OT: The Pittsburgher Thread: Its January and we are still talking about Handball!?! Currently 10-6

[MrBrightside]

Agreed. what a buzzkill!

And I still believe the Steelers job is the best in the NFL due to ownership giving the HC position basically a lifetime contract and it being part of their fabric. Every year there is the graphic showing three coaches in 55+ years etc.

The next coach will be given a vast amount of time. Especially if the team doesn't have a franchise QB.

Johnson is going to look for a win now situation that is based on offense. If you really think he'd be interested in coming here to Wilson, Pickens, and this rag tag bunch of offensive players, you're more optimistic than I am. It's all academic anyway - Tomlin isn't going anywhere and the next offensive coach this organization makes the head coach will be the first...at least the first since the 1960's.

 

[MrBrightside]

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

When you hear Tomlin talk, it's clear he he has no real answers. They aren't creating turnovers. Turnovers are notoriously fluky, particularly fumbles. The ball bounces the way it bounces. Is it a good idea to try and maximize the number of times the other team puts the ball on the ground? Sure. But you are going to end up with games like in Baltimore where the other team recovers.

Minkah is the only one who has come out and admitted that teams were scheming against their weaknesses, though he inexplicably placed blame on the veterans who were brought in as FA's. Somehow, all season long these guys were allowed to continue to communicate using the terminology of their old teams and only just now in the thick of their schedule did teams start to exploit this.

This shit happens every year in December to the defense, as B2B has pointed out. It's a joke. Highest paid defense in the league. Every defense has FA additions at this point, and the defense has reportedly been dumbed down significantly over the years so guys could supposedly do more playing and less thinking.

It's going to get carved up badly in the post-season no matter who they play.
Additionally, as I said in the game thread, when he runs into these offenses that go for it on 4th down quite frequently (Eagles and Chefs), it stresses the scenario even more that you highlight above. He is doing absolutely nothing in the game plan to counter. He comes into the game down 7 not realizing that he will lose TOP/Series counts automatically because he does nothing on the offensive side to increase risk and increase possessions.

 

[bigdaddyk88]

Yeah Ben Johnson is going to be able to pick any location he wants, he's not coming to a team with no QB, no offensive weapons and a rapidly aging defense.

At least on the offensive side of the ball, I think my plan as of now would be:

1. Draft a WR in round 1 this year
2. Go with Fields over Wilson due to cost and use the money saved to help pay for a good WR2 in free agency
3. Trade Pickens at the draft for a 2nd rounder, with the intend of using that to help out either DT or CB.

I don't think the Steelers could realistically contend with the market to sign Higgins, but Godwin could be a decent option. Adding Godwin in free agency and Isaiah Bond with their 1st would be a nice boost for the WR group.

Why couldn’t we compete they invest in the Higgings market both guys are in the 23 to 25 million aav range which is what they were looking at paying Aiyuk neither are seen as wr 1. Higgins is hurt often and doesn’t practice during the season. He played through a high ankle sprain he would not have if he was on a long term contract
There’s no world they sign either guy and draft a wr round 1.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Why couldn’t we compete they invest in the Higgings market both guys are in the 23 to 25 million aav range which is what they were looking at paying Aiyuk neither are seen as wr 1. Higgins is hurt often and doesn’t practice during the season. He played through a high ankle sprain he would not have if he was on a long term contract
There’s no world they sign either guy and draft a wr round 1.

I figure Higgins is breaking $30 million on his deal and other teams will outbid the Steelers for him. Especially with how Khan has operated as GM.

I'm also skeptical a Bengals player would want to sign with the Steelers on a huge deal, even though Queen went from the Ravens to the Steelers last year.

 

[bigdaddyk88]

I figure Higgins is breaking $30 million on his deal and other teams will outbid the Steelers for him. Especially with how Khan has operated as GM.

I'm also skeptical a Bengals player would want to sign with the Steelers on a huge deal, even though Queen went from the Ravens to the Steelers last year.

I figure Higgins is breaking $30 million on his deal and other teams will outbid the Steelers for him. Especially with how Khan has operated as GM.

I'm also skeptical a Bengals player would want to sign with the Steelers on a huge deal, even though Queen went from the Ravens to the Steelers last year.

Next season only 4 teams have a wr with a cap at 30 million or more. Higgins on the tag made 21 million. Not sure he gets more than DJ more got 4/110 27 million Aav

 

[Peat]

I figure Higgins is breaking $30 million on his deal and other teams will outbid the Steelers for him. Especially with how Khan has operated as GM.

I'm also skeptical a Bengals player would want to sign with the Steelers on a huge deal, even though Queen went from the Ravens to the Steelers last year.

The odds of the Bengals finding a way to keep him shouldn't be discounted - and neither should them getting him to agree to a tag and trade to a team that then gives him a long term contract, at which point you know the Bengals won't trade him to the Steelers.

I want them to be in if the opportunity is there, but I have low expectations.

 

[xlm34]

I have a feeling DK Metcalf is on this team next year.

 

[bigdaddyk88]

I have a feeling DK Metcalf is on this team next year.

If people hate how GP acts they will hate DK

 

[Empoleon8771]

The odds of the Bengals finding a way to keep him shouldn't be discounted - and neither should them getting him to agree to a tag and trade to a team that then gives him a long term contract, at which point you know the Bengals won't trade him to the Steelers.

I want them to be in if the opportunity is there, but I have low expectations.

Yeah that's why I think Godwin is a bit more realistic. He's a bit older, doesn't have the same divisional rivalry that would prevent a deal and I think he's less likely to be re-signed by the Bucs than Higgins is to be re-signed by the Bengals.

Going into next year with Godwin, Bond/Egbuka (round 1 pick) and Austin as your top-3 WRs with using the pick you get for Pickens on a CB is an idea I like. I like Edbuka a lot from his measurables, a 6'1" 205 lb slot receiver with 4.3 speed? I love that. Only issue is that Austin (and Wilson, if he ever plays) are also both slot guys.

 

[bigdaddyk88]

The odds of the Bengals finding a way to keep him shouldn't be discounted - and neither should them getting him to agree to a tag and trade to a team that then gives him a long term contract, at which point you know the Bengals won't trade him to the Steelers.

I want them to be in if the opportunity is there, but I have low expectations.

To tag him it would cost them 25 million thats half of their cap space plus Chase wants 40 million a year thats a lot of guarantee money in escrow
They were 3rd in defensive spending and need to rebuild their defense

 

[Peat]

To tag him it would cost them 25 million thats half of their cap space plus Chase wants 40 million a year thats a lot of guarantee money in escrow
They were 3rd in defensive spending and need to rebuild their defense

I said tag and trade. There'd be no dead money post trade.

 

[End of Line]

Decided to crunch some numbers from the 4 game losing streak:

They have been out gained 1,522yds to 1,035yds an avg of 380.5yds to 258.75yds

Out scored 109p to 57p with an avg of 27.25p to 14.25p

They’ve also forced 5 TO’s but have also turned it over 6x themselves

Just f***ing ugly

 

[pistolpete11]

Oh yeah in an offense driven league having an offensive HC is such an advantage. Not to say you can’t win with a defense first HC but you’re going to have to nail OC picks every other year if your offense is good because your OC will get a head coaching job somewhere.

I totally agree. It doesn't HAVE to be an offensive guy, though that'd make it easier, and it won't be with the Steelers. I've come to terms with that. All I can hope for is 1) It's not Tomlin 2) The defensive guy realizes his limitations, hires a good OC, and stays the f*** out of his way and 3) he's aggressive and at least wants to score points.

So tired of this just keep it close and hope to kick a few more FGs than they do.

 

[xlm34]

Yeah that's why I think Godwin is a bit more realistic. He's a bit older, doesn't have the same divisional rivalry that would prevent a deal and I think he's less likely to be re-signed by the Bucs than Higgins is to be re-signed by the Bengals.

Going into next year with Godwin, Bond/Egbuka (round 1 pick) and Austin as your top-3 WRs with using the pick you get for Pickens on a CB is an idea I like. I like Edbuka a lot from his measurables, a 6'1" 205 lb slot receiver with 4.3 speed? I love that. Only issue is that Austin (and Wilson, if he ever plays) are also both slot guys.

Godwin has also been mostly a slot guy in his career although I think he has played outside some. If you get rid of Pickens and bring in Godwin, I think you’d need to also prioritize getting someone you think can win on the outside.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Godwin has also been mostly a slot guy in his career although I think he has played outside some. If you get rid of Pickens and bring in Godwin, I think you’d need to also prioritize getting someone you think can win on the outside.

Yeah that's why I think Bond is a bit more realistic than Egbuka if they're going the draft route. I think you can argue that they need to get an outside WR regardless of whether they keep or trade Pickens. Even if you keep Pickens, I don't really see a second outside WR on the team. Austin is too small to do it effectively and relying on Wilson to be anything right now is a risky gamble.

The comparison I've seen for Egbuka is Shakir from Buffalo, who can play outside but is wildly more effective in the slot.

 

[Shrimper]

We won't fix our WR issues and continue to focus on a run game even though it's clear we're incapable of doing it.

 

[bigdaddyk88]

I said tag and trade. There'd be no dead money post trade.

Right but even with a tag n trade you have to have the money available when he signs and its tied up til they trade him

 

[xlm34]

Yeah that's why I think Bond is a bit more realistic than Egbuka if they're going the draft route. I think you can argue that they need to get an outside WR regardless of whether they keep or trade Pickens. Even if you keep Pickens, I don't really see a second outside WR on the team. Austin is too small to do it effectively and relying on Wilson to be anything right now is a risky gamble.

The comparison I've seen for Egbuka is Shakir from Buffalo, who can play outside but is wildly more effective in the slot.

Oh yeah another outside guy (2 if they kick Pickens to the curb) is a complete non negotiable for Khan not to have a total disaster of an offseason. You cannot have what you had this year.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Oh yeah another outside guy (2 if they kick Pickens to the curb) is a complete non negotiable for Khan not to have a total disaster of an offseason. You cannot have what you had this year.

Yeah and ultimately, I think the most likely outcome is that they just re-sign Pickens and draft an outside WR in either round 1 or 2. Pickens is frustrating to deal with, but they'd likely get back a pretty poor return for him if they tried to move him. Just imagine what message that would send other teams if the Steelers are trying to trade Pickens with the quality of other WRs the team has. It's a dead giveaway that there's something wrong.

I think the absolute most we'd see is an outside WR drafted early and a #2/3 slot/outside hybrid guy FA signed. Enter next year with a WR room of something like Pickens, Hopkins, Austin, Bond and Wilson to start and eventually Bond will jump Austin and Hopkins will move to the slot WR role. Hopkins has primarily been an outside WR for his career but has a decent bit of slot WR experience as well:

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

If people hate how GP acts they will hate DK

Agreed
Metcalf is another GP.

Metcalf is less of an issue because Seattle actually throws him the ball

Blew my mind when I found out that the reason we went from the game plan that produced 520 total yards and 44 points is because Mike Tomlin believed Cincy's defense had vastly improved over the last four weeks since the first matchup and didn't think the Steelers could replicate that game plan.

So Tomlin made a deliberate decision to go run heavy this time.

https://www.post-gazette.com/sports/ste ... 2412300113

I'm sure he was scared of Cincy's improved turnover numbers, even though half of the turnovers came in one game against the Titans.

CLASSIC living in his fears stuff from the man who "doesn't live in his fears".

 

[Peat]

Right but even with a tag n trade you have to have the money available when he signs and its tied up til they trade him

The Chiefs traded Sneed within two and a half weeks of FA starting in a similar position. Even for the cheap Bengals, this is is not an impossible scenario.

 

[bigdaddyk88]

The Chiefs traded Sneed within two and a half weeks of FA starting in a similar position. Even for the cheap Bengals, this is is not an impossible scenario.

It’s about escrow but we will see

Agreed
Metcalf is another GP.

Metcalf is less of an issue because Seattle actually throws him the ball

Blew my mind when I found out that the reason we went from the game plan that produced 520 total yards and 44 points is because Mike Tomlin believed Cincy's defense had vastly improved over the last four weeks since the first matchup and didn't think the Steelers could replicate that game plan.

So Tomlin made a deliberate decision to go run heavy this time.

https://www.post-gazette.com/sports/ste ... 2412300113

I'm sure he was scared of Cincy's improved turnover numbers, even though half of the turnovers came in one game against the Titans.

CLASSIC living in his fears stuff from the man who "doesn't live in his fears".

The funny thing Smith called plays that worked against the bengals that RW ignored, Watching the all 22 since the Philly game its easy to see why Denver dumped RW

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

The funny thing Smith called plays that worked against the bengals that RW ignored, Watching the all 22 since the Philly game its easy to see why Denver dumped RW

But the overall philosophy damned them from the beginning. They continued to run on 1st and 2nd downs despite being behind.

All QB's are going to miss some throws. And the obvious times we decided to throw, RW had pressure. The players did execute, but this gameplan did the offense no favors

Also when you game plan to be in one score games a fumble here and a fumble there really kills you.

It’s why Tomlin lives in his fears hasn’t featured Warren over Harris.

If you have a big boy offense that moves the ball and scores with consistency you don’t need to worry about the occasional turn over nearly as much.

 

[bigdaddyk88]

I don’t think they wait on the draft for a wr. They have to move money off the defense to offense and draft Cam replacement. They need cb depth even if Trice steals DJ job