OT: The Pittsburgher Thread: 5 and 2 Justin who? Hand the Fields to Wilson

[Buddy Bizarre]

I will say one positive thing about Fields' early slide - it completely negated any possibility of a fumble, which would have been by far the worst outcome of that play. Should have done better with it regardless but I do wonder if that was on his mind.

I think they definitely told him: whatever you do, don't fumble

But JF should also have been instructed: if you get the 1st down, you can go OOB if you need (which also avoids a potential fumble).

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

I’d be tempted at this point to just leave Jones at RT and continue to develop there with Fautanu playing LT — I’m not sure if his issues are solely playing a side he wasn’t used to and at this point he’s probably played as many games at RT in the NFL as he did at LT in college.

That is an option.

And I can't believe I'm going to type this, but Dan Moore for 3 more years at LT with Faunt staying at RT doesn't scare me. Let Jones continue to be the swing tackle. Then in a year or so they can pick another OT high.

 

[Goalie_Bob]

Yep, I think as well that not fumbling caused him to react the way that he did.

 

[bigdaddyk88]

That is an option.

And I can't believe I'm going to type this, but Dan Moore for 3 more years at LT with Faunt staying at RT doesn't scare me. Let Jones continue to be the swing tackle. Then in a year or so they can pick another OT high.

Unless you are going to pay Moore 12-15 million aav this isn’t an option. This isn’t a tag situation like Starks because it 20 million dollars

Yep, I think as well that not fumbling caused him to react the way that he did.

He honestly thought he got the 1st when he slid early. Its a Qb power run he has used since his rookie season he wasn’t worried about fumbling especially with the ravens best lb being hurt

 

[xlm34]

That is an option.

And I can't believe I'm going to type this, but Dan Moore for 3 more years at LT with Faunt staying at RT doesn't scare me. Let Jones continue to be the swing tackle. Then in a year or so they can pick another OT high.

The potential contract is what scares me a bit there. I think Moore could ask for and get 15 million from a team in FA. And giving that much to a guy whose only good year was in a contract year is risky. He definitely doesn’t seem like the type of person that would coast after getting paid, but if he turns into the Moore he was the last 3 years…

 

[Peat]

Also I just want to +1 everyone saying that Steelers-Ravens games have their own laws independent of the rest of the season. Both sides have too much knowledge of each other, too much intensity, and too much talent on defence for it to be an easy game. You're gonna see the worst of both teams' offences on those days. I mean, yeah, some of the things that went wrong are things I always suspected were weak points, but there's a good chance they don't bite so hard against other teams.

Less than 20 carries for Henry, but the entire Balt TEAM had less than 20. All of their runners had over 5 ypc to boot.

For all the work Monken has done in the passing game, he was an absolute f***ing idiot yesterday. I bet he lived in his fears when Henry fumbled early.

Take that 31 yard ripper away and Henry averaged 2.8 yards per carry. You can't keep handing the ball off for that.

My guess is that a close study of the tape would show that by and large, the Steelers completely buttoned down the Ravens running lanes on most plays. Big gaps when they didn't but not much on the majority of plays.

The potential contract is what scares me a bit there. I think Moore could ask for and get 15 million from a team in FA. And giving that much to a guy whose only good year was in a contract year is risky. He definitely doesn’t seem like the type of person that would coast after getting paid, but if he turns into the Moore he was the last 3 years…

Moore has improved from year to year and has always been a worker so minimal fear... but minimal fear on that is still substantial.

For me, right now, the beat reporters are saying Moore is going so I'll believe that's the case. That the team want to see their investment in the 1st round picks pay off too much. Given the reward-risk of Moore I'm not going to get too whatever about that. They do have to be right about what they've got in Jones and Fautanu though.

 

[MrBrightside]

Per the weekly presser, the injuries to Benton and Porter don't seem big deals, which is great news.

I really don't get the people who love to come on here and act like an 8-2 team is Carolina, but to address some of this stuff:

1. The Ravens led the NFL in sacks coming into yesterday, so while the Steelers' OL isn't great at pass protection, (a) that's a good pass rush and (b) Wilson holding the ball too long was responsible for much of the pressure.

2. Extrapolating anything from games between those teams is a fools errand as it literally is a "throw out the records" situation when they play. That's an overused cliche but it really does apply to Steelers/Ravens.

3. The two big adjustments that really could be huge would be to involve Fields in the red zone and to get Williams more run.

 

[Shaftception]

3. The two big adjustments that really could be huge would be to involve Fields in the red zone and to get Williams more run.

In my perfect world for the offense, I'd want to see:

1. Fields get more opportunities to run the option, especially in the redzone. The play Fields slid early was probably the most obvious play they ran all day (why else bring Fields in than to threaten a qb run? Especially in a position where they're trying to burn Baltimore's remaining timeouts?) and he would've gained 10+ yards on it easily had he not slid and just kept running hard. Somehow it completely fooled the Ravens even though it should've been obvious. That play would work in the redzone too, and he still could pull up and attempt a pass should it be available or the run is sniffed out. Too much potential being squandered not to give it more opportunities going forward as a change of pace. And Russ doesn't seem to be making a stink about the matter either.
2. No downfield throws to anyone other than Pickens the majority of the time, and Williams. Passes to VJ and Austin up the sidelines are 90% wasted downs. Neither are consistently outrunning defenders, and neither are capable of high-pointing a catch in traffic. A three yard run with Najee up the middle is more often going to be less pointless than a throw to either of them, and they already run too often with him imo as is.
3. Obvious one, but throw over the middle more, especially to the TE's. Everyone know's about Russ's history of avoiding the mof, and him holding the ball too long got him into trouble more often than not yesterday, but he's shown on the rare occasion he does hit the mof, especially yesterday late to Washington, that he's still capable of doing so. He missed a wide open Freirmuth over the middle for a 1st down on a play he instead threw to an out route short of the 1st that forced a punt I want to say in the 3rd that was pretty egregious, but again that tends to be his m.o. Succeeding over the middle is the missing piece holding the offense back from being more efficient and less reliant on the moonball to make all the big plays. It's clearly there and waiting to be exploited, its just a question of if the playcalling/qb preference will ever make it a priority to try to improve on before it's too late.

 

[WickedWrister]

 

[TooManyHumans]

I was just going to say that I am in favor of using Fields not so much in the RZ but more near the goal line. I am not putting Fields in if we have the ball at the 19, but once we are inside the 10 it makes a lot of sense.

 

[WickedWrister]

Probably a better conversation for the offseason but Pickens is going to get a f***ing bag in his next contract.

 

[Peat]

Apparently Wilson's QBR for the game was 14.5. Woof.

 

[The Old Master]

I will say one positive thing about Fields' early slide - it completely negated any possibility of a fumble, which would have been by far the worst outcome of that play. Should have done better with it regardless but I do woimonder if that was on his mind.

no. don't need to over think this. he just thought he had the first.

 

[TooManyHumans]

Apparently Wilson's QBR for the game was 14.5. Woof.

And yet we won. As much as people bag on Tomlin, it is crazy how many wins he has gotten recently given the crap QB play we have largely had.

 

[Peat]

And yet we won. As much as people bag on Tomlin, it is crazy how many wins he has gotten recently given the crap QB play we have largely had.

Thing is, much as I do think what he can do with subpar QB play is pretty impressive, I am dubious on how useful a trait that is in the NFL at best and think it might actually be counterproductive at worst.

 

[TooManyHumans]

I will never advocate for losing to improve draft position, if that is what you are alluding to. That's how you become the Browns.

 

[MrBrightside]

I will never advocate for losing to improve draft position, if that is what you are alluding to. That's how you become the Browns.

Yep. As a fan of the Pirates the fact that anyone would advocate for the Steelers to act like them is a hard no. Culture matters and while there are some issues in the organization, the strength of culture is definitely a huge asset.

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

Also I just want to +1 everyone saying that Steelers-Ravens games have their own laws independent of the rest of the season. Both sides have too much knowledge of each other, too much intensity, and too much talent on defence for it to be an easy game. You're gonna see the worst of both teams' offences on those days. I mean, yeah, some of the things that went wrong are things I always suspected were weak points, but there's a good chance they don't bite so hard against other teams.



Take that 31 yard ripper away and Henry averaged 2.8 yards per carry. You can't keep handing the ball off for that.

My guess is that a close study of the tape would show that by and large, the Steelers completely buttoned down the Ravens running lanes on most plays. Big gaps when they didn't but not much on the majority of plays.



Moore has improved from year to year and has always been a worker so minimal fear... but minimal fear on that is still substantial.

For me, right now, the beat reporters are saying Moore is going so I'll believe that's the case. That the team want to see their investment in the 1st round picks pay off too much. Given the reward-risk of Moore I'm not going to get too whatever about that. They do have to be right about what they've got in Jones and Fautanu though.

Re: Rats running game. You still have to give the ball to Henry more than 13 carries.. I dislike the "take away the long runs" because you can't erase that. It happened. Ravens also erred by not giving LJ more run pass options too. Seemed like when they designed the run for LJ he seemed to hit for big plays.
I still say they went away from the run way too early.

Re: Moore. Yes it's a risk, but if Moore regresses then you have a backup plan in place in Jones or Faunt. The other option is to pick yet another OT with a high pick or pay big dollars in FA. That's something I do not want to see them doing.

 

[Peat]

I will never advocate for losing to improve draft position, if that is what you are alluding to. That's how you become the Browns.

Or any of the teams that got a foundational piece around the top 10 without trading up, which usually makes up the majority of teams in the league that are still going at the business end of the season.

There's also plenty of teams who have one-off bad seasons due to a bad QB or even just bad injury luck but who bounce right back, often nastier than before. It was such a season that allowed the Big Ben era to happen.

As such, I have no fear of losing seasons. I am okay with them happening. I don't regard preventing them from happening at all costs as hugely desirable. I don't know that I'd advocate for them, as you can clearly build a powerhouse team off of the back of a fairly middling one with the right aggressive trade-up, but I don't care if they happen.

What I do care about is this team finding the sort of QB that makes them relevant in the biggest games of the season. And Tomlin's ability to stay alive without that guy is at best kind of irrelevant, and at worst an impediment to getting them.

Re: Rats running game. You still have to give the ball to Henry more than 13 carries.. I dislike the "take away the long runs" because you can't erase that. It happened. Ravens also erred by not giving LJ more run pass options too. Seemed like when they designed the run for LJ he seemed to hit for big plays.
I still say they went away from the run way too early.

It happened but you also can't call your plays around "we're getting nothing much on most of our runs but if we catch them with their pants down again it'll be amazing". Or to put it another way - I think the median and mode are at least as useful than the mean here, and both of those numbers were 3 for Henry at the end of the half. No gain or 1 yard was as common as 4 yards or more iirc. To me that means that the mean is misleading you and that maybe you shouldn't be trying to hand it off to Henry.

Re: Moore. Yes it's a risk, but if Moore regresses then you have a backup plan in place in Jones or Faunt. The other option is to pick yet another OT with a high pick or pay big dollars in FA. That's something I do not want to see them doing.

The other option is to ride on Jones and Fauntau and go fairly cheap on the back-up. Not saying that's the best option, but it's on the table and I'd kind of anticipate it happening. Wouldn't be the first time. Remember when the back-up to Moore and Chuks was Trenton Scott, whoever he is?