The Identity (Politics) of Leaf Fans

Ianturnedbull

Registered User
Jun 11, 2022
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I am pretty sure I will have no positive impact here and was going to post this in another thread that triggered this thought for me. I decided that would have hijacked the other thread, so I am starting this fresh. I really don't want this to be about Dubas, Treliving and their respective moves. There are plenty of threads for that, I am more interested in discussing the fans that are polarized and seemingly obsessed by the topic. I am hopeful this can be done in a productive way.

We really have to let the Dubas stuff go. For the record, I liked Dubas, but was happy he was let go. I didn't like Tre as the next guy, and now I am starting to come around.

Clearly a case can be made that Dubas built a strong and solid hockey team. Yes, both of those elements are defensible. He BUILT the team and it was/is SOLID and STRONG. A case can also be made that his teams fell short of their potential.

Debating this stuff and what could have been is fine with me. I like the discussion, it's what fans do. We are almost two years out now and the debate continues to be as much about the person as the product he produced.

It all feels a bit too Republican/Democrat to me. The identity politics of some (many) on here cause some people to feel they have to disagree with and hate on everything Dubas did, and others defend everything he did and make excuses. Neither end of the spectrum is true, it never is. He wasn't perfect and he wasn't terrible. We were one of the best teams in the NHL under him, we have the longest streak of playoff appearances, and we haven't had the playoff success we feel we should have by now.

Does anyone want to weigh on this? Do the two ends of the spectrum make this place spicy or exhausting for you? Should we try to find more common ground and take a more balanced view or are the extremes just a fact of life in every fandom? Perhaps exacerbated in our massive and passionate one?
I associate Dubas fans (the ones that chose a hockey identity based on his managerial style) with mental illness.

We don't have to let it go. Anyone and everyone that defended and continues to defend his tenure as GM deserves to be ridiculed forever and is a big reason why this team will continue to fail going forward.

Some of You Folks acted and continue to act like he was God's gift to hockey. When he bastardized the game. That is unforgivable.
He had no effect on "the game".
 

rumman

Registered User
Sep 10, 2008
16,138
12,570
My take
Posters are talking good and bad about Dubas my opinion he failed we didn’t win a cup and I don’t care what he is doing now. He is gone no looking back only ahead

Same goes for posters who worry about a player we trade playing good for another team. What he does with another team does not matter to me good or bad. He is not a leaf anymore and if he finds success somewhere else then good for him.

I only care about the team we have now and hope they can be successful. Looking back doesn’t do any good because no matter how much you piss and Moan you can’t change the past.

Look ahead not behind

Go leafs
I’d argue past failures should not be forgotten, one should learn from their mistakes……..
 

rumman

Registered User
Sep 10, 2008
16,138
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I associate Dubas fans (the ones that chose a hockey identity based on his managerial style) with mental illness.


He had no effect on "the game".
He signed, paid players that under his tenure didn’t win shit, both him and Shanahan are responsible for allowing failure to be acceptable……..
 

Aashir Mallik

Registered User
Apr 19, 2019
12,212
12,842
Both “sides” of dubas are on completely different ends who having differing opinions on the key things he did. Most people either thought be sucked, or was amazing. There is a little middle ground, but majority doesn’t fall here. Personally, I fall closer to the thinking of he wasn’t good, but not completely hating him, but I also wasn’t a fan of the team during Matthews and nylanders contract negotiations, only during marners so whilst I don’t like their contracts at all, I don’t really know the intricate details that others do. (Maybe this is why I like Marner the least lol, I saw his contract negotiations play out)

Some defend his signings of the core 4 and defend the players themselves no matter what, whereas some completely hate the signings, saying it’s the reason the team is failing, and believe the players aren’t as good as we think. His fans think his drafting was elite, but his haters think it’s below mediocre. Some liked how he signed free agents, others think he signs bad contracts and finds ways to move them using draft capital. Ditto for trades. Both sides have very little to no common ground on what dubas did right or wrong.

I don’t really care either way, we have treliving right now and he’s been about as successful as dubas was, not a high bar but it’s a bar that the toilet bowl teams of the Atlantic (sens, sabres, wings) would die for. I try not to really care or think about dubas unless he is brought up in the some thread, usually where someone is defending something he did or putting treliving down by using dubas. I find this BS because dubas was by no means a good gm, and with so much failure attached to his brand, it doesn’t make sense to me to go out of your way to defend him
 

keonsbitterness

Registered User
Sep 14, 2010
36,249
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south of Steeles
We don't have to let it go. Anyone and everyone that defended and continues to defend his tenure as GM deserves to be ridiculed forever and is a big reason why this team will continue to fail going forward.

Some of You Folks acted and continue to act like he was God's gift to hockey. When he bastardized the game. That is unforgivable.
I don't get the God or bastard part. He took a playoff team that lost in the 1st round and turned it into a playoff team that (usually) lost in the 1st round.
 
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HamiltonNHL

Resigning Marner == Running it back
Jan 4, 2012
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..... it all feels a bit too Republican/Democrat to me. The identity politics
Honestly, what does Dubas have to do with identity politics / Rep/Demo ? I honestly have no idea. Did you mean politics and opinions are both POLARIZED ?

Clearly a case can be made that Dubas built a strong and solid hockey team.
<opinion> no info provided </opinion>


In your opinion, what were Dubas three best moves?
right back at you.

Title: The Identity (Politics) of Leaf Fans​


is the purpose of this title to express the ...

Exaggerated Polarized opinions of Dubas ?

otherwise you are conflating unrelated topics, NOT in a good way (using your words)
 

Ianturnedbull

Registered User
Jun 11, 2022
5,852
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He signed, paid players that under his tenure didn’t win shit, both him and Shanahan are responsible for allowing failure to be acceptable……..
He said "the game". Should I interpret that as the team?

You're way to horny to defend the phony. I want you to reread the sentence. Maybe try going to the Leafs game so you can get some peace and quiet to concentrate because post-Dubas nobody makes a peep at the game.
I've never defended Dubas in my life.
 

Voodoo Child

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Jun 16, 2009
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All Mod Cons

Registered User
Sep 7, 2018
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We don't have to let it go. Anyone and everyone that defended and continues to defend his tenure as GM deserves to be ridiculed forever and is a big reason why this team will continue to fail going forward.

Some of You Folks acted and continue to act like he was God's gift to hockey. When he bastardized the game. That is unforgivable.
Yeah, the blaming Mike, Lou, weather and taxes lasted the whole of Kyle's tenure. Apparently it's one rule for Kyle and another for everyone else.
 
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rumman

Registered User
Sep 10, 2008
16,138
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I think you are behind the times and I must be more woke than you. I know of 325.5 gender identities. You'll need to up your game to be in the same woke conversation as me. As proven by my higher number than yours. 325.5 > 14. Sorry / Not sorry.
sad, but true............

Yeah, the blaming Mike, Lou, weather and taxes lasted the whole of Kyle's tenure. Apparently it's one rule for Kyle and another for everyone else.
some throw it much better than they catch it................
 

Guided by Veseys

Registered User
Nov 14, 2011
3,751
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This is nothing compared to the Kadri vs Frattin debates. Now those were the days of ferocious political zealotry.
 

TakeTheBody

Registered User
Jan 10, 2018
2,163
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I was okay with Dubas until he left the way he did. Now? Screw Dubas. I do hope his family is well.
 

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