Prospect Info: - Tom Willander: 11th Overall 2023 Draft (Rogle BK J20) - Part 02 | Page 98 | HFBoards - NHL Message Board and Forum for National Hockey League

Prospect Info: Tom Willander: 11th Overall 2023 Draft (Rogle BK J20) - Part 02

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I think Slick Rick is doing what he has to do to stay in the game; I just find it funny when people freak out because of it.


like I get our ownership group is full of total worm dicks, but the idea we're lowballing our most important prospect is tardy. We didn't with Lekkerimaki, and we aren't doing it now.

Equally tardy is the idea Willander is going to forgo the quickest and most lucrative path to an NHL career over bonuses the vast majority of kids in his situation wouldn't ask for.

Management just increased their offer to close the gap. (Halford and Brough)

Cam Robinson also hints at something getting done. (Sekeres and Price)

I believe the premise that Willander is asking for too much is off. If anything, management held firm either for too long or at an unacceptable position, as they have shown to do in the past.

I think Willander will sign, and we'll find the delay to be unwarranted.
 
Maybe things are different if Willander actually makes Team Sweden…

…but he didn’t. In Rutherford’s interview last week with Shannon he more or less just came out and stated he expects Willander to make the big team and contribute next season…

…there’s no chance he’s going back to College or playing in Europe next season just because the Canucks were only willing to pay him the exact same amount as the 11th overall pick from the draft previous.

He might have wanted more but offering the same as what the 11th overall the season before got paid isn’t the type of offer to upset a guy so much he’s willing to burn bridges and give up a 1,000,000 + dollars in salary

More than anything this is Diamond just taking care of Diamond and telling Willander there is no hurry to sign right now and he may be able to force a team desperate for a PR win to pay him a couple hundred grand more.
I totally agree this is probably more about Diamond vs Canucks rather than Willander vs Canucks. Rutherford mentioned precedent with signing draft picks and the bonus structure they have in place. Raising the Willanders salary by 200k isn't going to make Diamond much but if he can raise the average of all draft picks pay that is where the big money comes in to play. Seems a bit unsettling to use Willander as a pawn piece though, if I was him I would find new representation.
 
Update from Dhaliwal from his interview with Halford (Dodd) & Brough.

  • Getting close to a decision on his future by sometime next week
  • His advisor is heading to Sweden to meet with Willander and his family to discussion options; this includes signing with the Canucks
  • World Hockey Championships are where teams from the European Leagues have congragated and are trying to sign players for the upcoming season
  • Reports from earlier in the week that the Canucks are close to signing Willander are not true
  • Everybody agrees that Willander should pro next season; either in Europe or Vancouver
  • Swedish national coach, Sam Hallam, raves about Willander
  • Has returned home and has started his off-season training
  • The gap between the two sides has closed and the Canucks have increased their offer
 
Update from Dhaliwal from his interview with Halford (Dodd) & Brough.

  • Getting close to a decision on his future by sometime next week
  • His advisor is heading to Sweden to meet with Willander and his family to discussion options; this includes signing with the Canucks
  • World Hockey Championships are where teams from the European Leagues have congragated and are trying to sign players for the upcoming season
  • Reports from earlier in the week that the Canucks are close to signing Willander are not true
  • Everybody agrees that Willander should pro next season; either in Europe or Vancouver
  • Swedish national coach, Sam Hallam, raves about Willander
  • Has returned home and has started his off-season training
  • The gap between the two sides has closed and the Canucks have increased their offer

Of course you are on it. Thanks for the recap.

That last line is very telling here. It's the Canucks finally moving off of their position. This bodes well.
 
irrelevant....fixed it for you.

it's the most logical outcome by far. Nothing else makes sense for any of the parties involved.

It is, which means that one party, or both, were being illogical in their position.

My guess is it's management, seeing as how they just increased their offer.
 
Update from Dhaliwal from his interview with Halford (Dodd) & Brough.

  • Getting close to a decision on his future by sometime next week
  • His advisor is heading to Sweden to meet with Willander and his family to discussion options; this includes signing with the Canucks
  • World Hockey Championships are where teams from the European Leagues have congragated and are trying to sign players for the upcoming season
  • Reports from earlier in the week that the Canucks are close to signing Willander are not true
  • Everybody agrees that Willander should pro next season; either in Europe or Vancouver
  • Swedish national coach, Sam Hallam, raves about Willander
  • Has returned home and has started his off-season training
  • The gap between the two sides has closed and the Canucks have increased their offer
The biggest take away for me is Dhaliwal doesn't like that Cam Robinson is out ferreting him on tis one.
 
The biggest take away for me is Dhaliwal doesn't like that Cam Robinson is out ferreting him on tis one.

I think the part where the Canucks have increased their offer as revealing in this. It's suspected that Robinson's source(s) are from the Canucks directly while we all know who Dhaliwal's sources are. Robinson was optimistic that he would sign with the Canucks and Dhaliwal is hedging.

Canucks increased their offer and now feel the deal will get done. Willander's "advisor" is saying "not so fast".
 
I think the part where the Canucks have increased their offer as revealing in this. It's suspected that Robinson's source(s) are from the Canucks directly while we all know who Dhaliwal's sources are. Robinson was optimistic that he would sign with the Canucks and Dhaliwal is hedging.

Canucks increased their offer and now feel the deal will get done. Willander's "advisor" is saying "not so fast".
Cam interviewed Willander a couple weeks ago...seems within the realm of possibility that Willander is his source no?

Rutherford is the source of the only offer info that's been quantified and for all anyone actually knows, it could be the only one.

Though i could see, if they started lower, their original offer was somewhere between:

1746814394606.png



and

1746814427081.png
 
I think the part where the Canucks have increased their offer as revealing in this. It's suspected that Robinson's source(s) are from the Canucks directly while we all know who Dhaliwal's sources are. Robinson was optimistic that he would sign with the Canucks and Dhaliwal is hedging.

Canucks increased their offer and now feel the deal will get done. Willander's "advisor" is saying "not so fast".

I feel like it's posturing and all semantics from Willander's camp at this point, would be incredibly stupid from both sides to not make it work.
 
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Maybe things are different if Willander actually makes Team Sweden…

…but he didn’t. In Rutherford’s interview last week with Shannon he more or less just came out and stated he expects Willander to make the big team and contribute next season…

…there’s no chance he’s going back to College or playing in Europe next season just because the Canucks were only willing to pay him the exact same amount as the 11th overall pick from the draft previous.

He might have wanted more but offering the same as what the 11th overall the season before got paid isn’t the type of offer to upset a guy so much he’s willing to burn bridges and give up a 1,000,000 + dollars in salary

More than anything this is Diamond just taking care of Diamond and telling Willander there is no hurry to sign right now and he may be able to force a team desperate for a PR win to pay him a couple hundred grand more.
narrator: However, Allvin and JR are stone cold killers
 
It is, which means that one party, or both, were being illogical in their position.

Gandler and Diamond only represent European clients and they grind over nickels and dimes in bonuses for their ELC guys....likely using the "stay in Europe" card. In Willander's case they played the "he loves school card" almost immediately (like before Willander's season was even over IIRC).

They're shady AF IMO. I previously posted an old article about them being sued by former client Patrick Elias. I'm kind of surprised they're still around, but the Russians and Finns appear to like them.

I think they probably HATE Alvin because he kind of let them twist in the wind all summer over Lankin who eventually took a 1 year deal at $875k. It ended up working out for their client in the end (thanks to Demko's health), but it was probably a very tense relationship for a while.
 
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Gandler and Diamond only represent European clients and they grind over nickels and dimes in bonuses for their ELC guys....likely using the "stay in Europe" card. In Willander's case they played the "he loves school card" almost immediately (like before Willander's season was even over IIRC).

They're shady AF IMO. I previously posted an old article about them being sued by former client Patrick Elias. I'm kind of surprised they're still around, but the Russians and Finns appear to like them.

I think they probably HATE Alvin because he kind of let them twist in the wind all summer over Lankin who eventually took a 1 year deal at $875k. It ended up working out for their client in the end (thanks to Demko's health), but it was probably a very tense relationship for a while.

If you accept that both management and agent have displayed barriers to deal-making in the past, then the raise in offer is the most telling bit of information. They both grind over nickles and dimes imo.

In the end, we will know the salary amount.
 
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If you accept that both management and agent have displayed barriers to deal-making in the past, then the raise in offer is the most telling bit of information. They both grind over nickles and dimes imo.

In the end, we will know the salary amount.
management has only had to negotiate one ELC for a 1st round pick since they got here and he signed - without a scintilla of hoopla - a contract that was consistent with his draft slot/year. Picks outside of the first round have fallen into place as expected too.

you're comparing how they've negotiated with pending free agents, the vast majority of whom were soon to be unrestricted.

Just go back and read some of slick ricks musings on April 1st, two weeks before his season actually ended:

"“Knowing his representative, they will likely do what they feel is best for his career long-term in earning power. What does the actual contract look like? It could come down to a battle over the scheduled performance bonuses. Canucks may be trying to sign Willander to the same performance bonuses that Jonathan Lekkerimäki got two years ago. Keep that one in mind."

“Willander has certainly met or exceeded his draft position with his stellar play. Maybe the bonuses he feels should be higher. Do you burn a year of the contract? Do you play the rest of the year in Abbotsford? Going back to school, I’ve been told, for a third season is now an option as well. There are a lot of things in play.”

Cubic Zirconia and Co. started whining about the Canucks offer before there even was one. And that line about doing "what's best for his long term earnings power". comic f***ing gold. "Tommy, instead of signing the ELC being offered (which 99%+ prospects in his position would do) and earning a spot on the Canucks next season where you'll make $975k and up to another $600K in bonuses, we think you should head back to BU and make SFA"
 
It's just business. Management isn't incompetent in taking a hard line at this point, not on this at least. Diamond isn't a devious moustache twirling villain manipulating a gullible young Willander.

Neither management nor agent/advisor area doing anything wrong. Both are playing the cards they are dealt.

What's the worst outcome for Willander in the next 6 weeks? The Canucks current offer. Nothing lost by waiting a few weeks. The best outcome is extra bonuses by the canucks caving or trading him. Not a ton of pressure.

Management can trade him or wait him out and sign at what they offer. They can increase the offer. They have their own options.
 
narrator: However, Allvin and JR are stone cold killers

I can’t help but feel Patrik Allvin is being overshadowed by Jim Rutherford’s heavy-handed approach. Take last season: Elias Pettersson explicitly wanted contract talks delayed until the offseason—a reasonable request that Allvin likely would’ve respected. Instead, Rutherford’s influence prevailed, pressuring Pettersson to sign mid-season. This mirrors Rutherford’s history of rigid, my-way-or-else tactics.

Remember Jack Johnson in 2005? Drafted 3rd overall by Carolina, Johnson wanted one more collegiate year to develop. Rutherford, then-GM of the Hurricanes, forced him to turn pro immediately—even threatening a trade. and yes. Jim Rutherford trades the 3rd overall pick, refusing to allow his player to play one more year in college

2006 Trade:
Johnson, who was the third overall pick in the 2005 NHL Entry Draft, was traded to the Kings after Carolina GM Jim Rutherford considered trade offers due to Johnson's reluctance to turn professional.
 
We're about to trade all our future 1sts so I dont know what prospects are gonna point at Tom's deal and say I want that.

Pay the man his bonuses.
 
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All this Willander stuff.

Maybe he just doesn't want to come HERE.

All the noise and how he has been built up already would make it very hard to live up to the hype some fans have loaded onto his shoulders.

When perceived to be at the top there is only down to go.

For the team's best interest it is best if the story is about the contract bonuses.
Even for trade purposes.
If other team's know he doesn't want to be here offers go down.
 
All this Willander stuff.

Maybe he just doesn't want to come HERE.

All the noise and how he has been built up already would make it very hard to live up to the hype some fans have loaded onto his shoulders.

When perceived to be at the top there is only down to go.

For the team's best interest it is best if the story is about the contract bonuses.
Even for trade purposes.
If other team's know he doesn't want to be here offers go down.
This literally has nothing to do with anything.

If he can't handle pressure of some flavor then he's in the wrong profession.

And there's no reason to assume he doesn't want to be here. He's an unsigned college prospect and it isn't even June.
 
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