Speculation: The Next GM

[MartyOwns]

This isn’t a full rebuild mode because we already have building blocks. This is a continuation of a rebuild and we are now retooling around Nico Hughes and Mac.

I think selling off Coleman indicates that this is indeed a full rebuild, where the expectation is that we won't be competitive for 3-5 years. it's not that important to me exactly how a rebuild is defined, the point is that in that context, I think Palms is a goner. his best years will be behind him when we are ready to compete.

 

[Triumph]

I think selling off Coleman indicates that this is indeed a full rebuild, where the expectation is that we won't be competitive for 3-5 years. it's not that important to me exactly how a rebuild is defined, the point is that in that context, I think Palms is a goner. his best years will be behind him when we are ready to compete.

I don't agree. They're giving Palmieri the A for the rest of the season - if they were going to trade Palmieri, I don't think he would've played last night. Now they might trade Palmieri next season, but I'd be very surprsied if he went anywhere at the deadline this year.

Moreover, Fitzgerald specifically mentioned the trades for Palmieri and Johansson as things the Devils did in the past with excess draft picks. I'd be very surprised if the Devils used all 3 of their 1st round picks at this draft (assuming they have all 3).

 

[Spoiled Bratt]

We have a shot at possibly landing 3 top #20 prospects.

There’s no point in trying to acquire guys with draft picks because that’s exactly what Shero did and by the looks of things, management wasn’t all that happy with the results. Doing the exact same thing, that the guy who just got fired did when he got here, isn’t a plan or else why fire Shero?

Again, we have a core of youngsters and if we can walk out of the 1st round with 3 or 4 prospects that were taken in the top 25, we’ll have one of the best foundations in the game.

It’s called rebuilding according to the timeline of our core players.

 

[NJDevils17]

We have a shot at possibly landing 3 top #20 prospects.

There’s no point in trying to acquire guys with draft picks because that’s exactly what Shero did and by the looks of things, management wasn’t all that happy with the results. Doing the exact same thing, that the guy who just got fired did when he got here, isn’t a plan or else why fire Shero?

Again, we have a core of youngsters and if we can walk out of the 1st round with 3 or 4 prospects that were taken in the top 25, we’ll have one of the best foundations in the game.

It’s called rebuilding according to the timeline of our core players.

it’s okay to acquire players with picks, it just has to fit the timeline and make sense. The Palms trade was great in this aspect. I would hope we do something like that again when we’re ready.

 

[Guttersniped]

did fitzgerald make any comments on palms like he did vats? it will be really interesting to see how that plays out. i didn’t want palms traded, but now that we’re in full rebuild mode it doesn’t make much sense to keep him

He played yesterday, they would hold him out if they were dead set on trading him. When we try to divine the reasons behind moves I think people underestimate how the team has to be sensitive to public perception.

Shero was fired for a number of understandable reasons but it also provides a scapegoat and symbolizes of the owners’ desire for better results. I can imagine Shero making these same deadline deals, there might not have been that great of a divide in team building philosophy but just the need for a restart.

The Coleman trade is a pr blow because everyone, myself included, is madly in love with him and most fans understandably don’t care about futures until they turn into NHL players. You can’t turn down that deal not only because of the return but also because who know what a team will get from him with a long term deal that starts when he’s 30.

There are reasons to keep Palmieri, we need some offense and our young centers need goal scoring wingers. His offensive production has been ridiculously consistent the 5 years he’s been here despite the player turnover. We expect a big return so it’s unlikely we will pleasantly surprised like the Coleman return and most fans don’t care about that, especially when we lose the guy who’s been out scoring leader 4 out 5 years.

 

[Triumph]

We have a shot at possibly landing 3 top #20 prospects.

There’s no point in trying to acquire guys with draft picks because that’s exactly what Shero did and by the looks of things, management wasn’t all that happy with the results. Doing the exact same thing, that the guy who just got fired did when he got here, isn’t a plan or else why fire Shero?

Again, we have a core of youngsters and if we can walk out of the 1st round with 3 or 4 prospects that were taken in the top 25, we’ll have one of the best foundations in the game.

It’s called rebuilding according to the timeline of our core players.

It's not though because your plan wastes Hughes's ELC entirely and waits for Blackwood to be 27 or 28 by the time the Devils are trying to contend for a Stanley Cup. The point is that the Devils will have an excess of picks and the ability to deal some for players that can help right now or soon and they should be doing that.

I don't see any other reason for Fitzgerald to bring up those trades. It is clearly something he is thinking about. If he can deal a 1st round pick for a good player who is cost controlled for 4-6 years? Yeah, that's a deal he should consider.

 

[Davegarri]

did fitzgerald make any comments on palms like he did vats? it will be really interesting to see how that plays out. i didn’t want palms traded, but now that we’re in full rebuild mode it doesn’t make much sense to keep him

What did he say about Vats? I must've missed it

 

[Bologna 1]

i think i have settled in on fitzgerald keeping the reigns as the next gm. its well known he has been right in the mix for a bunch of jobs over the past couple years, so clearly NJ isn't the only one high on him. and his handling of things recently cements that he seems to have a great handle on navigating.

 

[JrFischer54]

fitz will be the gm next year i am 100% convinced about that. there is noway he can go out there and say that the core of the team is going to be player x y z and then ownership dump him and bring someone else in. would look brutal

 

[MartyOwns]

What did he say about Vats? I must've missed it

something along the lines of 'we haven't spoken to his agent, but that could change'. i'm sure someone has the direct quote

 

[Triumph]

well, let me clarify. when i said 'i think palms is a goner' i meant that i think he should be a goner- and thats coming from someone who didn't want him (or coleman, really) gone last week. aside from that:

-we just traded our captain, so i wouldn't really read too much into letters on the chest.

The Devils didn't name Greene captain last week and then trade him. There's a big difference between naming captains right now and naming them at the beginning of the season or any other time.

palms will get a better return if we trade him this year vs next year (same with coleman). so hanging onto him for next season, when we (almost certainly) will not be competing for a playoff spot, would be idiotic.

It's not idiotic. The Devils might want to keep Palmieri long-term - again, I think they are keeping him, or else he'd already be sitting out. They're not going to have a team of 22 year olds. They're going to try to compete next season.

i'm not sure what using the 3 first round picks vs trading them has to do with my post, but i'd rather see us use the picks. there are certainly guys i would trade one of those picks for, but i very much doubt they would be available (meaning, they would've have to have been drafted in 2018 or 2019, and GM's don't usually trade players that were just drafted a year or two ago). but, if for some reason they are willing to, i would be open to it.

I mean, this was a post about what Fitz is going to do, not what you would do. There's a massive difference. Fitzgerald said the Devils are going to try to be competitive next year and specifically mentioned the Palmieri and Johansson trades. I doubt he keeps all 3 picks.

 

[Nubmer6]

The Devils didn't name Greene captain last week and then trade him. There's a big difference between naming captains right now and naming them at the beginning of the season or any other time.



It's not idiotic. The Devils might want to keep Palmieri long-term - again, I think they are keeping him, or else he'd already be sitting out. They're not going to have a team of 22 year olds. They're going to try to compete next season.



I mean, this was a post about what Fitz is going to do, not what you would do. There's a massive difference. Fitzgerald said the Devils are going to try to be competitive next year and specifically mentioned the Palmieri and Johansson trades. I doubt he keeps all 3 picks.

I believe Fitz also said he didn't want to trade Coleman and I believe it was reported that he wasn't actively shopping him. He just got an offer he couldn't refuse for a particular player.

 

[NjdevilfanJim]

The Devils didn't name Greene captain last week and then trade him. There's a big difference between naming captains right now and naming them at the beginning of the season or any other time.



It's not idiotic. The Devils might want to keep Palmieri long-term - again, I think they are keeping him, or else he'd already be sitting out. They're not going to have a team of 22 year olds. They're going to try to compete next season.



I mean, this was a post about what Fitz is going to do, not what you would do. There's a massive difference. Fitzgerald said the Devils are going to try to be competitive next year and specifically mentioned the Palmieri and Johansson trades. I doubt he keeps all 3 picks.

I think it's more simple than you think if he gets blown away by an offer he will deal Palmieri if not he will keep him....he will fetch more now for a team to take two runs with him for a cup but next year he will still have value......The Bruins to me should be going hard after him yeah he is not the size of kreider but he's just as physical and plays to me with more of an edge game in game out and fits more of their need a right shot right wing.....and he'll drop the gloves great all around pro if he retires a NJD so be it. As far as the picks going for players maybe but don't forget the expansion draft is going to loom large over all teams next yr so taking players u like with those picks might be better way to go....

 

[Edmonton East]

They need to target a playoff appearance for 2021, while a 2022 appearance is mandatory. A franchise does not want to fall into the trap of high end prospects playing multiple years of hopeless hockey. That hurts development and motivation. That's how you got the cultures of suck in EDM and Buffalo.

As I've said before, I think the team and contract timing lines up fairly well to be a serious contender in 3-4 years. Assuming they don't completely bungle this draft and they have 3 1st rounders.

Also, as I said when Shero departed, I expected Coleman to be shipped out. That said, moving Palms would be a mistake since he's the only shooter in the entire top 9. I'd be surprised if they moved him and I consider is highly unlikely at this point.

 

[Edmonton East]

I believe Fitz also said he didn't want to trade Coleman and I believe it was reported that he wasn't actively shopping him. He just got an offer he couldn't refuse for a particular player.

Yeaaaaaaaaaaa that isn't true. GMs almost always say they didn't wanna move a guy. Bad look to say you were calling every GM trying to move someone. Especially a heart and soul guy like Coleman.

Take it for what it's worth, but 6 teams inquired about Coleman. And it quickly came down to Avs vs Lightning. I have no idea what Avs offer was though....I heard 3 different things, all of which were way less than the Lightning offer so I don't even have a gut feeling for what the actual offer was. Regardless, Coleman is way more valuable to the Lightning given his contract and their cap. Gives them a good player at a bargain and flexibility.

Good trade for both teams, but I do HATE that 1st pick provision. Surprised it happened. There's a MASSIVE difference in a 2020 pick around #20 vs a 2021 around #28. Nightmare scenario is Coyotes getting in (or missing and winning lotto) and Vancouver missing. While unlikely, that is very possible at this juncture.

 

[Nubmer6]

Nightmare scenario is Coyotes getting in (or missing and winning lotto) and Vancouver missing. While unlikely, that is very possible at this juncture.

Bad question... in case of that eventuality, what does the 2021 draft look like depth-wise?

 

[NjDevsRR]

Yeaaaaaaaaaaa that isn't true. GMs almost always say they didn't wanna move a guy. Bad look to say you were calling every GM trying to move someone. Especially a heart and soul guy like Coleman.

Take it for what it's worth, but 6 teams inquired about Coleman. And it quickly came down to Avs vs Lightning. I have no idea what Avs offer was though....I heard 3 different things, all of which were way less than the Lightning offer so I don't even have a gut feeling for what the actual offer was. Regardless, Coleman is way more valuable to the Lightning given his contract and their cap. Gives them a good player at a bargain and flexibility.

Good trade for both teams, but I do HATE that 1st pick provision. Surprised it happened. There's a MASSIVE difference in a 2020 pick around #20 vs a 2021 around #28. Nightmare scenario is Coyotes getting in (or missing and winning lotto) and Vancouver missing. While unlikely, that is very possible at this juncture.

Wait, #28 in 2021? You expect Vancouver to be one of the best teams next season?

We get Vancouvers 2021 1st rounder if they miss the playoffs this season. (Which is unlikely)

The Vancouver pick will be anywhere from 16-24 this season depending on playoff performance. I don’t see them going far.

 

[Edmonton East]

Wait, #28 in 2021? You expect Vancouver to be one of the best teams next season?

We get Vancouvers 2021 1st rounder if they miss the playoffs this season. (Which is unlikely)

This wasn't a 3-way trade. Maybe the reporting has been crappy or I just don't understand it, but I would think the trade means Vancouver 1st this year or Tampa 1st next year....considering Tampa has no rights to Vancouver's 2021 1st.

UPDATE mid post: I remembered the Miller trade conditions incorrectly. So we are talking #20 this year vs a worse pick the following year. Although I expect Vancouver to be a serious threat in the West next year, 28 is too high (again, was thinking it was Tampa's). Further, with how the Devs contracts likely line up in the future, I'd much prefer this year.

 

[NJDevs26]

Well we can’t do much about the pick provision, it was preexisting. It’s still slightly better to get a 16-23 pick (in theory) even if it gets deferred than getting a likely 28-31 pick this year.

 

[NjDevsRR]

This wasn't a 3-way trade. Maybe the reporting has been crappy or I just don't understand it, but I would think the trade means Vancouver 1st this year or Tampa 1st next year....considering Tampa has no rights to Vancouver's 2021 1st.

UPDATE mid post: I remembered the Miller trade conditions incorrectly. So we are talking #20 this year vs a worse pick the following year. Although I expect Vancouver to be a serious threat in the West next year, 28 is too high (again, was thinking it was Tampa's). Further, with how the Devs contracts likely line up in the future, I'd much prefer this year.

Definitely prefer this season since the first round is apparently very deep. And its gravy on top if we hit the lotto with our pick.

 

[R8Devs]

Yeaaaaaaaaaaa that isn't true. GMs almost always say they didn't wanna move a guy. Bad look to say you were calling every GM trying to move someone. Especially a heart and soul guy like Coleman.

Take it for what it's worth, but 6 teams inquired about Coleman. And it quickly came down to Avs vs Lightning. I have no idea what Avs offer was though....I heard 3 different things, all of which were way less than the Lightning offer so I don't even have a gut feeling for what the actual offer was. Regardless, Coleman is way more valuable to the Lightning given his contract and their cap. Gives them a good player at a bargain and flexibility.

Good trade for both teams, but I do HATE that 1st pick provision. Surprised it happened. There's a MASSIVE difference in a 2020 pick around #20 vs a 2021 around #28. Nightmare scenario is Coyotes getting in (or missing and winning lotto) and Vancouver missing. While unlikely, that is very possible at this juncture.

If Vancouver misses the playoffs this year it would be their unprotected 2021 1st round pick next year.
But Vancouver is 3 points ahead of Arizona with 2 games in hand so it'd be pretty surprising if they miss.

 

[Edmonton East]

Bad question... in case of that eventuality, what does the 2021 draft look like depth-wise?

Admittedly, I do all of my draft analysis year of. And when I do, I go all the way back as far as I can for each player. My preferred approach because it prevents early year bias from impacting your assessment the actual year of the draft. So I'd be useless in answering that.

@StevenToddIves would probably have a better perspective for that draft....despite how much we argued about Hughes in the offseason

 

[captainscott]

We have a shot at possibly landing 3 top #20 prospects.

There’s no point in trying to acquire guys with draft picks because that’s exactly what Shero did and by the looks of things, management wasn’t all that happy with the results. Doing the exact same thing, that the guy who just got fired did when he got here, isn’t a plan or else why fire Shero?

Again, we have a core of youngsters and if we can walk out of the 1st round with 3 or 4 prospects that were taken in the top 25, we’ll have one of the best foundations in the game.

It’s called rebuilding according to the timeline of our core players.

exactly and 18.19.20.22. is now the age of the core players. palmers will be traded. or zajac. if they fetch the right return.

im not trading either for another palmeri should get same return as Coleman and you do the deal if you are the devils.. then flip something for a real NHL top defender potentially...
I think when all is said we are going to have 4 number 1 draft picks in 2020 draft. we have to build from the net out... and we need draft capital to do it.

 

[Spoiled Bratt]

They need to target a playoff appearance for 2021, while a 2022 appearance is mandatory. A franchise does not want to fall into the trap of high end prospects playing multiple years of hopeless hockey. That hurts development and motivation. That's how you got the cultures of suck in EDM and Buffalo.

As I've said before, I think the team and contract timing lines up fairly well to be a serious contender in 3-4 years. Assuming they don't completely bungle this draft and they have 3 1st rounders.

Also, as I said when Shero departed, I expected Coleman to be shipped out. That said, moving Palms would be a mistake since he's the only shooter in the entire top 9. I'd be surprised if they moved him and I consider is highly unlikely at this point.

We are gutting our team and gave away a heart and soul player for a return, granted, was a no brainer to take.

With that said, why would we keep Palmieri around if we’re moving everyone else. As good as he is shooting the puck, he becomes exactly what we’re saying in regards to the timeline of our young core. His prime is now and the next several years whereas our core will be peaking when Palmieri will start to decline.

Adding veterans on low risk deals is our main goal during the offseason, in order to keep the kids in check and not have a roster of teenagers running the show like the Oilers had with Hall, Eberle, RNH, etc.

 

[Guttersniped]

No GM can guarantee playoffs in 2 years so I’m not sure how it could be called mandatory. For one thing Hughes needs to turn into a top six center, I think everyone agrees he’s not there yet no matter what his upside is. We lack elite talent mainly because we didn’t have that many shots at it. It’s hard to even gauge how good this staff is at at non-1st overall top picks because they’ve only had four of them starting in 2016.

Having a bad team sucks, can hinder development and should be avoided but you need multiple shots in draft because there are always misses. Everyone acts like we have a ton of picks but we don’t have our next two 2nds or our 2020 3rd. It’s nuts to not use at least two of the 1sts and we should probably should use all three unless an amazing trade opportunity arises.

If we get a 1st for Vats and somehow a 2-3rd for Simmonds then it’s becomes a lot easier to trade a 1st. I honestly don’t give a shit about late round gems at this point because we’ve only had six shots at something better than that in four years.

The Palmieri trade was amazing but that was a fluke, GMs don’t usually sell low on 24 yo NHL players. All the other futures for players trades brought guys two years away from UFA. Forget top 2 guys, even younger 3-4ths are expensive and I’m wary of a Griffin Reinhart-style reclamation project.