it
1. Cale Makar
intentional space
2. Zach Werenski
3. Adam Fox
4. Josh Morrissey
5. Quinn Hughes
6. Roman Josi
7. Victor Hedman
8. Rasmun Dahlin
9. Douglie Hamilton
10. Miro Heiskanen
HM
Slavin for actual defense
Toews for balanced, non-pp
McAvoy
Sergachev
Bouchard for PP specialist
Carlson for old man still doing it
I think Fox is being unfairly punished for the Rangers being such a mess in general right now. Virtually anyone he plays with is completely underwater when they're out there on the ice without him.
hockeyviz.com
NYR 2425 Fox With-or-Without You
Visualizations and predictions for understanding hockey.
hockeyviz.com
Machinehead
HFNYR MVP
Not to mentionI think Fox is being unfairly punished for the Rangers being such a mess in general right now. Virtually anyone he plays with is completely underwater when they're out there on the ice without him.
NYR 2425 Fox With-or-Without You
Visualizations and predictions for understanding hockey.
Yeah, what Lindgren does to Fox's numbers when paired with him vs. without him the last two years is a war crime.
Machinehead
HFNYR MVP
He's not having his best year, but he went from like, 1B in the world to the clear #3. It's not that deep.
Any Rangers fan that suggests anything beyond that hates him because he's short.
nowhereman
Registered User
Hughes is the best defenseman in NHL. And Werenski, Fox and Morrissey are not on his level.
Hallonbroder
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- Nov 29, 2024
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Like, this season, or? If it’s this season, what’s Fox doing on these lists? If it’s in general, what’s Werenski doing on them?
Right now, I think it’s between Hughes and Heiskanen (this season)
Right now, I think it’s between Hughes and Heiskanen (this season)
benfranklin
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I disagree strongly compared to Makar.
The other 3 I can see the argument. Hughes is more offensive, but the others IMO arent far behind and drastically better defensively.
You argument is decent at first looking at this season only, then sure the Rangers woes have dragged Fox down a bit. Can say the same about teh Blue Jackets in general. They've never been good and Werenski is the one consistent bright spot there and especially this season.
But then you double down on Heiskanen who offensively is having an awful season compared to his peers.
So no idea what you're going off of. A mix of the past 5 years and this season?
nucks88
Registered User
Appears you made this list without looking at any hockey games first as well….
benfranklin
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Feel free to argue it without being an obvious Canucks fan who will make it a Makar vs Hughes thing.
I feel like I went at it objectively looking at analytics, both offense and defense, zone start %'s, this year and the previous few years, as well as hypothetically if theyre underachieving or overachieving because of the teams they are on (Dahlin on the Panthers or Hughes on the Sharks).
Czechboy
Náš f*cken barák!
- Apr 15, 2018
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I'm going to Echo this list.. pretty much what I'd say.
Is Dobson on a down year (I don't follow the Isles)... felt like he was making some of these lists last year.
I'm not watching enough hockey these days to make a proper list)
A lot of statwatching only helps in evaluating defs for fantasy leagues.
benfranklin
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Easy to stat watch too and make a best dman list without taking into account actual defense. Not saying you, but many posters. IE Bouchard anywhere on any list.
Driving me insane people are putting Bouchard on some of these lists and faber no where to be seen
- Oct 13, 2018
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Wait until the playoffs, there's just too many teams to watch everyone. That's when people take note.
nucks88
Registered User
Well keep fighting your fight …. The vast majority of hockey fans disagree with your assertions but you do you….Makar and Hughes have distanced themselves from the rest of the pack significantly…this isn’t a discussion regarding just them it is a list of the top 10 Dmen…
Makar
Fox
Q. Hughes
L. Hughes
Josi
Hedman
Heiskanen
Werenski
Morrissey
Dahlin
Fox
Q. Hughes
L. Hughes
Josi
Hedman
Heiskanen
Werenski
Morrissey
Dahlin
Ace of Hades
#Demko4Vezina
1. Quinn Hughes
2. Cale Makar
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3. Adam Fox
4. Miro Heiskanen
5. Roman Josi
6. Josh Morrisey
7. Jaccob Slavin
8. Charlie McAvoy
9. Viktor Hedman
10. Zach Werenski
2. Cale Makar
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3. Adam Fox
4. Miro Heiskanen
5. Roman Josi
6. Josh Morrisey
7. Jaccob Slavin
8. Charlie McAvoy
9. Viktor Hedman
10. Zach Werenski
Ratsreign
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- Mar 12, 2018
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Not enough points scored to make top 10 defender lists
benfranklin
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Predictable response from a nucks fan. You guys can’t help get off to the Hughes vs Makar debate.
I’d still take Fox over Hughes. Rangers are having their issues obv, but that’s not enough to discount what Fox has been for 4 years now. Hughes offense has greatly improved but comes at the expense of him playing actual defense. Analytics prove he receives sheltered o zone starts where Fox and Makar have upped their D zone starts in recent years.
- Oct 9, 2012
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Stat watchers. If people actually watched his defensive play they would know better.
benfranklin
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Like Heiskanen, it is a pathetic amount of points for how good of a team he’s on, so yes, not even close to the current top 10 list.
