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OT: The Pittsburgher Thread: 5 and 2 Justin who? Hand the Fields to Wilson

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Other things from the last couple of pages I don't feel like tracking down quotes for

- Everything said about command of the line resonates with me. Having seen that, I am still very much of the belief that the best thing for the Steelers long term is to keep Wilson for 2-3 more years and draft a guy to sit behind and learn. I think if you want a true franchise QB, then you want as much help as possible and you want a stable situation for him to learn in. Wilson offers that and he offers a bit of time for skilling up the rest of the offence to help whoever the new guy is. This situation still isn't it for helping a guy.

- Fields has absolutely had games where he's thrown a bunch of deep balls.

- I agree with being a little cautious on declaring the running game alive and cooking because I too thought the Jets gave up a little (and also are bad at run defence), and that before they did they stonewalled Harris and Warren plenty of times (despite being bad at run defence) but I will say I saw some good runs early on. I also think we've just got to accept the Tomlin principle here is to finish strong and if that means starting slow it's worth it. But! The big thing here for me is that all those pitches really don't suit Harris. Harris is getting success anyway when the OL is doing their thing, but I don't know he does it how Smith wants it done to set up the scheme.

Empoleon8771 said:
Wilson went like 14/19 after an extremely bad start. He also showed his patented moon ball that Fields simply does not have.

Last night pretty conclusively showed that Wilson was a better passer than Fields. Fields has a massive advantage on Wilson in athleticism (although I think Wilson has more than he showed yesterday) but Wilson is definitely the better passer.
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I saw someone somewhere who was a Broncos fan compliment how Wilson was getting it out sharp rather than trying to do too much, so maybe it's a good thing Wilson's not trying to show us his athleticism. Accept the hero ball days are done and do just enough to get free to make a pass.
 
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Peat said:
I do think I might disagree with you about the WR talent mattering more than who's at QB, Empo. I think the right QB can get a lot more out of WRs - certainly did with Pickens - and while nobody wants Jefferson and Austin to be WR2 and WR3, Jefferson's history suggests there is meat on the bone. There's still a hard ceiling with the WRs, but I think Wilson with these guys might upgrade the team more than Fields with Williams.
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Agree on Pickens but don't agree on the rest. One of Wilson's early incompletions was hitting Austin in the face with the ball and he just dropped it.

Wilson will be able to get more out of Pickens due to his moon ball that Fields simply doesn't have. Wilson can just lob it up to Pickens and Pickens will be able to come down with enough of them (or draw PIs) to make their passing game much improved. But beyond him, I still think the difference between Fields and Wilson for their other WRs will be pretty marginal. I may change my tune on Austin as the year goes on, because I've seen glimpses with him that give me intrigue. But Van Jefferson just looks terrible (even with his TD pass) and they don't have anyone else at WR worth anything.

As an aside, Wilson being at QB and using his moon ball makes me wonder significantly more if Mike Williams is actually the best target they could be looking at. Williams is another jump ball guy that wins contested catches and having 2 of those guys to pair with Wilson gives him a lot more options. It's just a question of how much do you trust Austin as a slot guy?

Pengwins said:
Mike Williams looked good one that 1 catch and he is good at catching lob balls which is what RW does best. We MUST trade for Mike Williams asap
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I literally just thought the same thing when thinking about Wilson's lob ball. If Fields was at QB, I don't think he'd make a ton of sense as a target. But with Wilson at QB, I think he makes a ton of sense as an outside WR target.
 
Broderick Jones was roasted numerous times again last night. You can't keep trotting him out every week.

Of any position, I'd be looking to trade for an upgrade at RT. Over WR, CB, whatever.
 
Russ QB7 on the week with the 5th highest EPA. One spot higher if you omit Jameis who only had 12 plays.

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Identifying man coverage and chucking it in Pickens's general direction is how you pass if you are the Steelers' qb. That is what worked best for Kenny, too. I'd say it was Fields' largest shortcoming as his play was otherwise very good.

And it really opens up the run game. If defenses are scared you are going to get 40 yards over the top they aren't going to play press man with 8 guys in the box.

It is great to see both qb's bring something to the table and both have handled the parts of the season where they weren't starting with incredible professionalism.
 
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Empoleon8771 said:
Agree on Pickens but don't agree on the rest. One of Wilson's early incompletions was hitting Austin in the face with the ball and he just dropped it.

Wilson will be able to get more out of Pickens due to his moon ball that Fields simply doesn't have. Wilson can just lob it up to Pickens and Pickens will be able to come down with enough of them (or draw PIs) to make their passing game much improved. But beyond him, I still think the difference between Fields and Wilson for their other WRs will be pretty marginal. I may change my tune on Austin as the year goes on, because I've seen glimpses with him that give me intrigue. But Van Jefferson just looks terrible (even with his TD pass) and they don't have anyone else at WR worth anything.

As an aside, Wilson being at QB and using his moon ball makes me wonder significantly more if Mike Williams is actually the best target they could be looking at. Williams is another jump ball guy that wins contested catches and having 2 of those guys to pair with Wilson gives him a lot more options. It's just a question of how much do you trust Austin as a slot guy?
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You don't think QB-WR chemistry can improve from the first game?

Or that a generally improved passing game isn't a tide that lifts all ships? I mean, heck, look at last night. Neither Jefferson or Austin did that much, but one got a touchdown and the other got a big 39 yard completion for the stats. Why? Right place, right time.

As for Williams... we'll see. And I suspect we will actually see. I'd prefer variety but it looks like they want to double down.
 
WickedWrister said:
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Don't want to shit on the parade, but I have a couple of minor quibbles about the FG block team:

1. Why is Watt out there? He's arguably the MVP and it'd be super dumb if he got hurt on the FG block team
2. Why ISN"T Washington out there standing directly in front of the center and jumping to try and block this kick?
 
ImporterExporter said:
Broderick Jones was roasted numerous times again last night. You can't keep trotting him out every week.

Of any position, I'd be looking to trade for an upgrade at RT. Over WR, CB, whatever.
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I think cook might see time soon at RT. Anderson is back to working RT
 
Buddy Bizarre said:
Don't want to shit on the parade, but I have a couple of minor quibbles about the FG block team:

1. Why is Watt out there? He's arguably the MVP and it'd be super dumb if he got hurt on the FG block team
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Probably because it is a play that can take points away from the other team. That is huge.
 
Buddy Bizarre said:
Don't want to shit on the parade, but I have a couple of minor quibbles about the FG block team:

1. Why is Watt out there? He's arguably the MVP and it'd be super dumb if he got hurt on the FG block team
2. Why ISN"T Washington out there standing directly in front of the center and jumping to try and block this kick?
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I don't necessarily hate Watt on FG block plays, they can be super impactful plays as we saw last night. Probably a more valuable snap than a 1st and 10 in the 1st quarter on the opponents side of the field.

Dean Lowry is also a beast at 6'6" and got the block last night so who am I to question the honorable Danny Smith.

3 straight weeks with a blocked punt/kick is pretty remarkable. I wonder what the record for consecutive weeks with a block is.
 
Given Watt's snap count shows consistent special team usage over the years, I'm guessing he's always been on the FG block unit. Feel like it's fairly commonplace for teams to use their stars there - after all, it's points on the line, and I can't remember the last time I heard of an injury there.
 
TooManyHumans said:
On one throw to Pickens in the EZ, the DB clearly yanked his arm down well before the ball got there. Obvious pass interference but NFL officiating sucks. We all know this.
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Are you telling me, that throwing a flag for unnecessary roughness on like the second play of the game does not, in fact, set the precedent for the rest of the game.
 
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Peat said:
Given Watt's snap count shows consistent special team usage over the years, I'm guessing he's always been on the FG block unit. Feel like it's fairly commonplace for teams to use their stars there - after all, it's points on the line, and I can't remember the last time I heard of an injury there.
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You're correct, Watt is/has been on ST's for years. I just don't think the juice is worth the squeeze to risk Watt.

If I remember correctly, Troy P got hurt on a FG block, but don't quote me on that.
 
Khelandros said:
Are you telling me, that throwing a flag for unnecessary roughness on like the second play of the game does not, in fact, set the precedent for the rest of the game.
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Definitely not since they threw down a Steelers player after the whistle later in the game and there was no flag.

Buddy Bizarre said:
You're correct, Watt is/has been on ST's for years. I just don't think the juice is worth the squeeze to risk Watt.

If I remember correctly, Troy P got hurt on a FG block, but don't quote me on that.
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They can get hurt on any play. STs plays are pretty weighty and I don't see why Watt would be more likely to get hurt on STs than regular defense, so I don't really have a problem with it.
 
Buddy Bizarre said:
You're correct, Watt is/has been on ST's for years. I just don't think the juice is worth the squeeze to risk Watt.

If I remember correctly, Troy P got hurt on a FG block, but don't quote me on that.
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Search says your memory is correct, 2009 game vs the Titans. But if we're talking one star player every decade, I can live with that. If this was like kick off return where it was extra dangerous I'd be on the side of Watt not getting the snap, but this appears to be fairly risk free by football standards. Maybe even safer than a regular snap. I slightly wonder if Watt's skillset is all that much superior here, but that's a question for Danny Smith and he says yes.
 
ImporterExporter said:
Broderick Jones was roasted numerous times again last night. You can't keep trotting him out every week.

Of any position, I'd be looking to trade for an upgrade at RT. Over WR, CB, whatever.
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Jones started like 5 games total when he was drafted if I remember. We were told that he was a project. It becomes a catch-22. He needs to play to develop. But, you go through the growing pains if you play him.
 
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