The line to apologize to Marc Bergevin starts here ---->

[Hoople]

I always say him making it to the show. He'll need a couple full seasons in the AHL but he'll earn his shot.

That said.....

Bergevin used a prospect that we had plenty of, an offensively gifted winger who is small in stature, to land what we needed now, a RH winger with some size who scores goals in close.

And he got Vanek for so little that if the trade were posted in this site, the poster would be banned....even NHL 14's CPU GM tells you off. To me that's a big win.

Also, if he somehow manages to resign Vanek, well. This trade would rival the Coutnall for Kordic trade in one-sidedness.

And I realize most around here think he signs in Minny....but most would have scoffed at this trade. A good run, and the fans getting behind him along with the quality organization could sway his decision.

Great post.

Its all about taking a low risk chance on having a top line forward, a huge need for this team.

Bergevin will do his best to convince Vanek to stay in Montreal. I am sure that the entire management organization will sell Vanek on staying here and throw a lot of money at him.

If Vanek does decide to leave, so what? We get back our 2nd round pick, some posters will cry for Collberg and life will go on.

Our prospect pool is full of Collberg type players. He will not be missed by most.

 

[sandysan]

Sure, you can do that. But then you need a way, way bigger observation window than two seasons, especially for a rookie GM.

It would be a shame to only evaluate him on his first two years, decide that he must be replaced because overall he made more bad moves than good (which is arguable, but that's not my point) and see him flourish somewhere else, having now two years of experience under his belt and being way better at his job...

For the POV of Molson, considering what MB did in the last two years and the results of the team, I would wait some more years before even considering replacing him.

So one cant have an opinion of someone who, within his first year, lays out a plan for the fans and then proceeds to completely undermine it ?

MB could turn out to be a great GM, he could also turn out to be a bust. But all I have to go on, at this time, is what he has done. I think its disingenuous to say " hooray we got vanek as a rental" and proclaim this as evidence of his being good bad or neutral without considering the other choices he has made.

I think that any gm would make the cut if you only counted their good deals and ingored or rationalized the sideways or backward ones.

I think that for me, MB's redemption is underway. I hope that these types of deals continue and that the gains DO outweigh the losses, but he doesnt get there by trumpeting the good but ignoring the bad, or at least he shouldnt.

 

[SpeedyPotato]

Great post.

Its all about taking a low risk chance on having a top line forward, a huge need for this team.

Bergevin will do his best to convince Vanek to stay in Montreal. I am sure that the entire management organization will sell Vanek on staying here and throw a lot of money at him.

If Vanek does decide to leave, so what? We get back our 2nd round pick, some posters will cry for Collberg and life will go on.

Our prospect pool is full of Collberg type players. He will not be missed by most.

Actually, we only get the pick back if we miss the playoffs. Other than that, I agree 100% with you

 

[Agnostic]

Great post.

Its all about taking a low risk chance on having a top line forward, a huge need for this team.

Bergevin will do his best to convince Vanek to stay in Montreal. I am sure that the entire management organization will sell Vanek on staying here and throw a lot of money at him.

If Vanek does decide to leave, so what? We get back our 2nd round pick, some posters will cry for Collberg and life will go on.

Our prospect pool is full of Collberg type players. He will not be missed by most.

Pick only comes back if the Habs miss the playoffs, I don't see that happening really.

I am not sure how I feel about it but the Habs have the advantage of offering an 8th year on a contract.

Vanek stated publicly this season that he'd be willing to re-sign with Buffalo if they could do a speedy turnaround. They can't obviously but there's hope he was being sincere and really isn't obsessed with Minnesota at all.

And where did this Minnesota talk come from anyway? Minnesota fans?

Vanek has been in Buffalo since what , 2004 and he loyally served. Not to disparage Buffalo but if there was ever a reason to pull the "wifey needs me at home" card it's to get out of that place.

I need more information on this one.

 

[Phil Parent]

Pick only comes back if the Habs miss the playoffs, I don't see that happening really.

I am not sure how I feel about it but the Habs have the advantage of offering an 8th year on a contract.

Vanek stated publicly this season that he'd be willing to re-sign with Buffalo if they could do a speedy turnaround. They can't obviously but there's hope he was being sincere and really isn't obsessed with Minnesota at all.

And where did this Minnesota talk come from anyway? Minnesota fans?

Vanek has been in Buffalo since what , 2004 and he loyally served. Not to disparage Buffalo but if there was ever a reason to pull the "wifey needs me at home" card it's to get out of that place.

I need more information on this one.

Well, you know all the links between him and Minnesota. Wife is from there, he lives there in the offseason, he's a Golden Gopher alumni and he has buddies on the Wild.

But yeah, sure, he might have said those things to haste his exit from Long Island, let's see.

 

[macavoy]

Pick only comes back if the Habs miss the playoffs, I don't see that happening really.

I am not sure how I feel about it but the Habs have the advantage of offering an 8th year on a contract.

I dont want Vanek at 38 yrs old for $7m. He's a perfect rental.

 

[HabFanInLeafLand]

Well, you know all the links between him and Minnesota. Wife is from there, he lives there in the offseason, he's a Golden Gopher alumni and he has buddies on the Wild.

But yeah, sure, he might have said those things to haste his exit from Long Island, let's see.

“I played many times for Buffalo in Montreal and it’s so electric. I’m super excited.â€

We might have the inside track. I think a deep playoff run would be a good way to sweeten the pot as well.

 

[overlords]

Pick only comes back if the Habs miss the playoffs, I don't see that happening really.

I am not sure how I feel about it but the Habs have the advantage of offering an 8th year on a contract.

Vanek stated publicly this season that he'd be willing to re-sign with Buffalo if they could do a speedy turnaround. They can't obviously but there's hope he was being sincere and really isn't obsessed with Minnesota at all.

And where did this Minnesota talk come from anyway? Minnesota fans?

Vanek has been in Buffalo since what , 2004 and he loyally served. Not to disparage Buffalo but if there was ever a reason to pull the "wifey needs me at home" card it's to get out of that place.

I need more information on this one.

I might have misread you or had something go completely over my head, but why exactly can the habs offer an 8th year?

 

[Whitesnake]

I've YET to see anyone saying that signing Vanek is not a good move. I think its unanimous that it is. The real question is how do you evaluate a GM ? Do you focus exclusively on this last moves ? his most unexpected moves ?

Or do you look at all of the moves and make a determination whether in aggregate the gains accomplished by the good moves exceed those lost by the bad.

I have no problem saying that the signing of vanek improves MB's stock, but if you want to say he's a good ( or bad) GM I think you have to look at things in aggregate.

Being, in my opinion demonstrably less bad is not synonymous with being good, apparently it does for some.

And that's how I see it too. It's the total moves. And people should even acknowledge that it's moves while he is here...and it goes beyond that as you might have to reassess a GM work AFTER he is fired. While you might not see some negativity about the move, as it shouldn't be, I'm just telling you that depending of the end-result, you WILL see the negativity of some. If we lose in the 1st round and lose Vanek for nothing have, we would have given up a 2nd and Collberg for just the hope that we could have done better. I think that my other me, the draft lover, will hate it, the Habs fan likes it as we are now, and I think that with how bad the East is, it's worth it. We still need things to fall into place. And I would have hope to have a better D. If you give me a Cup Finals, I will not care if we lost a 2nd. If you give me a 1st round loss, I will still believe it was an awesome move to make.....but I will question other things like....when the heck will be see that Therrien is a liability. When is he going to address the problems we have on D. And the rest of our deficiencies. So true....you analyse the overall work of a GM with his overall work.

 

[Teufelsdreck]

It's an excellent trade for a rental player but Vanek will not stay. As a UFA he would have no inclination to play anywhere but Minnesota. That's not Bergevin's fault. The hunt for a forward to complement Pacioretty's goal scoring goes on,

 

[Agnostic]

I might have misread you or had something go completely over my head, but why exactly can the habs offer an 8th year?

Contract term limits - 7 years for free agents, 8 years with players signing with their current team.

Hard to get used to , Montreal is Vanek's current team.

 

[Laphroaig]

I'm still in shock that no other team came up with a better offer. I'm not usually in favour of rentals but we got Vanek cheap. Can't wait for the playoffs.

 

[Athletique_Canadien]

No need for me to apologize since my statistics & posting history put me on the side of questioning why there was so much MB hate.

 

[jeangauthier]

Great post.

Its all about taking a low risk chance on having a top line forward, a huge need for this team.

Bergevin will do his best to convince Vanek to stay in Montreal. I am sure that the entire management organization will sell Vanek on staying here and throw a lot of money at him.

If Vanek does decide to leave, so what? We get back our 2nd round pick, some posters will cry for Collberg and life will go on.

Our prospect pool is full of Collberg type players. He will not be missed by most.

Also a great post.........

 

[Halifaxhab*]

Great post.

Its all about taking a low risk chance on having a top line forward, a huge need for this team.

Bergevin will do his best to convince Vanek to stay in Montreal. I am sure that the entire management organization will sell Vanek on staying here and throw a lot of money at him.

If Vanek does decide to leave, so what? We get back our 2nd round pick, some posters will cry for Collberg and life will go on.

Our prospect pool is full of Collberg type players. He will not be missed by most.

We lose the 2nd for a playoff apperance, but we gain a 5th. And Kovalev was sayingb all the same things about testing, and in the end he fell in love with Montreal.

I'm not holding my breath, but Vanek staying is not out of this realm of possibilities.

Besides. Even if he leaves, if he can help us win a couple rounds, other UFAs can see Montreal as a solid young team trending upwards and makes us an attractive choice.

 

[ECWHSWI]

before the vanek signing no one said the habs were contenders, now there are like 5 threads " asking " the same question. Is it because of vanek or vaney and a slightly better but shorter drewiske ?

you should look into the differences between " better" and "good", it would be informative.

So if mike milbury had pulled one trade out of his.........hat that worked out, then all of the crappy myopic and franchise destroying choices he made get wiped off the table ?

Now imagine someone arguing that milbury is a good GM if the last acquisition he made was for a good two month rental.

of I forgot, if you dont think that EVERY trade the GM makes is the greatest of all possible options, you are a negative nancy.

thanks champ, but the problems ( aside from those addressed by vanek) dont go away if you ignore them.

gets better, now MB is compared to Milbury

 

[sandysan]

And that's how I see it too. It's the total moves. And people should even acknowledge that it's moves while he is here...and it goes beyond that as you might have to reassess a GM work AFTER he is fired. While you might not see some negativity about the move, as it shouldn't be, I'm just telling you that depending of the end-result, you WILL see the negativity of some. If we lose in the 1st round and lose Vanek for nothing have, we would have given up a 2nd and Collberg for just the hope that we could have done better. I think that my other me, the draft lover, will hate it, the Habs fan likes it as we are now, and I think that with how bad the East is, it's worth it. We still need things to fall into place. And I would have hope to have a better D. If you give me a Cup Finals, I will not care if we lost a 2nd. If you give me a 1st round loss, I will still believe it was an awesome move to make.....but I will question other things like....when the heck will be see that Therrien is a liability. When is he going to address the problems we have on D. And the rest of our deficiencies. So true....you analyse the overall work of a GM with his overall work.

I think we are in perfect agreement and when I pointed out the folly of simply focusing on a good trade (one where the player can leave and has yet to play) and ignoring the bad, I get labeled a MB hater, bitter and (my favorite) a negative Nancy.

the habs have lots of problems, getting a temporary reprieve on 5/5 scoring does nothing to fix problems on the back end.

 

[ECWHSWI]

I think we are in perfect agreement and when I pointed out the folly of simply focusing on a good trade (one where the player can leave and has yet to play) and ignoring the bad, I get labeled a MB hater, bitter and (my favorite) a negative Nancy.

the habs have lots of problems, getting a temporary reprieve on 5/5 scoring does nothing to fix problems on the back end.

what ? are you really saying getting a forward doesnt fix the D corp ? really ?

god damn! good thing you're here to tell us, no one would have thought of that, never!

awesome analysis you made, everyone will be impressed!

 

[ArtPeur]

We lose the 2nd for a playoff apperance, but we gain a 5th. And Kovalev was sayingb all the same things about testing, and in the end he fell in love with Montreal.

I'm not holding my breath, but Vanek staying is not out of this realm of possibilities.

Besides. Even if he leaves, if he can help us win a couple rounds, other UFAs can see Montreal as a solid young team trending upwards and makes us an attractive choice.

The problem is.. there aren't much talented UFA next summer.. :/

Heatley has been slowing down (but could be an option if he comes cheap)
Gaborik.. well, it's Gaborik, you can't expect much out of him
Moulson might not cost too much, he might be interested to play here if he hits UFA
Cammalleri?
Vrbata? Most of his success have been in Phoenix, would he like to come here though?
Callahan could be an interesting upgrade of Gionta but he might cost too much
.. and then you got all those aging guys

 

[Halifaxhab*]

The problem is.. there aren't much talented UFA next summer.. :/

Heatley has been slowing down (but could be an option if he comes cheap)
Gaborik.. well, it's Gaborik, you can't expect much out of him
Moulson might not cost too much, he might be interested to play here if he hits UFA
Cammalleri?
Vrbata? Most of his success have been in Phoenix, would he like to come here though?
Callahan could be an interesting upgrade of Gionta but he might cost too much
.. and then you got all those aging guys

Perhaps a Dman is signed and you use the excess to land a fwd. And maybe some of our youth steps up?

 

[Teufelsdreck]

We lose the 2nd for a playoff apperance, but we gain a 5th. And Kovalev was sayingb all the same things about testing, and in the end he fell in love with Montreal.

I'm not holding my breath, but Vanek staying is not out of this realm of possibilities.

Besides. Even if he leaves, if he can help us win a couple rounds, other UFAs can see Montreal as a solid young team trending upwards and makes us an attractive choice.

It's possible for Vanek to stay but it appears he doesn't want to. Let's hope his sojourn is productive. If the Habs are eliminated in the first round, they would also have been eliminated without him. That would put the ball back in Bergevin's court.

 

[ECWHSWI]

It's possible for Vanek to stay but it appears he doesn't want to. Let's hope his sojourn is productive. If the Habs are eliminated in the first round, they would also have been eliminated without him. That would put the ball back in Bergevin's court.

based on...

 

[sandysan]

what ? are you really saying getting a forward doesnt fix the D corp ? really ?

god damn! good thing you're here to tell us, no one would have thought of that, never!

awesome analysis you made, everyone will be impressed!

So a gm playing a shell game with problems makes him great? sure we fixed 5/5scoring, then in two months that goes away and we have essentially the same team pre vanek and we can sign a 2 month UFA rental #3 D, and the inability to score haunts us.

just keep switching liabilities for each other and the rubes (present company included) will keep trumpeting what a great job he's doing.

 

[ECWHSWI]

So a gm playing a shell game with problems makes him great? sure we fixed 5/5scoring, then in two months that goes away and we have essentially the same team pre vanek and we can sign a 2 month UFA rental #3 D, and the inability to score haunts us.

just keep switching liabilities for each other and the rubes (present company included) will keep trumpeting what a great job he's doing.

so, you think it was a bad trade, got it!

 

[HabsQC]

Dear Marc,

Thanks now I can legitly hope we can get through the east in the playoffs.
Hopefully the western conference destroy themselves.
Vanek opened a small crack in a window that will close as soon as june.
But every hope is permitted

Thanks