Prospect Info: Tom Willander: 11th Overall 2023 Draft (Rogle BK J20) - Part 02

[wonton15]

I find it very upsetting. On the surface it seems very surface. Digging deeper it looks even dumber.

The best I can make of it is that two sides have drawn a line in the sand.

Adding on to the last point, the best I can make of it is that management has “drawn a line” to use that to control the narrative if/when they trade him. It isn’t a money or cap thing at this juncture. The numbers are negligible given the tier of prospect and cap landscape.

 

[Caboose]

The only way this would make any sense, is if Willander is asking for those bonuses that are virtually unattainable, yet have to count against the cap for the year regardless of whether he gets them or not.

Regardless, it's still not a good look for the Canucks management.

 

[Breakers]

The only way this would make any sense, is if Willander is asking for those bonuses that are virtually unattainable, yet have to count against the cap for the year regardless of whether he gets them or not.

Regardless, it's still not a good look for the Canucks management.

On ELC the bonuses are pre-determined measures.
He's allowed a maximum of 4 bonuses in schedule A for a million


he can ask for schedule B and they can just give them to him, it is not a snowballs chance in hell he'll get them. It's like winning the norris, top 10 in points, assists, or goals for defense which he wont reach in those 3 years.

 

[Just A Bit Outside]

I hope Willander tells them to shove it.

This mgmt group has shit the bed the last year (regardless of ownership).

They had one easy job and they have f***ed it up royally.

 

[Russian_fanatic]

Im pretty close to done with the Canucks in general. I honestly don't even care if Willander becomes a bust/Nathan Smith 2.0

The fact that this ownership group is disrespecting their first round pick for $200,000 is unforgivable.

Good for Willander for coming out, he's a smart kid. I hope he drags this out. If management trades the kid, or if they can't get him signed and he flees, I want to thank Willander because this will be my last straw with this organization and team.

 

[VanJack]

If reports are true, and the Canucks and Wilander are $200,000 apart, then obviously something will get done eventually.

But it raises a deeper question. If the Canucks front office is quibbling about such a picayune amount, what does it say about their approach to their payroll generally? Is this some kind of signal about the situation with ownership? Maybe the low Canadian dollar; a stagnating condo market and all the tariff uncertainty is having a bigger impact than we imagined?

From all reports, the Canucks will enter the off-season with more than $14m in cap space. But I'm beginning to wonder whether--in the name of frugality and economics--they actually spend to the max like they have in the past.

And if the decision is to go 'younger and cheaper' on the payroll--what does that mean for Quin Hughes future in Vancouver?

 

[Phrasing]

f***ing sign him, it’s $200k. This management has already wasted millions on worse players. What in the actual f***.

 

[rypper]

Let's go for a hfboards forum meet up at Elisa steakhouse. We'll rack up a massive 200k bill that ol Franko can turn around and set aside for Willander if he hits his bonuses.

 

[F A N]

On ELC the bonuses are pre-determined measures.
He's allowed a maximum of 4 bonuses in schedule A for a million


he can ask for schedule B and they can just give them to him, it is not a snowballs chance in hell he'll get them. It's like winning the norris, top 10 in points, assists, or goals for defense which he wont reach in those 3 years.

Actually his potential cap hit does need to be accounted for if he doesn’t make the roster on opening night and later gets recalled. Thats my understanding. So the bonuses still do matter from a cap management perspective.

 

[Vancouver_2010]

Seriously, if the canucks owner is that cheap, maybe the canucks fan can collectively send tom willander 1 dollar each. I am sure that would exceed 200k.

Seriously, what is your goddamn problem? just sign him already!

 

[me2]

The team will get a good look at him again men at the WC. If he plays well they'll pay him, if he doesn't he he'll probably take the Canucks offer. It's poor it's not sorted quickly and cleanly but it's still not a big issue yet.

 

[lawrence]

we’re short by 200k get this stuff done you cowards !!!!

 

[Canucks LB]

This is the stupidest f***ing contract negotiation in organizational history

 

[TomWillander1RD]

If I were TW, I’d sign the current deal, assuming it differs only in 200k mostly unattainable bonus terms. Then, I’d prove my value and ensure no hometown discount in the next contract.

 

[lawrence]

If I were TW, I’d sign the current deal, assuming it differs only in 200k mostly unattainable bonus terms. Then, I’d prove my value and ensure no hometown discount in the next contract.

to be fair 200 000k is really nothing for a team like the Canucks who are known for recklessly over spending. Especially 200 k might mean a lot for a young lad (unproven at the NHL) for a entry level contract. So lets just give it to him, have a good impression for us, and don't make our team look like fools and less appealing. We've already failed to sign like 4 other prospects already, I don't want us to fumble a 1st rounder. This is just terrible.

now if the plan was that, he was always gonna be included in some deal and we end up with Anthon Cirelli, or a Mathew Barzal okayyyyyy... you slick cowards fooled us... but at the moment this is not a big deal Get this done move on.

 

[HairyKneel]

Im pretty close to done with the Canucks in general. I honestly don't even care if Willander becomes a bust/Nathan Smith 2.0

The fact that this ownership group is disrespecting their first round pick for $200,000 is unforgivable.

Good for Willander for coming out, he's a smart kid. I hope he drags this out. If management trades the kid, or if they can't get him signed and he flees, I want to thank Willander because this will be my last straw with this organization and team.

Keep us in the loop.

Were you one of the guys that quit being a fan when Elmer was steering the ship?

 

[Nick Lang]

Actually his potential cap hit does need to be accounted for if he doesn’t make the roster on opening night and later gets recalled. Thats my understanding. So the bonuses still do matter from a cap management perspective.

What does that mean exactly? Would they need to have an extra million in cap space set aside if he was called up and replacing a similarly priced player, say Mancini, Petterson, or a cheap vet?

If that's the case then yeah it matters and it's kind of on Willander to not be so pushy either. I mean he's not realistically hitting those marks. He's not getting any of the points based ones. Maybe plus minus. He's not going to play top 4 minutes as a rookie with Myers and Hronek ahead of him. Very unlikely he makes the all rookie team. Just screws with the Canucks ability to call him up. Maybe give him the bonuses then and leave him in the A all year unless he's just too good there.

 

[Vector]

This is the stupidest f***ing contract negotiation in organizational history

I don't know if that's true. The Ohlund contract negotiations were pretty rough and resulted in an offer sheet 4 years after getting drafted.

Burke offering to drive Trent Klatt to the airport would have been viewed as crazy now.

 

[Raistlin]

If reports are true, and the Canucks and Wilander are $200,000 apart, then obviously something will get done eventually.

But it raises a deeper question. If the Canucks front office is quibbling about such a picayune amount, what does it say about their approach to their payroll generally? Is this some kind of signal about the situation with ownership? Maybe the low Canadian dollar; a stagnating condo market and all the tariff uncertainty is having a bigger impact than we imagined?

From all reports, the Canucks will enter the off-season with more than $14m in cap space. But I'm beginning to wonder whether--in the name of frugality and economics--they actually spend to the max like they have in the past.

And if the decision is to go 'younger and cheaper' on the payroll--what does that mean for Quin Hughes future in Vancouver?

With bolded in mind. That's what I am wondering about too. We have a LOT of unsold condos in the market from what I know. I really don't think it's a Allvin/JR call to quibble over 200k, it's not a cap issue, what is it to them?

This is not usually something our ownership is known for(being that cheap), so I think there is something external that is changing the way they run their business, global recession looming, low dollar, etc. Not signing a stay-at-home rookie is not a big deal outside of HF is probably what their mentality is. It just seems like something so stupid that it's a "directive from corporate" or something.

 

[lawrence]

I don't know if that's true. The Ohlund contract negotiations were pretty rough and resulted in an offer sheet 4 years after getting drafted.

Burke offering to drive Trent Klatt to the airport would have been viewed as crazy now.

the R.J Umberger fiasco was also a pathetic showing. All 1st rounders in his draft year was landing the rookie max, and by the time it stopped he wasn't even asking for rookie max. We gotta stop being subborn assholes. We need a mike Gillis again.

 

[TomWillander1RD]

to be fair 200 000k is really nothing for a team like the Canucks who are known for recklessly over spending. Especially 200 k might mean a lot for a young lad (unproven at the NHL) for a entry level contract. So lets just give it to him, have a good impression for us, and don't make our team look like fools and less appealing. We've already failed to sign like 4 other prospects already, I don't want us to fumble a 1st rounder. This is just terrible.

now if the plan was that, he was always gonna be included in some deal and we end up with Anthon Cirelli, or a Mathew Barzal okayyyyyy... you slick cowards fooled us... but at the moment this is not a big deal Get this done move on.

I'm not disagreeing with you.

I was just pointing out that this is a $200K unguaranteed amount. It’s not like he would be getting it immediately as a signing bonus anyway. From Willander's perspective, if he reaches the conditions needed to earn that bonus, it'd mean he'd be in line for a much bigger contract down the road, making the $200K at that stage not much of a loss. In that sense, turning pro immediately, even if the organization keeps lowballing, is a smarter move than going back to school. If he doesn't perform, he wouldn't be getting the bonus anyway.

I agree with everyone here that this is a massive failure by management or perhaps the ownership (I'm starting to think ownership has been used as a scapegoat too easily for every one of management’s failures without valid proofs). It would have been far smarter to build a good relationship with a young prospect who's known for his character, rather than nickel-and-diming over a $200K unguaranteed bonus. The costs they'll face after this entry-level contract because of this mishandling could end up being far greater than what they "save" here.

Also, the team is allowed to exceed the cap because of bonuses with any overage carrying into next year, so the potential cap implication here is minimal. Even if he hits his bonus clauses, you'd be thrilled anyway, because it means you have a great player on your hands. That's a good problem to have, and you deal with it when the time comes.

I also don’t understand this idea that giving in to Willander’s bonus demand would somehow set a bad precedent or hurt the team's leverage in future negotiations. Who cares about a bonus you likely won’t even end up paying out? On top of management’s recent failures, this just makes them look foolish, and it’s the kind of thing that will make key college free agents think twice about dealing with this team.

 

[Jerry the great]

I find it very upsetting. On the surface it seems very surface. Digging deeper it looks even dumber.

Are you referring specifically to the Club's position?

 

[TruGr1t]

I refuse to believe that $200k report. That's literally too dumb to be true.

 

[me2]

I doubt it is aquilini holding it up. It's just too small a number for ownership input. It's pocket change by nhl team payroll. It would just come out of somewhere else anyway.

If the Canucks want him then he'll be signed for next season, they have 2-3 months, its not urgent. If he is trade bait for a forward it is isn't a problem (they sign and trade or the new team wants to own the signing PR).

Right now, it isn't hurting us and it isn't a big deal.

 

[F A N]

What does that mean exactly? Would they need to have an extra million in cap space set aside if he was called up and replacing a similarly priced player, say Mancini, Petterson, or a cheap vet?

If that's the case then yeah it matters and it's kind of on Willander to not be so pushy either. I mean he's not realistically hitting those marks. He's not getting any of the points based ones. Maybe plus minus. He's not going to play top 4 minutes as a rookie with Myers and Hronek ahead of him. Very unlikely he makes the all rookie team. Just screws with the Canucks ability to call him up. Maybe give him the bonuses then and leave him in the A all year unless he's just too good there.

Yes that's what it means. So if Willander can earn an extra $850K in bonuses and he isn't on the opening day roster, you have to account for that extra $850K when you recall him. If like this season we want to accumulate cap space by staying under the cap throughout the season Willander's bonuses could cause issues. We could have Willander on the opening day roster since D-Petey and Mancini are both waivers exempt and if at least one of them is pencilled in for a spot the Canucks can easily get around this issue. If Willander is put onto the opening day roster his bonsuses go into a performance bonus relief pool.

I got this from reading a couple of articles from Canucks Army (discussing Podkolzin and Lekkerimaki's bonuses).