To retaliate or not to retaliate? How do you handle dirty players?

[SJGoalie32]

I was just kidding cause it sounded long lol.
I'd be saying something too though. It takes a lot to get under my skin to actually physically retaliate - to me there's nothing better than taking a cheap shot/slash/whatever and saying something with a smile on my face as they skate to the penalty box. They get so rattled over it.

That's my favorite, too.

About once every other season or so when I'm playing as a forward, some guy will take several strides and throw a body check against me along the boards. However, I have a pretty low center of gravity and generally keep my head up, so I am able to see the hit coming, absorb it, and usually remain upright while the guy who throws the hit falls on the ice and gets whistled for the penalty. I usually just stand over him and talk smack to him (nothing too vulgar or unsportsmanlike, just enough to let him know what I think of him and his cheap shot) while he's still laying on the ice trying to get up/crawl his way to the penalty box.

I don't know if THEY get rattled over it, but it's one of the best feelings for me. Especially the part where I thankfully don't actually get hurt (because one of these times that COULD end badly).

 

[4thline]

Where exactly did I say that?

Dude, you do what you do. I really don't care. All I'm saying is if someone pulls an ass play on you and you retaliate with an ass play, you both are *****.

The way I see it is that sometimes retaliation is warranted, but not by reciprocating in kind. I'm not a stickwork guy. There's never a justified time to wind up and two hand a guy (John Scott's aside ) or spear, or any of that ****. Hit em, fight em, just don't sink to their cheapshotting level.

 

[Jackson12]

1st game of championship 3 game series, the other team's captain elbows me as we go for the puck on the side boards, then cross-checks me with my back to him at the point.

Before this happened I didn't even know who he was.

I ignored the elbow, but after the cross-check I turned and had some choice words, so the guy said "bring it". I started to approach him and was going to punch him in his head but stopped myself because it was the championship series, and if we both got sent off it would not be an even trade-off.

He's an example of a player thinking what happens in the NHL on TV is acceptable in lower level rec league. What was really aggravating was the ref was right there, having seen both the elbow and the cross-check, yet called nothing.

HOWEVER - and this is the best part - the WHOLE INCIDENT is on video, as I tape most of my games to analyze after the fact.

As a courtesy to a friend of mine on the other team, I sent the clip and told him he had a choice, either we deal with this "in-house", or the league head and his boss will get a copy, which would lead to a suspension of the player - and I would have pushed for a penalty of some kind to the ref for not making a call for either the elbow or the cross-check.

Here is the video:

this is just sad

 

[AD1066]

1st game of championship 3 game series, the other team's captain elbows me as we go for the puck on the side boards, then cross-checks me with my back to him at the point.

It's pretty harmless in the grand scheme of things, two minute penalty at most.

If you haven't played hockey very long, you might be thrown off by these types of things that would seem egregious in other sports. Neither the elbow nor the shove were particularly forceful.

Cue up a video of Holmstrom being checked in front of the crease, if you'd like to see the kind of self-control these guys exhibit at higher levels. It's frustrating, sure, but I think it's something people learn to brush off the longer they play.

There are situations where a response is warranted, but in my opinion these are rare and limited to things like knee-on-knee or intentional hits from behind. The sort of thing that can really injure someone. Otherwise you just kind of learn to play through the slashing and shoving and try to beat them on the scoreboard.

 

[Goonzilla]

Depends to on what the other guy is wanting to do. If it's to be annoying, put you off your game, bait you or to try and make a name for themselves that's one thing, though if they're out to try and take you out or injure you it's something else.

Certainly the guy in the video appears to have succeeded spectacularly in causing annoyance and putting someone off their game.

 

[beerleaguevet]

Uh, wrong. I showed the video to several players on other teams and several refs and all said a cross-checking penalty should have been called.

What I do find funny is how so many people claiming "oh that happens all the time in my league/open hockeys" will respond with a push/fight in response to getting their stick lifted.

Sorry, been watching and playing too long for a few highly questionable, anonymous internet posters to tell me a cross check in the upper back/neck area 60 feet from the puck is acceptable. I'm not buying what you're selling.

I would be absolutely embarrassed to show guys from other teams a video, complaining about whether a call should have been made. Hockey is a physical game (yes, even in Men's League). At drop-in, I definitely would give that plug a quick comment, but that would be the end.

But this was a championship game? If that's all it takes to get you upset and sending videos to opposing teams, threatening league intervention, you'll be in for a rude awakening if you ever start playing higher divisions.

Was it extracurricular and unnecessary? Yes. A penalty? Up to the official, the magnitude of the game, and what they're letting go. Mind you, I play hockey in Canada and that stuff is generally brushed aside unless it is after the whistle.

You should have fallen flat on your face if you wanted a penalty call. That'd be more honorable than threatening the other team to deal with some minor bumping.

 

[JBear]

I play ball hockey so even though there is a lot less hitting and potential for injury we only usually play with minimal equipment and there are still dirty players, and teams. I was slew-footed almost 2 years ago and my elbow is still not 100%.

We just played a team who are a lower (better) division (we are in a combined division) and are just dirty, especially hack and slash happy while being jerks about everything. We're smaller, not as skilled for that game, and the refs were calling nothing. Just frustrating as there is very little you can do about it except maybe chirp them if you have a few good ones.

 

[jazzykat]

and the refs were calling nothing. Just frustrating as there is very little you can do about it except maybe chirp them if you have a few good ones.

I realize that there have been good arguments for not retaliating in this situation but IMO anyone who is doing this kind of stuff is:

1. used to it and thinks it is a normal part of the game (higher level guys take quite a bit of a thumping that they think nothing of, but that have the potential to injure lower level guys).

2. a dick looking to get away with whatever they can

3. a nutburger trying to win at all costs

4. someone who is so crap in skill that they can't help themselves (I got hit at slow speed but by a heavy guy from behind) and I was livid. It turned out he was such a bad skater he probably couldn't stop. I almost felt bad afterwards because I don't make it a habit to pick on weaker players for being weak.

I think you need to address the issue verbally first in a professional manner. If that doesn't work then I think you have to give it back otherwise you are allowing them to try to injure you with no repercussions of any sort.

 

[JBear]

I realize that there have been good arguments for not retaliating in this situation but IMO anyone who is doing this kind of stuff is:

1. used to it and thinks it is a normal part of the game (higher level guys take quite a bit of a thumping that they think nothing of, but that have the potential to injure lower level guys).

2. a dick looking to get away with whatever they can

3. a nutburger trying to win at all costs

4. someone who is so crap in skill that they can't help themselves (I got hit at slow speed but by a heavy guy from behind) and I was livid. It turned out he was such a bad skater he probably couldn't stop. I almost felt bad afterwards because I don't make it a habit to pick on weaker players for being weak.

I think you need to address the issue verbally first in a professional manner. If that doesn't work then I think you have to give it back otherwise you are allowing them to try to injure you with no repercussions of any sort.

I think they were #2 & 3 as they beat us 5-2. They are not a lower (better) division team that are used to the slashing and hacking (and yes the higher skilled players accept this as part of the game for the most part). I, as the captain, won't personally talk to another team about slashes but will rather talk to the refs to handle the situation. I am now open to slashing back and making sure that both the other team and refs know it's a retaliation and if they can't handle it maybe they should stop slashing us.

 

[Greeneye]

When I was younger I would normally turn the other cheek and take the PP. Now I prefer to respond with as hard of a two hander as I can muster. I don't have time for that crap.

 

[Guffaw]

Always retaliate and top whatever was done to you. Thats honestly how i handle it. If it means a penalty, an ejection, a suspension thats fine. No league, pickup, etc is worth taking sht from anybody. Why i don't play mens league anymore.

 

[LeanBeef]

I typically only retaliate when my teammates are getting pushed around.

My teammate only has one arm and was getting pushed around by some steroid abusing jerk off who is clearly manly enough to pick on someone missing an arm. I got so pissed off I skated up to him, slashed the stick out of his hands, cross checked him, called him a ****, and tried to fight him but he wouldn't go.

Did I overreact?

Edit: Also, he was wearing a blacked out visor, which just made him look even more of a ******

funny you mention standing up for your teammates. Last night I had a game against one of my good buddies from highschool.

They were beating us pretty bad and the game was getting kinda out of control. I was in front of the net with my buddy on the other team and he jokingly pushed the back of my helmet over my head. While moving away I stepped on a stick and it must have looked like I was pushed to the ice.

I was laughing until I saw one of my hothead teammates throwing gloved punches at my buddy on the ground which started a huge scrum with 3 players kicked from the game.

Needless to say I introduced them to each other after the game and my teammate ended up buying a beer for my buddy who ended up with a busted lip.

 

[JoeGarelli]

Hah.. Video removed or deleted by user..

 

[Terry Yake]

Hah.. Video removed or deleted by user..

i think he finally realized how embarrassing that was

 

[Tacks92]

It's pretty harmless in the grand scheme of things, two minute penalty at most.

If you haven't played hockey very long, you might be thrown off by these types of things that would seem egregious in other sports. Neither the elbow nor the shove were particularly forceful.

Cue up a video of Holmstrom being checked in front of the crease, if you'd like to see the kind of self-control these guys exhibit at higher levels. It's frustrating, sure, but I think it's something people learn to brush off the longer they play.

There are situations where a response is warranted, but in my opinion these are rare and limited to things like knee-on-knee or intentional hits from behind. The sort of thing that can really injure someone. Otherwise you just kind of learn to play through the slashing and shoving and try to beat them on the scoreboard.

Very well said.

 

[AD1066]

Very well said.

Thanks, I know people were ragging on him but I think it's partially a matter of perspective.

In my experience someone who is newer to the game will often take these things more personally than an experienced vet. And if you're coming over from another sport, things like slashing and cross-checking seem like egregious penalties/fouls in the context of those other sports.

When I watch the highest level men's league at my rink, there's a ton of whacking or rubbing people out along the boards. But these guys are ex-college or junior players, and think nothing of it. It's not personal or malicious, so nobody feels the need to retaliate.

But at lower levels, I've seen guys flip out over the smallest things. When you're relatively inexperienced, everything seems more personal than it often is.

 

[The Tikkanen]

I think the term "dirty" needs to be better defined. Getting an elbow to the head along the boards, a slash on the hands or cross checked in front of the net is part of the game, which is why hockey has penalties. Dirty to me is taking those penalties and escalating them to the match penalty, the clear intent to injure, that's when you get my attention. If you get upset when a guy takes a regular penalty on you you're not going to last very long in hockey. If I get a slash on the hands when I have the puck there is a difference between a normal slash and the guy trying to break my bones. A normal slash I don't really pay much attention, if I feel some pain I think maybe I might need newer or better protection from my elbow pads or gloves. If I think the guy is trying to break my bones then it's time to drop the gloves immediately.

 

[Tacks92]

I wouldn't be too sure about that, I'm one of the lesser skilled guys with the pick at the pick up I play, but more than capable in my league division by virtue of the extra time and space I get to make decisions and execute passes or moves. Regardless I'm one of the bigger guys at either and where that can give me some sort of advantage I certainly use it, not because I'm jealous or frustrated by anyone, but rather why wouldn't you play to your advantages or strengths over others?

Doesn't mean you try and wipe anyone out or look for trouble, but if it means that someone is put off their game just a little bit, it benefits both you and your team; and hopefully everyone is there to compete and try and do what they can to help win.

..and the puck skills are coming along nicely. But even if I was one of the top skilled players, you'd still be silly not to use your size a little when it's to your advantage.

Sorry to bump something from waaaay back in the thread, but I agree with both points. When I play against really skilled players, I use my body a lot more, grind it out along the boards, try to take away their time and space. It's clean, defensive minded bump and grind. That being said, I do notice that most of the blatant jerks out there tend to be guys who suck but think that they don't.

 

[jamesj12]

That being said, I do notice that most of the blatant jerks out there tend to be guys who suck but think that they don't.

So true, I try not to waste too much energy on these suckers. As my favorite movie says, dip, dodge, dive, duck, and dodge.

 

[FLYLine27*]

nut shot.

 

[Goonzilla]

I think the term "dirty" needs to be better defined. Getting an elbow to the head along the boards, a slash on the hands or cross checked in front of the net is part of the game, which is why hockey has penalties. Dirty to me is taking those penalties and escalating them to the match penalty, the clear intent to injure, that's when you get my attention. If you get upset when a guy takes a regular penalty on you you're not going to last very long in hockey. If I get a slash on the hands when I have the puck there is a difference between a normal slash and the guy trying to break my bones. A normal slash I don't really pay much attention, if I feel some pain I think maybe I might need newer or better protection from my elbow pads or gloves. If I think the guy is trying to break my bones then it's time to drop the gloves immediately.

I think in rec league hockey it's really accidental v intentional. I have no problem with an accidental stick or elbow; and absolutely no problem with anyone checking me or trying to knock me down or through the glass if they want to have a go, non contact league or otherwise, provided it's clean and I'm on the puck. It's pretty easy to differentiate between the two.

..but any non-accidental contact to the head..look out. That's what dirty is..that or slew footing.

We had great refs a couple of days ago who just let the game flow. There was one penalty called all game. I got to throw my weight around a little bit on the forecheck, but not going all out, which the refs could see. Copped a little slash and a couple of angry looks, but no one got hurt and the other team seemed to realise we were playing hockey and not doing ballet. No 'stick in the muds' complaining to anyone, just getting on with the game. How it should be.

 

[Brunomics]

nut shot.

I hope your kidding.

I'm all for getting retribution through a hard check or anything like that to send a message but if your going to nut shot someone your just a ***** that probably deserved whatever you got in the first place.

 

[RussianBum86]

OT playoff game. The puck is lose about seven to ten feet from the net. The goalie and I are both going for it. The goalie gets the puck and I turn away to avoid contact. I do not touch the goalie, but he punches in the back with his blocker with my back turned. I turn around and his defender punches me in the face. The ref doesn't call anything. I being the captain ask the ref why no call on either punch and he says it is overtime. The goalie starts cursing at me. A few plays later my teammate puts the puck in the net, and the goalie kicks the net off. By the time the ref gets there puck is still in the net and net is off. The ref says no goal because the goalie knocked the net off. There is no penalty or goal awarded. We got to a shootout and I score the game winning goal as the last shooter. To celebrate my teammate play punches me and says we have to call that a goal right boys? The other team goes irate telling me to act like I scored before.... oh the irony.

 

[PopeInTheWoods]

The other team goes irate telling me to act like I scored before....

That's when you looked shocked and tell them, "But this is the first goal I've ever scored in my ENTIRE LIFE!!!"

 

[BogsDiamond]

Thanks, I know people were ragging on him but I think it's partially a matter of perspective.

In my experience someone who is newer to the game will often take these things more personally than an experienced vet. And if you're coming over from another sport, things like slashing and cross-checking seem like egregious penalties/fouls in the context of those other sports.

When I watch the highest level men's league at my rink, there's a ton of whacking or rubbing people out along the boards. But these guys are ex-college or junior players, and think nothing of it. It's not personal or malicious, so nobody feels the need to retaliate.

But at lower levels, I've seen guys flip out over the smallest things. When you're relatively inexperienced, everything seems more personal than it often is.

This is me. I never played high level hockey and I would get severely red-arsed if someone crosschecked or slashed me.
Whenever I'd lose my cool, the perpetrator would look stunned at my response.

On the occasion that I was given the chance to speak to the guy after the game, I'd do my best to explain that I didn't play Junior and this a rec league. I don't pay $250+ to get crosschecked, slashed or body checked.
I play clean and I like the favour returned.

What high-level guys seem to forget is that rec hockey is not the NHL, or OHL or whatever piss-water junior league they used to play in where games 'mattered'.
Turn it off and have a nice skate. Not everyone wants to go to work the next day with a cast on their wrist.