Ron Francis as Kraken GM ~ The Verdict Is In

[BKarchitect]

They are disappointing and that Stephenson contract is going to age like milk (and you can question the outlays or extensions on other vets too) but overall I don’t think their franchise is in bad shape. Lots of over-amplification of things that aren’t really problems in the OP. I think the prospect pool is in very good shape with a potential star in Catton and tons of quality depth while Beniers and Wright aren’t close to being busts. Daccord is a fantastic goalie.

They could be in even better shape and Francis should be done soon but I think this is definitely a franchise that has a lot of pluses if leadership pulls back from making “win now” moves and just guides the talent and capital in the system.

 

[Big McLargehuge]

Ron Francis has done a bad job. Period. That's the problem.

Teams were better prepared after the Vegas expansion draft, so he deserves some slack...but he still built a team full of third liners and 4-6 defensemen, has handed out some brutal contracts to middling talent, and hired two of the shittiest coaches of the 2010s back-to-back to lead them.

 

[JPeeper]

lol @ people giving Francis shit for building a team of 3rd liners and 4-6 d-man.

Yeah no shit, that's how expansion teams are built when teams protect all their good players. GM's didn't go full Simple Jack this time like with Vegas and gift them top line players.

Vegas is not the norm, do people not remember the dozen expansion teams before them? They were all crap for years.

 

[bleedgreen]

As others have said, they're building slow. However, some of their picks (at the expansion draft) were head-scratchers.

They're in their fourth season. I would wait until next summer before passing judgment. However, I do understand the skepticism given Francis' body of work in Carolina.

This is the part I never get. He built the base of the Canes as they currently are. He didn’t even get to truly start the rebuild until a year in when he could finally trade Estaal so the rebuild really began his second summer when he was only there for four years. He took over a team that had no prospects, and because PK wouldn’t pay anyone they didn’t have many vets to trade off. He wasn’t allowed to add anything to the budget aside from Justin Williams. He got good value in the ones he did trade but there wasn’t anything to do but slowly build the young assets. He jumped on cap trades like Teravainen (which was one of the first “pay me to take your cap troubles” trades).

He left the Canes far better than he found them, and in perfect position to move forward when the wallet showed up. Maybe it was time for a change with the new ownership but Canes generally associate a decade of suck with him when he’s the one that turned it around. JR put the team there. Fans got frustrated because they weren’t already in the playoffs despite the rebuild being pretty short. Detroit’s is taking longer, and there’s nothing wrong with that. The only thing RF sucked at was goalies. He needs to fire whoever advises him there.

 

[Gurglesons]

People criticizing Shane Wright in February of 2025 immediately show their colors.

Kraken suck though.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

Reading the Rangers board you'd think they're a great franchise with how Kakko is producing.

 

[ryan callahan]

Wright and McCann are their best forwards and get 3rd line icetime while absolute boat anchors get top line minutes. Bylsma needs to get fired.

 

[bleedgreen]

The problem is not that their team hasn't won yet. (In fact, I'd say most would agree that making round 2 in game 7 of their second year was very impressive). The problem is that they appear to have a very bleak outlook for the future, and that shouldn't necessarily be the path of an expansion team in their 4th season.

Beniers, Wright, Kakko, Tolvanen…..all young and contributing currently. Role playing draft picks like Winterton and Evans are already in the lineup and undrafted finds like Kartye on lower lines. Cattan (stud), Reykopf, Sale and Firkus all very solid prospects on their way with a prospect pool in the top third of the league.

I don’t mean to give you a hard time man, but “bleak outlook”? They’ve got all that and they’re only four years in!

 

[Kevinsane]

Beniers, Wright, Kakko, Tolvanen…..all young and contributing currently. Role playing draft picks like Winterton and Evans are already in the lineup and undrafted finds like Kartye on lower lines. Cattan (stud), Reykopf, Sale and Firkus all very solid prospects on their way with a prospect pool in the top third of the league.

I don’t mean to give you a hard time man, but “bleak outlook”? They’ve got all that and they’re only four years in!

This. They haven’t tanked, and while the results in the win column this year arent great, the pipeline is healthy and the future hasn’t been mortgaged.
There have been some questionable signings, for sure, but for the most part every team has a couple of those.

 

[Big Daddy Cane]

News: Thread 'Seattle Kraken Expansion Draft Thread [Part II]'

Jul 14, 2021

Post 1: Guide
Post 2: Kraken Expansion Draft Picks
Post 3: NHL Protected Lists
Post 4: Players Eligible for Drafting by Kraken
Post 5: Medical Exemptions
Post 6: Kraken Expansion Draft Trades


HFBoards Discord server for expansion draft talk:
Join the HFBoards Discord Server!

• caley
• Replies: 1,585
• Forum: Trades Rumors & Free Agency

• 

Interesting thread to reflect back on. I remembered passing on Tarasenko and Domi being controversial. The opportunity cost of Tarasenko was Dunn. Domi was traded for scraps at the 2022 deadline.

I forgot about Voracek. He played in only 90 more games the rest of his career before going on LTIR. Price, also a player many were clamoring for, played in only 5 before the same fate.

 

[Mattilaus]

It's hard to think of a more boring team to watch.

That said, they've done all right, I think.

Islanders

 

[La Bamba]

Seattle has done good for the most part. They already have a playoff series win under their belt and a good amount of talent. Their only bad contract is Grubauer is its only 2 more seasons after this one.

Not as good as Vegas but Vegas was a whole other animal

 

[ESH]

They are building slow but maybe too slow. They've loaded up to the gills on depth and these players are getting up there in age. It's getting harder to imagine what the moment the team "clicks" would look like. Their playoff win vs Colorado could have been the peak of their rebuild, and that rebuild has failed and has to start over.

There's also something to be said for avoiding being in that .500 team, just below the playoff line. Building slow up to the playoff line is nice, but it costs you in draft capital along the way. It's a recipe to remain a deep team without that top tier talent, indefinitely

What do you mean rebuild? This is the very first build

 

[bleedgreen]

This. They haven’t tanked, and while the results in the win column this year arent great, the pipeline is healthy and the future hasn’t been mortgaged.
There have been some questionable signings, for sure, but for the most part every team has a couple of those.

Honestly I don’t even dislike the signings. Seattle and Carolina are both mid tier markets I think in terms of drawing free agents and being a prime destination for the current generation of free agents. I think they’re both great places to live but I’m not a mid 20’s millionaire. I look at the Stephenson deal and I feel Seattle is in the same boat as Carolina or other teams in this cluster that would have to pay a million more and a year longer to get a deal done, so you either go without the player or you suck it up. They needed a vet center who can contribute and keep up with the pace of play they want to be at. If you took a year and a million off Stephenson I think it’s a great contract. He’s a 2C, maybe 3C in time and he’s two points off leading the team and is the leading scoring center at 40 pts. Many Calgary fans have told me that Kadri is worth every penny and is doing great on his contract and they have the same exact amount of points and Kadri is more expensive. Everyone is going on and on about how contracts will be fine because of the new cap space coming….I don’t get how this one is a calamity. If the Canes get Rantanen done it will be a million more and in our case obviously a year longer than anyone else’s offer but if we landed him on the open market we would’ve had to over pay to get him. Orlov is way overpaid but it’s short term so we did it.

 

[bleedgreen]

There’s two threads going on at the same time about this but it’s somehow “overlooked”…..

 

[TheDawnOfANewTage]

lol @ people giving Francis shit for building a team of 3rd liners and 4-6 d-man.

Yeah no shit, that's how expansion teams are built when teams protect all their good players. GM's didn't go full Simple Jack this time like with Vegas and gift them top line players.

Vegas is not the norm, do people not remember the dozen expansion teams before them? They were all crap for years.

It’s the moves afterwards that are cause for concern, though. It’s tough- gotta do something to build top lines, but giving all the moneys to Chandler Stephenson is.. a decision. Just the first example I can think of.

 

[Three On Zero]

Seattle is performing exactly how an expansion team should be, Vegas’s success spoiled a lot of people

 

[Iggys Dome]

Crazy they were one goal away from the conference finals a couple years ago.

But overall yeah, they look to be mid for a while. But maybe Vegas messed up everyone’s expectations of what an expansion team should achieve early on.

 

[DingDongCharlie]

Was defiantly a mistake taking Wright 1st overall

Good thing nobody did.

Man this thread is embarrassing for many of you. Especially the takes on Wright who’s been excellent as a rookie.

Gauthier probably fits their team identity better since he’s a better skater.

Wright wasn’t the wrong selection. Look at their C depth when they drafted him and the abundance of wingers they had.

 

[PatriceBergeronFan]

Think the Vegas success caused a bit of too high of expectations.

Or alternatively it felt as though Seattle management assumed it would be easy, and had a poor mindset heading into the draft.

They should have handled the entire roster building very differently.

 

[DingDongCharlie]

Beniers getting called out here too? A 22 years old, who's 2nd in scoring from his draft class? Maybe fans expectations are BS aka too high here? I mean you can debate the contract he got and say he's not living up to it, but he's doing about as well as could be expected from his draft position, talent around him and years out from draft.

Seattle is drafting well, full stop. It’s not easy to add star talent and while Francis hasn’t been great he’s addressed team needs. He added Montour and Chandler Step. I don’t think he should have and the team should have been ok with the slower approach building thru the draft. Everyone seems to have an issue with their drafting so what’s the criticism here? Really what’s Seattle supposed to look like at that moment?

For a team who's first draft pick is 2nd in scoring from that 2021 draft and Evans taken 35ov was an excellent draft. Getting Wright who's finally putting it all together 4ov when much the year he was seen as the next 1ov selection was good for them. The Kraken have 4 players who've played for them they drafted. Have we really forgotten how recent Seattle joined the league.

Seattle is a mediocre team. They should be a mediocre team. I say that not liking Francis moves to try and improve as they should be focused on drafting and developing. I saw the Montour and Stephenson contracts as bad moves. This is a team still building their core group. That should be done though the draft. Catton coming. Another good draft position coming. Daccord, Wright, Beniers, Evans, Kakko. They have good young pieces to build around. They are years out from where I think we see an established core group though. Patience should be taken here. If they rush this they will be like we were after we drafted McDavid and tried forcing the issue, only to make everything worse.

I think this season having them regress from where the management thought they could be is a blessing. They are better with another top 10 pick in the draft vs being a bubble team with this roster.

 

[majormajor]

How does Francis not get criticized more for this?

Team is going backwards since year one and is now firmly entrenched in the grip of mediocrity.

Beniers low key busting considering his draft position.

Drafting Wright.

Hiring Hakstol and Bylsma.

The disaster that is Philip Grubauer.

The ghost of Andre Burakovsky.

If you want to talk about the Kraken being a disappointment, we can have that conversation. But since you're not well informed about the team, you should start the thread with a more inquisitive attitude about how they

Drafting Shane Wright - who lately looks on his way to being a point per game center - is the feather in Francis' cap.

Beniers was never expected to be a big scorer in his draft year debates - his projection was closer to being a 70 pt two-way guy, which he can still get to. He's gradually been improving this year after a bad start.


If you really want to know what bedevils the Kraken, they entered the league only able to pick up players essentially 23 or 24+ years old, because of the rules of the expansion draft. So they were drafting 18 year olds and selecting mid 20s guys. Now four years later those first draft picks are 21-22 (too young still to make a big difference) and the older guys are mostly 30+, the youngest of the original group are around 28. So there is a big six year age gap there in the prime years.

Teams that lack prime age players are bad. That's it, that's the story. Francis would have had to be incredibly bold to get around that problem, and he certainly isn't that. Most GMs would have had roughly similar results, even if they had been smarter about not signing Grubauer or Stephenson.

Prospects are alright but nobody profiles to change the makeup of the team.

No. Catton on Wright's wing and that could be prime Gaudreau - Monahan. Having the deepest group of "A-" forward prospects in the league helps a lot too, we don't know how they'll turn out but the Kraken have good odds of some of them popping.

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

How does Francis not get criticized more for this?

Team is going backwards since year one and is now firmly entrenched in the grip of mediocrity.

Beniers low key busting considering his draft position.

Drafting Wright.

Hiring Hakstol and Bylsma.

The disaster that is Philip Grubauer.

The ghost of Andre Burakovsky.

Hasn’t Wright been scoring like crazy lately?

 

[Mr Kot]

Was defiantly a mistake taking Wright 1st overall

There goes Satan again, lying to everyone.

 

[FlameChampion]

Organization has a couple problems.

First they hired Francis who is terrible. Haksol and Bylsma are terrible coaches.

Making the playoffs the one year was one of the worst things that could happen. Now their ownership expect them to win. Their fanbase expect them win. They signed mid players to bad deals because they thought they were better than they are.

They are going to bad and be in the murky middle for years upon years.