OT: The Pittsburgher Thread: Post Draft - Still dont need no QB

[pistolpete11]

Tbh I feel like there’s been a shift towards character in player acquisition/team building. Draft or FA.

Not saying we drafted low character guys all the time before but feels like high character is a priority.

Which is great. unfortunately the NFL is devoid of morals and moral victories but can’t argue with it

Agreed there's seemingly been a shift. 'High character' is relative compared to the rest of the NFL, of course. You're never going to have a team of saints and if you do, you'll probably suck. Having guys that are professional, show up on time, do the work, play hard, and aren't out committing felonies is about all you can ask for.

Pickens hasn't had any run ins with the law that I am aware of, but he's not professional, doesn't show up on time, and doesn't always play hard. They tried trading DJ to see if he was a bad influence on him and things arguably got worse. The talent is tantalizing, but I'm not all sorry to see him go.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Yeah Pickens was quitting on so many plays last year that it's really tough to see him go. He doesn't run routes where he's not the primary target, he doesn't block on running plays and throws tantrums when he doesn't get the ball. The team is far better off with him gone and Tomlin is 100% correct for pushing him off the team.

That said, it still doesn't excuse Khan not bringing in someone else or drafting another guy despite trading Pickens. Metcalf, Austin and Woods is the same exact thing they ran last year, they're just hoping that Wilson actually exists this year.

 

[The Old Master]

Yeah Pickens was quitting on so many plays last year that it's really tough to see him go. He doesn't run routes where he's not the primary target, he doesn't block on running plays and throws tantrums when he doesn't get the ball. The team is far better off with him gone and Tomlin is 100% correct for pushing him off the team.

That said, it still doesn't excuse Khan not bringing in someone else or drafting another guy despite trading Pickens. Metcalf, Austin and Woods is the same exact thing they ran last year, they're just hoping that Wilson actually exists this year.

kahn may have not known what tomlin was going to do. it would be the steelers way.

 

[Empoleon8771]

kahn may have not known what tomlin was going to do. it would be the steelers way.

There were reports that Pickens to Dallas was going to happen at the draft. Tomlin isn't the one that made that trade, Khan was.

 

[TooManyHumans]

There simply doesn't seem to be a plan. There are just random moves they make. If they were planning on trading Pickens, then they absolutely failed to adequately address the WR position in free agency and the draft. They had to get someone else and now we are left in the same WR situation we had last year, only at the cost of replacing a 2nd with a 3rd and spending a ton of money. Also, trading Pickens makes sense if we are planning for the future, but if we are, then what the f*** sense does it make to court Rodgers? That is a win now move (and a sad one at that, but whatever). If we are trying to win now, then trading Pickens makes no sense. I think that lack of a coherent plan is what most fans find frustrating right now.

 

[pistolpete11]

Yeah Pickens was quitting on so many plays last year that it's really tough to see him go. He doesn't run routes where he's not the primary target, he doesn't block on running plays and throws tantrums when he doesn't get the ball. The team is far better off with him gone and Tomlin is 100% correct for pushing him off the team.

That said, it still doesn't excuse Khan not bringing in someone else or drafting another guy despite trading Pickens. Metcalf, Austin and Woods is the same exact thing they ran last year, they're just hoping that Wilson actually exists this year.

But who cares? They aren't competing this year nor are they developing a QB. As long as they get another guy before they go into the season with their new QB of the future, it's no-harm-no-foul in my book.

 

[Shaftception]

You honestly believe at meetings in the off season that they have discussions based on "finishing with a winning record" as the goal? Come on. The winning season bit was created and perpetrated by the sports media. I see far more references to the winning season streak from Tomlin haters. And no, I don't love Tomlin and wish they would move on.

Art's brother Jim went on a media tour back in January to promote a book about Dan Rooney, during a podcast discussion, he said the following.

Jim Rooney's explanation for playoff slump a sobering reality check of Steelers' lowered standards

Rooney: “I don’t want to get into excuse-making, but the reality is, we outperform the NFL mean at a greater rate than just about any team for the last 25 years. Another team that has been in that category in terms of outperforming that mean has been the Ravens. There’s no other team that has been as successful and has a division rival that has outperformed the mean. So when you look at the challenges we face, if this was a boxing match, and you were judging the competition, not just looking at the winning percentage, you would have to say that we have performed in a harder circumstance than most, and we’ve outperformed them.”

Here's a comment from a former GM regarding his opinion of how that comment comes across.

Steelers Fans Given A Peek At The "Scary Proposition" That The Rooneys Are Ok With Just Being Above Average

"I hope not," admitted Whaley. "I mean, you do have a guy named Rooney saying this, so he has access to the inner circle and the inner sanctum of the thought process. This is higher than Mike Tomlin. This is the Rooney family and all the investors. That's a scary proposition he threw out there for everybody to think about. Let's outperform the mean and make money or is this the old standard that everybody's used to? Let's outperform the NFL and win championships. What it's going to portray to the public, if this gets out there, is that we're ok being above average. It's that bettors mentality, if I win 51% then I'm good, I'm making money. That's basically what he said."

As they point out in the articles, Jim's not actually part of the team's ownership group, but it's obvious he would've had discussions with people high up in the organization before, the most obvious being his own brother.

Now put two and two together. It's obvious this is the way the organization thinks and runs it's business, this is just the first slip up where someone tied to the ownership accidentally in so many words admitted it.

Just win enough games every year to keep the season ticket waiting list full, this isn't a serious organization with competitive goals anymore.

They're in it for the money, probably largely because the Rooney's ownership group is one of the poorest in the league, where the majority of their wealth is tied to the team's value.

 

[xlm34]

I have some serious questions about how this team operates, but I don’t have many doubts that their goal every year is to win the Super Bowl. To win the Super Bowl, you need to make the playoffs. To make the playoffs you need to have a winning record. I think that’s all there is to it.

They typically just focus one year at a time. I think this offseason is the first one in a while I can remember that seems to be setting up more for the year after than the upcoming one.

 

[The Old Master]

There were reports that Pickens to Dallas was going to happen at the draft. Tomlin isn't the one that made that trade, Khan was.

it looks to me that the deal was offered to us at the draft and kahn turned it down because they could just keep him and get a just as good comp deal. then tomlin said there was no way he wanted to keep him forcing the trade now.

 

[xlm34]

it looks to me that the deal was offered to us at the draft and kahn turned it down because they could just keep him and get a just as good comp deal. then tomlin said there was no way he wanted to keep him forcing the trade now.

The deal the Cowboys offered at the draft was reportedly a 4th. The Steelers apparently were looking for a day 2 pick and got it after the draft so he was moved.

And the comp pick thing has been beat to death but again:

1.) This third is better than whatever a third round comp pick would have been

2.) There’s no guarantee anyone gives Pickens a deal that would satisfy the requirement for a 3rd round comp pick

3.) To get the comp pick, the Steelers would have to do pretty much nothing in free agency.

 

[CheckingLineCenter]

1.) This third is better than whatever a third round comp pick would have been

2.) There’s no guarantee anyone gives Pickens a deal that would satisfy the requirement for a 3rd round comp pick

3.) To get the comp pick, the Steelers would have to do pretty much nothing in free agency.

And a year earlier

 

[bigdaddyk88]

And a year earlier

It doesn’t help the offense in 25 but maybe in 26.

 

[Peat]

Tbh I feel like there’s been a shift towards character in player acquisition/team building. Draft or FA.

Not saying we drafted low character guys all the time before but feels like high character is a priority.

Which is great. unfortunately the NFL is devoid of morals and moral victories but can’t argue with it

To be Master of the Obvious, all other things being equal high character will beat low character over the long run because high character is going to work harder, listen more, and sulk less. They've pretty obviously ran into some of these problems on the field over the last few seasons so they're correcting course.

 

[Shaftception]

I have some serious questions about how this team operates, but I don’t have many doubts that their goal every year is to win the Super Bowl. To win the Super Bowl, you need to make the playoffs. To make the playoffs you need to have a winning record. I think that’s all there is to it.

They typically just focus one year at a time. I think this offseason is the first one in a while I can remember that seems to be setting up more for the year after than the upcoming one.

I'm admittedly probably one of the more annoyingly pessimistic opinions on the state of the team, yet I feel like even I give them more credit than what you're stating here.

I simply cannot believe they truly think their goal every year is to win a Super Bowl when they're putting out the caliber of quarterback they have over the past 5 years on the field. Not even I think they're that delusional.

They have to know when they're throwing out Hodges, Rudolph, Trubisky, Pickett, etc. that they don't have any realistic chance of making the Super Bowl. They know at best they might make a wild card game and then likely hope to stay competitive in said game.

They simply have to have different motivations behind doing what they do year to year, and it's can't logically be winning a Super Bowl, unless you think again they have no brains.

I find it far more believable the Rooney's simply don't want to commit to extended losing seasons trying to draft a franchise QB for fear of loss in gate revenue, or the potential loss of team culture, or whatever justification you can think of that isn't they're just that oblivious to the reality of them actually making a Super Bowl any of these past seasons.

I mean, when was the last time a wild card team simply made the playoffs and then went on an unexpected championship run? This isn't hockey, pretty much the perceived contenders in the regular season usually make the Super Bowl.

Sure, there's the occasional outlier. Washington as a 6th seed made the NFC championship game last season, but nobody thought that was a longshot beforehand due to how good Daniels turned out. I think the last team that was a genuine surprise to make the Super Bowl was Cincinnati, and only because of how quickly they did so after having drafted 1st overall, not because of the quality of their roster. The 5th seed Bucs won the Super Bowl the year before that, but that result had the Brady factor.

Long story short, there are very few genuine surprise teams winning Super Bowl's today.

So again, unless the Steelers are just that unique in their delusion, they know going into these seasons they aren't real threats in the post season.

They clearly are not building the team each year to win championships, and they clearly until maybe this year aren't punting seasons to improve future prospects. So what has their goal actually been then?

 

[Peat]

I'm admittedly probably one of the more annoyingly pessimistic opinions on the state of the team, yet I feel like even I give them more credit than what you're stating here.

I simply cannot believe they truly think their goal every year is to win a Super Bowl when they're putting out the caliber of quarterback they have over the past 5 years on the field. Not even I think they're that delusional.

They have to know when they're throwing out Hodges, Rudolph, Trubisky, Pickett, etc. that they don't have any realistic chance of making the Super Bowl. They know at best they might make a wild card game and then likely hope to stay competitive in said game.
...

They clearly are not building the team each year to win championships, and they clearly until maybe this year aren't punting seasons to improve future prospects. So what has their goal actually been then?

See, I was literally just thinking about this, thinking how Pickens can't be a win now move, and how it looks like they want to really obviously be a Philadelphia type team that just keeps rolling and finds a QB despite it.

But what if they think Pickens is addition by subtraction because he's just that annoying?

And what if they think they can go deep in the playoffs with the current room because Smith did that with Corey Davis as WR2? And think they could win it with a dead ARod because the Eagles won it with Foles and because they think their defence can be the next one so good it shuts down Mahomes completely?

Yeah, it does all seem quite delusional but, well, some of the stuff they do seems quite delusional. They always talk the talk too.

I guess no way of knowing for sure. But... yeah, honestly, I could believe it. I think I believe they're sane more but... yeah, doubt.

edit: The more I look at this and the more I think about them not trading their 1st back, the more I find it plausible tbh.

 

[JTG]

Rooney's last interview told us everything we needed to know - he truly believes this team is above the bar because of the level of winning they have done in totality. Until that thought process is gone...this is what we get. Point, blank, period.

It is infuriating because honestly, keeping Pickens was the right move to ACTUALLY win. So now we are really just the same team as last year with a better run defense and MAYBE a better rushing attack. No bueno.

 

[T1K]

If Pickens had played out his contract, then signed with someone else next year, wouldn't the Steelers gotten almost the same compensation as they got in the trade?

If so, the trade becomes even more incomprehensible.

If the plan is to get a QB in the 2026 draft, a 2026 3rd is far more helpful than a 2027 comp pick.

 

[JTG]

They honestly need to take a QB the next 2 drafts. Flood the system. Now is the time. They have the assets. Let Howard run the pack. I like the idea. I think we have the right guy in Howard to really assist this thing.

 

[pistolpete11]

I think Rooney and Tomlin's goal is to win as many games as possible every year. It's as simple as that. I wish it was to win Super Bowls or at least playoff games in the not too distant future, but everything they've said leads me to believe they take pride in NHALS and being above the bar or whatever other phrase.

Since Khan has taken over, though, there has been a clear shift. They are building the trenches in the draft, they are taking into account character more, and they are making decisions that benefit the long term more than they have in a long time (ex. acquiring so many comp picks next year). They are finally building towards something and it's not 2025.

 

[pistolpete11]

Rooney's last interview told us everything we needed to know - he truly believes this team is above the bar because of the level of winning they have done in totality. Until that thought process is gone...this is what we get. Point, blank, period.

It is infuriating because honestly, keeping Pickens was the right move to ACTUALLY win. So now we are really just the same team as last year with a better run defense and MAYBE a better rushing attack. No bueno.

ACTUALLY win with Mason Rudolph or 42-year-old Rodgers? I don't see it, even with Pickens.

 

[bigdaddyk88]

ACTUALLY win with Mason Rudolph or 42-year-old Rodgers? I don't see it, even with Pickens.

10/7 is the ceiling and 1st round playoff loss as the roster sits today

 

[bigdaddyk88]

They honestly need to take a QB the next 2 drafts. Flood the system. Now is the time. They have the assets. Let Howard run the pack. I like the idea. I think we have the right guy in Howard to really assist this thing.

Howard isn’t going to start at all next season unless there is injuries

 

[DanielPlainview]

Art II needs to step down. Hopefully the next generation of Rooneys understands football has evolved since the early 90s. You're not going anywhere relying on an elite defense and a lunchpail offense.

 

[bigdaddyk88]

I can’t wait to watch Woods and Ben run block as a wr

 

[Booker T]

I have some serious questions about how this team operates, but I don’t have many doubts that their goal every year is to win the Super Bowl. To win the Super Bowl, you need to make the playoffs. To make the playoffs you need to have a winning record. I think that’s all there is to it.

They typically just focus one year at a time. I think this offseason is the first one in a while I can remember that seems to be setting up more for the year after than the upcoming one.

Steelers need to up their game.