OT: The Pittsburgher Thread: Congrats to the Seattle Kraken, uhhhh SeaHawks!

[Wattsburgh]

There is a huge difference in going into a game prepared to play it and Mike Tomlin.

This is true lol.

 

[pistolpete11]

I don't understand the QB methodology here. If 2027 is as loaded as everything thinks, then the Steelers would want to probably take one of those guys. So that would make Allar and Hahrd completely DIW. Wouldn't you like to see what you have in those guys first? If you don't see what you have, then you CANNOT pass on a Sellers or Sayin next year. And if you take one of those guys, then you've wasted your third round pick in three straight years! You wasted the pick you got for Pickens.

I'm fine with taking Allar but you gotta see him in action. Stop dicking around with Rodgers.

Their process here makes no logical sense and that makes me mad. At best they're wasting picks on QBs they'll never be using, at worst they're actually planning on bypassing QB next draft because they maybe saw something when Allar was running scout team? Huh?

I basically agree with you and it's why I was against drafting a QB before R5-6, but to play devil's advocate, what happens if the 2027 class falls apart just like the 2026 class did? How long do you continue to kick the can down the road?

Allar gives them a long term project and who knows what the future holds? Even if they draft a R1 guy in 2027, that guy could bust or get hurt and then they fall back on Allar. By then, maybe we works a few things out. That's what happened with Washington when they took RG3 and Cousins in the same draft.

 

[Double-Shift Lasse]

what happens if the 2027 class falls apart just like the 2026 class did? How long do you continue to kick the can down the road?

That would never happen.

Is what people said when they were like don't bother to draft a QB in '25 because look at the '26 class.

 

[Peat]

If Aaron Rodgers couldn’t win last year what makes them think he can this year? Just curious. It’s not like he’s in his prime and getting better. And we only made substitutions in free agency outside of Pittman Jr. The draft was offensive heavy but considered developmental. All these signs point to just starting Will Howard and then Allar if he fails. I guess it comes down to is McCarthy and Pittman Jr., enough to win a Super Bowl compared to last year? With the talent in Buffalo and New England and the entire AFC West plus what the Texans did this offseason I say no. Go for the homerun franchise QB in 2027 and play Howard to see what you got. Would actually be more entertaining to accept losing then. Losing with Rodgers would be a nightmare. No Super Bowl and another mid round pick. Boring and disappointing.

If the aim is SB or bust, when is the last time a team with a QB picked in the top 5 won?

I'm not at all hard set on signing Rodgers to make the first round, but the whole throw the kids in as it's a win-win is ignoring that there's been a lot of losing for this strategy recently. Lot of teams not being able to get QBs despite drafting high, lot of QBs not working out.

Meanwhile the SB was just won by a team on their 2nd mid-tier starter after losing a franchise QB. Prior to that, a team with a 2nd round QB. A combined 3 losing seasons out of the last 20 and a continuous emphasis on putting QBs up to the job out there.

I'm not saying it has to be done that way, but I think the idea that throwing cannon fodder out at QB to draft high is definitely the way to go has a few flaws to it.

 

[Empoleon8771]

There are a couple of major faults in the "they should draft a QB in 2027" talk:

1. We have no idea if the QB class in 2027 will be good. It was supposed to be great in 2026 and it wasn't.

2. The Steelers will likely be too good to be in a position to draft a huge upgrade at QB, even with someone like Allar or Howard starting. Between Simpson going #13 this year and the most recent QB heavy draft having 6 guys going before #12, I think the Steelers need to have a top-5 pick to get a franchise altering QB. The roster just has too much juice for that to happen.

3. Even if they get a super high pick to draft a QB, it's not a guarantee that QB pans out, so having more lottery tickets like Allar and Howard is worth it. Of the 6 QBs taken early in 2024, 2 of them haven't panned out at all (Penix and McCarthy), 2 have been hits (Nix and Maye) and 2 have been a bit up and down so far (Daniels and Williams). We have no clue whether the Steelers pick would be Maye 2.0 or McCarthy 2.0, even if they were in the position to draft that QB.

 

[Wattsburgh]

If the aim is SB or bust, when is the last time a team with a QB picked in the top 5 won?

I'm not at all hard set on signing Rodgers to make the first round, but the whole throw the kids in as it's a win-win is ignoring that there's been a lot of losing for this strategy recently. Lot of teams not being able to get QBs despite drafting high, lot of QBs not working out.

Meanwhile the SB was just won by a team on their 2nd mid-tier starter after losing a franchise QB. Prior to that, a team with a 2nd round QB. A combined 3 losing seasons out of the last 20 and a continuous emphasis on putting QBs up to the job out there.

I'm not saying it has to be done that way, but I think the idea that throwing cannon fodder out at QB to draft high is definitely the way to go has a few flaws to it.

Ben Roethlisberger, Joe Burrow, and just recently Maye and Nix if he didn’t get hurt. Caleb Williams almost made it. You’re saying a top young QB can’t compete for a SB surrounded by talent? I guess I’m confused with what you’re saying. I see young QBs win all the time. Mahomes wasn’t that old during his first either. Brady came in right away and won. And your own Roethlisberger beat out the veteran favorite Matt Hasselbeck. Anyway that’s getting off topic and my point was to just get your franchise QB and stop dicking around. And wasting the talent that is already here. These QBs today can play sooner than years past.

 

[Peat]

I basically agree with you and it's why I was against drafting a QB before R5-6, but to play devil's advocate, what happens if the 2027 class falls apart just like the 2026 class did? How long do you continue to kick the can down the road?

Allar gives them a long term project and who knows what the future holds? Even if they draft a R1 guy in 2027, that guy could bust or get hurt and then they fall back on Allar. By then, maybe we works a few things out. That's what happened with Washington when they took RG3 and Cousins in the same draft.

You throw some money at Mac Jones or Kyler Murray in free agency and hope they're the next castoff QBs to blossom in a good environment.

There are a couple of major faults in the "they should draft a QB in 2027" talk:

1. We have no idea if the QB class in 2027 will be good. It was supposed to be great in 2026 and it wasn't.

2. The Steelers will likely be too good to be in a position to draft a huge upgrade at QB, even with someone like Allar or Howard starting. Between Simpson going #13 this year and the most recent QB heavy draft having 6 guys going before #12, I think the Steelers need to have a top-5 pick to get a franchise altering QB. The roster just has too much juice for that to happen.

3. Even if they get a super high pick to draft a QB, it's not a guarantee that QB pans out, so having more lottery tickets like Allar and Howard is worth it. Of the 6 QBs taken early in 2024, 2 of them haven't panned out at all (Penix and McCarthy), 2 have been hits (Nix and Maye) and 2 have been a bit up and down so far (Daniels and Williams). We have no clue whether the Steelers pick would be Maye 2.0 or McCarthy 2.0, even if they were in the position to draft that QB.

There's faults in every QB acquisition strategy. The failure rate is high across the board.

But the team can trade up and you can absolutely get good QBs around 10 in the draft which they can trade up to without going insane. The draft may not cooperate but that is a path with a reasonable history of success, albeit high risk-high reward. The way the team is constructed, it's should get talked about until its proven that it's not needed or the draft won't support it and it'll be a miracle if it's not needed.

 

[Wattsburgh]

There are a couple of major faults in the "they should draft a QB in 2027" talk:

1. We have no idea if the QB class in 2027 will be good. It was supposed to be great in 2026 and it wasn't.

2. The Steelers will likely be too good to be in a position to draft a huge upgrade at QB, even with someone like Allar or Howard starting. Between Simpson going #13 this year and the most recent QB heavy draft having 6 guys going before #12, I think the Steelers need to have a top-5 pick to get a franchise altering QB. The roster just has too much juice for that to happen.

3. Even if they get a super high pick to draft a QB, it's not a guarantee that QB pans out, so having more lottery tickets like Allar and Howard is worth it. Of the 6 QBs taken early in 2024, 2 of them haven't panned out at all (Penix and McCarthy), 2 have been hits (Nix and Maye) and 2 have been a bit up and down so far (Daniels and Williams). We have no clue whether the Steelers pick would be Maye 2.0 or McCarthy 2.0, even if they were in the position to draft that QB.

I like the Steelers chances of developing an Arch Manning / Dante Moore more so than the Jets. Besides just because they don’t always pan out doesn’t mean you stop trying. You keep drafting one UNTIL you do. It’s always been that way with every team.

 

[Peat]

Ben Roethlisberger, Joe Burrow, and just recently Maye and Nix if he didn’t get hurt. Caleb Williams almost made it. You’re saying a top young QB can’t compete for a SB surrounded by talent? I guess I’m confused with what you’re saying. I see young QBs win all the time. Mahomes wasn’t that old during his first either. Brady came in right away and won. And your own Roethlisberger beat out the veteran favorite Matt Hasselbeck. Anyway that’s getting off topic and my point was to just get your franchise QB and stop dicking around. And wasting the talent that is already here. These QBs today can play sooner than years past.

I said top 5 pick QB win the SB. Your list of examples is, iirc, 11, didn't win, didn't win, didn't win, didn't win, 11.

Yes, a top young QB can win a SB if surrounded by talent. Indeed, given the way the rookie wage scale works, a young QB is the best way.

But getting that top young QB in the top 5 picks and then being able to surround him with enough talent is clearly not that easy.

(Also not my Roethlisberger. I purposefully didn't become a Steelers fan until he retired).

 

[Wattsburgh]

Do you want the Roethlisberger era or the Maddox/Kordell/Tomzack/Graham/Brister/Odonnell era. I’ll take Ben. And yes 2027 has the makings of being that special. I like the draft more so than the Super Bowl and have been following them for years. 2026 QB class was known as ass. Especially compared to this one (27).

 

[Empoleon8771]

I like the Steelers chances of developing an Arch Manning / Dante Moore more so than the Jets. Besides just because they don’t always pan out doesn’t mean you stop trying. You keep drafting one UNTIL you do. It’s always been that way with every team.

But it's not just about what teams are drafting them, guys can be completely random on the same team. Look at how McCarthy flopped on the Vikings while Cousins and Darnold had their careers revived there. The Falcons developed Matt Ryan but completely flopped on Penix. The Colts developed Luck but completely flopped on Richardson.

I agree with you that it's just "keep trying until you get it", but I think that "trying until you get it" also includes taking gambles like Allar in the mid rounds.

There's faults in every QB acquisition strategy. The failure rate is high across the board.

But the team can trade up and you can absolutely get good QBs around 10 in the draft which they can trade up to without going insane. The draft may not cooperate but that is a path with a reasonable history of success, albeit high risk-high reward. The way the team is constructed, it's should get talked about until its proven that it's not needed or the draft won't support it and it'll be a miracle if it's not needed.

Yeah I wasn't saying "don't draft a QB high in 2027", my point was more about how you can only draft a QB high in 2027 and any other strategy won't work. The reality is that most won't work and it's all mostly about getting lucky.

 

[Wattsburgh]

I want just want a franchise QB again damnit (Bradshaw/Roethlisberger). Lol. I know we still compete with the Odonnells and Kordells of the world but a franchise QB lasts longer. Unfortunately we are spoiled and want dynasties.

 

[pistolpete11]

But getting that top young QB in the top 5 picks and then being able to surround him with enough talent is clearly not that easy.

Particularly before you need to pay them $40-50-60M/year.

You spend the first few years of that guy's career rebuilding the roster, have a shot or 2 at it where anything could happen in a given year, and then the rest of their career sacrificing the rest of the roster to be able to pay them.

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

If the aim is SB or bust, when is the last time a team with a QB picked in the top 5 won?

I'm not at all hard set on signing Rodgers to make the first round, but the whole throw the kids in as it's a win-win is ignoring that there's been a lot of losing for this strategy recently. Lot of teams not being able to get QBs despite drafting high, lot of QBs not working out.

Meanwhile the SB was just won by a team on their 2nd mid-tier starter after losing a franchise QB. Prior to that, a team with a 2nd round QB. A combined 3 losing seasons out of the last 20 and a continuous emphasis on putting QBs up to the job out there.

I think it's hard to evaluate and develop a strategy along the lines of: what are other teams doing?
There are so many variables in football, it's almost impossible to account for them.

Look at the last couple of SB staring QB's. They are almost all anomalies.

Mahommes- went from Superman where he couldn't lose to being more pedestrian where they had to rely on defense and running game.
Hurts- SB MVP who was benched in college. Amazing a couple years ago but now looks pretty lost.
Darnold - major anomaly who was a high pick, benched, rebuilt by KOD and was in a great environment to maximize his talents. Remember the year prior all the experts predicted and said he folded in big moments.
Maye- probably the most "normal" trajectory. A top 5 pick who had a tough couple of seasons with a poor team around him. But when they started getting talent, he blossomed last year.

If you go further back, you'll have Tom Brady who is the very definition of "outlier".

I think if you want to see any commonalities with those teams who made the SB it is this: a strong running game and opportunistic defense. Of course you need good play from the QB too, but I see it as something deeper.

 

[pistolpete11]

Do you want the Roethlisberger era or the Maddox/Kordell/Tomzack/Graham/Brister/Odonnell era. I’ll take Ben. And yes 2027 has the makings of being that special. I like the draft more so than the Super Bowl and have been following them for years. 2026 QB class was known as ass. Especially compared to this one (27).

2026 QB class was not thought of as ass a year out. It lacked top end guys, but it had like 6 guys that were projecting to be R1 picks. Ended up with 2 and they were a different 2 than originally thought.

Point being, nobody really knows this far out and a lot can change.

 

[Empoleon8771]

I still think they should have just committed to Darnold when he was a free agent, I know he was focused on Seattle but the Steelers were in too but were unwilling to commit to him being their franchise QB.

 

[pistolpete11]

I still think they should have just committed to Darnold when he was a free agent, I know he was focused on Seattle but the Steelers were in too but were unwilling to commit to him being their franchise QB.

I really didn't want him at the time because I thought he was going to get massively overpaid. Then I saw the contract and was like "Well, shit. I would have done that."

 

[Wattsburgh]

2026 QB class was not thought of as ass a year out. It lacked top end guys, but it had like 6 guys that were projecting to be R1 picks. Ended up with 2 and they were a different 2 than originally thought.

Point being, nobody really knows this far out and a lot can change.

Key Notes on the 2027 QB Class

• Loaded Class: Scouts are reportedly very excited about this group, with some describing it as potentially the best quarterback draft of all time, possibly featuring up to eight first-round prospects.

I know for a fact they didn’t say this about 2026. Before the college season nor during.

All time???

 

[Empoleon8771]

Key Notes on the 2027 QB Class

• Loaded Class: Scouts are reportedly very excited about this group, with some describing it as potentially the best quarterback draft of all time, possibly featuring up to eight first-round prospects.

I know for a fact they didn’t say this about 2026. Before the college season nor during.

All time???

They actually did. The class was supposed to be elite at QB with Manning, Klubnik, Nussmeier, Leavitt, Allar and Sellers all as projected round 1 QBs.

A big reason the 2027 class is getting hyped so much is that Manning, Moore, Leavitt and Sellers didn't declare for the 2026 draft.

 

[xlm34]

I’m buying the ‘27 hype way more than I bought the ‘26 hype. Manning and Moore would have been top half of the draft QBs had they declared this year and that didn’t exist going in to ‘26.

Last year was always going to turn a little ugly if the underclassmen didn’t declare and unfortunately they didn’t. Same thing could happen this year but I think it’s a way more intriguing group.

 

[The Deuce]

The college game is really not producing quality QBs right now. Every year we hear the next class is going to be good only to see it flop. Not sure what teams can do about that.

 

[The Deuce]

The college game is really not producing quality QBs right now. Not sure what teams can do about that. Every year we hear the next class is going to be good but it turns out to be pretty mediocre.

 

[PensandCaps]

There are a couple of major faults in the "they should draft a QB in 2027" talk:

1. We have no idea if the QB class in 2027 will be good. It was supposed to be great in 2026 and it wasn't.

2. The Steelers will likely be too good to be in a position to draft a huge upgrade at QB, even with someone like Allar or Howard starting. Between Simpson going #13 this year and the most recent QB heavy draft having 6 guys going before #12, I think the Steelers need to have a top-5 pick to get a franchise altering QB. The roster just has too much juice for that to happen.

3. Even if they get a super high pick to draft a QB, it's not a guarantee that QB pans out, so having more lottery tickets like Allar and Howard is worth it. Of the 6 QBs taken early in 2024, 2 of them haven't panned out at all (Penix and McCarthy), 2 have been hits (Nix and Maye) and 2 have been a bit up and down so far (Daniels and Williams). We have no clue whether the Steelers pick would be Maye 2.0 or McCarthy 2.0, even if they were in the position to draft that QB.

Daniels is definitely a hit. just hurt last season

 

[Wattsburgh]

QB-Will Howard, Drew Allar, 2027 1st Round
RB-Rico Dowdle, Jaylen Warren, Kaleb Johnson
WR-DK Metcalf, Michael Pittman Jr., Germie Bernard, Roman Wilson
TE-Pat Freiermuth, Darnell Washington
OT-Troy Fautanu
OG-Gennings Dunker
C-Zach Frazier
OG-Mason McCormick
OT-Max Iheanachor
OT-Broderick Jones
ST/Hybrid-Eli Heidenreich, Kaden Wetjen

I’m completely fine with this youth development. With our Defensive talent and McCarthy on Offense now we need a new identity. I’m completely fine with at least trying not to think we can win a SB without a franchise Quarterback and let McCarthy come in without pressure and instead developing his mark. Take a year off and get your 2027 QB. I’m all for it. Would make me love watching the College Football season as well. This is MUCH needed. NO MORE MID PICKS FOR 1 season. We need high end asap.

 

[Wattsburgh]

They actually did. The class was supposed to be elite at QB with Manning, Klubnik, Nussmeier, Leavitt, Allar and Sellers all as projected round 1 QBs.

A big reason the 2027 class is getting hyped so much is that Manning, Moore, Leavitt and Sellers didn't declare for the 2026 draft.

Yeah but with the NIL everyone in mock circles knew Manning wasn’t coming out. And I never wanted anything to do with Klubnik nor Nussmeier. And Sellers reminded me of AR so that one was iffy. So none of these 3 were considered franchise QBs amongst mock enthusiasts. At least on the boards I visit.