The insanity needs to stop this offseason barring a miracle.

[TheGreenTBer]

Sure that was worse but this a different kind of worse. This rebuild started with so much promise, skill and talent. Then Dubas thought he was smarter than any GM in history and went and signed Tavares to that god awful contract. Then we found out these skilled guys fold like a cheap suit when the going gets tough.
So much promise, so much hope and so much disappointment

Good point.

Failure with no expectations is less painful than failure with high expectations.

 

[hullsy47]

This offseason will be their last chance to make a change to the core for the next 3 years. You're completely locked in if you re-sign Marner + Tavares.

If they lose in the first two rounds, it's time to cut things right here and now.

Both Marner and Tavares should be removed and you begin reworking things.

Just let em walk outbid the oilers for mcdavid if they dont extend him

 

[kevsh]

The other down side of trading away all the team's draft picks?

If any notable RFAs are eligible for an offer sheet this Summer, when the Leafs may have just freed up $11M in cap space if Mitch walks, the team won't have the opportunity to go after them.

Valiardi would be one I'd look at if Tavares walks, or D'Andre Miller, Mason McTavish. Unfortunately, in each case the Leafs don't have the picks to cover. Sigh.

 

[The Shadow]

The other down side of trading away all the team's draft picks?

If any notable RFAs are eligible for an offer sheet this Summer, when the Leafs may have just freed up $11M in cap space if Mitch walks, the team won't have the opportunity to go after them.

Valiardi would be one I'd look at if Tavares walks, or D'Andre Miller, Mason McTavish. Unfortunately, in each case the Leafs don't have the picks to cover. Sigh.

Nothing good comes from trading these top picks for players that aren’t top guys.

 

[ACC1224]

If the insanity is whining about the same things over and over again, I'd agree it 'needs to stop'.

 

[Rare Jewel]

If the insanity is whining about the same things over and over again, I'd agree it 'needs to stop'.

One playoff-round win in ten years of Shanahan, and it's considered whining?

 

[hullsy47]

One playoff-round win in ten years of Shanahan, and it's considered whining?

I think first thing ted rogers does is order pelley to bring in his own guys to MSLE
THE WHOLE CHEBANG

 

[TMLBlueandWhite]

They're finding out that a plan of

1) Suck
2) Aquire high picks
3) Draft star players
4) ????
5) Win Stanley Cup

Isn't workable.

I don't know how anyone at ML$E can expect the greatest fan base in the world to trust them. They're the ones who kept running it back every year despite enormous pressure from the fans to change it up. Now they're either gonna lose Marner for no return or get bent over the barrel again while they run it all back for another three or more years.

How the hell can we expect anything other than continued incompetence.

It's beyond sickening to see the same dumb person who presided over this mess still in charge. Any competent organization would have cleaned house by now but not ML$E. Everyone from the President to the players are guaranteed employment performance be damned.

Maybe if they had actually listened to their fans they might have won it all by now.

 

[TMLAM34]

I don’t know how you don't blow it up if they get knocked out in the first round or if they get embarrassed in the second round again. But then again, we’ve been saying the same thing for how many years now?

Everything would be on the table this off-season, including letting Marner walk, trading Matthews, etc. A complete retool would be needed.

 

[namttebih]

no I'm saying there both failures in there own ways, and don't understand why the 93 team is celebrated as if they accomplished anything.

They actually made the conference finals in 93 and 94. Neither team were stacked with superstars. They weren't supposed to win. They made it that far because of pure heart. They were literally the exact opposite of the current team. Guys like Dougie and Wendel put the team on their back and willed the team to make it there.

In the case of 93, it was a 1 goal game 7 loss where Gretzky got a hattrick. We had just lived through the 80s Leafs. This team gave us hope and pride to be Leaf fans.

I don't understand how you don't understand this.

 

[tuckerintensity]

The one thing that you can always guarantee as been less sane than our management/ownership group is our fan base.

 

[Commander Clueless]

The one thing that you can always guarantee as been less sane than our management/ownership group is our fan base.

Difference is that's the fanbase's job.

 

[ACC1224]

One playoff-round win in ten years of Shanahan, and it's considered whining?

Yes, repeating the same thing over and over again is considered whining.
There anyone that isn't aware of their playoff record? You find the topic fresh and insightful?

 

[Rare Jewel]

Yes, repeating the same thing over and over again is considered whining.
There anyone that isn't aware of their playoff record? You find the topic fresh and insightful?

Not particularly, but it's an open forum, where people can discuss whatever.

The thread coming after a game that could be seen as a measuring stick isn't all that surprising, though.

 

[thewave]

Shanahan is an asshole, he probably knew from day 1 that this core won't win a thing. He knows what types of players it takes to win. But yet he still enabled Dubas making dumbass decisions for years. He was ok with overpaying the core guys, giving them whatever they wanted. He created this culture of 0 accountability. Just because he became a corporate shill, and was helping MLSE sell more jerseys.

Can't prove a thing but bet the meddling of LarryT, the common of all denominators is the head of the Leafs lack of success snake.

 

[thewave]

Good point.

Failure with no expectations is less painful than failure with high expectations.

Failure? Rogers Bell and LarryT have turned the Leafs into a psychological warfare weapon attacking the entire golden horseshoe for over two decades now.

This is a joke obviously but kinda along the lines of, is it though.

 

[sxvnert]

There are a number of reasons Lou should have moved on from Toronto and the Leafs gone in another direction. Yet, he has won 7x as many playoff rounds as this team has in the last nine years. Could anyone at Sportsnet or TSN had seen this discrepancy coming when they encouraged the "sign at all costs" decision on Nylander in his final RFA year?

I was thinking today of all of the pearl clutching by fans, especially younger fans I'm sure, who are losing their minds over the status of certain players in the offseason.

The best outcome for the Leafs is to let them walk, build the forward group as Brad has built the back end and move into a new, re-tooled era around two offensive stars in Matthews and Nylander. The Leafs now have two young forwards in McMann and Knies who can play in the top six, so Leafs would have plenty of cap space to fill in those two positions AND far more cash to build depth on lines 3 and 4 if they choose to go in this direction, and they should, barring a real deep playoff run.

Crafty veteran Lou went to NYI and despite not having the 4 superstar core players, he has won 7 rounds. The Leafs have won a...single...round....in...ten...years...

Put this into perspective, your beloved Maple Leafs have won a single playoff series in 21 years! If I hired a monkey and asked that monkey to randomly pick some players out of the entire league, altered it for cap compliance, would that monkey have done worse than this franchise?

Please, mercilessly, move on from this failed formula, it's been nine years. Dictate your decisions solely on their success this postseason. Solely.

Would rather split Marners 13.5 or 14m over Ehlers & Bennett.

Ehlers Matthews Nylander
Knies Tavares McMann
Laughton Bennett Cowan
Lorentz Kampf ---------
------------------------------------------
Ehlers Matthews Nylander
Tavares Bennett Knies
McMann Laughton Cowan
Lorentz Kampf ---------

 

[thewave]

Would rather split Marners 13.5 or 14m over Ehlers & Bennett.

Ehlers Matthews Nylander
Knies Tavares McMann
Laughton Bennett Cowan
Lorentz Kampf ---------
------------------------------------------
Ehlers Matthews Nylander
Tavares Bennett Knies
McMann Laughton Cowan
Lorentz Kampf ---------

Ehlers and Bennet will win you more games. I think I can say that with confidence.

 

[Leafsfan74]

Would rather split Marners 13.5 or 14m over Ehlers & Bennett.

Ehlers Matthews Nylander
Knies Tavares McMann
Laughton Bennett Cowan
Lorentz Kampf ---------
------------------------------------------
Ehlers Matthews Nylander
Tavares Bennett Knies
McMann Laughton Cowan
Lorentz Kampf ---------

There are going to be 171 UFA forwards this offseason, Surely Leafs can find a way to spend the money on forwards that are heavy, feisty and eager to be tenacious when the big chips are down.

It's also insane that the two most expensive contacts of the available list are both Leafs. One of them coming off of RFA. Just horrendous cap management.

Jeannot on the 4th Line might be a good start. Add depth up and down the lineup rather than underachievement playoff performers up front.

 

[GoonieFace]

Ehlers and Bennet will win you more games. I think I can say that with confidence.

Ehlers is meh and has had past injury concerns. You think Marner is bad in the playoffs, Ehlers is much worse.

Bennett would be a good add, but obviously depends on the cost. I think he stays in Florida.

Not every hole has to be filled UFA’s. Cap space is valuable for many different reasons. But with Tre pretty much emptying out the cupboard, it’s going to be tough to acquire people via trade, even with the cap space created should Marner and Tavares walk.

 

[Leafsfan74]

Ehlers is meh and has had past injury concerns. You think Marner is bad in the playoffs, Ehlers is much worse.

Bennett would be a good add, but obviously depends on the cost. I think he stays in Florida.

Not every hole has to be filled UFA’s. Cap space is valuable for many different reasons. But with Tre pretty much emptying out the cupboard, it’s going to be tough to acquire people via trade, even with the cap space created should Marner and Tavares walk.

Which is why I didn't want them to overpay. For Carlo I can understand, but not for a 3rd line centre though I like the player.

I'd rather them keep the cap space available and see if McDavid becomes available in '26. That would be one hell of a 1-2 punch up the middle.

 

[Lightsol]

The mistake was giving Nylander $11.5 on the assumption that his 99-point season would be the norm going forward. Though he's scoring this season, he's likely going to finish around 75-80 points... Which means he's regressed back to his mean. And now because of that, Marner's floor is $12 million, because there is no universe you can justify paying Marner less than Nylander.

And don't even get me started on the current iteration of Matthews at $13 million... Ugh.

 

[MilkofthePoppy]

Well we could build through the draft as I have been saying for the past 20 years but once again we have no first round picks for two years lol. The problem with this organization is its inability to build and develop players.

 

[Gary Nylund]

Yes, repeating the same thing over and over again is considered whining.
There anyone that isn't aware of their playoff record? You find the topic fresh and insightful?

Objective appraisal of the situation isn't whining, it's ... objective appraisal.

You're the one that's constantly whining. You find whining about people being objective fresh and insightful?

Here's a thought - maybe if the team stopped failing and disappointing over and over again the objective appraisal will come up with a different result, and then you can stop whining. Think about it.

 

[Gary Nylund]

Matthews is a big time loser. He’s a rich loser but still a loser. What kind of captain ever says ‘I guess we expected an easier night’ after being pummeled by Las Vegas - a perennial contender????

How dumb do you have to be to expect an easy night against a contending team.

He should never have been captain. You need someone who has that win at all costs mentality like a Brady Tkachuk who despite having never won a cup anyone can tell this guy has the passion and will to do whatever it takes and I would bet any money he will win at least a cup or two in his career. He was just dealt a bad hand by being drafted to a terribly run team

Did he really say that? Holy moley, and here I thought Marner was the one who sounds like an idiot with a microphone in front of him.

Unreal.

no I'm saying there both failures in there own ways, and don't understand why the 93 team is celebrated as if they accomplished anything.

They exceeded expectations, by a lot! As a fan, IMHO that's all you can ask for really.