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Player Discussion Tony DeAngelo (MOD WARNINGS: Post #12/#900)

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Vinny DeAngelo said:
Ahhh I see what you did there... you’re a funny guy
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I mean it explains it pretty well no? It's less of a prejudice than playing on the offside for a defenseman makes playing defense a bit harder, so if they are already weak on the defensive side of things, it's not the "old boys club" keeping him down.

I also like the "he's one of our best D prospects".

It's similar to when marketers start doing the "one of the best family thrillers of the season". They might not be wrong. What is a "family thriller"? Are family thrillers good? Is it actually the best family thriller, or are there better family thrillers?


Anyway, what's your take on ADA?
 
ReggieDunlop68 said:
I mean it explains it pretty well no? It's less of a prejudice than playing on the offside for a defenseman makes playing defense a bit harder, so if they are already weak on the defensive side of things, it's not the "old boys club" keeping him down.

I also like the "he's one of our best D prospects".

It's similar to when marketers start doing the "one of the best family thrillers of the season". They might not be wrong. What is a "family thriller"? Are family thrillers good? Is it actually the best family thriller, or are there better family thrillers?


Anyway, what's your take on ADA?
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His greatest value for the rangers is playing on the ice. He has an undeniable skill-set. And like every other prospect in history he has to prove he can stick and grow off his mistakes at the big level. I don’t think he’s been given that chance, yet.
 
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The ADA subplot is really intriguing but the writers should give us more clues about what's happening off-screen.
 
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I thought this quote from today's article The Athletic was interesting:

“Tony knows what he needs to do,” Quinn said. “We’ve had good conversations and he understands what’s expected of him and he knows what he needs to do to get back in the lineup.”

I think there are a few angles beyond the benefits that DeAngelo would get from more ice time that are worth considering:

1) Quinn is responsible for building the team's culture. If he plays players who aren't practicing as hard, playing with as much effort, or committing to the team / system as much as other players are simply because they are younger and have more natural talent, what kind of message does that send everyone else on the team? Over the next 2-5 years of the rebuild, what is better for the development of our young players? Having a culture where players understand that they need to practice hard, play with effort, and commit to the team to get playing time or getting our young players ice time regardless of their effort and commitment to their own development?

2) Will DeAngelo develop better if he gets more ice time but faces less rigorous repercussions for not taking steps forward in his development or if he gets less ice time but faces more rigorous repercussions for not taking steps forward in his development?

At the least, it seems like Quinn isn't mindlessly deciding to play vets over younger players but has specific goals with DeAngelo that he is trying to use ice time as a means to achieve.
 
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The above quote from Quinn sounds like he has had multiple failed conversations with ADA.
 
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kid cant seem to get a real shot. and with staal here and the rest of the defense healthy and paying well, he wont.

if theres and injury, especially to pionk or shatty, hell play.

again, hes a righty on a righty heavy defense.

i guess at this point, its patience and working hard in practice. ive no doubt when he plays, his skillset will show what hes capable of.

honestly, pionk has been good. he deserves to play. but its not like its made a difference.

31 yr old marc staal has played in every game. let that marinate for a bit.....
 
8 games, ~10% of season

DeAngelo ~38 minutes (~16 mins without Staal)

Hope he can do whatever it is the coach is referring to, which I assume is to bare knuckle fight McQuaid and win by knockout with whichever hand he chooses to be tied behind his back.
 
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Inferno said:
Pionk is weird...the eye test is a lot better than the advanced stats....but even the eye test isn't that great. He makes a ton of God awful plays that basically nobody cares because he's not DeAngelo.

So weird.
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This is the strange thing... They shouldnt be competing against one another.. Thats poor management. Both these guys should be skating and if one has to go long term make the move then. No reason veteran filler Dmen should be playing above them
 
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Buchnevich89 said:
Referring to mainly our coaching staff and FO:

DeAngelo makes a defensive mistake: “There it is. He’s too one dimensional. He needs to sit.”

Any other defenseman makes the same mistake: *crickets*
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Eh IDK. I mean they benched Shattenkirk, their "marquee" defenseman, because he wasn't "right mentally" and wasn't "skating right" and all that. They've had Pionk out of the lineup for a couple games. I guess they could bench Skjei, who has made some mistakes. And then there's Staal, but I don't think that's necessarily in the hands of the coaches at this point.

But beyond any of that, I don't think the coaching staff has said he's too one-dimensional. I think you're conflating what people here say and what the coaching staff says. All we've actually heard from Quinn regarding ADA is that "We've had conversations, he knows what he needs to do to get back on the ice," which implies--to me--that whatever is preventing him from getting in games is either off-ice or related to practice, or some other habits. Maybe not, but that's sure what it sounds like.
 
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nyr2k2 said:
Eh IDK. I mean they benched Shattenkirk, their "marquee" defenseman, because he wasn't "right mentally" and wasn't "skating right" and all that. They've had Pionk out of the lineup for a couple games. I guess they could bench Skjei, who has made some mistakes. And then there's Staal, but I don't think that's necessarily in the hands of the coaches at this point.

But beyond any of that, I don't think the coaching staff has said he's too one-dimensional. I think you're conflating what people here say and what the coaching staff says. All we've actually heard from Quinn regarding ADA is that "We've had conversations, he knows what he needs to do to get back on the ice," which implies--to me--that whatever is preventing him from getting in games is either off-ice or related to practice, or some other habits. Maybe not, but that's sure what it sounds like.
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With all of this said and given that there was talk of off-ice issues in the past, this seems like the most plausible explanation. And if that's the case, keep him off the ice until he does what he needs to do.
 
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nyr2k2 said:
Eh IDK. I mean they benched Shattenkirk, their "marquee" defenseman, because he wasn't "right mentally" and wasn't "skating right" and all that. They've had Pionk out of the lineup for a couple games. I guess they could bench Skjei, who has made some mistakes. And then there's Staal, but I don't think that's necessarily in the hands of the coaches at this point.

But beyond any of that, I don't think the coaching staff has said he's too one-dimensional. I think you're conflating what people here say and what the coaching staff says. All we've actually heard from Quinn regarding ADA is that "We've had conversations, he knows what he needs to do to get back on the ice," which implies--to me--that whatever is preventing him from getting in games is either off-ice or related to practice, or some other habits. Maybe not, but that's sure what it sounds like.
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Fair point, but every other defenseman seems to have a 1-2 game benching and they are back. It feels different with Tony. It doesn’t feel like they are rushing to get him back in the lineup, whereas with Pionk and Shattenkirk, they wanted them back ASAP.
 
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Buchnevich89 said:
Fair point, but every other defenseman seems to have a 1-2 game benching and they are back. It feels different with Tony. It doesn’t feel like they are rushing to get him back in the lineup, whereas with Pionk and Shattenkirk, they wanted them back ASAP.
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Yeah, I don't disagree. Which is why when you take that, and factor in the way Quinn described the situation, I'm led to believe there's more to the situation that it just being him making mistakes in his bad game.
 
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Buchnevich89 said:
Fair point, but every other defenseman seems to have a 1-2 game benching and they are back. It feels different with Tony. It doesn’t feel like they are rushing to get him back in the lineup, whereas with Pionk and Shattenkirk, they wanted them back ASAP.
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We don't really know what's going on behind the scenes. The most likely answer though is that those other players have shown in practice that they got the message, whereas ADA has not. I mean, we can come up with all types of conspiracy theories, but Quinn said it himself. ADA knows what he needs to do. Does he have a poor attitude? Is he dogging it in practice? Does he make the same mistake over and over again despite repeated instruction? Who knows, but there's obviously some disconnect between the coaches and ADA, and the coaches aren't going to budge on it, nor should they. ADA is the only one who can move the needle at this point.
 
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Vinny DeAngelo said:
Maybe ADA denied Quinn's invite to his little rookie breakfast club? New York Rangers turn into the real house wives of NYR
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Yeah or maybe a guy who has had some issues in the past is having some issues again? IDK. The breakfast club scenario is probably more plausible.
 
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