OT: The Pittsburgher Thread: 5 and 2 Justin who? Hand the Fields to Wilson

[bigdaddyk88]

Harris is a serviceable back who unfortunately due to his draft position has no business being just serviceable. There really is nothing more to say in my opinion.

With Warren getting healthier I'd suspect that the YPC goes up for Najee the rest of year.

Warren is rb 3 right now

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

Warren is rb 3 right now

Is Warren still working his way back from injury? What's going on with that?

 

[End of Line]

 

[pistolpete11]

"If you don't have Najee Harris, you're looking for a Najee Harris."

 

[Double-Shift Lasse]

Not sure that's 100% accurate. When Najee was out yesterday, Patterson assumed that role, but Warren still played on downs when Warren would have played, i.e. Warren rotated situationally with whomever was also playing.

 

[Peat]

Any QB needy team is likely to take one in the draft. That doesn't mean JF wouldn't be a good addition to their roster.
He could also go to a team like Jax and get a bunch of games as a starter due to Trevor's inability to stay healthy.

Fields is going to be in high demand this offseason. That's my prediction. (note this is not an endorsement of him)

But going to somewhere as a 'veteran' mentor to a QB who'll take his job halfway through the season, or to a frankly ropey AF Jacksonville to gamble that Lawrence - a guy who only missed one game his first three seasons - is going to be the QB who misses the most games, is a situation in which Pittsburgh can make a competitive pitch.

In hindsight they should have paid him this off-season.

Now he is going to get paid more than he is worth. If that prediction is anywhere close to accurate, I hope that it is not the Steelers doing the paying.

I don't think they should have. I'd have been okay with them doing so but I don't think they'll commit to using Harris the way he should be used, I think they're best to sever the cord, even if 6.5m for Harris isn't awful value.

I know he just turned down the UNC job, but I could see Arthur Smith getting another HC job opportunity somewhere too. Maybe even the NFL. A top 10 offensive unit comprised mainly of castoffs from other teams is some real “oil from stone” type shit.

I definitely think he'll be offered it if he keeps things up. Be interesting to see how interested he'd be. If I was him, I'd only bite if it was a real pearl of a job.

I mean it was a blizzard and Wilson still put up strong numbers for the conditions (21 for 28 with 270 passing yards).

He had a 75% completion percentage for 270 yards and a TD good for a 116.7 QB rating in the snow. He had the fumble, but that's about it. It was ugly for the offense as a whole because they couldn't run the ball effectively, specifically on short yardage, but Russ played well all things considered and his stat line was perfectly fine.

His only really 'bad' game statistically was the Ravens. You're right that there's a pretty big "so far" qualifier on there, but it's been a while since we've had a QB that could take advantage of mediocre or even bad teams. Things would have to get real ugly for me to not think that Russ is their best option going into next year.

My point was not that he had an awful game vs the Browns - although I do think too much is made of his raw stats and not enough of his performance at critical moments to extend drives - but that the sample size means each game can throw his stats in big directions either way. Although, yes, saying after the Ravens would have made the point even clearer.

And if you're looking for some games to set up real ugly, then Browns-Eagles-Ravens-Chiefs is a solid set up - two very physical divisional match-ups against teams who've shown the ability to overwhelm the Steeler OL, two top 10 defences. I would like to stress right now that if things go awful in those matches we should be slow to judge him, but the perception could be brutal - and being slow to judge vs hard match ups should be matched with being slow to judge vs easy. And hey, who knows, maybe he does pretty good against them and all of a sudden we're optimistic. Who knows! But given the uncertainty and small sample, it's a very open question.

And while I'm not really for moving on from Wilson atm, Rudolph put up a pretty similar passer rating and offensive scoreline last year vs the Bengals. The team had a decent day out vs 2 of the 3 bottom 10 defences they faced under Fields too. This team has been pretty solid vs bad defences ever since removing Canada/Pickett with three different QBs imo. Wilson's the best out of the three, but not so much I feel he's a different breed.

 

[xlm34]

But going to somewhere as a 'veteran' mentor to a QB who'll take his job halfway through the season, or to a frankly ropey AF Jacksonville to gamble that Lawrence - a guy who only missed one game his first three seasons - is going to be the QB who misses the most games, is a situation in which Pittsburgh can make a competitive pitch.

I definitely think he'll be offered it if he keeps things up. Be interesting to see how interested he'd be. If I was him, I'd only bite if it was a real pearl of a job.

I think these two things could be linked. If Smith does get a HC job and that team has a need at QB, I think there’s a decent chance Fields follows Smith. Smith seems to love Fields and I’d imagine given his performance as the starter, Fields would see that as a really good opportunity

 

[WickedWrister]

Just an absurd amount of distribution

 

[Peat]

I think these two things could be linked. If Smith does get a HC job and that team has a need at QB, I think there’s a decent chance Fields follows Smith. Smith seems to love Fields and I’d imagine given his performance as the starter, Fields would see that as a really good opportunity

Oh we talking about Smith getting a HC job this summer? I thought @WickedWrister meant some point in the future.

In any case, yeah, possible, although it feels unlikely. I would also add imo that any HC job that has a need at QB is not the real pearl of a job I'd bite at. Although who knows what Smith thinks. He hasn't exactly been bothered by QB in his previous stops.

 

[bigdaddyk88]

Is Warren still working his way back from injury? What's going on with that?

Warren isn’t an every down rb. He is somewhere between Pollard and Chase Brown. Has 5 fumbles and 6 rushing tds. He is solid 3rd down rb

 

[bigdaddyk88]

Oh we talking about Smith getting a HC job this summer? I thought @WickedWrister meant some point in the future.

In any case, yeah, possible, although it feels unlikely. I would also add imo that any HC job that has a need at QB is not the real pearl of a job I'd bite at. Although who knows what Smith thinks. He hasn't exactly been bothered by QB in his previous stops.

I think if he leaves for a HC gig it’s because of the Qb. He got fired because of Qb play in Atlanta. He can love fields all he wants but even a fields level Qb gets him fired again. People in Chicago loved fields he is a great teammate but he is severely limited as a passer. Smith has a lifetime contract under Tomlin I don’t think he goes anywhere. I could see him deciding on the o line coach future and working with Wilson next season and developing a rookie Qb behind the scenes next 2 seasons

 

[WickedWrister]

Oh we talking about Smith getting a HC job this summer? I thought @WickedWrister meant some point in the future.

In any case, yeah, possible, although it feels unlikely. I would also add imo that any HC job that has a need at QB is not the real pearl of a job I'd bite at. Although who knows what Smith thinks. He hasn't exactly been bothered by QB in his previous stops.

If we're talking about Smith getting another NFL HC job opportunity, that process usually starts as soon as the regular season ends AKA Bloody Monday, so sometime beginning in January.

We'll see how things shake out but if we can somehow end up winning a playoff game, Smith is going to get a lot of credit for resurrecting Russell Wilson's career. Ian Rapoport is basically a mouthpiece for these guys agents and wrote as much in the "article".

 

[Peat]

If we're talking about Smith getting another NFL HC job opportunity, that process usually starts as soon as the regular season ends AKA Bloody Monday, so sometime beginning in January.

We'll see how things shake out but if we can somehow end up winning a playoff game, Smith is going to get a lot of credit for resurrecting Russell Wilson's career. Ian Rapoport is basically a mouthpiece for these guys agents and wrote as much in the "article".

Huh, okay. See how that goes. I mostly hope not.

I would add that out of the current NFL HC roles going that I know of - Jets and Bears - I'd think twice about them due to incompetent ownership in Smith's shoes. He doesn't need the money so for him it's just about the ego, and if he wants to make his name I think the ownership could be serious barriers in both places. Both do have some attractive talent tho.

 

[Empoleon8771]

I think Smith needs more than 1 year of having a middling offense with the Steelers for me to think that he's a serious threat of leaving for a HC job.

 

[Peat]

Everything I said about wait and see until after the next four applies to Smith, but they are top 10 by ppg right now which is impressive for the talent assembled. It falls apart a little if you look at how, but I'm sure it'll get him a few interviews at least if he wants them.


Incidentally, have we all taken a moment to appreciate the latest bit of ex-Steeler WR drama?

 

[Empoleon8771]

Everything I said about wait and see until after the next four applies to Smith, but they are top 10 by ppg right now which is impressive for the talent assembled. It falls apart a little if you look at how, but I'm sure it'll get him a few interviews at least if he wants them.


Incidentally, have we all taken a moment to appreciate the latest bit of ex-Steeler WR drama?

Maybe I'm applying too much logic to it but I feel like Smith was so bad in his last stint that he needs a longer track record of being good before he gets another chance. But again, that's applying logic and it's not like the NFL operates based on that

 

[Peat]

Maybe I'm applying too much logic to it but I feel like Smith was so bad in his last stint that he needs a longer track record of being good before he gets another chance. But again, that's applying logic and it's not like the NFL operates based on that

God's ain truth.

 

[JTG]

I think if the Steelers finish in the top 10 offensively, he'd get calls for a HC for sure. Artie strikes me as a better coordinator than a HC though.

It'd be nice to keep some continuity here into next season.

Porter got worked. When reading the negatives of him through the draft process and seeing him at PSU, yesterday was what everyone was talking about. That was an atrocious performance by him.

 

[Peat]

The thing about Porter is quite a few of those look like what he's doing all game every game. The end zone spin around was particularly stupid but a lot of them, you see them every game from every guy. In 7 of Porter's 12 games this year, the refs have not said a damn word about it with the end result that he's been a pretty good CB.

But 3 games account for all but one of Porter's 13 penalties this season. And in those games, he's obviously an awful CB.

But, much as I am a huge believer in that you don't make excuses, you just figure out how to deal with the refs - how do you work with that? It's not even like he can look at a reffing crew and say "hey, they're consistent this way, I've got to do these things today". Hochuli's crew reffed the Steelers vs the Cowboys this year and didn't blow a thing on Porter, and I bet he gave them reason. Similarly Rogers' crew has done two Steelers' games this year, one with 3 penalties for Porter and one with none.

Do you tell Porter to completely modify his game so he can avoid getting penalised to hell in 25% of his games, or do you tell him to push it as 75% of games he effectively gets away with it (one penalty for a physical CB in this league is just the price of doing business)?

Hopefully they can find some middle ground tweaks but as a basic fundamental, the NFL needs to decide how they're consistently reffing Joey Porter before this team can tell him how to play.

 

[OnMyOwn]

I still think they should have taken him off Higgins. It was obvious that strategy wasn’t working.

 

[bigdaddyk88]

I still think they should have taken him off Higgins. It was obvious that strategy wasn’t working.

And put jackson who only plays zone on the goon. Jackson had safety help on chase often. Higgins when healthy and motivated is a real good receiver and he would look great here

 

[pistolpete11]

My point was not that he had an awful game vs the Browns - although I do think too much is made of his raw stats and not enough of his performance at critical moments to extend drives - but that the sample size means each game can throw his stats in big directions either way. Although, yes, saying after the Ravens would have made the point even clearer.

And if you're looking for some games to set up real ugly, then Browns-Eagles-Ravens-Chiefs is a solid set up - two very physical divisional match-ups against teams who've shown the ability to overwhelm the Steeler OL, two top 10 defences. I would like to stress right now that if things go awful in those matches we should be slow to judge him, but the perception could be brutal - and being slow to judge vs hard match ups should be matched with being slow to judge vs easy. And hey, who knows, maybe he does pretty good against them and all of a sudden we're optimistic. Who knows! But given the uncertainty and small sample, it's a very open question.

And while I'm not really for moving on from Wilson atm, Rudolph put up a pretty similar passer rating and offensive scoreline last year vs the Bengals. The team had a decent day out vs 2 of the 3 bottom 10 defences they faced under Fields too. This team has been pretty solid vs bad defences ever since removing Canada/Pickett with three different QBs imo. Wilson's the best out of the three, but not so much I feel he's a different breed.

I think Wilson individually and the offense as a whole have been a clear tier above Fields.

Wilson's stats are not being inflated by 1 good game. If anything, the Ravens game is the outlier that is dragging his numbers down which I dunno. Maybe it's unfair, but I just can't get too worked up about it. I've been watching this rivalry for too long to expect anything much different from anybody. I mean, the 2x NFL MVP across the field was even worse.

If we're talking about the plays you don't see on the stat sheet, I think it leans even further in Wilson's advantage. I've been pretty vocal about needing splash plays to provide instant offense from time to time and it's not even close when comparing Russ to Fields. Fields numbers are solid, but they were very conservative with him. Wilson has much more of a command of the offense and they are way more explosive with the moon balls.

I get it. He's (probably) not going to throw for 400 yards against the next 4 opponents. But statistically, stylistically, eye test, career track record, etc. I think it's being overly cautious to say we need to wait and see. The Steelers will because of their whole not wanting to discuss contracts mid-season thing, but as fans, it's pretty clear Russ is their best option for next year.

 

[Double-Shift Lasse]

And put jackson who only plays zone on the goon. Jackson had safety help on chase often. Higgins when healthy and motivated is a real good receiver and he would look great here

He and GP had a polite conversation on the field after the game.

 

[pistolpete11]

I think it's entirely possible that Smith is a good OC and not a good HC, but he went 7-10 with the husk of Matt Ryan, journeyman Mariota, and likely a bust in Ridder. That's not that bad.

Now, if he pushed strongly for Mariota or Ridder, it raises some questions about his talent evaluation. But he'd have Williams in Chicago. Jets would be a tougher decision because I think at 42 years old, Rodger is probably cooked, but maybe they will have a high draft pick and he can have another shot at drafting somebody. Should be a better QB class than Ridder's year (could it be much worse?).

 

[CheckingLineCenter]

Big argument for Smith is players seem to absolutely love him.

I see him as a Dan Quinn on the offensive side of the ball type long term. Lot of stops but a solid OC who will get HC looks.